15:53:06 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dnt
15:53:06 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/07/17-dnt-irc
15:53:08 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
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15:53:10 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be TRACK
15:53:10 <Zakim> ok, trackbot
15:53:11 <trackbot> Meeting: Tracking Protection Working Group Teleconference
15:53:11 <trackbot> Date: 17 July 2017
15:54:07 <Bert> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tracking/2017Jul/0013.html
15:54:33 <Bert> Previous meeting: https://www.w3.org/2017/07/10-dnt-minutes.html
15:54:39 <Bert> Chair: Bert
15:55:17 <Bert> Regrets+ Matthias, David
15:55:33 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
15:55:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/07/17-dnt-minutes.html Bert
15:58:06 <fielding> fielding has joined #dnt
16:01:09 <rvaneijk> rvaneijk has joined #dnt
16:01:38 <mikeoneill> mikeoneill has joined #dnt
16:01:55 <mikeoneill> webex link says its cancelled
16:02:04 <vincent_> vincent_ has joined #dnt
16:02:08 <Bert> see new link in topic and in agenda
16:02:20 <Bert> I don't know why the old one doesn't work anymore.
16:02:40 <Bert> -> https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=mc92f16330cf3b8542490cb8443a06fcf Webex link
16:03:02 <rvaneijk> new one works fin.
16:03:05 <walter> ah
16:03:51 <mikeoneill> present+
16:04:09 <Bert> present+
16:04:20 <walter> present+
16:05:05 <fielding> present+
16:05:28 <rvaneijk> present+
16:06:31 <vincent_> present+
16:06:33 <walter> Hm, Shane isn't on IRC either
16:09:22 <Bert> mikeoneill: I reduced the API calls from 6 to 3 and all return the same response type.
16:09:49 <Bert> ... Now has a new property in the Bag to distinguish webWide from site-specific.
16:09:50 <fielding> Mike is talking about the pull request at https://github.com/w3c/dnt/pull/45
16:10:23 <fielding> Right, ednotes are not published by CR
16:10:51 <at> at has joined #dnt
16:10:54 <Bert> ... Roy put in a note about not understanding a sentence.
16:11:20 <wileys> wileys has joined #dnt
16:11:22 <Bert> fielding: Maybe just remove that sentence. It doesn't seem to matter.
16:12:18 <Bert> shane: Like David, I'd need more time to review the changes.
16:12:33 <Bert> fielding: It's not in the document yet, it's mike's propoasl.
16:13:14 <Bert> bert: is an API chnage possible at all at this point?
16:14:37 <wileys> In the promise structure it appears the UGEs have been collapsed with a boolean for web-wide or not, correct?
16:15:03 <Bert> bert: roy, your opinion on mike's API?
16:15:32 <Bert> fielding: my goal is to get implementation commitments.
16:16:37 <fielding> I haven't had a chance to go through it in detail, but my preference remains to get an indication by browsers first and then go to CR. But I will defer to the WG.
16:18:13 <Bert> bert: what does the ed. note in 7.3 mean?
16:18:23 <Bert> fielding: Not really explained in the spec.
16:18:41 <Bert> mikeoneill: Thereis something in the wiki. Could maybe opy that.
16:18:56 <Bert> fielding: Anything, from wiki or mail.
16:19:30 <Bert> ... need more detail than the current one sentence at the start.
16:19:49 <fielding> earlier, Mike pointed out the comment on https://w3c.github.io/dnt/drafts/tracking-dnt.html#exception-checking
16:20:01 <Bert> mikeoneill: I can find text.
16:20:17 <fielding> ... about none of us knowing what the last sentence means in that section.
16:23:04 <Bert> mikeoneill: Section 7.6, doNotTrack property is not redundant. Just keep it.
16:23:22 <Bert> fielding: I remember now why the remark is there.
16:23:49 <Bert> mikeoneill: I have implemented it, it is not hard.
16:24:10 <Bert> fielding: property is generated dynamically for each navigator window.
16:24:26 <Bert> mikeoneill: Every context has its own property.
16:24:58 <Bert> ... E.g., an iframe. Have to be able to find the value without bouncing a request to a server.
16:25:23 <Bert> fielding: I think the need is reasonable, but the spec doesn't reflect that.
16:25:35 <Bert> mikeoneill: I coul dmake some text.
16:25:55 <Bert> fielding: If you can describe it.
16:26:18 <Bert> ACTION mikeoneill: describe doNotTrack property purpose and implementation
16:26:19 <trackbot> Error finding 'mikeoneill'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2011/tracking-protection/track/users>.
16:27:24 <Bert> mikeoneill: "Expires" property: roy says it should be removed, but it is still in HTTP.
16:27:49 <Bert> fielding: Yes, for legacy reasons. But if we have maxAge, expires is not needed.
16:28:11 <Bert> mikeoneill: It is not much cost to implement.
16:28:23 <Bert> fielding: Date parsing is actually expensive.
16:28:33 <Bert> mikeoneill: Yes, but that code is there already.
16:29:40 <Bert> fielding: No implems yet, we can decide. But we need more than 2 people with an opinion.
16:29:57 <Bert> mikeoneill: There are implems.
16:31:36 <Bert> shane: Expires is clearly understood, but maxAge serves the same pupose.
16:32:02 <Bert> mikeoneill: Easier to remove expires than to chnage to Promises.
16:33:30 <Bert> RESOLVED: remove "expires"
16:33:36 <fielding> action on me to remove Expires property on API
16:33:36 <trackbot> Error finding 'on'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2011/tracking-protection/track/users>.
16:34:07 <fielding> action fielding to remove Expires from API in favor of just using maxAge
16:34:07 <trackbot> Created ACTION-474 - Remove expires from api in favor of just using maxage [on Roy Fielding - due 2017-07-24].
16:37:57 <Bert> bert: Do we need to mention DNT-extension as at risk (issue 48)?
16:38:14 <fielding> action fielding to rephrase "at risk" on DNT-extensions
16:38:14 <trackbot> Created ACTION-475 - Rephrase "at risk" on dnt-extensions [on Roy Fielding - due 2017-07-24].
16:38:25 <Bert> fielding: We can republish the CR instead. But there seems no reason to mark it at risk at present.
16:38:37 <Bert> mikeoneill: Back to API:
16:39:15 <Bert> ... Re the duplets, I made a variable domain.
16:39:37 <Bert> fielding: Will have a look, haven't had time to read it.
16:40:05 <Bert> mikeoneill: [Something about resolving a Promise]
16:40:33 <Bert> fielding: Probably editorial. Web Platforms specs typically specify algo for promises.
16:40:52 <Bert> mikeoneill: I can make a pull request for next week.
16:41:57 <Bert> bert: how much time do we need for review & editing?
16:42:08 <Bert> mikeoneill: Most seems to be editorial.
16:42:19 <rvaneijk> Q: what is the consequence of a revision to the API for the process?
16:42:40 <rvaneijk> q+
16:43:21 <Bert> shane: browser want to know that servers will implement before they spend resources. Move to Promises is big.
16:43:42 <Bert> ... I don't have enough feedback.
16:44:27 <Bert> mikeoneill: Promises are in the spec.
16:44:34 <Bert> fielding: yes, that was already decided,
16:44:47 <Bert> shane: OK, so I'll need to talk to my team.
16:45:27 <Bert> bert: How many weeks do we want for review?
16:45:58 <Bert> shane: We first need the editorial chnages in the spec. And then about 2 weeks after that.
16:46:15 <Bert> ... And if no comments in those two weeks, that implies acceptance.
16:46:28 <rvaneijk> q-
16:46:44 <Bert> fielding: I can do work this week only.
16:47:39 <Bert> mikeoneill: I can do my text next Monday.
16:49:41 <rvaneijk> sorry, soundcard problem
16:50:33 <rvaneijk> would it require new implementations?
16:51:25 <fielding> I think further changes would be bound by existing implementations. Right now we are not bound because the Promises changes.
16:51:36 <wileys> wileys has left #dnt
16:51:39 <rvaneijk> ok, tnx
16:52:27 <Bert> RRSAgent, amke minutes v2
16:52:27 <RRSAgent> I'm logging. I don't understand 'amke minutes v2', Bert.  Try /msg RRSAgent help
16:52:36 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
16:52:36 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/07/17-dnt-minutes.html Bert
16:52:56 <fielding> zakim, list attendees
16:52:56 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been mikeoneill, Bert, walter, fielding, rvaneijk, vincent_
16:53:18 <fielding> present+ shane
17:08:54 <Bert> RRSAgent, make minutes v2
17:08:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/07/17-dnt-minutes.html Bert
17:35:07 <Bert> zakim, bye
17:35:07 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been mikeoneill, Bert, walter, fielding, rvaneijk, vincent_, shane
17:35:07 <Zakim> Zakim has left #dnt
17:35:13 <Bert> RRSAgent, bye
17:35:13 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2017/07/17-dnt-actions.rdf :
17:35:13 <RRSAgent> ACTION: mikeoneill to describe doNotTrack property purpose and implementation [1]
17:35:13 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2017/07/17-dnt-irc#T16-26-18