13:36:41 RRSAgent has joined #dap 13:36:41 logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/06/16-dap-irc 13:36:43 RRSAgent, make logs world 13:36:43 Zakim has joined #dap 13:36:45 Zakim, this will be DAP 13:36:45 ok, trackbot 13:36:46 Meeting: Device and Sensors Working Group Teleconference 13:36:46 Date: 16 June 2016 13:36:49 mats has joined #dap 13:37:20 Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0044.html 13:37:24 fjh has changed the topic to: agenda https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0044.html 13:37:45 Chair: Frederick_Hirsch 13:37:53 Present+ Frederick_Hirsch 13:38:11 Topic: Welcome, scribe selection, agenda review, announcements 13:48:25 fjh_ has joined #dap 13:58:52 Andrey_Logvinov has joined #dap 14:00:06 Present+ Dom 14:01:27 Present+ Andrey_Logvinov 14:01:44 anssik has joined #dap 14:01:52 Present+ Anssi_Kostiainen 14:01:59 ScribeNick: dom 14:04:06 fjh_ has joined #dap 14:04:38 TPAC 2016 registration - https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0043.html 14:04:49 FJH: reminder of TPAC registration; not sure I'll be able to make it myself 14:04:58 ... We had an updated WD of wake lock 14:05:02 WakeLock API published as WD https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0010.html 14:05:12 Topic: Minutes approval 14:05:27 RESOLUTION: Minutes from 2 June 2016 are approved http://www.w3.org/2016/06/02-dap-minutes 14:05:29 +1 to approve 14:05:35 Topic: Battery 14:05:40 updated tests https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0040.html 14:05:45 FJH: what's the status on battery? 14:06:06 Anssi: Firefox was failing a couple of tests; we thought the problem was in Firefox, but it turned out that our test case was wrong 14:06:14 ... (Chrome was thus wrong) 14:06:24 ... we've updated the test case and the test results 14:06:39 ... and we can conclude the failure is not related to the battery API, but a broader issue with Chrome 14:06:39 q+ 14:06:51 ack dom 14:06:54 ... so I don't think it should block 14:07:13 dom: Boris is still commenting that test case has issue due to race condition 14:07:24 dom: where is the implementation report? 14:07:38 anssik: new person taking on work, so need to follow up 14:07:49 action: anssik to get new updated test report 14:07:49 Created ACTION-762 - Get new updated test report [on Anssi Kostiainen - due 2016-06-23]. 14:08:40 https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0040.html 14:10:05 Dom: once I have the updated report, I'll proceed with the next step for the Battery API Proposed Rec 14:10:50 anssik: latest test report update is 13 May 14:10:57 https://github.com/w3c/test-results/commit/c3e7c6e24c1f4783f66bfdd2c1fbe849fc4c5d61 14:11:36 anssik: so we have confirmed, test report needs an update 14:12:55 FJH: what will be needed from me for this? 14:12:58 Dom: not sure yet 14:12:59 Topic: Media Capture Update 14:13:07 https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0036.html 14:13:17 -> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jun/0036.html Anssi's update on implementations of HTML Media Capture 14:13:29 s/: Media Capture/: HTML Media Capture/ 14:13:46 Anssi: we don't have a second implementation (at least not a widely shipping one) 14:14:00 ... so we basically need to keep monitoring 14:15:05 Frederick: we have an open candidate rec with a call for implementation, so let's wait until we get the required level of implementation 14:15:23 Anssi: there was some interest from Ted@Apple? to add new feature to this spec 14:15:30 ... although that discussion kind of died out 14:15:42 ... maybe this will find more implementation and we can move forward 14:16:16 Frederick: we'll review this on a regular basis (e.g. every 6 months) 14:16:36 ... but I don't think there is any harm in keeping this open 14:16:41 Topic: Vibration PER 14:17:31 fjh_ has joined #dap 14:18:50 dom: talked with Phillippe Le Hegaret, plan to have revision of Page Visibility, couple of weeks 14:19:02 dom: need to decide what to do 14:19:10 dom: in favor of waiting for a few weeks 14:20:21 fjh: will they be doing PER 14:20:38 dom: no, they want to make substantive changes as well, so that'll need a full rec-track cycle 14:20:39 dom: no, need to go through REC track starting at FPWD, but FPWD might be enough for us 14:20:55 ... but referring to FPWD would likely be acceptable in this case 14:21:33 https://github.com/w3c/vibration/issues/7 14:22:14 dom: ok to fix this 14:23:13 general agreement on call to go with approach of watiing for FPWD related to Page VIsibility, not removing this, and going forward with PER, relying on Philliipe’s judgement on risk (which we agree with) 14:23:59 dom: will provide pull request 14:24:04 https://github.com/w3c/vibration/issues/10 14:24:29 anssi: andrey suggested requiring permission for vibration in a new issue 14:24:49 dom: wif we did this would not have implementations, would prefer to defer and and do PER, save for v2 14:24:49 ... obviously this isn't what existing implementations do, so would require a substantive change (not PER compatible) 14:24:56 Andrey_Logvinov: agree 14:25:00 ... so it sounds like more a v2 suggestion 14:25:13 +1 to PER without this, and then v2 14:25:24 makes sense to align with current implementations 14:25:34 fjh: makes sense to me as well 14:25:57 anssi: I'll tag it with v2 14:26:03 fjh: add a comment too 14:26:09 anssi: done 14:26:24 Topic: Sensor 14:27:28 fjh: So Tobie is taking up another spec 14:27:33 Anssi: yes, WebIDL 14:27:41 fjh: who can take over his work? 14:27:56 Anssi: I can contribute, and we have 2 new intel contributors from the Chromium implementation side 14:28:12 ... Our plan is to upstream the implementation and give feedback to the group based on that 14:28:23 ... and update the spec based on clarifications that emerge 14:28:48 ... there will be feedback coming in very soon, based on issues already identified in their implementation work 14:28:57 q+ to ask about wide review 14:29:11 ack dom 14:29:11 dom, you wanted to ask about wide review 14:29:41 dom: should we start the wide review process without tobie around? 14:30:04 anssi: I don't feel pressed to start it right now; the feedback we'll get will be in the order of clarifications 14:30:09 if we are getting feedback from Intel contributors we shoudl probably incorporate that first 14:30:14 ... When we get to CR we need to satisfy having completed CR 14:30:24 s/shoudl/should/ 14:30:25 s/completed CR/completed wide review 14:30:53 fjh: it seem more logical to see feedback integrated first before starting first review 14:31:06 ... esp if it's in the short term 14:31:24 anssi: sounds reasonable 14:31:50 ... the idea is to make sure the spec reflects the implementation, that is both precise and reflects reality 14:32:11 ... so it would make better use of reviewers time 14:32:31 ... I think we should aim at initiating wide review ahead of TPAC 14:33:30 dom: main issue is that TPAC is in September, which follows August that is always quiet 14:34:07 ... maybe we could start end of August? 14:34:17 Frederick: I was thinking earlier, in July 14:34:26 Dom: sounds even better to me if that's compatible with Anssi's timeline 14:34:36 Anssi: we already got a review from the TAG 14:34:47 ... not sure the horizontal groups need the fine tuning to make useful reviews 14:35:39 Dom: agreed re other horizontal groups 14:36:09 ... TAG would probably benefit from seeing the latest refinements 14:36:16 Anssi: so we can stage the reviews 14:36:44 Frederick: I'm not sure we need staging if a final doc is only a couple of weeks away 14:39:04 Dom: I guess it depends on the timeframe of getting these refinements in, and how confident we are of this timeframe 14:39:21 frederick: can you ask estimates from your colleagues Anssi? 14:39:39 Anssi: they'll raise issues as they implement; I'll ask for an estimate 14:40:38 Frederick: let's plan for generic wide review first week of July 14:40:53 ... if we're not ready for general wide review, we can start a staged review then 14:43:12 fjh_ has joined #dap 14:43:48 lets try to have wide review early july, incorporating changes, then stage as needed 14:44:03 note that Dom and Anssi will not be avaible mid July until end August 14:44:14 Topic: Wake Lock API 14:44:50 https://github.com/w3c/wake-lock/issues/64 14:45:07 Andrey: still one open issue about restricting wake lock requests to top level origin 14:45:39 https://github.com/w3c/wake-lock/issues/51 14:45:42 ... I have created a PR to address it 14:45:50 ... not sure how this works with permissions 14:46:12 ... inheritance 14:46:39 ... In Chromium, there is a proposal that the top level browsing context need to delegate permissions explicitly 14:47:26 Frederick: it sounds that permissions is a work in progress that is being developed 14:47:35 ... while same origin is already available today 14:47:37 ... is that correct? 14:48:08 Andrey: if so, maybe we should merge the PR 14:48:21 Dom: I think we should merge the PR and ask specific feedback from WebAppSec in our wide review 14:48:38 Frederick: yes; we should add a note to call attention on the discussion on permission 14:48:49 Andrey: OK, will create another PR with that note then 14:49:28 dom: once that done, we should start the wide review process as previously discussed? 14:49:31 Frederick: yes 14:53:52 Topic: Other Business 14:54:13 RRSAgent, draft minutes 14:54:13 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/16-dap-minutes.html dom 14:54:32 fjh: we should look at our schedules, possible cancel meetings in July/August. 14:54:42 fjh: I have conflict 28 July 14:55:01 fjh: also have conflict 30 June, can you chair Dom? 14:55:02 dom: yes 14:55:12 Topic: Adjourn 14:55:18 rrsagent, generate minutes 14:55:18 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/16-dap-minutes.html fjh 14:56:13 s/avaible/available/ 14:56:33 rrsagent,generate minutes 14:56:33 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/16-dap-minutes.html fjh 14:57:15 s;July/August.;July/August, given a number of people are on summer holiday.; 14:57:21 rrsagent, generate minutes 14:57:21 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/06/16-dap-minutes.html fjh 15:14:48 fjh_ has left #dap 16:39:12 Zakim has left #dap