13:00:22 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #sdwcov
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13:00:24 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
13:00:24 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #sdwcov
13:00:26 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be SDW
13:00:26 <Zakim> ok, trackbot
13:00:27 <trackbot> Meeting: Spatial Data on the Web Working Group Teleconference
13:00:27 <trackbot> Date: 18 May 2016
13:00:29 <ByronCinNZ> present+ ByronCinNZ
13:00:32 <phila> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:00:37 <phila> chair: billroberts
13:01:02 <billroberts> present+ billroberts
13:01:10 <dmitrybrizhinev> present+ dmitrybrizhinev
13:01:31 <Duo> present+ duo
13:01:31 <sam> present+ sam
13:01:59 <phila> agenda: https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Coverage-Telecon20160518
13:02:38 <phila> present+ phila
13:02:47 <Maik> present+ Maik
13:02:54 <roba> present+ Rob Atkinson
13:02:59 <phila> regrets+ ScottSimmons
13:05:13 <jonblower> jonblower has joined #sdwcov
13:05:27 <jonblower> present+ jonblower
13:05:37 <Kerry> Kerry has joined #sdwcov
13:05:53 <Kerry> present+ kerry
13:05:57 <Kerry> scribe: kerry
13:06:03 <billroberts> https://www.w3.org/2016/05/04-sdwcov-minutes
13:06:03 <Kerry> scribeNick: kerry
13:06:09 <Kerry> chair: billroberts
13:06:31 <Kerry> proposed: approve minutes https://www.w3.org/2016/05/04-sdwcov-minutes
13:06:39 <phila> +1
13:06:41 <billroberts> +1
13:06:43 <Duo> +1
13:06:45 <Maik> +1
13:06:46 <Kerry> +1
13:06:59 <Kerry> resolved: approve minutes
13:07:06 <billroberts> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Patent_Call
13:07:44 <billroberts> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Coverage-Telecon20160518
13:07:56 <Kerry> topic: Brief recap of previous meeting
13:09:01 <phila> zakim, code?
13:09:01 <Zakim> I have been told this is SDW
13:09:02 <roba> thanks bill - will provide a very quick statement of intent
13:09:41 <phila> zakim, this is SDW COV https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m43518e4b18b34cafab570b12e0dc39be pw sdw Meeting no. 642 889 345 (+1-617-324-0000)
13:09:41 <Zakim> got it, phila
13:09:42 <Kerry> billroberts: handy template for FPWD
13:09:48 <phila> zakim, save this description
13:09:48 <Zakim> this conference description has been saved, phila
13:09:58 <Kerry> topic: Updates on example implementations: ANU
13:10:02 <Duo> http://anu-linked-earth-data.github.io/#/
13:10:10 <Kerry> Duo: basic demo at link
13:10:43 <Kerry> ....very simple client app, have taken a small landsat subset from agdc and loaded to jena and built client app to access data as rdf
13:10:59 <Duo> https://github.com/ANU-Linked-Earth-Data/ontology
13:11:04 <Kerry> ...data currently loaded dynamically as RDF datacube in Jena
13:11:30 <Kerry> ...2nd lin is ontology repository, shows datatime, resolution, band etc
13:12:00 <Kerry> ,,,client app does basic time-based search over tiny data, can click on a particular area
13:12:12 <Kerry> ...also a link button to link to data itself, but now a dummy
13:12:29 <Kerry> .... looking for some more data and more complex queries and multiple bands
13:12:32 <jonblower> q+
13:12:44 <billroberts> ack q
13:12:47 <billroberts> ack j
13:13:08 <Kerry> jonblower:  very nice, but didn't get is ontology describing pixes or a big binary blob?
13:13:17 <roba> q+
13:13:37 <Kerry> Duo: binary blobs becuase pixiels are too big -- we tested this and discussed at an elalier meeting
13:13:38 <Maik> http://144.6.231.77/landsat/query?query=PREFIX%20xsd%3A%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.w3.org%2F2001%2FXMLSchema%23%3E%20PREFIX%20led%3A%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23%3E%20SELECT%20%3Fsubject%20%3FgeoSparql%20%3FtimePeriod%20%3Fband%20%3Fimage%20%3Fresolution%20WHERE%20{%3Fsubject%20a%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fpurl.org%2Flinked-data%2Fcube%23Observation%3E.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.
13:13:38 <Maik> example.org%2FANU-LED%23imageData%3E%20%3Fimage.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23etmBand%3E%20%3Fband.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23bounds%3E%20%3FgeoSparql.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23time%3E%20%3FtimePeriod.%20%3Fsubject%20%3Chttp%3A%2F%2Fwww.example.org%2FANU-LED%23resolution%3E%20%3Fresolution.%20Filt
13:13:38 <Maik> er%28%3FtimePeriod%20%3D%20%222012-02-10T23%3A50%3A47.650696%2B00%3A00%22^^xsd%3AdateTime%29}ORDER%20BY%20DESC%28%3FtimePeriod%29%20LIMIT%2025
13:13:47 <Kerry> billroberts: can we ss the rdf?
13:14:10 <Kerry> duo: see query and json result here
13:14:24 <Kerry> ... maik has posted  [what?]
13:14:33 <Kerry> billroberts:  please post a link to the rdf
13:14:33 <billroberts> ack roba
13:15:39 <Kerry> roba: looking at ontology on link .. has a lot of axes concepts.. how does this realte to rdf datacube -- it is different
13:15:58 <Kerry> dmitrybrizhinev: it inherits from rdf-datacube -- are you looking at right link?
13:16:06 <Kerry> roba: maybe not
13:16:08 <phila> I think it's https://github.com/ANU-Linked-Earth-Data/ontology/blob/master/ANU-LED.owl
13:16:10 <Maik> (my link works, just copy paste it in full, don't click on it)
13:16:20 <Kerry> dmitrybrizhinev: you need to look at anuld
13:16:24 <billroberts> q?
13:16:33 <Duo> q+
13:16:42 <Kerry> billroberts: will take a proper look afterwards
13:17:31 <Kerry> Duo: on top of that we had a chat with rob woodcock (AGDC) about uses of link data and coverage, and a similar chat with ed parsons
13:18:31 <Kerry> ...Rob wants us to be smarter about queries e.g summer above tropic of capricorn
13:18:41 <Kerry> ..or every second month
13:19:01 <Kerry> ... does not like resampling becuase sicentists don't like it
13:19:06 <roba> I have already captured these alternative use cases here: https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Data_cube_for_coverage
13:19:15 <billroberts> ack d
13:19:47 <Kerry> ...also meeting at ANU Fenner school wher eenvironmental data on a map was broken into "meaningful" regions
13:20:10 <phila> q+
13:20:11 <jonblower> q+
13:20:18 <Kerry> ...ed wants to see restful APIs over SPARQL, things that startups can access
13:20:20 <billroberts> ack p
13:20:49 <Kerry> phila: wnat to use some of this for the Chinese project report
13:21:13 <Kerry> ...if I were not an rdfhead what is the point?
13:22:36 <Kerry> duo: still early stages... describing data in a meaningful way.. by having it here can be easier to access.. heading towards resful approach without sparql
13:22:44 <roba> q+
13:23:04 <Kerry> phila: i see a column with diagonal black stripes -- what is this to a non-expert?
13:23:55 <Kerry> Duo: this is an artifact of lansat -- many people want this - it is in the data
13:24:03 <billroberts> q?
13:24:47 <Kerry> ... if you don't want this this may not be what you want
13:25:17 <Kerry> phila: want to tell people this is a good way to stitch them together
13:25:29 <billroberts> ack j
13:26:08 <Kerry> jonblower: what do users need is a good question? yes scientists often want it close to original, but others want the over  visual
13:26:16 <Kerry> q+
13:26:44 <Kerry> ...good to bring these issues out
13:26:55 <billroberts> ack roba
13:27:00 <Kerry> bill: creates rquirement for metadata
13:27:08 <phila> q+ to make a quick aside about https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/WD-dwbp-20160519/#EnrichData
13:27:52 <Kerry> roba: i know believe that we may not want to turn all inot rdfdatacube but this is a useful test of the competency of the model
13:27:59 <billroberts> ack kerry
13:28:31 <phila> Kerry: There's a deeper question in there. The RDF QB is only appropriate for moderately well developed imagary as oyu're assuming it's laid out on a regular grid.
13:28:52 <roba> rdf-QB does not assume a grid. its agnostic about dimensions
13:29:08 <phila> ... There's a slightly deeper problem, it's not juyst about what has been done to the data. It's also about how far we go in saying what the satellite image shows.
13:29:16 <phila> ... I'm happy with this though
13:29:33 <phila> ... What is an appropriate data model for represetning coverage in general.
13:30:53 <phila> Kerry: Not all coverages map into easy data models
13:31:33 <Kerry> jonblower: convenient that AGDC is thinking about what level of pre-processing to do
13:31:45 <roba> q+
13:32:17 <Kerry> billroberts: we are going to have to deide if we need a suite of alternative solutions for say unprocessed towads that has been through a degree of processing
13:32:18 <phila> ack me
13:32:18 <Zakim> phila, you wanted to make a quick aside about https://www.w3.org/TR/2016/WD-dwbp-20160519/#EnrichData
13:32:57 <Kerry> phila: discussion abouit various access to dat reminds me that DWBP doc that will be last call tomorrow and asking for reviews
13:32:59 <jonblower> q+
13:33:29 <Kerry> ...there is a BP on "data enrichment"  and you need to say which value are processed and which are raw.
13:33:35 <Kerry> ...hoping someone will look at this
13:33:37 <billroberts> ack roba
13:34:01 <phila> phila has changed the topic to: The SDW Coverages Sub Group channel
13:34:28 <Kerry> roba: my undertanding that rdf datacuibe does not require regular dimensions..i am looking at gridded things
13:34:57 <billroberts> ack jon
13:35:00 <Kerry> billroberts: yes, may be one-dimansional eg all the towns in australia
13:35:23 <phila> s/imagary as oyu're/imagery as you're/
13:35:38 <Kerry> jonblower: th3e other thing about users is that they can go from one type to the other but they need an entry point to start low and help people to ramp up
13:35:51 <Kerry> ..by linking between representations and processing steps
13:36:09 <Kerry> topic:  University of Reading/CoverageJSON
13:36:17 <Maik> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ceo-ld/2016May/0000.html
13:36:50 <Kerry> Maik: as on the CEO-Ld mailing list have added how to derive new data from existing data
13:37:16 <Kerry> ...also how you can tile things over x and y dimension in our format
13:37:31 <Maik> https://github.com/Reading-eScience-Centre/coveragejson/issues/29#issuecomment-219984916
13:37:36 <Kerry> ...and how to define static subsets based on axis indices like the cube indices
13:37:45 <Kerry> not finished yet
13:37:55 <Kerry> q?
13:38:10 <Kerry> q+
13:38:39 <billroberts> Rob's wiki page: https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Data_cube_for_coverage
13:38:45 <Kerry> roba: joined OGC Europe on cisizen science observatories
13:38:50 <Maik> s/x and y/any
13:38:57 <Kerry> ... problem that cuts across SDW BP
13:39:09 <Kerry> ... and a need to share resources
13:39:42 <Kerry> ...developing a methodology for describing interoperability profiles, wanting to test and promote SDB BPs
13:40:05 <Kerry> s/SDB/SDW/
13:40:40 <Kerry> ... particularly want datacube descriptions to model large numbers of related datasets that realte spatially and temporally for citizen sciences to use
13:40:55 <Kerry> ...want to test ideas coming from the group
13:41:32 <Kerry> q+
13:42:07 <billroberts> ack k
13:42:22 <phila> Kerry: We seem to have forgotten the linking issue
13:42:38 <phila> ... It seems to have gone down in the list of things we need to deal with.
13:42:57 <phila> ... Are we making this up and we don't need it, or is it really critical - which I think it is
13:43:01 <phila> billroberts: I think it's important
13:43:05 <roba> q+
13:43:12 <phila> Kerry: I'm not hearing it in the discussion today
13:43:27 <phila> billroberts: When I was working through the reqs, it does certainly come up in a lot of places
13:43:48 <billroberts> ack rob
13:43:48 <phila> ... Metadata bout Coverage datasets, you need  a mechanism to add metadata
13:44:06 <phila> roba: That's the basis of what we'll be demonstrating. using metadata to drive dynamic linking
13:44:24 <phila> ... Finding all the slices and dices through the coverage which we see as a linking use case
13:44:27 <Kerry> roba: want to use metadata to drive dynamic linking e.g. findin all slices and dices
13:44:30 <jonblower> q+
13:44:33 <phila> Kerry: Sounds like a discovery use case to me
13:44:38 <billroberts> ack jon
13:44:39 <phila> roba: That's a valid use of links
13:45:12 <Kerry> jonblower: but the melodies reasons are data annotation and linking to vocabularies that describe properties
13:45:42 <Kerry> billroberts: "omn the web" is important and sometimes its a simple as linked inot a web page
13:45:50 <Kerry> s/inot/into/
13:45:56 <billroberts> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Coverage_draft_requirements
13:46:02 <Kerry> topic:  Requirements doc: presentation and review of draft by Bill
13:46:36 <Kerry> billroberts: worked through UCR document and also BP document
13:46:49 <Kerry> ... worked through those high level requirements\
13:47:07 <Kerry> ... particularly coverage extracts in a web frinedly way
13:47:15 <Kerry> ...some things are clearer and some are not
13:47:18 <Kerry> ... q+
13:47:21 <Kerry> q+
13:47:40 <Kerry> .... will continue to tidy up and give me your thoughts...
13:47:51 <Kerry> and work through one issue at a time...
13:48:20 <Kerry> ...classification of requirements, started with coverage-related and some that should be
13:48:30 <Kerry> ..plus ones we brought up in meetings so far...
13:48:51 <Kerry> billroberts: ... some things we might want to pick up on
13:49:16 <Kerry> ... one thing is "discovery" e.f landsat archives
13:49:22 <Kerry> s/f/g/
13:49:31 <Kerry> ...not well soved at present for non-expert community
13:49:45 <Kerry> s/soved/solved/
13:50:34 <Kerry> ...another issues is identifiers for coverage extracts -- is such an identifier an aip spec for generating an extract
13:50:50 <Kerry> ...or is it a thing?
13:51:15 <Kerry> .... not possible to enumerate pre-prepared all possible exptracts, so you need some kind of api,
13:51:36 <jonblower> got a lot of half-baked thoughts on this that we probably don't have time to go into today...
13:51:48 <Kerry> ....we also want to make sure we have a good connection to ssn strand of work
13:51:59 <jonblower> (I mean I have, I wasn't minuting Bill's thoughts!)
13:52:10 <Kerry> ... seveal places we see that time is of equal status to spatial dimension
13:52:38 <Kerry> ...some additional requirements not mentioned in UCR section
13:52:54 <Kerry> ....also deciding what our target user groups are
13:53:04 <Kerry> ....what is easy for some person is not so good for others
13:53:16 <Kerry> ...planing to schedule a few of these per discussion
13:53:19 <Kerry> q+
13:53:21 <billroberts> q?
13:53:31 <billroberts> ack k
13:53:49 <phila> Kerry: I had a look at the doc and had some ideas for little bits here and there.
13:54:06 <phila> ... Can I suggest that you invite people to commnet on the doc in situ?
13:54:21 <phila> ... I think it's better that people edit the wiki and attach their names/comment
13:54:34 <phila> ... That might work better than e-mails with bits and pieces flying around.
13:54:43 <phila> billroberts: +1
13:56:31 <Kerry> billroberts: yes, please edit wiki directly, and use the "this is a minor edit" to not send emails if appropriate
13:56:57 <phila> Wiki pages have a history tab so you can see who has done what
13:57:07 <Kerry> ...this is good for a frequent save strategy
13:57:18 <Kerry> ...please stick you name on your comments
13:58:38 <Kerry> ... BP meeting next
13:58:52 <Kerry> billroberts: any further comments?
13:59:01 <phila> RRSAgent, draft minutes
13:59:01 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/18-sdwcov-minutes.html phila
13:59:10 <Kerry> ....good stuff being done, thanks!
13:59:19 <billroberts> bye
13:59:21 <Kerry> rrsagent, make logs public
13:59:24 <phila> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:59:28 <phila> RRSAgent, draft minutes
13:59:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/18-sdwcov-minutes.html phila
13:59:28 <Kerry> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:59:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/05/18-sdwcov-minutes.html Kerry
13:59:38 <roba> \join #sdw
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