07:02:19 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #wot-td
07:02:19 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/11/23-wot-td-irc
07:03:05 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot-td
07:04:07 <dape> dape has joined #wot-td
07:04:42 <kaz> present+ Kaz, Sebastian, Dave, Uday, Yingying
07:05:02 <kaz> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-wot-ig/2016Nov/0019.html
07:05:56 <dape> present+ Daniel_Peintner
07:06:22 <kaz> present+ Taki
07:06:57 <kaz> present+ Victor
07:08:52 <victor> victor has joined #wot-td
07:11:13 <kaz> zakim, pick a scribe
07:11:13 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose Dave
07:11:37 <dsr> scribenick: dsr
07:11:49 <uday> uday has joined #wot-td
07:12:46 <dsr> Sebastian: Michael McCool has proposed a change to the charter in respect to thing descriptions to address the AC Review feedback
07:13:31 <dsr> Sebastian looks for a way to project the rendered version of Michael’s pull request
07:14:41 <dsr> Sebastian too provided some suggestions for changes, which Michael took into account
07:14:56 <dsr> rrsagent, set logs public
07:15:14 <Fenger> Fenger has joined #wot-td
07:16:03 <dsr> Sebastian notes that his change should make it easier for people to understand what  the charter is saying.
07:17:23 <kaz> present+ Feng_Zhang
07:17:50 <dsr> We want to avoid misunderstandings about what tools are needed to process thing descriptions.
07:18:52 <dsr> Things can consume data from other sources, e.g. other things.
07:19:44 <dsr> This relates to the declarations about input and output data.
07:20:37 <dsr> Kaz: perhaps we should discuss the details of the pull request in the main WoT IG call when Michael will be present and able to answer questions
07:23:19 <dsr> Sebastian discusses the wording around thing lifecycles
07:25:56 <dsr> Any questions? [No]
07:27:22 <kaz> scribenick: kaz
07:27:32 <kaz> dsr: demo of Simulation of leaky water tank
07:27:43 <kaz> ... (explains the demo scenario)
07:28:05 <kaz> ... there are inlet valve and outlet valve
07:28:40 <kaz> ... the outlet valve automatically opens when the water goes under the lower line
07:28:53 <kaz> ... and the inlet valve automativally opens when the water goes above the upper line
07:29:13 <kaz> ... there is HTML forms to specify levels, etc.
07:29:22 <kaz> ... you can change the limit, etc.
07:30:06 <kaz> ... also interfere the movement using "inlet valve"/"outlet valve" radio boxes
07:30:19 <kaz> ... the green sign shows if you're connected with the server
07:30:42 <kaz> ... (shows the issue 281)
07:31:02 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/issues/281 issue 281
07:31:24 <kaz> dsr: next shows the demo of Simulation of ECG
07:31:45 <kaz> ... server is streaming server-sent events
07:32:03 <kaz> ... what do we need to for streaming?
07:32:19 <kaz> ... e.g., ECG data
07:32:32 <kaz> ... for a digital converter
07:32:46 <kaz> ... what is the protocol?
07:33:03 <kaz> ... metadata here let you know about the data
07:33:09 <kaz> [[
07:33:10 <kaz> {
07:33:10 <kaz> 	properties: {
07:33:10 <kaz> 		ecg: {
07:33:10 <kaz> 			type: “number”;
07:33:10 <kaz> 			upper: 1023;
07:33:12 <kaz> 			lower: 0;
07:33:14 <kaz> 			rate: 100,
07:33:16 <kaz> 			source: “http://example.com/stream/ecg”,
07:33:18 <kaz> 			protocol: “server sent events”
07:33:20 <kaz> 		}
07:33:22 <kaz> 	}
07:33:26 <kaz> }
07:33:28 <kaz> ]]
07:33:30 <kaz> dsr: more compound example with compound data
07:33:40 <kaz> ... time stamp, voltage, etc.
07:33:55 <kaz> [[
07:33:57 <kaz> 5.093750,1891.621105,-0.101894,0.698271,9.961602
07:33:57 <kaz> 5.109375,-156.757717,,,
07:33:57 <kaz> 5.125000,-2117.106552,-0.101894,0.698271,9.961602
07:33:57 <kaz> 5.140625,-1169.248790,,,
07:33:58 <kaz> ]]
07:34:28 <kaz> dsr: ecga includes ecg, x, y, and z
07:34:38 <kaz> [[
07:34:38 <kaz> {
07:34:38 <kaz> 	types: {
07:34:38 <kaz> 		acceleration: {
07:34:38 <kaz> 			type: “number”,
07:34:40 <kaz> 			min: -1.0,
07:34:42 <kaz> 			max: 1.0,
07:34:44 <kaz> 			rate: 32
07:34:46 <kaz> 		}
07:34:48 <kaz> 	},
07:34:50 <kaz> 	properties: {
07:34:52 <kaz> 		ecga: {
07:34:56 <kaz> 			rate: 64,
07:34:58 <kaz> 			source: “http://example.com/stream/ecg”,
07:35:00 <kaz> 			protocol: “server sent events”,
07:35:02 <kaz> 			properties: {
07:35:04 <kaz> 				ecg: {
07:35:06 <kaz> 					type: “number”,
07:35:08 <kaz> 					upper: 1023,
07:35:10 <kaz> 					lower: 0
07:35:12 <kaz> 				},
07:35:14 <kaz> 				x: “acceleration”,
07:35:16 <kaz> 				y: “acceleration”,
07:35:18 <kaz> 				z: “acceleration”
07:35:20 <kaz> 			}
07:35:22 <kaz> 		}
07:35:26 <kaz> 	}
07:35:28 <kaz> }
07:35:30 <kaz> ]]
07:35:32 <kaz> dsr: defining x, y, z separately from the ecg data
07:35:34 <kaz> ... next of properties
07:35:36 <kaz> s/next/nest/
07:35:46 <dape> q+
07:35:50 <kaz> q?
07:35:56 <kaz> ack d
07:36:22 <kaz> dape: wondering what you need is additional information to get the data?
07:36:32 <kaz> dsr: server-sent event is an API of HTML5
07:36:47 <kaz> ... you provide information of URI, event source and callback
07:36:57 <kaz> ... the interface is independent from protocols
07:37:08 <kaz> ... very easy to implement using Node.js
07:37:37 <kaz> ... not saying HTTP has advantage, though
07:37:57 <kaz> ... but there are many supports for HTTP
07:38:00 <kaz> s/, though//
07:38:27 <kaz> dape: you could change the source from HTTP to any other ones
07:38:29 <kaz> dsr: yes
07:38:50 <kaz> q+
07:39:03 <kaz> seba: what kind of media type are you using?
07:39:08 <kaz> ... what kind of data format?
07:39:27 <kaz> dsr: that's kind of included in the protocol field
07:39:45 <kaz> ... not exposed to applications but could be
07:39:53 <kaz> ... services essentially sending JSON
07:40:05 <kaz> ... array of objects
07:40:17 <kaz> ... this API is appropriate to streaming
07:40:33 <kaz> ... can register callbacks
07:40:49 <kaz> ... the interface exposes the information to applications
07:41:20 <kaz> kaz: wondering if we want to gather this kind of use cases for TD Restructuring?
07:41:22 <kaz> dsr: think so
07:41:50 <kaz> ... would be useful for brainstorming
07:42:24 <kaz> kaz: in that case, I'd suggest Sebastian sends out a call for request for use cases to the group
07:42:30 <kaz> seba: ok
07:43:01 <kaz> ... btw, not unclear about if this approach is useful for today's Web apps
07:43:20 <kaz> ... how to handle unsubscribe?
07:43:27 <kaz> dsr: you can drop subscription
07:43:40 <kaz> ... simple but useful
07:44:05 <kaz> ... the client can stop and resume
07:44:14 <kaz> seba: ok
07:44:38 <kaz> ... the structure you sowed is written in JavaScript
07:45:00 <kaz> ... do you use the notation based on the Current Practices?
07:45:24 <kaz> dsr: not directly JSON-LD but easily converted to RDF
07:46:02 <kaz> seba: would be very nice if we could handle this in Web-like approach
07:46:29 <kaz> ... you're expecting to understand JSON object notation as well
07:46:48 <kaz> ... we're working on independent representation
07:47:20 <kaz> ... would handle both JSON object representation and others
07:47:58 <kaz> dsr: based on the use cases/requirements we could find which would be the appropriate representation
07:48:40 <kaz> seba: we'd have some generic representation which could be converted to any representations
07:49:12 <kaz> ... what the standard side of TD would be?
07:49:20 <kaz> dsr: should be based on requirements
07:50:10 <kaz> seba: JSON approach vs semantic approach
07:50:25 <kaz> ... your example seems to be difficult for semantic interpretation here
07:50:42 <kaz> ... not very machine understandable...
07:50:49 <kaz> dsr: it's very simple
07:51:06 <kaz> ... in terms of mapping, it's also simple
07:51:40 <kaz> seba: how to handle the rate?
07:51:45 <kaz> dsr: using the context mechanism
07:52:01 <kaz> ... something maps to a blank node
07:52:21 <kaz> ... happy to elaborate during upcoming calls
07:52:48 <kaz> seba: there are already existing standards
07:53:08 <kaz> dsr: right. we don't want to people to use something they don't want to use
07:53:42 <kaz> seba: we have to go into more detail once we launch the WG
07:53:56 <kaz> ... staying on JSON-LD or some new approach
07:54:06 <kaz> ... have to find out the right direction to take
07:54:25 <kaz> dsr: need to see pros and cons
07:55:23 <kaz> seba: there should not be need for RDF parser
07:55:40 <kaz> ... how should we rely on TD notation?
07:55:51 <kaz> ... current approach works well for PlugFests
07:56:00 <kaz> ... so would stick with JSON-LD
07:56:19 <kaz> ... 5 mins remaining
07:56:34 <kaz> ... Daniel, your pull request?
07:56:47 <kaz> topic: MIME types
07:57:05 <kaz> -> https://github.com/w3c/wot/pull/278 issue 278
07:57:14 <kaz> dape: issue on MIME types
07:57:53 <kaz> seba: tx for your change proposal
07:58:05 <kaz> ... will merge this with the Current Practice document
07:58:40 <kaz> ... so that we can use that for the next PlugFest
07:58:51 <kaz> ... will use a few next days for that
07:59:02 <kaz> topic: Next meeting?
07:59:15 <kaz> seba: next Wednesday, 8am CET
07:59:38 <kaz> ... if you have topics, please make issues and/or send emails
07:59:52 <kaz> ... something more to discuss today?
07:59:53 <kaz> (none)
08:00:09 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
08:00:13 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
08:00:13 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/11/23-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
08:00:51 <kaz> [ adjourned ]
08:00:55 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
08:00:55 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/11/23-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
08:01:33 <kaz> Meeting: TD Restructuring
08:01:40 <kaz> Chair: Sebastian
08:01:40 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
08:01:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/11/23-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
08:02:17 <kaz> i/Michael McCool has/topic: Pull Requests on TD for the draft WG Charter/
08:02:19 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
08:02:19 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/11/23-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
08:04:16 <kaz> i/scribenick: kaz/topic: Streaming and Compound Values (with demo)/
08:04:18 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
08:04:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/11/23-wot-td-minutes.html kaz
08:11:03 <yingying_> yingying_ has joined #wot-td
08:12:03 <ying_ying> ying_ying has joined #wot-td
09:18:37 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot-td
09:44:14 <Zakim> Zakim has left #wot-td
09:52:20 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot-td
12:37:34 <dsr> dsr has joined #wot-td
12:57:29 <kaz> kaz has joined #wot-td
13:00:50 <taki> taki has joined #wot-td
13:02:18 <taki> taki has left #wot-td
13:11:20 <yingying> yingying has joined #wot-td