16:32:34 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aria
16:32:34 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/04/07-aria-irc
16:32:36 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
16:32:36 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #aria
16:32:38 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
16:32:38 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
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16:32:39 <trackbot> Meeting: Accessible Rich Internet Applications Working Group Teleconference
16:32:39 <trackbot> Date: 07 April 2016
16:32:43 <Rich> RRSAgent, make log public
16:32:47 <Rich> chair: Rich
16:33:05 <LJWatson> LJWatson has joined #aria
16:33:12 <JF> present+ JF
16:33:23 <LJWatson> present+ LJWatson
16:33:35 <janina> present+ Janina
16:33:47 <fesch> present+ fesch
16:33:53 <JF> agenda?
16:34:14 <joanie> present+ Joanmarie_Diggs
16:34:33 <mck> mck has joined #aria
16:36:08 <mck> mck has joined #aria
16:36:20 <Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2016Apr/0011.html
16:37:13 <JF> +1 to a Joint CAll
16:38:29 <clown> clown has joined #aria
16:38:58 <MichielBijl> present+ Michiel_Bijl
16:40:06 <cyns> zakim take up topic 1
16:40:17 <cyns> zakim, take up item 1
16:40:17 <Zakim> I see nothing on the agenda
16:40:31 <Rich> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-aria/2016Apr/0011.html
16:40:49 <MichaelC> present+ MichaelC, Cynthia, Rich
16:40:53 <clown> present+ Joseph_Scheuhammer
16:40:54 <cyns> topic: role=text moving to aria 2.0 cfc
16:41:02 <MichaelC> present+ JamesN
16:41:10 <cyns> rs: we can resolve it. no objections
16:41:17 <cyns> topic: role=password
16:41:46 <cyns> mk: are there actions and issues related ot role=text that need to move to 2.0?
16:41:48 <MichaelC> present+ Jemma
16:41:57 <Rich> https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/products/17
16:42:01 <joanie> q+ to ask about role="text"
16:42:11 <clown> action-2023
16:42:11 <trackbot> action-2023 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Write a proposal about how to modify the definition of role text to limit its use. -- due 2016-02-23 -- OPEN
16:42:11 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2023
16:42:18 <clown> issue-111
16:42:18 <trackbot> Sorry, but issue-111 does not exist.
16:42:27 <clown> issue-1017
16:42:27 <trackbot> issue-1017 -- Separate out text from role="none" and "presentation" so that a single location may be referenced in Core-AAM -- open
16:42:27 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1017
16:42:37 <bgaraventa1979> bgaraventa1979 has joined #aria
16:42:59 <bgaraventa1979> present+ Bryan_Garaventa
16:43:24 <joanie> ack me
16:43:24 <Zakim> joanie, you wanted to ask about role="text"
16:43:30 <Rich> q?
16:43:34 <cyns> mk: how do we move items out of master brach without losing them?
16:43:52 <MichaelC> present+ Matt
16:43:55 <cyns> jd: do we want to mark at risk or remove as if it wasn't there?
16:44:05 <cyns> rs: remove as if never there?
16:44:27 <cyns> jd: will come up with a way to have a permenant commit that has that stuff and can be pulled in later.
16:44:29 <jemmaku> jemmaku has joined #aria
16:45:10 <MichaelC> action: joanie to figure out to preserve text and then remove it
16:45:10 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2046 - Figure out to preserve text and then remove it [on Joanmarie Diggs - due 2016-04-14].
16:46:13 <jemmaku> present+ JaEunJemmaKu
16:46:41 <MichaelC> action: clown to remove mappings for text
16:46:41 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2047 - Remove mappings for text [on Joseph Scheuhammer - due 2016-04-14].
16:46:56 <clown> action-2047
16:46:56 <trackbot> action-2047 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Remove mappings for text -- due 2016-04-14 -- OPEN
16:46:56 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2047
16:48:16 <cyns> topic: role=password
16:48:44 <cyns> rs: 3 wg members raised conerns. Leonie was one. are you ok with the new text?
16:49:30 <MichaelC> q+ to schedule meeting with webappsec
16:49:44 <cyns> lw: we need a good review with the security team.
16:49:52 <cyns> lw: but it seems basically ok
16:49:54 <Rich> https://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/password-role/aria/aria.html#password
16:50:19 <cyns> rs: has Charles weighed in? Did he also want a security review?
16:50:24 <cyns> rs: don't know where John sits.
16:50:36 <JF> Q+
16:50:37 <cyns> rs: I think everyone wanted a security review.
16:50:48 <MichaelC> ack me
16:50:48 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to schedule meeting with webappsec
16:51:05 <cyns> rs: I can take action to meet with security ig, for after April 18
16:51:51 <cyns> mc: I think we can procede with edits, don't need to block on security review
16:52:07 <cyns> mc: It will jsut be in an editor's draft, not working draft
16:52:20 <cyns> rs: any objections to putting in spec for now?
16:52:24 <Rich> q?
16:52:27 <joanie> q+
16:52:30 <cyns> jf: I have no objection to continuing to work in this
16:52:46 <Rich> q?
16:52:54 <MichaelC> ack jf
16:53:11 <cyns> jf: I talked to charles, and he wants review as well.
16:53:34 <cyns> jf: can we look at a differnt name, other than password, that might not imply other stuff that comes with password
16:53:50 <cyns> jf: like role=obscured or role=blurred or something
16:54:05 <cyns> jf: the heart of my concern is what people will assume a password is.
16:54:25 <cyns> rs: I think what you want to say is "this isn't a standard html password"
16:54:33 <MichaelC> q+ still notes to things named password in aapi, and part of the problem is we don´t know if it´s going to be obscured so naming it such might cause confusion
16:54:53 <MichaelC> q+ to note still maps to things named password in aapi, and part of the problem is we don´t know if it´s going to be obscured so naming it such might cause confusion
16:54:54 <cyns> jf: yes. for example, in html passoword, you can't copy and paste. users may expect this. new name is a new behavior.
16:55:11 <cyns> mk: i wonder how AT would interpret that?
16:55:26 <cyns> mk: would they still tell users it's a password field
16:55:30 <cyns> q+
16:55:59 <cyns> lw: for that to be meanigful, you'd have to understand the difference between custom and standard field
16:56:08 <mck> q?
16:56:14 <MichielBijl> +1
16:56:19 <mck> Q+
16:56:19 <cyns> jd: does the group want editor's note that this is at risk, and we're going to consult with security?
16:56:23 <MichaelC> ack j
16:56:25 <MichaelC> ack me
16:56:25 <Zakim> MichaelC, you wanted to note still maps to things named password in aapi, and part of the problem is we don´t know if it´s going to be obscured so naming it such might cause
16:56:25 <JF> +1 to Under Discussion note
16:56:26 <Rich> ack joanie
16:56:29 <Zakim> ... confusion
16:56:31 <cyns> mc: use "under discussion" rather than at risk
16:56:46 <LJWatson> +1 to leaving a note in the spec to say "under discussion"
16:57:05 <cyns> mc: I think it would still map to password in aapi. and part of the problem is that it isn't obscured
16:57:14 <MichaelC> ack c
16:57:30 <jamesn> jamesn has joined #aria
16:57:36 <JF> Q+ to also ask, as part of this, to have a specific W3C Communications go out to SR Vendors
16:57:37 <cyns> cs: +1 to michael. we don't have soemthing other than password to map it to
16:57:54 <cyns> rs: the fact that it's not obscured is the problem. need to talk to ATs
16:58:03 <cyns> rs: after we talk to security people
16:58:10 <cyns> jn: put off to 2.0?
16:58:41 <joanie> q+
16:58:54 <cyns> cs: I raised it and 2.0 is ok with me
16:59:29 <cyns> mc: we haven't done a consensus test for 1.1 vs. 2.0. We have put in a lot of work, and we seem close. I'd hate to abandon now.
16:59:33 <joanie> I would like to add for the record that I am fine for 2.0 as we need to feature freeze soon.
16:59:36 <joanie> q-
16:59:44 <clown> +1 to MichaelC
16:59:52 <cyns> mc: if security conversation has big problems, or there's new issues, then maybe we can push to 2.0. for now, I htink we should procede with 1.1 plan
16:59:55 <Rich> ack mck
17:00:03 <cyns> mk: +1 to michael and cynthia
17:00:10 <Rich> ack JF
17:00:10 <Zakim> JF, you wanted to also ask, as part of this, to have a specific W3C Communications go out to SR Vendors
17:00:43 <mck> mck has joined #aria
17:00:58 <cyns> jf: rich mentioned concern about going to every screen reader makers. If we're really requiring them to do something, I'd like to see an official w3c communication asking them to do it.
17:01:04 <cyns> rs: that sounds good
17:01:12 <Rich> q?
17:01:34 <cyns> mc: I'm not sure something out of communications office is somethign we'd do. we can take offline. can do strong messaging from WAI domain.
17:02:09 <cyns> rs: draft resoltuion: put password into 1.1 editors draft, meet with security group, communicate with AT vendors to process it correctly
17:02:51 <cyns> rs: draft resoltuion: put password into 1.1 editors draft, meet with security group, communicate with AT vendors to speak rendered text
17:03:14 <cyns> rs: could limit it to passwords, but would like it broader
17:03:34 <cyns> mk: you're going to get pushback from screen reader vendors for perf and responsiveness reasons.
17:04:00 <cyns> mk: don't htink we should strong-arm screen readers into changing key echo to screen echo
17:04:12 <cyns> rs: it's a should
17:04:28 <cyns> mk: don't think we should do it it outside custom password field
17:04:32 <cyns> q+
17:04:35 <clown> q+ to clarify: not strong-arm the AT vendors, but the user agents.
17:04:49 <Rich> q?
17:05:23 <MichaelC> ack cy
17:05:32 <MichaelC> ack c
17:05:32 <Zakim> clown, you wanted to clarify: not strong-arm the AT vendors, but the user agents.
17:06:20 <cyns> cs: action: cyns to talk into narrator team about feasibility of echoing rendered text in role=password
17:06:27 <cyns> action: cyns to talk into narrator team about feasibility of echoing rendered text in role=password
17:06:28 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2048 - Talk into narrator team about feasibility of echoing rendered text in role=password [on Cynthia Shelly - due 2016-04-14].
17:06:34 <Rich> q?
17:06:52 <cyns> js: can you override password field echo?
17:07:46 <cyns> mk: lotus notes put special symbols into password text so the user could recognize if the pattern was right, but no one else could see it
17:07:50 <clown> s/can you override password field echo/can and author override, by script, native html5 password text obscuring/
17:07:53 <cyns> mk: that might be a legit use
17:08:41 <Rich> q?
17:09:05 <cyns> draft resoltuion: put password into 1.1 editors draft, meet with security group, communicate with AT vendors to speak rendered text
17:09:29 <janina> +1
17:09:37 <cyns> RESOLUTION: put password into 1.1 editors draft, meet with security group, communicate with AT vendors to speak rendered text
17:09:38 <Rich> +1
17:09:45 <joanie> +1
17:09:49 <cyns> +1
17:09:54 <JF> I can live with that resolution for now
17:09:59 <clown> +1
17:10:36 <cyns> topic: last call draft/feature complete in june?
17:10:59 <cyns> rs: does june sound resonable?
17:11:06 <cyns> cs: can we look at open issues to decide?
17:11:15 <Rich> https://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/products/17
17:11:55 <JF> if we are looking at ARIA 1.1 freeze by June, that *MAY* have an impact on previous topic
17:13:26 <joanie> action-1744
17:13:26 <trackbot> action-1744 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Implement edits proposed in issue-641, raise to group if any subsantive changes come out -- due 2016-03-17 -- OPEN
17:13:26 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1744
17:13:42 <cyns> issue-641
17:13:42 <trackbot> issue-641 -- Abstract role section allows nameFrom content, and some subclassed roles under section do not allow nameFrom:contents (even definition, img, and math, which seems like they should) -- open
17:13:42 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/641
17:14:03 <cyns> mk: aria-label overrides the name from the content
17:14:21 <cyns> js: you'll see a button whose name is the label and whose content is there as content
17:14:42 <cyns> mk: it's assistive tech who are revealing only the name?
17:14:47 <joanie> q+
17:15:27 <cyns> mk: screen readers dont' use both name and content
17:15:32 <cyns> cs: that seems like a bug
17:15:47 <cyns> mk: it's been an authoring technique
17:15:58 <Rich> q?
17:16:06 <Rich> ack joanie
17:16:09 <cyns> rs: seems like a red herring, since section is abstract and not mapped
17:16:19 <cyns> jd: action-1744
17:16:25 <cyns> action-1744
17:16:25 <trackbot> action-1744 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Implement edits proposed in issue-641, raise to group if any subsantive changes come out -- due 2016-03-17 -- OPEN
17:16:25 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1744
17:16:37 <cyns> action-1440
17:16:37 <trackbot> Sorry, but action-1440 does not exist.
17:16:42 <joanie> Regarding math and definition: Do we really want to allow name from contents??
17:16:42 <joanie> As a reminder, a while back we removed name from contents for listitem. The reasons for doing so were first and foremost the fact that there may be a bunch of descendants (such as a nested list). I can see that being the case both for math (see the MathML torture test) and for definition (imagine the 20-volume OED as a web app). Another reason is that what an AT likely wants to present for listitem (and I
17:16:48 <joanie> would argue definition and math) is the text under the element; not a name. And it might want to present that text in smaller chunks (e.g. during caret navigation); not all at once. Lastly, if an author really has a need to override this behavior, listitem (and definition and math) already allow name from author. Long way of saying that I don't think we want to make this change.
17:16:53 <joanie> I'm less certain about image. But given a sufficiently complicated image (e.g. an organizational chart), I question both the desirability of doing it at all. If we were to do it, having the user agent programmatically do it raises new questions: Should it be DOM order? Visual order? If the latter, top-down or left-right? Do we need to take locale into consideration? The more I think about it, the more I
17:16:59 <joanie> think this seems like a not-good idea....
17:17:03 <MichaelC> pfwg-action-1440?
17:17:03 <trackbot> Sorry, but no Tracker is associated with that shortname.
17:17:20 <joanie> https://github.com/w3c/aria/commit/ad4542315
17:17:24 <MichaelC> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1440
17:18:40 <cyns> jd: this seems like a won't fix.
17:18:43 <cyns> rs: agree.
17:19:10 <cyns> rs: objections to closing issue 641?
17:19:32 <cyns> jd: james wants to do stuff for some other roles. I don't think that's a good idea
17:19:46 <cyns> mk: there might be an issue, but the solution isn't good
17:20:08 <cyns> mk: we should probably punt the issue to 2.0 so we can look at other possible solutions
17:20:09 <joanie> +1 to punting for 2.0
17:20:15 <cyns> rs: +1 for punting
17:20:20 <cyns> mk: can't tell yet
17:20:29 <cyns> cs: +1
17:21:44 <cyns> issue-648
17:21:44 <trackbot> issue-648 -- Role computation with native host language semantics -- open
17:21:44 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/648
17:22:32 <cyns> mc: planning to work on this tomorrow. shouldn't block
17:22:44 <cyns> issue-690
17:22:44 <trackbot> issue-690 -- Implementor concerns for UA requirements in #aria-describedat -- open
17:22:44 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/690
17:22:48 <cyns> rs: should be closed
17:22:54 <JF> JF has joined #aria
17:23:32 <cyns> issue-697
17:23:32 <trackbot> issue-697 -- Remove "frameset" reference from the definition of Root WAI-ARIA node -- open
17:23:32 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/697
17:23:41 <cyns> rs: already done
17:24:03 <cyns> action-1658
17:24:03 <trackbot> action-1658 -- Joseph Scheuhammer to Remove the reference to “or <frameset>” from the role definition in the glossary. -- due 2015-06-25 -- CLOSED
17:24:03 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1658
17:24:38 <cyns> issue-701
17:24:38 <trackbot> issue-701 -- Modify aria-owns such that the idref order pertains to the order of the associated children -- open
17:24:38 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/701
17:24:44 <cyns> rs: didn't we do this already?
17:24:51 <cyns> mk: no related actions.
17:24:58 <cyns> rs: shouldn't be blocking
17:26:09 <Rich> Action: Joanmaire: Add text to aria-owns to address issue 701
17:26:09 <trackbot> Error finding 'Joanmaire'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/users>.
17:26:29 <Rich> Action: Joanmarie: Add text to aria-owns to address issue 701
17:26:29 <trackbot> Created ACTION-2049 - Add text to aria-owns to address issue 701 [on Joanmarie Diggs - due 2016-04-14].
17:26:39 <cyns> issue-742
17:26:39 <trackbot> issue-742 -- Introduce the ability to provide the destination context of a link -- open
17:26:39 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/742
17:27:00 <cyns> rs: move to aria 2.0?
17:27:09 <cyns> js: note that COGA needs it
17:27:31 <cyns> mk: discussion regarding link type vs. additional roles. didn't we land on roles?
17:27:40 <cyns> rs: for dpub, yes. this says coga
17:27:45 <cyns> mk: that can be 2.0, right?
17:28:01 <cyns> rs: objection to moving to aria 2.0?
17:28:16 <cyns> cs: +1
17:28:57 <cyns> RESOLUTION: move issue 742 to ARIA 2.0
17:29:14 <cyns> issue-1002
17:29:14 <trackbot> issue-1002 -- Spin Button default values inconsistent with HTML5 -- open
17:29:14 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1002
17:29:24 <cyns> rs: I think this is done.
17:29:27 <clown> action-2005
17:29:27 <trackbot> action-2005 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Solicit input regarding making default spinbutton values more consistent with the defaults for HTML5's input type="number" -- due 2016-01-21 -- CLOSED
17:29:27 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2005
17:29:31 <clown> action-2021
17:29:31 <trackbot> action-2021 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Draft text for default max and min spinbutton values -- due 2016-02-18 -- CLOSED
17:29:31 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/2021
17:29:33 <cyns> jd: I'll check. think you're right
17:29:47 <cyns> issue-1004
17:29:47 <trackbot> issue-1004 -- Add language to spec clarifying there may be exceptions to exposure -- open
17:29:47 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1004
17:30:41 <cyns> rs: this means there may be elements in svg that can never be mapped, and placing an aria role on them should be ignored
17:30:51 <cyns> mk: doens't that go in the SVG-AAM instead?
17:30:59 <cyns> +1
17:32:11 <cyns> rs: closing. it is handled in svg-aam
17:33:28 <clown> https://github.com/w3c/aria/issues/136
17:33:49 <cyns> js: there's a github issue too.
17:33:52 <cyns> rs: close it
17:34:10 <cyns> issue-1006
17:34:10 <trackbot> issue-1006 -- The roles that include children presentational = true are not consistent -- open
17:34:10 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1006
17:34:25 <cyns> rs: think this can be addressed in time
17:34:36 <cyns> issue-1014
17:34:36 <trackbot> issue-1014 -- Address aria-kbdshortcut concerns -- open
17:34:36 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1014
17:34:40 <cyns> rs: already in the works
17:34:49 <cyns> issue-1017
17:34:49 <trackbot> issue-1017 -- Separate out text from role="none" and "presentation" so that a single location may be referenced in Core-AAM -- open
17:34:49 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/issues/1017
17:34:57 <cyns> rs: this is my next action
17:35:06 <Rich> q?
17:35:09 <cyns> cs: I think yes
17:35:20 <cyns> jf: except password?
17:35:33 <cyns> rs: if we can't get it resolved, we push to 2.0
17:36:08 <cyns> mk: There may be a few things in actions
17:36:16 <cyns> rs: general concensus is we will shoot for june
17:37:34 <cyns> topic: combobox
17:37:38 <cyns> actio-1490
17:37:44 <cyns> action-1490
17:37:44 <trackbot> action-1490 -- Matthew King to Propose spec text edit for issue-610: comboboxes should allow complex children elements -- due 2016-02-03 -- OPEN
17:37:44 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/WAI/ARIA/track/actions/1490
17:38:06 <mck> Combobox proposal changes made since March 17 ARIA meeting:
17:38:07 <mck> 1. Included explicit mention of searchbox as an allowed role for the text input element.
17:38:07 <cyns> mk: added feedback from last meeting
17:38:09 <mck> 2. Added author MUST statement requiring aria-controls on the textbox element referring to the popup element.
17:38:10 <mck> 3. Clarified language regarding how aria-activedescendant can be used on the text box to refer to an active element contained by the pop-up element.
17:38:12 <mck> 4. Added SHOULD statement that applies to user agents and assistive technologies to encourage them to continue to supporting the ARIA 1.0 combobox pattern.
17:38:13 <mck> These changes are reflected in the action1490-combobox branch in RawGit:
17:38:15 <mck> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/action1490-combobox/aria/aria.html#combobox
17:39:17 <cyns> mk: I'd like to review this text today.
17:39:27 <cyns> mk: I will get to active-descendant text next time
17:41:52 <cyns> rs: maybe we should add searcbox to the table, to make it more clear for test tools?
17:42:22 <cyns> mk: other examples in the spec, it's not clear that you need to add the subclass
17:42:33 <cyns> mk: I don't mind adding it, but wasn't sure if that was a good practice
17:42:49 <cyns> rs: should be "textbox or searchbox and one of the following"
17:42:55 <cyns> mk: we don't do that in other places
17:42:58 <joanie> q+ to suggest it may be necessary
17:43:03 <cyns> rs: I know. but it makes is more clear
17:43:11 <cyns> mk: we don't do that for menu
17:44:04 <cyns> rs: menu can have any mix of those things, can be any order, etc. but, this... it has to be a textbox or search box and one of hte other. you couldn't have 3 tree grids, or a textbox and a searchbox
17:44:16 <Rich> q?
17:44:58 <cyns> jd: an advantage I see in being very explicit in this case is that you can't, for example, have a password. being explicit makes that mroe clear
17:45:04 <cyns> +1 to joanie
17:45:15 <joanie> ack me
17:45:15 <Zakim> joanie, you wanted to suggest it may be necessary
17:45:26 <cyns> rs: Freedom Scientific raised this issue: it needs to be a modal dialog box
17:45:39 <cyns> mk: glenn backed away. let's talk about it later
17:45:42 <Rich> q?
17:46:13 <cyns> mk: second change is in the 3rd paragraph. added "aria-controls"
17:46:54 <cyns> cs: +1
17:47:35 <cyns> mk: got more convinced as I looked at examples. there might be a lot of divs and images and stuff. it seems like good coding sense, and made coding easier to have the explicit relationship
17:47:52 <cyns> rs: call that a popup element?
17:48:08 <cyns> mk: already there
17:48:35 <cyns> mk: clarified active-descendant
17:51:16 <cyns> js: be more explicit about only list items?
17:51:25 <cyns> mk: cover that in best practices
17:52:01 <cyns> rs: what about dialog box. should it say owns instead of in?
17:52:12 <cyns> mk: already says that
17:52:35 <cyns> rs: doesn't say it contains or owns the popup
17:53:09 <cyns> rs: see it now
17:53:34 <cyns> mk: new paragraph refering to aria 1.0 spec and that the pattern has changed. user agents and at should continue to support
17:54:24 <cyns> rs: looks good
17:54:42 <cyns> mk: editorial question. should there be a link to the 1.0 spec.
17:55:03 <cyns> cs: yes, nice to have
17:55:32 <Rich> q+
17:55:35 <clown> q+
17:55:57 <cyns> js: example 5 doesn't have an aria-controls
17:56:03 <cyns> mk: good catch. will fix
17:56:11 <clown> ack me
17:56:38 <cyns> rs: my issue is around the dialog. I would like to require that if you're going to use a dialog, it must be modal
17:56:43 <cyns> Q+
17:57:01 <cyns> rs: don't want people tabbing off the end of the dialog
17:57:24 <cyns> mk: all dialogs should be containing the tab ring whether they're modal
17:57:43 <cyns> mk: non-modal allows clicking or keyboard out of dialog
17:58:01 <cyns> rs: I don't see anywhere that syas you can't tab outside a non-modal dialgo
17:58:33 <cyns> mk: a non-modal dialog in authoring practice pattern is that author provides a method for moving focus outside the dialog
17:58:42 <cyns> rs: I don' thtink the user agent does that
17:58:47 <cyns> bg: you can get trapped
17:59:41 <cyns> mk: I think rich raised a separate issue that isn't about comboboxes. Rich made an assumption about dialogs that I didn't think was accurate.
18:00:01 <cyns> mk: I think you implied that if a dialog is non-modal then you can tab out of it
18:00:47 <cyns> rssagent, make minutes
18:00:58 <cyns> * I didn't do that right. can someone make minutes?
18:01:35 <jamesn> rrs not rss
18:01:59 <Rich> scribe: Rich
18:02:04 <jamesn> rrsagent, make minutes
18:02:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/07-aria-minutes.html jamesn
18:02:04 <fesch> rrsagent, make minutes
18:02:04 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/07-aria-minutes.html fesch
18:02:32 <Rich> Rich: I want an aria MUST for dialogs in comoboxes to be modal
18:03:13 <Rich> JamesN: I agree with Rich. Why should the dialog child be any different?
18:03:59 <Rich> RRSAgent, make minutes
18:03:59 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/04/07-aria-minutes.html Rich
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