13:09:48 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #webtv
13:09:48 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-webtv-irc
13:10:03 <JF> agenda?
13:10:15 <JF> zakim, who is here?
13:10:15 <Zakim> Present: (no one)
13:10:17 <Zakim> On IRC I see RRSAgent, Zakim, JF, alexandra_mikityuk, kaz, Karen, trackbot, timeless, tobie, sangwhan, yhirano_
13:10:26 <JF> Present+ JF
13:14:41 <alexandra_mikityuk> Kaz, are you there?
13:14:48 <JF> TAG = TEchnical ARchitecture Group
13:15:16 <alexandra_mikityuk> OK
13:18:28 <kaz> Meeting: Cloud Browser
13:18:42 <kaz> present+ Kaz, Alex, Harrison, John, So
13:18:50 <kaz> zakim, pick a scribe
13:18:50 <Zakim> Not knowing who is chairing or who scribed recently, I propose JF
13:19:16 <kaz> scribe: kaz
13:19:19 <kaz> scribenick: kaz
13:19:41 <kaz> alex: would look at the plan
13:19:50 <kaz> ... bullet points on my notes
13:20:18 <kaz> -> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2016Apr/0003.html Alex's note
13:20:35 <alexandra_mikityuk> agenda Arch +
13:20:51 <alexandra_mikityuk> agenda UC assignment +
13:20:54 <alexandra_mikityuk> agenda?
13:21:10 <alexandra_mikityuk> agenda + Arch
13:21:22 <alexandra_mikityuk> agenda + UC assignment
13:21:30 <kaz> zakim, take up agendum 1
13:21:30 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Arch" taken up [from alexandra_mikityuk]
13:23:34 <JF> Q+
13:24:12 <kaz> alex: DOM tree within the cloud browser
13:24:25 <kaz> ... can mention that
13:24:40 <kaz> ... but should we add a chapter on that?
13:24:58 <kaz> jf: you have to expose the DOM tree to some of the users
13:25:23 <kaz> ... the problem is that if I can't see or can't hear
13:25:38 <kaz> ... I can't see the dancing picture, etc., on the screen
13:25:55 <kaz> ... in that case should use the accessibility APIs for DOM
13:26:12 <kaz> ... HTML5 guys also have similar problems with Canvas
13:26:26 <kaz> ... what to do with shadow DOM
13:26:52 <kaz> ... would provide this kind of feedback for the discussion
13:27:03 <kaz> alex: can you provide resources on Shadow DOM?
13:27:15 <JF> https://www.w3.org/TR/2015/WD-shadow-dom-20151215/
13:27:22 <kaz> q+
13:27:27 <kaz> ack J
13:27:45 <kaz> jf: just pasted the link to Shadow DOM spec
13:28:33 <kaz> ... the other thing we have to think is we can't assume every user can use TV remote
13:28:48 <kaz> alex: we need to identify communication use cases
13:28:53 <kaz> q?
13:29:14 <kaz> alex: apart of that, maybe questions from Harrison and Kaz
13:29:53 <kaz> ... we should add a section for DOM tree including shadow dom
13:29:56 <kaz> q?
13:31:18 <JF> +1 to thinking about modalities - that is a high-level (related) accessibility issue as well
13:31:46 <alexandra_mikityuk> q?
13:31:49 <kaz> kaz: this discussion made me think that we may want to think about user preferred modality for cloud browsers in addition to directly handle DOM tree on the cloud browser side
13:32:04 <kaz> alex: ok
13:32:13 <kaz> ... that was DOM tree discussion
13:32:21 <kaz> ... and what the functionality should be?
13:32:35 <kaz> ... what would be the best way for the group to handle this?
13:32:49 <kaz> present+ Steve
13:33:26 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Main_Page/Cloud_Browser_TF/UseCases cloud browser use case wiki
13:34:09 <kaz> alex: we're discussing cloud browser architecture and functionalities
13:34:36 <kaz> ... some of the rendering result sent from the cloud browser to the local side
13:34:49 <kaz> s/on the cloud browser side/on the local side/
13:35:10 <kaz> ... this would be rather confusing because we're thinking about APIs
13:35:38 <kaz> ... what we have done is hard-coded things
13:36:18 <kaz> ... cloud browser for gaming and remote desk top
13:36:28 <kaz> ... this is the first approach
13:36:47 <kaz> ... and then would think about cable infrastructure, etc.
13:37:27 <kaz> ... some of them are kind of artificial, though
13:37:35 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:37:35 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-webtv-minutes.html kaz
13:37:52 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
13:37:54 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:37:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-webtv-minutes.html kaz
13:38:01 <kaz> ... what are the basic functions
13:38:13 <kaz> ... video rendering, scrambling, etc.
13:38:25 <kaz> ... basic set of functionalities
13:38:41 <kaz> s/(no one), //
13:38:47 <kaz> Chair:Alexandra
13:39:14 <kaz> alex: if we talk about cloud browser on every single cloud
13:39:38 <kaz> ... how to put the architecture chapter?
13:39:48 <kaz> ... would make things easier
13:39:51 <alexandra_mikityuk> q?
13:39:54 <kaz> q-
13:40:17 <kaz> ... should we extend the document?
13:40:52 <alexandra_mikityuk> q?
13:41:04 <kaz> harrison: your question sounds reasonable
13:41:14 <kaz> ... we can split out all our requirements
13:41:27 <JF> Q+ to say that dancing pixels is almost the least complicated issue
13:41:48 <kaz> ... one question is from our diagram we only two components
13:42:33 <kaz> ... we should have additional components
13:42:38 <kaz> ... to make things clearer
13:43:03 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Main_Page/Cloud_Browser_TF#architecture architecture wiki
13:46:55 <kaz> alex: shows updated diagrams
13:48:00 <kaz> harrison: cloud browser is the key player
13:49:00 <kaz> ... from this diagram, cloud browser does everything
13:49:38 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/File:Ss-cp.png SS CP
13:52:32 <kaz> -> https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/File:Ds-lp.png DS LP
13:53:41 <kaz> jf: wondering what the cloud browser client is
13:54:37 <kaz> ... less clear about the interaction
13:54:43 <kaz> ... how to click the link?
13:54:56 <kaz> alex: you can receive any kind of results
13:56:09 <kaz> jf: still not sure about local runtime environment
13:56:38 <kaz> kaz: maybe we should clarify the lifecycle of cloud browsing session
13:56:42 <kaz> jf: would be useful
13:56:50 <kaz> alex: please give me an action
13:57:14 <kaz> ... basic motivation of cloud browsing is that the client is not an actual browser
13:59:03 <kaz> kaz: maybe we could call "Cloud Browsing server" for the "cloud browser"
13:59:36 <kaz> ... and "Cloud Browsing client" for the "cloud browser client"
13:59:39 <kaz> ... what do you think?
14:00:22 <kaz> jf: your cloud browser server processes the rendering task
14:01:38 <kaz> alex: would distribute the diagrams to make things clearer
14:01:38 <kaz> ... got another comment from Paul Higgs
14:02:10 <kaz> ... got a comment offline
14:02:37 <kaz> ... wanted to ask the group for opinions
14:02:55 <kaz> jf: we can start with an elevator speech, i.e., brief description within a few minutes
14:03:48 <kaz> kaz: +1
14:04:22 <JF> FWIW, I am a good target audience for the "elevator speech" audience
14:04:25 <kaz> ... will you update the diagrams on the wiki with these updated picture?
14:04:26 <alexandra_mikityuk> q?
14:04:36 <JF> ack JF
14:04:36 <Zakim> JF, you wanted to say that dancing pixels is almost the least complicated issue
14:05:01 <JF> +1 to that Kaz, as it helps make the elvator speech clearer
14:05:24 <kaz> cloud browser (cloud browsing server)
14:06:05 <alexandra_mikityuk> if Cloud Browser Server
14:06:28 <JF> the key word is "server"
14:09:07 <alexandra_mikityuk> q?
14:12:15 <kaz> local player (cloud browsing client)
14:12:19 <kaz> kaz: we can keep the original name "cloud browser" but would be better to add an alias like the above
14:12:21 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:12:21 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-webtv-minutes.html kaz
14:12:21 <kaz> alex: another two months for use case discussion
14:12:21 <kaz> ... and would add clearer definition too
14:12:29 <kaz> harrison: one question
14:12:32 <kaz> ... capturing video encoding functionality
14:12:32 <kaz> ... visual output from the set top box
14:12:32 <kaz> ... capturing the video data
14:12:32 <kaz> s/from/downloaded to/
14:12:32 <kaz> ... video encoding procedure
14:12:33 <kaz> ... my question is if the cloud browser is in charge of the interaction?
14:12:53 <kaz> kaz: would suggest we clarify the interaction during the session lifecycle
14:12:53 <kaz> ... maybe we can generate a ladder diagram
14:13:13 <kaz> harrison: will do
14:13:24 <kaz> ... another question is graphics library for composition
14:14:04 <kaz> ... how/who handles that capability?
14:16:00 <kaz> kaz: video streaming is generated on the cloud browsing server side
14:16:26 <kaz> ... and 2-D graphics generation (could be hardware accelerated) is done by the local player side
14:16:48 <kaz> alex: will put proposals on the wiki
14:17:00 <kaz> ... lifecycle, etc., as well
14:17:08 <kaz> kaz: great
14:17:30 <kaz> harrison: and would be great to send by email as well
14:17:35 <alexandra_mikityuk> q?
14:17:40 <kaz> alex: also would assign an action item
14:17:56 <kaz> ... to our action tracker
14:18:09 <kaz> ... tx for your cooperation
14:18:15 <kaz> ... great discussion
14:18:19 <kaz> [ adjourned ]
14:20:26 <kaz> rssagent, draft minutes
14:20:37 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:20:37 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/27-webtv-minutes.html kaz