19:44:23 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aapi
19:44:23 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2017/01/17-aapi-irc
19:44:25 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
19:44:25 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #aapi
19:44:27 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
19:44:27 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
19:44:28 <trackbot> Meeting: Accessible Rich Internet Applications Working Group Teleconference
19:44:28 <trackbot> Date: 17 January 2017
19:45:55 <clown> agenda: this
19:46:13 <clown> agenda+ GH-ISSUE-459: (All) macOS mapping of aria-colindex, -rowindex, -colcount, -rowcount, -rowspan, -colspan
19:46:26 <clown> agenda+ GH-ISSUE-464: (All) macOS mapping of aria-roledescription.
19:46:39 <clown> agenda+ GH-ISSUE-458: (All) macOS mapping of aria-errormessage.
19:46:50 <clown> agenda+ GH-ISSUE-456: (All) macOS mapping of feed role.
19:47:00 <clown> agenda+ Triage issues/actions: https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/products/23
19:47:09 <clown> agenda+ Triage core-aam bugzillas: https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=Core%20AAM&product=ARIA
19:47:18 <clown> agenda+ Triage accname-aam bugzillas: https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=AccName%20AAM&product=ARIA
19:47:26 <clown> agenda+ Triage accname actions: https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/26
19:47:31 <clown> agenda+ be done.
19:47:38 <clown> chair:  Joseph_Scheuhammer
19:50:45 <clown> clown has changed the topic to: https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m111076a5138536589c06d9b5c35ffb51 Meeting Number: 641 707 405 Next Meeting 10-Jan-2017, 20:00 UTC
19:50:59 <clown> clown has changed the topic to: https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m111076a5138536589c06d9b5c35ffb51 Meeting Number: 641 707 405 Next Meeting 24-Jan-2017, 20:00 UTC
19:58:32 <joanie> present+ Joanmarie_Diggs
19:58:41 <joanie> scribe: joanie
20:04:02 <joanie> Zakim, take up item 1
20:04:02 <Zakim> agendum 1. "GH-ISSUE-459: (All) macOS mapping of aria-colindex, -rowindex, -colcount, -rowcount, -rowspan, -colspan" taken up [from clown]
20:04:20 <joanie> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/464
20:04:39 <joanie> JS: It looks like we have consensus on this issue.
20:04:49 <clown> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/459
20:05:15 <joanie> JS: Joanie has figured out what the mappings are and given me the information I need.
20:05:32 <joanie> JS: James has also given me some information I need and assigned the issue back to me.
20:05:47 <joanie> JS: I should be able to finish this within a week.
20:06:12 <joanie> JS: I may ask Joanie a question or two along the way, but I think I can do it.
20:06:15 <bgaraventa1979> bgaraventa1979 has joined #aapi
20:06:16 <joanie> JS: Any comments?
20:06:30 <joanie> RS: If they are happy with the mappings, I'm good.
20:06:36 <joanie> RS: Close it when you're done?
20:06:40 <bgaraventa1979> present+ Bryan_Garaventa
20:06:50 <joanie> JS: I could, or we could do one final review.
20:07:02 <joanie> RS: You might want to check with Joanie since she knows the code.
20:07:05 <joanie> JS: Ok.
20:07:08 <joanie> Zakim, next item
20:07:08 <Zakim> agendum 2. "GH-ISSUE-464: (All) macOS mapping of aria-roledescription." taken up [from clown]
20:07:22 <clown> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/464
20:07:27 <joanie> JS: I looked at this one yesterday afternoon.
20:07:44 <joanie> JS: Specificially, this issue is about roledescription and how to handle empty strings.
20:08:03 <joanie> JS: There's a WebKit bug which states (Joseph reads from opening report)
20:08:27 <joanie> JS: https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=163647
20:08:46 <joanie> RS: Mac has a roledescription by default.
20:09:08 <joanie> RS: I would think that this means we ignore the whitespace and expose the native roledescription.
20:09:34 <joanie> JS: The way he has quoted the spec seems a little bit off.
20:09:56 <joanie> JS: Somewhere else, he brought up the meter element.
20:10:23 <joanie> JS: The problem is that meter doesn't have an explicit or implicit role.
20:11:08 <joanie> RS: I do not disagree with James on that.
20:12:08 <clown> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/aria/aria.html#aria-roledescription
20:16:36 <joanie> (Discussion about meter, generic elements, mappings of elements to platforms, and why the limitation of having an explicit or implicit role was added)
20:16:48 <joanie> JS: We could potentially try to address this in Core AAM.
20:19:21 <clown> present+ Joseph_Scheuhammer
20:19:23 <richardschwerdtfeger> richardschwerdtfeger has joined #aapi
20:19:41 <richardschwerdtfeger> present+ Rich_Schwerdtfeger
20:21:12 <joanie> JS: The only other thing I would say about this issue is that there are already mappings in the Core AAM.
20:21:19 <joanie> JS: So we could just close it and not worry about it.
20:21:32 <joanie> JS: Are we testing this statement from the spec.?
20:21:39 <joanie> JD: To me, it should be.
20:21:47 <joanie> JS: It's a must.
20:22:01 <joanie> JS: So there may be failures?
20:22:06 <joanie> JD: We don't know yet.
20:23:21 <joanie> JD: I think we'll have our two implementations via Gecko.
20:23:40 <joanie> JD: And for the non-whitespace cases, also Safari.
20:23:48 <joanie> JS: I can close this if there are no objections.
20:23:55 <joanie> RS + JD: No objections.
20:23:58 <joanie> Zakim, next item.
20:23:58 <Zakim> agendum 3. "GH-ISSUE-458: (All) macOS mapping of aria-errormessage." taken up [from clown]
20:24:30 <clown> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/458
20:24:45 <clown> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=165842
20:24:45 <joanie> JS: Actually, this is about aria-details.
20:24:54 <joanie> JS: There's a webkit bug (URL above)
20:25:01 <joanie> JS: (Reads from bug)
20:25:27 <joanie> JS: What is it on the other platforms?
20:25:32 <clown> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#ariaDetails
20:25:38 <joanie> JS: It's relation-details pointer.
20:25:49 <joanie> JS: And UIA uses describedby
20:26:01 <joanie> JS: Comments? I don't know what to do about this.
20:26:28 <clown> IA2_RELATION_DETAILS
20:28:02 <joanie> JD: I don't think there is anything to do, the comment in bugzilla suggests they don't want to implement it.
20:28:14 <joanie> JS: So the mapping goes from "TBD" to "not mapped"?
20:28:17 <joanie> JD: I guess.
20:28:23 <joanie> JS: Then it will pass.
20:28:26 <joanie> JD: Huh.
20:28:34 <clown> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=165842
20:28:46 <joanie> RS: James said they don't plan to implement it??
20:28:59 <joanie> JS: See the issue (URL above)
20:29:24 <joanie> RS: A lot of work was done to get consensus around this.
20:29:36 <joanie> RS: The community will not be happy.
20:29:56 <joanie> RS: I would like to respond on the bug.
20:30:07 <joanie> JS: I would recommend doing so on the github issue instead.
20:30:15 <clown> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/458
20:30:28 <joanie> JS: That way everyone will see the discussion.
20:35:10 <joanie> JS: He's suggesting the mapping be a navigation or link action.
20:35:48 <joanie> RS: I've commented.
20:37:34 <joanie> JS: Let's see what happens in the coming weeks.
20:38:05 <joanie> Zakim, next item
20:38:06 <Zakim> agendum 4. "GH-ISSUE-456: (All) macOS mapping of feed role." taken up [from clown]
20:38:33 <joanie> JS: It's actually a different issue.
20:38:39 <clown> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/456
20:38:47 <joanie> s/JS: It's actually a different issue.//
20:38:56 <clown> https://bugs.webkit.org/show_bug.cgi?id=151691
20:39:05 <joanie> JS: There's a WebKit bug link (URL above)
20:39:34 <joanie> JS: There are a number of comments here which we should read.
20:39:49 <joanie> RS: A list dosn't take articles or specify a navigation.
20:40:12 <joanie> RS: I did answer him, but no response.
20:41:37 <joanie> RS: The feed role solves a lot of problems.
20:41:49 <joanie> RS: You cannot use the arrows for this.
20:42:01 <joanie> RS: If it's a group, you don't know there's custom navigation.
20:42:08 <joanie> RS: If it's a feed, you know there is.
20:42:21 <joanie> RS: And you also know it's unlimited.
20:48:04 <joanie> RS: And in articles, you can have absolutely anything
20:48:13 <joanie> JS: James is suggesting a list.
20:48:25 <joanie> RS: Name one platform that operates list items using J and K.
20:48:29 <joanie> JS: I can't.
20:48:33 <joanie> RS: I rest my case.
20:52:31 <joanie> JD: Once we have a test case for it, it will spit up in my ATTA for WebKitGtk. That will remind me to implement it, and I can discuss this issue with James and Chris.
20:53:14 <joanie> Zakim, next item
20:53:15 <Zakim> agendum 5. "Triage issues/actions: https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/products/23" taken up [from clown]
20:53:32 <joanie> JS: Do you want to talk about aria-activedescendant?
20:53:43 <joanie> RS: I saw you replied. We can come back to it.
20:59:33 <clown> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/core-aam/core-aam.html#keyboard-focus_aria-activedescendant
20:59:49 <joanie> JS: The URL you (Rich) gave me is above.
20:59:58 <joanie> JS: You'll see some paragraphs and four list items.
21:00:14 <joanie> JS: The four list items describe what happens, but in an AAPI-neutral way.
21:00:37 <joanie> JS: So you have to look at those list items and then see what the platform does in that case.
21:02:49 <joanie> RS: OK, it looks like we can do this, but how to do it in the harness.
21:03:09 <joanie> https://www.w3.org/wiki/ARIA_1.1_Testable_Statements#Example
21:12:22 <richschwer___> richschwer___ has joined #aapi
21:23:50 <joanie> Zakim, part
21:23:50 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Joanmarie_Diggs, Bryan_Garaventa, Joseph_Scheuhammer, Rich_Schwerdtfeger
21:23:50 <Zakim> Zakim has left #aapi
21:24:22 <joanie> scribeOptions: -final
21:24:28 <joanie> RRSAgent, stop