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15:54:25 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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15:54:27 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be dpub
15:54:27 <Zakim> ok, trackbot
15:54:28 <trackbot> Meeting: Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
15:54:28 <trackbot> Date: 10 October 2016
15:54:30 <ivan> Chair: Tzviya
15:54:52 <ivan> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/mid/d849865f2f96448eb49fecadf65e3a33@AUS-WNMBP-005-n.wiley.com
15:55:07 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: agenda 2016-10-10: http://www.w3.org/mid/d849865f2f96448eb49fecadf65e3a33@AUS-WNMBP-005-n.wiley.com>
15:55:51 <ivan> Regrets: Vlad, David_Wood, Karen, Alan, Daniel
15:57:04 <tzviya> present+
15:57:10 <George> Ivan, you are very faint; I am on a land line.
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15:58:58 <HeatherF> present+ Heather_Flanagan
15:58:58 <ivan> Present+
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16:00:02 <leonardr> present+ Leonard_Rosenthol
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16:00:46 <laudrain> Present+
16:01:56 <clapierre> present+ Charles_LaPierre
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16:02:27 <tzviya> scribenick: laudrain
16:02:33 <rdeltour> present+
16:02:33 <ayla_stein> present+
16:02:47 <tzviya> https://www.w3.org/2016/10/03-dpub-minutes.html
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16:02:54 <laudrain> Minutes : no comments
16:02:58 <pkra> present+ Peter Krautzberger
16:02:59 <dauwhe__> present+ dauwhe
16:03:01 <laudrain> Minutes approved
16:03:18 <laudrain> Ivan : message from Karen
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16:03:47 <laudrain> reminder to join Felix at Franfurt bookfair booth
16:03:53 <ivan> https://www.w3.org/2016/10/W3CPosteratFrankfurt2016.pdf
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16:04:17 <laudrain> small slider : call for comment
16:04:39 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #dpub
16:04:51 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+ Bill_Kasdorf
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16:05:05 <brady_duga> present+ duga
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16:05:17 <cmaden2> present+ Chris_Maden
16:05:23 <garth> present+ garth
16:05:25 <laudrain> next week : meeting cancelled
16:05:43 <laudrain> 24th October next meeting
16:06:00 <garth> https://rawgit.com/w3c/dpub-pwp-ucr/dedupe/index.html
16:06:15 <tzviya> https://github.com/w3c/dpub-pwp-ucr/tree/dedupe
16:06:16 <laudrain> New branch for UCR docuement from Leonard
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16:07:17 <bjdmeest> Present+ Ben_De_Meester
16:07:23 <laudrain> Leonard : goal of that banch : remove duplicates
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16:07:40 <laudrain> and cleaning, merging related things
16:08:17 <laudrain> grammar cleaning, phrases tagged in issue tracker
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16:08:55 <laudrain> nothing contreversial added, and not in my own opinions
16:09:20 <tzviya> q?
16:10:14 <laudrain> ivan raised issues, let’s start with
16:11:35 <laudrain> ivan : general things, requirements very close or identical
16:11:52 <laudrain> Leonard added Ivan suggestions
16:12:09 <tzviya> ivan's comments: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-digipub-ig/2016Oct/0089.html
16:12:30 <laudrain> ivan : to be discussed : issue on versioning 4.1
16:13:02 <laudrain> didn’t understand the first phrase
16:13:18 <laudrain> what do we mean by « versioning »?
16:13:26 <tzviya> https://rawgit.com/w3c/dpub-pwp-ucr/dedupe/index.html#distro-vers
16:14:00 <laudrain> in section 4.1 Distribuiton and Versioning
16:14:04 <leonardr> q+
16:14:21 <laudrain> vesrion as a publisher.
16:14:34 <laudrain> s/vesrion/version/
16:14:59 <tzviya> ack le
16:15:16 <laudrain> Leonard : another issue with archiving versioning
16:16:02 <Bill_Kasdorf> +1 to consider distribution and versioning as separate issues
16:16:21 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:16:31 <laudrain> Tzviya : publisher need to update a book an develpment language because a new release
16:17:00 <tzviya> ack bi
16:17:16 <laudrain> in digital publication, no new publicaiton for that, a minor update just editing a minor version number
16:17:24 <ayla_stein> Agreed
16:17:31 <laudrain> BillK : separate versioning from distribution
16:17:45 <leonardr> q+
16:17:54 <tzviya> ack le
16:18:03 <laudrain> in archiving, an authoritative version is important
16:18:04 <ayla_stein> +1 Bill
16:18:55 <laudrain> Leonard : minor updates doesn’t change the canonical identifier but a change of a chapter change the identifier
16:19:04 <tzviya> in scientific publishing, the version of record is very important
16:19:17 <laudrain> BillK : 2 classes of changes : updates and corrections
16:19:53 <ivan> q+
16:19:54 <laudrain> Leonard : versioning and uniqueness from a publisher point of view
16:20:07 <tzviya> ack iv
16:20:22 <laudrain> Tzviya : several point of view on that subject among publishers
16:21:16 <laudrain> Ivan: separate between changes done by the publishers from annotation, but identical from the user’s point of view
16:21:32 <laudrain> terms meaining different things in the community
16:21:59 <laudrain> for instance : a new version in CSV, in Git
16:22:50 <laudrain> Tzviya: same issue also on updates and corrections
16:22:52 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:23:17 <laudrain> Ivan: req 18 : does not make sense
16:23:55 <laudrain> Leonard: see also 3.8 that sorts it
16:23:59 <ayla_stein> would it be possible to have definitions of "version" in different sections of the document?
16:24:10 <tzviya> ack bi
16:24:21 <laudrain> Ivan: there should be a way of tracking changes
16:25:12 <laudrain> BillK: a stable ID that doesn’t change in EPUB across minor correction, plus a time stamp
16:25:31 <laudrain> Ivan: it goes to implementation direction
16:25:41 <laudrain> BillK: is it the same thing?
16:25:58 <rdeltour> rdeltour: can we use the word "edition"?
16:26:08 <laudrain> Tzviya: we need the word version to something else
16:26:18 <tzviya> q?
16:26:20 <laudrain> Ivan: do we need to keep 4.1?
16:26:34 <laudrain> BillK: verioning is done elsewhere?
16:26:46 <rdeltour> q+
16:26:52 <garth> Q+
16:26:54 <tzviya> ack rd
16:27:00 <laudrain> Ivan: essentialy « I should be able to track changes »
16:27:23 <laudrain> Romain: « track changes » mean a lot in software dev
16:27:37 <laudrain> can we use teh word « edition » ?
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16:27:43 <tzviya> ack ga
16:27:46 <laudrain> Tzviya: means a lot 2
16:28:44 <leonardr> q+
16:28:55 <laudrain> Garth: package version isn’t changed by the distribution
16:29:14 <laudrain> Brady: doesn’t matter if all is in the same package
16:29:30 <ayla_stein> so maybe the method of distribution?
16:29:31 <HeatherF> a publisher, a librarian, or a standards developer
16:29:38 <tzviya> ack le
16:29:57 <laudrain> Leonard to fix versioning
16:30:35 <laudrain> current examples: 2 and 3, do we agree they stand in the same area?
16:30:50 <laudrain> BillK: they are different
16:31:10 <laudrain> Ivan: the 2nd work if we mean what Garth said
16:31:35 <laudrain> Leonard: they don’t say anything on package
16:32:08 <laudrain> Passing along isn’t necesseraly in the package way
16:32:43 <laudrain> Tzviya: keep these 2 examples to be rewritten
16:33:19 <laudrain> Ivan: one more thing in referencing to schema.org
16:33:32 <laudrain> For accessibility metadata
16:33:45 <Bill_Kasdorf> s/they are different/example 3 contains two separate issues
16:34:01 <laudrain> George or Romain: shema.org vocabulary
16:34:22 <laudrain> Charles: it is in progress
16:34:59 <laudrain> Avneesh: formal definition in the wiki page
16:35:15 <tzviya> q?
16:35:38 <laudrain> Leonard: some clean up in the next round
16:36:16 <laudrain> Tzviya: definition of a PWP? Portable or Packaged
16:36:28 <ivan> q+
16:36:32 <tzviya> ack iv
16:36:40 <tzviya> s/Tzviya/Leonard
16:37:29 <laudrain> ivan: Web publication and Packaged Web Publication? in the minutes of TPAC meeting
16:38:22 <HeatherF> second day more than the first
16:38:26 <laudrain> Garth: in the second day
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16:38:43 <HeatherF> first day was sort of hashing things out, second day was bringing it all together.
16:39:12 <ivan> https://github.com/w3c/dpub-pwp-ucr/wiki/Jotting-down-ideas-for-the-discussions-@-TPAC-F2F-on-%3F%3F-Web-Publications
16:39:30 <ivan> "A Web Publication is a collection of one or more Web resources in standard formats, organized together into a uniquely identifiable grouping."
16:39:59 <clapierre> Here are the other two pending accessibility Pending metadata properties.  https://pending.schema.org/accessibilitySummary and https://pending.schema.org/accessModeSufficient
16:40:01 <laudrain> Ivan: workng definitions (see link above)
16:40:01 <leonardr> +1 to @ivan
16:40:13 <leonardr> q+
16:40:34 <tzviya> ack le
16:41:13 <liam> present+
16:41:20 <laudrain> Leonard: great def, we want also games
16:42:02 <laudrain> Tzviya: hope for a very braod umbrella spec, and also EPUB4 in it
16:42:23 <tzviya> q?
16:42:25 <laudrain> Ivan: that introduction can be used as a start
16:42:35 <dauwhe__> q+
16:43:06 <laudrain> Leonard: next issue capabiliies of discovery under security
16:43:37 <laudrain> permission APIs, preserving integrity
16:43:41 <tzviya> ack da
16:44:53 <laudrain> Dave: section 2.6 on collections, usage examples not clear that it describes collection of Web collections
16:45:01 <ivan> q+
16:45:06 <laudrain> just collecting some stuff
16:45:33 <laudrain> Leonard: old version « bunch of stuff orgnised together"
16:45:50 <laudrain> conceptual publicaiotn gathered togethre
16:45:57 <laudrain> Now in a logicla unit
16:46:08 <laudrain> s/logicla/logical
16:46:08 <tzviya> ack iv
16:46:49 <laudrain> Dave: the 2nb usage, multiple paths to the publication
16:46:58 <tzviya> s/2nb/2nd
16:47:25 <laudrain> Ivan: is it a fondamental req?
16:47:40 <leonardr> q+
16:47:52 <laudrain> open the door to meta publication
16:48:02 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
16:48:13 <laudrain> Tzviya: this was the issue I wanted to raise
16:48:41 <laudrain> We need to clarify what that means
16:48:56 <tzviya> ack le
16:49:02 <laudrain> Dave: metadata betwenn the pub and the content itself
16:49:42 <ivan> q+
16:50:03 <tzviya> ack bi
16:50:03 <laudrain> Leanard: from the doc perspective : combining multiple sources together to a new document
16:50:26 <dauwhe__> q+
16:50:43 <laudrain> BiilK: fundamental definition : publicaiotn is a recource of resources
16:50:49 <tzviya> ack iv
16:51:34 <laudrain> Ivan: this is part of the production of a publication
16:51:47 <tzviya> ack da
16:51:59 <laudrain> nuke the whole thing
16:52:11 <leonardr> I agree with @Bill_Kasdorf and @Ivan - a publication is just another type of resource.  And would be fine nuking the section.
16:52:24 <laudrain> Dave: individual items need to be a publication?
16:52:42 <laudrain> BillK it can be but not necessarily
16:52:48 <ivan> q?
16:53:04 <laudrain> Dave: complicaiotn will be a mess
16:53:27 <laudrain> Ivan: nuclear option
16:53:40 <clapierre> +1 Nuke it
16:53:58 <garth> Remove section 2.6
16:54:09 <laudrain> Tzviay metadata associated with sub resources
16:54:18 <HeatherF> Yay for Leonard!
16:54:30 <laudrain> Tzviya: thank you Leonard!
16:54:33 <leonardr> you are welcome.
16:55:01 <laudrain> Tzviya: document reorg
16:55:02 <ivan> q+
16:55:05 <leonardr> yes, some of them are very good, @Ivan
16:55:06 <tzviya> ack iv
16:55:41 <laudrain> Ivan: one more task to do
16:56:21 <laudrain> discussion with Markus, « there is a use case we should add »
16:56:47 <leonardr> q+
16:57:06 <laudrain> example: for the packaged version, a way to ensure integrity of the package
16:57:10 <tzviya> ack le
16:57:21 <laudrain> after Heather is done with teh cleanup
16:57:34 <laudrain> s/teh/the
16:58:00 <laudrain> Heather: get started this week, something for the 24
16:58:04 <leonardr> q+
16:58:10 <tzviya> ack le
16:58:52 <laudrain> Ivan: merging Leonard branch is the simpliest thing to do
16:59:22 <laudrain> Tzviya: Charles any objection
16:59:37 <laudrain> Charles: i’ll take a look after the merge
16:59:54 <laudrain> Leonard: i’ll do it
17:00:01 <ivan> q+
17:00:04 <tzviya> ack iv
17:00:52 <laudrain> Ivan: we will ping Markus when the doc is in review
17:01:03 <ivan> s/Markus/Marcos/
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17:01:58 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:01:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/10/10-dpub-minutes.html ivan
17:02:08 <ivan> trackbot, end telcon
17:02:08 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
17:02:08 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been tzviya, Heather_Flanagan, ivan, Leonard_Rosenthol, laudrain, Charles_LaPierre, rdeltour, ayla_stein, Peter, Krautzberger, dauwhe,
17:02:11 <Zakim> ... Bill_Kasdorf, duga, Chris_Maden, garth, Ben_De_Meester, liam
17:02:16 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
17:02:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/10/10-dpub-minutes.html trackbot
17:02:17 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
17:02:17 <RRSAgent> I see no action items