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12:01:08 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-wot-irc
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12:08:27 <Yingying> chair: Matthias
12:09:01 <Yingying> scribe: yingying
12:09:08 <mkovatsc> Maybe some are in a different WebEx?
12:09:19 <mkovatsc> The 2:30 CEST?
12:09:36 <mkovatsc> https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=me9f16a4f569cc10028cd92ed566d0eb6
12:12:38 <victor_charpenay> victor_charpenay has joined #wot
12:13:19 <mkovatsc> Correct access code: 645 704 477
12:14:29 <mkovatsc> Kaz where are you? :)
12:14:29 <Yingying> present: Matthias_Kovatsch, Michael_Koster, Ari_Keranen, Daniel_Peintner, Frank_Reusch, Masato_Ohura, Masato_Ohura, Ryuichi_Matsukura, Sefki_Kolozali, Takuki_Kamiya, Victor_Charpenay
12:15:13 <victor_charpenay> present+ Sebastian_Kaebisch
12:15:48 <Yingying> Topic: Webconf logistics
12:16:01 <Yingying> ->https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/IG_WebConf#Agenda_of_next_WoT_IG_WebConf:_27_Apr_2016
12:16:41 <Yingying> Matthias: I cleaned up the wiki.
12:17:37 <mkovatsc> access code: 645 704 477
12:17:43 <Yingying> ...about the Topic part, should we remove it? Is anybody use it?
12:19:09 <Yingying> ...if not, can we remove it?
12:19:41 <Yingying> -> https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_Page#Topics
12:20:13 <Yingying> Matthias: another part is the interest group part:
12:20:16 <Yingying> ->https://www.w3.org/WoT/IG/wiki/Main_Page#Interest_Group
12:20:32 <Yingying> ...can we have consensus on it?
12:21:12 <Yingying> ...I will send email to the mailing group to check people's opinion.
12:21:38 <Yingying> Topic: Eclipse Virtual IoT Webinars
12:21:48 <kaz_> rrsagent, make log public
12:21:51 <kaz_> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:21:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-wot-minutes.html kaz_
12:23:15 <Yingying> Matthias: it is on 16 Jun 2016. There should be interesting topic in the Webinar and the output would be useful for Beijing F2F meeting. I would like to put something by the google hangout and utube after the meeting.
12:23:31 <Yingying> Topic: IG re-charter
12:23:45 <Yingying> Matthias: Sebastian, could you update the status on it?
12:25:16 <Yingying> Sebastian: we should concentrate on the items we should address in the IG. My opinion is about what we should do in WG and what in IG?
12:25:29 <dape> Charter issue by Dave: https://github.com/w3c/charter-drafts/issues/67
12:25:57 <kaz_> -> https://w3c.github.io/charter-drafts/wot-ig-2016.html draft IG charter
12:26:03 <Yingying> ...it should be very clear what they should do respectively. And the groups should work together.
12:26:19 <Yingying> ...this kind of working way should be clear in the IG charter.
12:26:37 <Yingying> ...and we should mention the new items we should do in future.
12:27:05 <Yingying> ...we should also work together on the plugfest and evolution.
12:28:18 <mkovatsc> q+
12:28:25 <Yingying> ...there was also discussion how long the IG should be. Taki proposed it to last till 2017 TPAC.
12:29:12 <Yingying> ...people who work on two groups should be aware we should work together.
12:30:04 <Yingying> Taki: Dave had a long list of discussion points. How IG will work with WG and other groups? I drew this picture to help people understand what IG will do.
12:31:08 <akeranen> akeranen has joined #wot
12:31:08 <Yingying> ...IG needs to work with WG and other groups. This will give people a picture how IG will work with other groups.
12:31:23 <akeranen> present+ Ari_Keranen
12:31:27 <akeranen> q+
12:31:33 <Yingying> ...how IG will work internally is not showed in the picture. It's also another item we need to discuss.
12:31:57 <Yingying> Sebastian: I like this picture.
12:33:12 <kaz_> present+ kaz_ashimura
12:33:13 <mkovatsc> ack mkovatsc
12:33:25 <mkovatsc> ack akeranen
12:33:28 <Yingying> Matthias: I have some comments. The spec should be reviewed by other SDOs. And for the input/suggestion, IG should be in a supporting role.
12:33:54 <kaz_> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:33:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-wot-minutes.html kaz_
12:33:57 <victor_charpenay> q+
12:34:16 <Yingying> Ari: I have a similiar suggestion on the relationship between WG and SDOs. The WG should have direct link with other SDOs.
12:34:40 <kaz_> present+ Yingying_Chen
12:35:28 <Yingying> Victor: I propose that we add content of what the groups are working on in the picture.
12:35:37 <dape> q+
12:35:46 <kaz_> q?
12:36:09 <victor_charpenay> ack victor_charpenay
12:36:12 <Yingying> Matthias: the lifetime of the IG.
12:36:19 <kaz_> q+
12:36:25 <mkovatsc> ack dape
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12:37:19 <mkovatsc> q+
12:37:25 <mkovatsc> ack kaz_
12:37:28 <Yingying> Daniel: how could we reach out the external SDOs. Sometimes it is IG, sometimes it is WG. Would it be confusing to other SDOs?
12:37:58 <Yingying> Kaz: it might be better to separate the outside and internal part.
12:38:27 <katsu> katsu has joined #wot
12:38:34 <Yingying> ...the other SDOs could be moved to up-left and the other W3C groups could be much larger than now.
12:39:48 <mkovatsc> q?
12:39:51 <mkovatsc> ack mkovatsc
12:40:47 <Yingying> Matthias: should IG be the one connecting with the other SDOs?
12:41:12 <Yingying> [Kaz drew something on the picture]
12:41:33 <Yingying> Kaz: the interaction center to other SDOs should be the IG.
12:41:37 <dape> q+
12:41:46 <mkovatsc> ack dape
12:42:08 <akeranen> q+
12:42:16 <Yingying> Daniel: it's easier for the external SDOs to interact with IG.
12:42:49 <Yingying> ...not all the stuff we work on IG should go into WG. We explore new things in the IG.
12:43:12 <kaz> q?
12:43:48 <Yingying> Matthias: WG has the concrete specification. We need to get real feedback for the specification, not just try to reach out.
12:44:04 <Yingying> Kaz: yes that's true.
12:44:18 <victor_charpenay> q+
12:44:45 <mkovatsc> ack akeranen
12:44:49 <victor_charpenay> ack victor_charpenay
12:44:50 <Yingying> Matthias: 2 proposal on the collaboration with other SDOs. We would send to mailing list for more opinion.
12:45:09 <mkovatsc> q?
12:45:58 <Yingying> Ari: pretty confusing with the 2 groups. what is the role of one and the other, especially to external people.
12:46:34 <Yingying> ...how to collaborate with other SDOs. I assume other SDOs would prefer to work with WG directly.
12:46:37 <kaz> i/pretty/kaz: wondering about the difference between "Other SDOs" and "Interested parties". maybe could be one entity.
12:46:48 <mkovatsc> q?
12:46:51 <Yingying> ...if we would like to have IG do it, what is the reason?
12:47:22 <Yingying> Kaz: the IG is planned to be closed in one year.
12:48:01 <Yingying> Ari: that would be another reason to have the WG as the main contact point to other SDOs as IG will be closed earlier than WG.
12:48:24 <Yingying> Matthias: I would suggest to write down it as an ACTION for next call.
12:48:24 <kaz> s/the IG is planned to be closed in one year./there is another possibility that the IG will be closed once the WG is launched./
12:48:38 <mkovatsc> q?
12:48:39 <kaz> q?
12:49:09 <kaz> [ kaz has just recorded the webex diagram. ]
12:50:26 <Yingying> Kaz: we should clarify the procedure for the charter work.
12:51:10 <Yingying> ...we will use the github to do it but we can simply agree on the procedure.
12:51:37 <kaz> s/we can simply/we chould/
12:51:45 <Yingying> Matthias: there is no actual content yet. People can just use pull request to add content. People can add comments.
12:53:12 <Yingying> Kaz: maybe we should start with empty document first and add content through pull request.
12:53:28 <Yingying> ...if and only if the proposal is approved, we can add it into the repository.
12:53:42 <Yingying> Sebastian: I am also very agree on it.
12:54:04 <Yingying> ...should we send to mailing list for opinion or send out some tutorial on it.
12:54:43 <Yingying> Matthias: you can still propose something on the mailing list. Tutorial would be good for people to participate.
12:55:15 <Yingying> Sebastian: we need some person who can take care of it.
12:55:24 <kaz> [[
12:55:24 <kaz> - Starting with a template in GitHub that has only boilerplate, but no specific content.
12:55:25 <kaz> - Each topic of the charter is formulated in a draft and opens a pull-request.
12:55:25 <kaz> - We discuss each pull-request on GitHub, where we can comment on individual lines or give general feedback as comment on the PR.
12:55:25 <kaz> - The original author/editor updates the pull-request with new commits and only once we have consensus, we merge the charter topic.
12:55:27 <kaz> ]]
12:55:56 <mkovatsc> +1
12:56:49 <mkovatsc> - Comments on the mailing list are converted by [?W3C staff?] to GitHub comments and prull-requests
12:57:14 <Yingying> Kaz: if everybody is OK with the policy, which repository we should use? web of thing repository?
12:58:22 <kaz> s/prull/pull/
12:58:52 <dape> q+
12:59:00 <mkovatsc> ack dape
12:59:33 <Yingying> Daniel: about moving the charter to the wot repository, I agree on it.
12:59:53 <Yingying> ...how to make the move?
13:00:39 <kaz> i/everybody/kaz: can copy comments on the ML to the GitHub issue if some people are not sure about GitHub and prefer sending messages to the ML/
13:00:41 <Yingying> Kaz: github is just the editorial area. We can simply copy the charter from the charter area to wot area.
13:02:15 <Yingying> ...if we copy the html file, we maybe could not copy the whole history and issue.
13:02:44 <Yingying> Matthias: we should be careful we do not lose any issue.
13:03:19 <Yingying> Kaz: do we really need to copy the history and issue for such short period?
13:03:42 <Yingying> ...maybe we can simply copy the html and make pull request in the new area.
13:05:26 <mkovatsc> q?
13:06:28 <Yingying> Topic: Plugfest preparation: Status reports of each action item
13:06:31 <victor_charpenay> https://github.com/vcharpenay/wot/tree/master/TF-TD/TD%20Extensions#datatypes
13:08:01 <Yingying> Daniel goes through the document.
13:09:03 <Yingying> Victor: do you see any issue on this structure or anything missing?
13:09:16 <Yingying> s/Daniel goes/Victor goes/
13:09:39 <Yingying> ...every body is encouraged to add comments on the document.
13:10:22 <Yingying> ...we made some examples on the comparison of the different schema.
13:11:28 <Yingying> rrsagent, make minutes
13:11:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-wot-minutes.html Yingying
13:12:37 <Yingying> ...we are currently modeling the schema. We encourage poeple to use JSON schema.
13:13:18 <SefkiKolozali_UniS_> What about OWL?
13:13:20 <Yingying> Daniel: JSON schema would be a better solution but your comments are welcom.
13:13:24 <michael> Q=
13:13:32 <michael> q+
13:13:55 <Yingying> Victor: do you refer to data type definition?
13:15:21 <Yingying> ...we want a very simple schema definition language.
13:16:02 <Yingying> Matthias: suggest to add what you want to do at the very beginning for people to add comments.
13:16:12 <Yingying> ...do you have any timeline of it?
13:16:48 <Yingying> Victor: not really. by the end of this week, we will have an example to show you.
13:17:55 <Yingying> Matthias: by the end of this week, the document should be useful for people to comments. People could prepare comments for the next meeting. is that ok?
13:18:15 <Yingying> Victor: alright we will make it.
13:18:48 <Yingying> Topic: TD/PB: (experimental) formal specification of the protocol binding [Matthias]
13:19:18 <Yingying> Matthias: we have added the document to the github.
13:19:52 <Yingying> ...the timeline is initial document will be ready on May 6th.
13:20:15 <Yingying> ...the test case document update is not done yet.
13:21:12 <Yingying> ...we have a document on github. On June 24 we have release candidate for online pre-testing.
13:21:31 <Yingying> ...We will discuss the details offline.
13:21:49 <Yingying> Topic:  Architecture update ("implementation view") [Matsukura-san/Nimura-san]
13:22:45 <Yingying> Kazuaki: we have no document to show today. currently I am working on the document. I can talk about it in next week.
13:23:11 <Yingying> ...I am trying to update use case document as well.
13:23:42 <Yingying> Matthias: should I roughly schedule you in 2 weeks?
13:23:49 <Yingying> Kazuaki: yes please.
13:24:52 <Yingying> Matthias: let's discuss the agenda for next meeting. Victor should I add one item for you to update the schema proposal.
13:25:07 <toru> present+ Toru_Kawaguchi
13:26:10 <dape> q+
13:28:40 <Yingying> Topic: Action Items
13:29:46 <Yingying> yingying: we would like to decide the venue in May and to have the network testing when it's decided.
13:29:50 <mkovatsc> q?
13:30:03 <mkovatsc> ack michael
13:30:05 <dape> ack dape
13:30:16 <Yingying> Matthias: about the revised draft review, Kaz and Dave are not here. I will start the discuss in the mailing list.
13:30:49 <mkovatsc> q?
13:32:15 <taki> taki has left #wot
13:32:33 <Yingying> rrsagent, make minutes
13:32:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-wot-minutes.html Yingying
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