<AWK_> Scribe: Chuck

<cwadams> the links for the telecon-info (above) are not rendering for me. Hangs. Can someone/anyone paste the super secret link to join webex and pwd here?

<cwadams> got it to work in a different browser

<cwadams> Scribe: cwadams

andrew: did a brief rocall
... implementation status

<AWK_> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/WCAG21/CR/implementations?sortby=conformance_level

andrew: you can sort the table so that you don't need to work to find sites that need to be tested.

<Ryladog> I'm going to do Knowbility at AA

andrew: nomensa is on the right track, an issue with video will be worked on.
... mayor's office. Someone mentioned they would check it out and reported that there were too many fatal errors.
... No reasonable path for those issues to be fixed.

kirckwood: issues will be very difficult to get fixed.

andrew: That one may get yanked off the list for AA.

andrew ... is the next one down.

andrew: deque university, the only issue around it was 3.2.6/4.1.3
... where is that one at? Status?

Glenda: Will check with Paul.

andrew: Paul is addressing it and we can assume it will be resolved?

Glenda: yes

andrew: Knowbility.

Katie: Will do nobility.

andrew: It may be worthwhile having someone who is not involved with knowbility.
... Need to be cautious that there is no potential concerns we are scratching our own back.

katie: Being a 3rd person shouldn't hurt.

Greg: I have not finished it, I doubt I'll get all the way through before deadline, plus still waiting for fixes on pages for issues I reported.

Katie: Want me to do something else?

Andrew: Given we may not have two reviews, would be good to have an unafiliated reviewer.

Katie: <reviewing sites that she can evaluate>

Andrew: Can anybody else do a review of Knowbility?
... Many on call are already doing reviews.
... A11y reviews, two people doing reviewd, Detlev & Glenda. What's outstanding? 3.2.6?

Glenda: Yes, been talking to Nick, he's out of time. Pulled contract form. Not greatest answer, but I can get you a pass.

Andrew: OK. What I would say is that we are asking that sites that pass to stay up at least until June. If he adds the contact form after we get through this it would be nice if it addresses requirements.

Glenda: he won't put things in there that will cause embarassment. We have that commitment.

Andrew: What's issue with contact form?

Glenda: 3.2.6 and I'll have to dig.

<Glenda> https://a11yrules.com

Andrew: Not the way we want to resolve things, but as long as this stays 5+ pages, it can still count.

Glenda: will stay above 5 easily.

Andrew: Between Glenda and Detlev you'll need to work it out and then check this one off.
... Detlev you need to look at 1.4.1.

Glenda: We are waiting on a pull request. The only tool reporting errors is mine.
... <reads off error being reported>
... Missing aria-valuenow is missing on volume slider before videos...
... These are affecting accessibility.

Michael: axe does a good job of sniffing out children. However we require WCAG 2 to be accessibility supported. I don't think anything is supporting valuenow

Detlev: Don't understand context of issue to respond.

Michael: Sounds like could be a volume sllider.

Andrew: Does that break 4.1.1?

Michael: Judgement call.

s /sllider/slider/

<JF> "If the current value is not known, the author should not set the aria-valuenow attribute." - https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Accessibility/ARIA/ARIA_Techniques/Using_the_aria-valuenow_attribute

Andrew: Reads validation and questions that anythign is broken.

s /anythign/anything/

<discussion on error and if it applies>

conclusion: the standard is not broken for the ones we discussed.

Glenda: Those are the only ones left in 4.1.1 and 4.1.2.
... I've done full scan of 20 pages.

Detlev: I'm setting this to pass.

Andrew: A11ywins, I sent follow-up note to Marcy asking for status. I found some non-trivial issues. She said she might not have control over everything.
... I haven't heard back from her if these are issues in her control. This one should be fairly quick to review, I would not encourage review now until we are certain it will pass.
... Matterhorn Protocol. Will not pass, has some non-trivial issues. High contrast for instance. Taking it off the list.
... Readibility Online Symposium. Chuck, you reviewed, did it pass?

Chuck: Insignificant issues. Passed or NA'd the standards.

Andrew: Nice, the one real change that needed to happen was for link underline to be more than 3.1. For a site built in 2012 with that being the only change, that's a positive on WCAG 2.1.
... Some of the reasons is that it's using good design practices. In other cases it doesn't really challenge the standards.
... Good to have that. A couple of other issues that needed to be fixed, nothing significant.
... Ethan's site... he has a bunch of other issues, Glenda and I thought it would be too much to fix in too little time.

<Glenda> A11YRules is showing on the Implementation List as satisfying AA https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/WCAG21/CR/implementation_list?category=all&level=AA

Andrew: We will try and get around w/o that one.
... Laney's site we need someone else to eval it. Two outstanding issues for it to be AAA site. Some have signed up to eval. We need someone else who can review site.

Michael: how big?

Andrew: Big, but not so combersome. Glenda ran tools and found and fixed a variety of issues. Glenda, can you run another scan?

<Glenda> Scanning now :)

Glenda: I can PUSH THE BUTTON! "that was easy...."

Andrew: Once done we will have a AAA site.
... Funca, they are working on it as we speak, think they can be done tomorrow. Detlev has started looking at it.

Detlev: Doing it right now.

<Glenda> https://www.funka.com/en/

Andrew: I will take a look at it as well. It's a BIG site. Trying to get definition of sections of site.

<Glenda> Pick a DIR!

Andrew: We probably won't look at every single page.
... They have already used a scanning tool.

Detlev: Is the page sample documented?

Andrew: No.

Detlev: If we pick five pages that may be too little anyways. For purposes of this exercise may be fine. Don't see issue of entire site isn't conformant.

Andrew: I'm trying to see what we say about this.
... <reviewing evaluator instructions>

<Glenda> Knowbility is 127 pages (that I scanned)

<Glenda> A11Y Rules is 20 pages

Andrew: <taking a moment to review>
... It says that that's all fine. If Michael joins we can ask that.

<Glenda> DQU is 239 pages

Detlev: At the WCAG level there isn't a stipulation for entire sites. Specifici pages are evaluated.

<kirkwood> My concerns with the Mayor’s Office site with them saying that we should see which I would have some influence on quick changes https://blueprint.cityofnewyork.us/

Andrew: What does everyone think and recall from the past.
... A conforming website with 1000s of pages. Did we require testing all pages?

Michael: WCAG is a page by page conformance requirement. Can say site meets standards except for video section for example.

Katie: You can scope a section. We didn't do whole sites.

Michael: I don't recall doing a full eval for the final.

Katie: We had the implementation page, don't know if we saved historical data.

Michael: Back to comment in silver about substantially meeting....
... We vertically scoped sections of a site, can declare conformance for section.

<kirkwood> This site claims AA conformance and I can have them make fixes https://blueprint.cityofnewyork.us/accessibility/

Andrew: If we only do "product" sections of site, that might be 300 pages instead of 3000, but still quite large. Did we do sampling?

<communication issues with scribe>

<testing if headset is back in action>

<unscribed moments due to communication issues with scribe>

kirkwood: May have mispoke about mayor's office, or to add to that. A site specifically has AA claims presented on it. I'm in contact with individual who maintains, some fixes have been made, it seems better. URL is blueprint.cityofnewyork.us

<kirkwood> https://blueprint.cityofnewyork.us/

<Glenda> Detlev, I just scanned Funka 2 links deep. Looking very, very good. I’ll send you the few issues I found.

<Glenda> And I’ll scan deeper now

Andrew: Someone had id'd a couple of issues on this site. One was that search receives focus but does not demonstrate focus. The other one was that placeholders were in use for form fields (down at bottom). They would need to do something different with those.
... Those are a couple of things that were identified. They need to be addressed.

Kirkwood: I can get the issues addressed provided I can explain clearly.
... If there are any other issues I can report on that would be great.

Glenda: I just scanned Funka two links deep from english home page, found 11 automated issues.
... I'm going levels deeper (due diligence). Funka
... They look great.

<kirkwood> If anyone can let me know of issues I can relay regarding https://blueprint.cityofnewyork.us/

<Glenda> I’ll set up a scan of https://blueprint.cityofnewyork.us/ now

Andrew: On implementations list I did add in blueprint.
... Let's have people review blueprint. I am also adding a pdf doc > 5 pages that we think meets AA. In total... <reviewed and counted list>
... If we have pdf, that's 7. We need one more. Maybe blueprint can help with that.

<KimD> *have to run

Andrew: We've got two AA's with Laney & Funka. <name> is working on a five page site. If we get these, we would have 8 and 2. We have to have all of these before we do the call on Tuesday.
... Goal is to approve transition plan.

JF: I mentioned in IRC, I've got a site I've been working on, dormant. If someone wants to put together 5 pages, I have a home for it.
... I can give people keys to the website.

Andrew: Check with Jake... If nothing else I will happily jump in.
... We are down to the wire, and we have to address issues.

JF: No comment on state of site right now.

Andrew: When I try it, nothing comes up.

Mark: Came up for me.

JF: There's not a lot of content there, started as a whim. It's avail.

Glenda: I'm going to discourage blueprint. I did a one level deep, I've got 16 color contrast issues, 13 forms missing labels, one missing..., 44, more issues listed.
... That's just automated. Not a good candidate.

Andrew: This is just AA.

<kirkwood> uh oh… oh well on blueprint, argh thanks Glenda

take up item 2

Glenda: Nobody is doing 120 pages manually.

marcjohlic: I'll take up one.

<Glenda> Smart representative testing with due diligence in mind

Andrew: I've looked at a number, found classes of pages, many pages (couple of 100) for a healthy sample.
... I'm looking for pattern of behavior on a large scale and deep review on smaller set.
... Someone raised issue on a list... if you hit tab and focus on skip link... Want to check with working group. If that's the case, then does that link need to go away if one hit's escape to pass dismissable on hover?
... I don't think that needs to happen. Content on hover is about additional content as opposed to the content appearing.
... What you're describing is actually a problem. <describes SC> I don't think we intended for this type of "thing", like if it's a skip link that you want to only appear on focus. That's different than what we've been discussing.
... Whole point of skip link is so that you can see and act upon it.

marc: Wording of this SC makes that fail. Meets the basic criteria of introductory wording, but doesn't meet dismissable. The only out I can think of is that this is actually some kind of equivalent facilitation. Same way that captions (rich media) address topics...
... This is equivalent facilitation for keyboard users, but kind of hard to describe.

Andrew: I think in this case the trigger is the skip link itself. it's intended for additonal content.

s /marc:/mike:/

mike: Describes the issue technically.

<JF> msg/ AWK_ (but I have exactly zero time to work on that - kitchen counter gets installed Friday, and I fly out for a week's worth of training on Sunday)

skip to content appears and obscures half the wording of items in top area. Here it's not a big deal because you exercise link and go down. But if that skip to main .... reconsiders proposition.

dequeuniversity.com

<marcjohlic> dequeuniversity.com

<marcjohlic> knowbility.org

trackbot, end meeting

This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.152  of Date: 2017/02/06 11:04:15  
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Succeeded: s/Nobility/Knowbility/
Default Present: AWK, Detlev, Greg_Lowney, Katie, Haritos-Shea, KimD, gowerm, JF, marcjohlic
Present: AWK Detlev Greg_Lowney Katie Haritos-Shea KimD gowerm JF david-macdonald marcjohlic
Found Scribe: Chuck
Found Scribe: cwadams
Inferring ScribeNick: cwadams
Scribes: Chuck, cwadams

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