17:57:38 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aria-apg
17:57:38 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/01/23-aria-apg-irc
17:57:44 <jamesn> rrsagent, make log world
17:57:50 <jamesn> meeting: ARIA APG TF
18:01:12 <annabbott> annabbott has joined #aria-apg
18:02:26 <MichielBijl> present+
18:02:43 <jemma> jemma has joined #aria-apg
18:03:59 <jongund> jongund has joined #aria-apg
18:04:39 <jongund> present+ jongund
18:04:53 <sirib> present+ sirib
18:05:12 <jongund> zakim
18:05:22 <annabbott> present+ AnnAbbott
18:06:14 <mck> mck has joined #aria-apg
18:06:57 <mck> zakim, clear agenda
18:06:57 <Zakim> agenda cleared
18:07:12 <mck> present+matt_king
18:08:39 <MichielBijl> RRSAgent, make minutes
18:08:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/01/23-aria-apg-minutes.html MichielBijl
18:08:46 <jemma> present+ JaeunJemmaKu
18:08:49 <mck> Agenda+ Around the table - status updates on issue assignments for current milestone
18:08:50 <mck> Agenda+ Issue 189: Updates needed for button example page https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/189
18:08:52 <mck> Agenda+ issue 233: Custom Checkboxes Incorrectly Work with Enter Key on Checkbox Example (Two State) & (Mixed State) https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/233
18:08:53 <mck> Agenda+ Issue 13: Should The menu and menubar design pattern caution authors not to use the pattern for site navigation menus? https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/13
18:08:55 <mck> Agenda+ Issue 221: Review multi-thumb slider design pattern https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/221
18:09:27 <mck> present+ matt_king
18:09:49 <annabbott> present+ Bryan Garaventa
18:11:31 <jamesn> jamesn has joined #aria-apg
18:12:22 <jongund> scribe: jongund
18:13:12 <jongund> topic: go around and update progress on issues
18:13:19 <mck> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/milestone/5
18:13:55 <jongund> MK: JG has a pull rev
18:14:21 <annabbott> MK: JG has pull request for buttons
18:14:55 <annabbott> MK: also has issue for show/hide
18:15:32 <annabbott> MK: we would have a design pattern for show/hide for accordian
18:15:53 <annabbott> JG: has example for show/hide
18:16:14 <annabbott> MK: ok to take up show/hide next week?
18:17:24 <annabbott> JG: ok but not certain diff between show/hide and accordian and where to put example?
18:17:32 <annabbott> MK: separate directory
18:18:10 <annabbott> MK: name dir either 'disclosure (show/hide)" or reverse the order
18:18:43 <mck> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/229
18:18:51 <annabbott> JG: has student working on 229 (slider)
18:19:32 <annabbott> MK: there's a checklist of to do's in 229
18:19:46 <annabbott> MK: assigning JG to 229
18:21:02 <annabbott> MK: Michiel has current issues: updated alert & breadcrumbs
18:21:19 <annabbott> Michiel will update breadcrumbs next week
18:21:30 <MichielBijl> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/185
18:21:30 <jongund> MK: I am looking for alert isse
18:22:08 <jongund> MK: Before we close them I want to make at least one other editor reviewing things
18:22:40 <jongund> MK: Before you close, specifically request an editor review
18:22:47 <jongund> MB: Will do
18:22:58 <jongund> AA: Do you want me to look at the changes
18:23:24 <jongund> JG: These might be something to have the newbies review
18:23:36 <jongund> MK: I am looking for more editorial consistency
18:23:54 <jongund> MK: For all of the examples, any reviews from people less familiar is good
18:24:04 <jongund> MK: MB was just taking about editorial process
18:24:16 <jongund> SB: I am happy to review examples
18:24:52 <jongund> MK: Once we have a new example I will set up an issue and I will assign SB
18:24:56 <jongund> AA: I can to
18:25:56 <jongund> MB: Daniel Defoe posted a message that he will not do breadcrumb, so I will do it
18:26:07 <jongund> MK: Jemma are you working on anything?
18:26:12 <jongund> Jemma: No
18:26:47 <jongund> MK: There is s bug in the treeview
18:27:28 <jongund> JN: This seems to be something related to Firefox
18:27:49 <jongund> MK: You think it is a FF bug?
18:28:15 <jongund> JN: Something changed in release 50 that broke other stuff I built
18:29:01 <jongund> JG: Dynamically changing tabindex is something we need to do
18:29:10 <jongund> AA: Issue 223?
18:29:26 <jongund> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/223
18:29:58 <jongund> JN: Tab is giving a char code out
18:31:42 <jongund> JG: Keypress is depricated?
18:32:30 <jemma> https://developer.mozilla.org/en-US/docs/Web/Events/keypress
18:32:34 <jongund> JG: We have other examples that you keypress
18:32:39 <MichielBijl> q+
18:32:41 <jemma> charcode in keypress is depricated
18:33:08 <MichielBijl> ack MichielBijl
18:33:17 <jongund> JG: All of your examples need to get rid of keypress
18:34:06 <jongund> Jemma: charcode and keypress are depricated
18:34:09 <MichielBijl> q+ to say that we should use keydown or keyup
18:34:35 <MichielBijl> example: element.addEventListener('keydown', keydownEventListener);
18:34:41 <MichielBijl> ack me
18:34:41 <Zakim> MichielBijl, you wanted to say that we should use keydown or keyup
18:34:48 <jongund> JG: We are going to have to fix some other example too
18:36:21 <jongund> MB: Some properties are depricated
18:37:25 <jongund> JG: I think it would be a good action item for Jemma
18:37:57 <jongund> MK: I am raising an issue to find any examples using keypress
18:38:06 <jongund> Jemma: Happy to help
18:39:25 <annabbott> MK: created issue #249 for keypress
18:39:40 <annabbott> MK: and assigned Jemma
18:40:16 <annabbott> Jemma: will look at #249 this week
18:40:20 <jongund> Jemma: I can work on it this week
18:40:29 <annabbott> MK: any issues, James?
18:40:32 <jongund> MK: JN are there any issues working on?
18:40:38 <jongund> JN: I will do what I can
18:40:56 <jongund> MK: There are a number of issues in the milestone
18:41:01 <jongund> JN: I will pick some up
18:41:37 <jongund> MK: This week I updated our status page, to figure out minimum viable product,
18:41:54 <jongund> MK: I am trying to make a plan for documentation
18:42:18 <jongund> MK: I am working on the information architecture for the page
18:42:43 <jamesn> agenda?
18:43:15 <jamesn> zakim, take up item 3
18:43:15 <Zakim> agendum 3. "issue 233: Custom Checkboxes Incorrectly Work with Enter Key on Checkbox Example (Two State) & (Mixed State) https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/233" taken up
18:43:18 <Zakim> ... [from mck]
18:44:20 <jongund> MK: I didn't releasize some of out checkboxes respond to "enter" key
18:44:39 <jongund> JN: I would not fail people on that feature
18:45:39 <jongund> MK: I have been doing some testing on native plateform, hitting enter often closes a dialog box
18:46:11 <jongund> MK: In some cases on OS X the focus on the checkboxes give an error tone
18:46:46 <jongund> MK: Should we do what platform behavior does
18:47:02 <jongund> AA: Our pattern is only spacebar
18:47:06 <jongund> JN: Yes
18:47:27 <jongund> JG: I can fix it
18:47:51 <jamesn>  zakim, next item
18:47:51 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Around the table - status updates on issue assignments for current milestone" taken up [from mck]
18:47:57 <jamesn> zakim, take up item 4
18:47:57 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Issue 13: Should The menu and menubar design pattern caution authors not to use the pattern for site navigation menus? https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/13"
18:47:58 <annabbott> MK: assign 233 to JG to fix so spacebar only
18:48:01 <Zakim> ... taken up [from mck]
18:48:16 <mck> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/13
18:49:16 <jongund> MK: The issues goes back to November 2015
18:49:25 <jongund> JN: I know him
18:49:53 <jongund> MK: He is essentially saying is the menu is creating poor example
18:50:15 <jongund> MK: One of our examples says site navigation
18:50:20 <jongund> MK: Other thoughts
18:51:09 <jongund> MK: JG: I think they are just concerned with poor aria implementation
18:51:50 <jongund> JN: I think site navigation can be better with aria menus, but there needs to be used as part of an overall design
18:52:43 <jongund> MK: I think JG voiced my concern, we need to help people do it well
18:53:30 <jongund> MK: JG: Do we ever say don't use this pattern for a purpose?
18:53:56 <jongund> MK: We point people to other patterns, for example dialog references other patterns
18:54:43 <jongund> MK: What I am thinking of doing is writing a response, we have an example now of how to do it as an example, and wait for his feedback
18:54:49 <jongund> AA: Sounds like a plan
18:55:11 <jamesn> zakim, take up item 5
18:55:11 <Zakim> agendum 5. "Issue 221: Review multi-thumb slider design pattern https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/221" taken up [from mck]
18:55:19 <jongund> https://github.com/w3c/aria-practices/issues/221
18:55:43 <jongund> MK: I noticed several things about it
18:55:55 <jongund> MK: It is lacking a description...
18:56:24 <jongund> MK: In particular it does not say anything about relationship between sliders
18:56:42 <jongund> MK In general what does aria-controls add value
18:57:00 <jongund> MK: It seems to be more a future behavior
18:57:26 <jongund> SB: In menus and trees...
18:58:15 <jongund> MK: There is little use of aria-controls in assistive technology
18:58:36 <jongund> JN: MOving to regions would be great but AT does not provide that functionality
18:59:02 <jongund> JN: We need to tell screen readers what they can do with it
18:59:37 <jongund> MK: Back to thumbs, we need to have something about moving other thumb
18:59:52 <jongund> JN: We have some controls that do bumb the other slider
19:00:20 <jongund> MK: Maybe working on the text for mult-thumb text is something you can do JN?
19:00:32 <jongund> JN: it is very situational
19:00:57 <jongund> JN: When the values converge there are potential different behaviors that can happen
19:01:23 <jongund> MK: Can you enumerate some of those options, and look at what other people have said
19:01:31 <jongund> rrsagent, draft minutes
19:01:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2017/01/23-aria-apg-minutes.html jongund