W3C

- DRAFT -

Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference

28 Jul 2016

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
(no, one), Laura, Wayne, AWK
Regrets
shawn, JohnR
Chair
jim
Scribe
AllanJ

Contents


who is here?

<Wayne> scribe, wayne

<Wayne> Extra Agenda:

<Wayne> Jim: We will be sending out a poll, the conflict with Mobil hurts.

Review: Techniques needed for Icon Fonts are there implications for LV users?

https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues/144#issuecomment-231309107

<laura> Techniques needed for Icon Fonts #144

<laura> https://github.com/w3c/wcag/issues/144

<laura> Using aria-hidden="true" on an icon font that AT should ignore

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_aria-hidden%3Dtrue_on_an_icon_font_that_AT_should_ignore

<laura> Icon Font with an On-Screen Text Alternative

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Icon_Font_with_an_On-Screen_Text_Alternative

<laura> Using aria-hidden="true" on Unicode characters that AT should ignore

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_a_Decorative_Unicode_Character

<laura> Unicode Character with an On-Screen Text Alternative

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Providing_an_On-Screen_Text_Alternative_for_an_Icon_Font

discussion of off-screen vs on-screen alternative

with all the usability studies about the hamburger menu, on-screen alternative better for everyone

is this a magnifier issue? or what is the issue with icon fonts and unicode characters?

scott: Zoomtext had issues previously, seems to be fixed. Unicode character text to speech engine may or may not speak?

awk: there are some unicode characters don't have a text alternative

scott: some speech engines don't recognize the unicode characters. there is a problem with replacement unicode characters - substituting an icon for an unicode entitity
... then user gets a box - no icon, or a label that makes no sense in relation to context or the icon

awk: need to mindful of issues. unicode private use area...
... on a page have a font as a ligature "home", announced as house, but the character is a picture of house
... don't want to say "icon fonts are bad" need nuance

wayne: icon fonts can be made very large. problem is with the naming - have things spoken with text to speech. they are very unpredicable
... chaotic with icon fonts

<Wayne> scott: Because it is private use there is not map to the character?

scott: hard to tell what the icon is, and speech doesn't help. hard to put a tooltip on an icon font.
... from LV perspective they are ok, IF authors are following the other rules.

awk: so a screen reader issue (text to speech)

<AWK> http://timepiece.inostudio.de

wayne: LV users use screen readers
... some work, some don't

awk: when do they work, when don't they. need to define the work/non-work

scott: clock, screen reader sees it, reads it.
... if one character so a screen reader says multiple words. or are we limited to one character?

<Wayne> I have these issues: 1) Sometimes I cannot see the icon because it has too little contrast or is too complex, 2) when I listen there is not text alternative.

awk: then they use ligature (combined characters). data is 2 or more characters, but onscreen is 1 character. but screen reader sees word.
... need to word techniques to allow things done properly. and define what is "done properly"

wayne: need simple, good contrast, and text alternative.

awk: explains concept. will write page for examples of icon fonts, with ligature - so screen reader works, change fonts and word appears and icon vanishes. need some examples

laura: can we review each technique

scott: awk approach may work. may be cognitive issue. need some issue where icon makes no sense...need mechanism to have words -- fail gracefully
... tool time, or turn off icons and get words

<ScottM> something is wrong with IRC

<ScottM> I keep getting disconnected...

<laura> Using aria-hidden="true" on an icon font that AT should ignore

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_aria-hidden%3Dtrue_on_an_icon_font_that_AT_should_ignore

<laura> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/tests/iconfonts/decorative.html

aria hidden = true Icon Font

showing heading with red triangle. private area character.

not announce because hidden by aria

<laura> Icon Font with an On-Screen Text Alternative

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Icon_Font_with_an_On-Screen_Text_Alternative

On screen

<laura> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/tests/iconfonts/onscreen_alt.html

<laura> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/tests/iconfonts/onscreen_alt_in_link.html

<laura> Using aria-hidden="true" on Unicode characters that AT should ignore

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_a_Decorative_Unicode_Character

the ones with unicode are very similar. all work with a screen reader

<laura> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/tests/unicode/decorative.html

<laura> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Providing_an_On-Screen_Text_Alternative_for_an_Icon_Font

<laura> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/tests/unicode/onscreen_alt.html

<laura> http://www.d.umn.edu/~lcarlson/wcagwg/tests/unicode/onscreen_alt_in_link.html

must have empty span with aria-hidden=true to keep "anything" from being spoken

wayne: serious authoring issue to get a character on the screen.
... Laura's are good techniques

<ScottM> KISS is always best (Keep it simple stupid) :)

3 points - need words, need good contrast, need simple icons

awk: may be 1 technique, hiding disruptive content using unsupported font information.

laura: different ways to code.

awk: may get push back is always words.

ja: add points to techniques...not the SC

laura: all have aria-hidden, different ways to code.

awk: are icon fonts a problem, and what is the problem.
... laura's techniques are about assistive technology.

wayne: if you can't distinguish the character, you need the words

scott: you need the words if you can't understand the 1 character (icon),

ja: change the preamble to say not AT and AT users. include wayne's points

<laura> New Low Vision SC to set baseline contrast for images & icons that convey information (WCAG Issue 96)

<laura> https://github.com/w3c/low-vision-SC/issues/3

awk: uncomfortable about defining icon fonts. some character/glyph/etc what has meaning to whom under what conditions
... unicode left facing triange, has meaning, and screen readers speak correctly... its a matter of use and context

<Wayne> AWK: We are not sure what icon fonts are. Icon font is not as clear. Letters like A or Chinese characters have unque identification. Icon fonts are not unique in their interpretation. What does an Icon font mean?

awk: information must be correctly expressed and presented/rendered properly

<Wayne> Scott: Limit letters to the natural language of the page.

<Wayne> s: An Icon is established, but what does it mean.

<Wayne> s: Has meaning in the context of the page. Words and letters have meaning in the context of their language.

<Wayne> trackbot, end meeting

Summary of Action Items

Summary of Resolutions

[End of minutes]

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Present: (no one) Laura Wayne AWK
Regrets: shawn JohnR
Found Date: 28 Jul 2016
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