IRC log of apa on 2017-10-25

Timestamps are in UTC.

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logging to
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RRSAgent, make logs world
15:49:18 [Zakim]
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Meeting: Accessible Platform Architectures Working Group Teleconference
15:49:20 [trackbot]
Date: 25 October 2017
15:49:25 [janina]
agenda+ preview agenda with items from two minutes
15:49:25 [janina]
agenda+ TPAC 2017
15:49:25 [janina]
agenda+ CSS A11y TF
15:49:25 [janina]
agenda+ Actions Checkin (Specs)
15:49:26 [janina]
agenda+ new on TR
15:49:27 [janina]
agenda+ Other Business
15:49:30 [janina]
agenda+ next and future meetings
15:49:32 [janina]
agenda+ be done
15:51:50 [janina]
15:51:54 [janina]
chair: janina
15:55:33 [janina]
regrets: john, gottfried
16:01:23 [MichaelC]
16:02:38 [janina]
regrets+ Joanie
16:02:48 [Mark_Wilcock]
present+ Mark Wilcock
16:02:58 [IanPouncey]
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Present+ JF
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16:03:53 [JF]
scribe: JF
16:03:56 [JF]
16:04:04 [JF]
zakim, take up item 1
16:04:04 [Zakim]
agendum 1. "preview agenda with items from two minutes" taken up [from janina]
16:04:27 [JF]
JS: basic agenda.
16:04:44 [JF]
Good news - new member for/at APA. [Introductions]
16:07:54 [JF]
Welcoming Mark Wilcock
16:09:41 [JF]
zakim, next item
16:09:41 [Zakim]
agendum 2. "TPAC 2017" taken up [from janina]
16:09:54 [janina]
16:09:58 [JF]
JS: beginnings of an agenda
16:10:33 [JF]
Monday is looking quite full - if there is something that you are directly participating in please be sure that times work for you
16:10:51 [JF]
JS: there are still things coming that aren't on the calendar
16:11:10 [JF]
ie. having a chat with the automotive fols (ref: a11y and autonomous driving cars)
16:11:22 [JF]
16:12:21 [JF]
zakim, next item
16:12:21 [Zakim]
agendum 3. "CSS A11y TF" taken up [from janina]
16:12:54 [JF]
JS: is Monday morning a good time to prep for this, in anticipation of a Tuesday joint-meeting?
16:13:21 [JF]
JS: Charles LaPierre and others from Publishing have some requests related to that as well
16:13:38 [JF]
IP: yep, sounds fine
16:14:14 [JF]
IP: sadly behind on github issues - will address that this week
16:14:39 [JF]
IP: have started working on an agenda for our joint meeting with CSS WG
16:15:40 [JF]
AGenda so far: introductions, the history of the TF, progress and recent push
16:15:53 [JF]
where we are, participants, and hopefully a call for help
16:16:32 [JF]
the real "meat" however is to discuss known issues/concerns, as well as seek input on future requests
16:16:51 [JF]
also, how to most effectively intergrate withtheir WG
16:17:34 [JF]
JS: questions?
16:18:23 [JF]
JS: Introductions will need to be brief when we meet with that group - anticipate a large turnout
16:18:42 [JF]
JS: agenda sounds good - can Ian share that so that we can forward it along?
16:19:04 [JF]
do we want to focus on any particular issues? (highlight things that need to be worked on now)
16:19:20 [JF]
i.e. media queries issue/concern
16:19:55 [JF]
IP: yes, the key goal is to gain focus and clarity on topics
16:20:27 [JF]
16:20:50 [janina]
16:20:53 [janina]
ack jf
16:21:45 [JF]
JF asking if we might invite EO to the meeting?
16:22:39 [JF]
IP: can add agenda item to discuss whether or not to involve EO...
16:22:53 [JF]
whether we invite them or not TBD - perhaps have a chat with EO post TPAC
16:23:24 [JF]
JS: we can talk about that during the prep time
16:23:37 [JF]
JS: we will only have an hour, so this may not yet be mature enough
16:25:28 [tink]
scscribe: tink
16:26:17 [tink]
IP: I'll work on a list of initial topics, and will circulate.
16:26:26 [tink]
zakim, next item
16:26:26 [Zakim]
agendum 4. "Actions Checkin (Specs)" taken up [from janina]
16:26:37 [tink]
zakim, close item 3
16:26:37 [Zakim]
agendum 3, CSS A11y TF, closed
16:26:38 [Zakim]
I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:26:38 [Zakim]
4. Actions Checkin (Specs) [from janina]
16:26:48 [tink]
16:26:48 [trackbot]
action-2153 -- John Foliot to Review and draft a warning note for orienation api spec, for apa review -- due 2017-10-25 -- OPEN
16:26:48 [trackbot]
16:27:12 [tink]
16:27:12 [trackbot]
action-2151 -- Janina Sajka to Review permissions -- due 2017-10-18 -- OPEN
16:27:12 [trackbot]
16:27:19 [tink]
JS: Still looking at it.
16:27:29 [tink]
rrsagent, make minutes
16:27:29 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate tink
16:28:11 [tink]
16:28:11 [trackbot]
action-2123 -- Shane McCarron to Triage changelog of dom 4.1 - note stuff on mutation -- due 2017-04-19 -- OPEN
16:28:11 [trackbot]
16:28:23 [tink]
MC: There is a new draft out.
16:28:37 [tink]
... Shane is helping Joanie with ARIA testing.
16:28:51 [tink]
... Should reassign?
16:29:14 [tink]
... Becky Gibson may rejoin.
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... We have actions older than a year.
16:29:56 [tink]
zakim, close item 4
16:29:56 [Zakim]
agendum 4, Actions Checkin (Specs), closed
16:29:58 [Zakim]
I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:29:58 [Zakim]
5. new on TR [from janina]
16:30:05 [tink]
kim, take up next item
16:30:13 [tink]
zakim, take up next item
16:30:13 [Zakim]
agendum 5. "new on TR" taken up [from janina]
16:30:17 [MichaelC]
-> Tracking Preference Expression (DNT)
16:30:27 [tink]
s/kim, take up next item//
16:30:37 [tink]
rrsagent, make minutes
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I have made the request to generate tink
16:31:09 [tink]
MC: Tracking Preference Expression spec.
16:31:15 [tink]
... Are we interested?
16:31:21 [tink]
JS: Think not.
16:31:46 [tink]
MC: CSS Flexbox.
16:31:52 [MichaelC]
-> CSS Flexible Box Layout Module Level 1
16:31:58 [tink]
... Has gone to CR.
16:32:21 [tink]
... Do we say anything?
16:32:30 [tink]
LW: Have we said anything before?
16:32:42 [tink]
JS: Discussion at TPAC 2015.
16:33:12 [tink]
MC: We agreed at some point not to hold back Flexbox, because the same problem affects a group of similar specs.
16:33:35 [tink]
IP: There is a common issue in the form of content order.
16:33:55 [tink]
... Suggest drafting some suggestions about how that's documented.
16:34:39 [tink]
... Should content order follow visual order for AT, or keyboard users etc.
16:35:12 [tink]
MC: Do you think this would be best practice for authors?
16:36:09 [tink]
IP: Two aspects, best practice for implementation, and then adequate documentation for authors to understand how it works.
16:36:37 [tink]
MC: The most we could ask the spec would be an accessibility consideration section.
16:37:09 [tink]
IP: We can file issues on each repo.
16:37:22 [tink]
MC: With Flexbox in CR it'll get harder to change things.
16:37:42 [tink]
IP: I'd like us to start writing some of this ASAP.
16:38:41 [tink]
LW: Wonder if we're to late for UA guidance?
16:39:00 [tink]
... Firefox had a good solution, though it was deemed to be a bug because of the spec language, but now they've reverted it.
16:39:10 [tink]
MC: Not sure it's too late.
16:39:57 [tink]
JS: Consensus seemed to be that rewriting the DOM was a problem.
16:40:05 [tink]
LW: Firefox didn't rewrite the DOM.
16:40:20 [tink]
MC: But if we can get the browsers to agree to do it the way Firefox did, that oculd be a way forward.
16:40:28 [tink]
rrsagent, make minutes
16:40:28 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate tink
16:42:10 [jamesn]
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16:43:16 [MichaelC]
rrsagent, make minutes
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I have made the request to generate MichaelC
16:43:37 [tink]
16:44:17 [tink]
LW: There is an open issue on the W3 Process to require accessibility considerations in specs.
16:44:33 [tink]
MC: So for Flexbox we're not going to do anything directly.
16:46:51 [tink]
zakim, take up next item
16:46:51 [Zakim]
agendum 6. "Other Business" taken up [from janina]
16:46:59 [tink]
zakim, close item 5
16:46:59 [Zakim]
agendum 5, new on TR, closed
16:47:01 [Zakim]
I see 3 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
16:47:01 [Zakim]
6. Other Business [from janina]
16:47:07 [tink]
JS: Anything?
16:47:12 [MichaelC]
s/scscribe: tink/scribe: tink/
16:48:20 [tink]
MC: MC: We need to get the CAPTCHA document updated.
16:48:35 [tink]
JS: Having trouble getting it to a point where Roy and Michael can work on it.
16:49:49 [tink]
... Will try for this week.
16:49:57 [tink]
16:50:12 [tink]
rrsagent, make minutes
16:50:12 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate tink
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