See also: IRC log
<scribe> ScribeNick: Florian
<aswan> i joined the one from the invitation but am the only one there...
<mikepie> It
<mikepie> It's failing for me too
<mikepie> I'll resend...
<AndersR> hangout problem here
<shwetank> anyone here? Im trying to connect to the google hangout, but its giving me erorrs while also saying im the only one in the call
<John-Galt> shwetank: https://hangouts.google.com/call/kkkwlctkpfanfbcbggl5tn2diye
Florian: Where do we go from the basic draft we have?
mikepie: I can understand from an
implementation perspective how these two might overlap
... but I am not sure I understand how it helps us to raise
this to the TAG etc.
Florian: To me the idea is to notify the TAG that we're working on an area where it seems that other groups have interest working on as well. We're about to do our own thing, but if a grand unifying solution should be made instead, they should wake up now and kick off something, otherwise, we'll do our thing
AndersR: I have tried to interest the TAG in such things before, but they didn't pay attention. I'm just an individual, but if there is more people interested in the topic, including large corps, maybe they'll pay attention this time.
mikepie: Who was on the web payment side? Eirk?
Florian: Yes, but we haven't talked since TPAC
AndersR: Someone from google as well.
mikepie: I'd be curious to hear about what they think. I don't think what they're doing requires explicit native messaging
Florian: so I suggest we keep moving forward with our specs, and in parallel use that statement to allert the broarder community and see if we get feedback
mikepie: Can we try directly engagine with the web payment folks first, maybe in a call, before spending too much time on a formal statement?
Florian: Sure
ACTION florian to try and arrange a call with web payment people
aswan: Mike has done a lot of
work, and made an outline for the draft
... mike explained that Edge is planing to take a different
route from Mozilla and Chrome on some aspects, so we decided to
leave these parts unspecified
... where we are differing is the actual protocol between the
browser and the native app.
... the part that will be specified then is permission, the
manifest, and the API that the browser exposes to the web
app.
... IPC and finding applications would be out of scope.
... that will simplify what the spec needs to cover
Florian: so setting up the environment, launching the app, etc would be non standard, but talking to it would be
aswan: essentially.
... that enables more platform integration and doing things the
native way
mikepie: Yes. A way to look at this is that we are standardizing the web part, but the native part remains system specific.
Florian: as we're not trying to recreate flash or NPAPI, and not trying to distribute native code, but to integrate with an environment that's presumably already there. So on a first approach that makes sense to me.
mikepie: (aside: I cleaned up the spec and added some script, now it's nicer).
Florian: I am a bit surprised that ReSpec can't solve these things for you, but if it works now, fine
mikepie: I'll keep digging the respec doc, but for now it works
aswan: we had a recent meeting as a kick off just to established the outline, now we need to fill things in.
Florian: anything to discuss here now?
aswan: first we need to fill in the document, then work through issues
Florian: Ideally let's work on the issues on github, and if something gets stuck we can use this call.
mikepie: Our tweeter feed still has an egg. This is embarassing.
Florian: yes it is
<John-Galt> https://github.com/mozilla/OpenDesign
kmag2: we have a community design portal, that could be relevant
<aswan> i have another meeting starting, have to drop off...
Florian: I am skeptical of design by comittee
kmag2: it wouldn't be that
Florian: then sure.
shwetank: Can we start with something as a default, and improve on that as we get feedbac? I like 8
Is this the updated version: https://mikepie1.github.io/browserext-1/LogoIdeas.png
<John-Galt> 8/7
Florian: Strall poll: pick your favorite two, ranked
<mikepie> 6,5
Florian: 8, 5
<shwetank> 8/9
<AndersR> 8/9
Florian: looks like an 8 to me. Everybody can live with that?
mikepie: sure.
Florian: Mike, please send me the good quality version, and I'll use it for the twitter account
shwetank: would prefer a while background
mikepie: you would only see the shield then
shwetank: ok
ACTION kmag2 to get feedback from Mozilla
mikepie: I'll walk you through
the updates first
... I have registered the URI scheme.
Florian: thanks
mikepie: Also referenced our
specifications with SpecRef
... also added the script I mentioned earlier to get nice
formatting for WebIDL
... I've synced the issues in the spec and github
Florian: Nice, thanks.
mikepie: Issue 1 and 2 and large
todos for myself.
... we talked about trying to be consistent on IDs. I would be
ok with not doing that, but if we should do it, doing it now
would be good. I'll talk to my team
... Issues in green are marked as resolved. I'll remove them
with the next pull request, so I'd like you to confirm that
they're all OK.
(not minuting the issue numbers as they are changing)
mikepie: we removed the mention of bookmarks
Florian: can do it later right?
mikepie: Yes, not part of the
core. Can be grafted on later.
... Talking about the availability about the APIs, we define it
in terms of the default CSP, with a link to it.
(issues 6 7 and 8)
mikepie: issue 10 (github #19). I
had text about content scripts and imediate events and delayed
events, and I wasn't quite sure what it meant anyway, so I've
removed for now
... issue 11, at tpac we had decided to remove the optional
permission part of the table. Now that's done.
... Specified that unknonwn manifest keys can be ignored
Florian: do have normative text about the mechanism to require some keys, to deal with forward compat?
kmag: I don't think that's in there yet
mikepie: I'll add an issue for that
Florian: yes, it would be good to have in the spec now that keys can be otherwise ignored
mikepie: issue 13 is about my bit
of helper javascript
... Issue 14. Waiting for Andrey
Florian: Please at mention him (and me) in github. Will follow up
mikepie: 15/16: at tpac we agreed
on formatting for the webIDL, so I made these changes.
... 18. This was just a work item for me, I filled a section
in.
... issue 19 / gh11. At Tpac we agreed about removing the
extension object because it was redundant with runtime. So I
did that.
... issue 20 / 21. Just work items for me.
kmag: I'll add in some documentation from our code. Chrome documentation is a bit light, so there are details to fill in
mikepie: thanks
... started to do some research about whether our API coverage
is sufficient for good support of basic extensions.
... lastError and onInstalled would help a lot of
extensions
kmag: not sure about lastError. Not really needed if we're going the promisses
Florian: didn't we say we kept callbacks as a fallback?
kmag: that's what firefox does, but I thought said we would not including that in the browser namespace, and if you want to do callbacks, you'd do it with a polyfil, maybe under the chrome namespace
mikepie: that's what we were discussing, but we hadn't resolved
shwetank: I think I want callback fallbacks, but I'll think about this
<kmag> https://github.com/kmaglione/webextension-polyfill
kmag: the polyfill library I wrote only supports promisses in the browser namespace. we could do it the other way around
<kmag> That should be https://github.com/mozilla/webextension-polyfill
Florian: we need an issue in github to track this debate
mikepie: one last thing. It looks like "capture visible tab" and "onReplaced" would help cover a lot more extensions
kmag: not sure about onReplaced. We have it as a stub, but it is not backed by actual functionality. I don't actually know when chrome actually triggers it.
shwetank: haven't seen people use it
mikepie: so we can skip that one.
all: argue back and forth
Florian: So we go with Monday novemeber the 17th, half an hour earlier than today (anchored on US time zones)
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.148 of Date: 2016/10/11 12:55:14 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/note/not/ Found ScribeNick: Florian Inferring Scribes: Florian Present: Florian mikepie Kris Maglione Got date from IRC log name: 20 Oct 2016 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2016/10/20-browserext-minutes.html People with action items: WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]