14:34:00 RRSAgent has joined #dap 14:34:00 logging to http://www.w3.org/2016/02/04-dap-irc 14:34:02 RRSAgent, make logs world 14:34:02 Zakim has joined #dap 14:34:04 Zakim, this will be DAP 14:34:04 I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot 14:34:05 Meeting: Device APIs Working Group Teleconference 14:34:05 Date: 04 February 2016 14:34:26 Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Feb/0017.html 14:34:32 fjh has changed the topic to: dap https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Feb/0017.html 14:34:51 Regrets+ Andrey_Logvinov, Dominique_Hazael-Massieux 14:35:04 Chair: Frederick_Hirsch 14:35:07 Present+ Frederick_Hirsch 14:50:12 Regrets+ Giri_Mandyam 14:58:07 lukasz has joined #dap 14:58:12 hey 15:01:02 Present+ Tobie_Langel 15:03:13 anssik has joined #dap 15:05:26 me anssi guess we will cancel since only tobie and I are on the call 15:05:35 https://github.com/w3c/sensors/issues/75 15:05:39 anssi perhaps you can follow up on email re battery and vibration 15:06:36 https://github.com/w3c/sensors/blob/gh-pages/sensor-types.md 15:06:46 Topic: Sensors 15:09:13 should devloper care about streaming vs polling type of sensor or should they look the same 15:09:22 on change vs continuous 15:10:01 fjh: should care if interested in data 15:10:12 tobie: depends on use case, e.g for map positioning might not matter 15:10:39 … for geolocation doesn’t matter 15:13:26 ScribeNick: fjh 15:13:40 … dumb sensors are polled 15:13:40 … smart sensors push 15:13:49 fjh: polling with very short time becomes streaming 15:14:10 tobie: usually push is enough, can easilty replicate as if polled 15:14:30 … doesn’t work for low level access need continous stream, e.g. virtual reality 15:14:36 fjh: auto? 15:15:21 giri: everything is interrupt driven on handsets 15:15:43 … streaming or poll choice irrelevant in this case, depends on underlying implementation 15:17:00 fjh: consistent API possible 15:17:16 giri: different drivers by manufacturer, intellectual property, so not uniform 15:17:54 tobie: hardware abstraction layer makes this less important 15:18:19 giri: still need to consider what is underneath, e.g Android HAL has not kept up, e.g. depth cameras 15:18:47 tobie: depth camera is not in our scope 15:19:31 giri: developers need to be aware of limitations 15:19:41 … with respect to frequency returned by sensor 15:19:53 tobie: need to understand real developer use cases 15:20:28 tobie: removed everything from spec that IOS and Android could not provide 15:21:56 giri: can you tell me what implemenation needs to provide, so I can check if it is possilbe 15:22:08 tobie: have checked IOS and Android 15:22:16 s/possilbe/possible/ 15:22:39 s/Sensors/Generic Sensor API/ 15:23:08 giri: provides DSP for both IOS and Android 15:23:16 s/provides/Qualcomm provides/ 15:24:03 tobie: geolocation is easier across platforms 15:24:17 … gyroscope etc are typically polled 15:24:31 … clear cut across platform 15:24:47 … not so clear - heart rate, ambient light, etc not clear whether to poll or stream 15:24:53 … more research required 15:25:09 giri: some of these are not integrated into smart phne 15:25:14 s/phne/phone/ 15:25:24 tobie: implementer does not know 15:25:35 giri: are these sensors dynamically discoverable 15:25:40 tobie: saving for L2 of spec 15:26:05 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:26:05 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/02/04-dap-minutes.html fjh 15:26:37 tobie: remaining questions - how to present two options to developer in compelling way 15:26:53 giri: non-trivial question 15:27:35 s/.*dumb sensors/tobie: dumb sensors/ 15:28:03 s/me anssi guess we will cancel since only tobie and I are on the call// 15:28:17 s/anssi perhaps you can follow up on email re battery and vibration// 15:29:06 fjh: next steps? 15:29:51 tobie: have propsed set of sensor types, underlying physical sensors, see table 15:29:52 https://github.com/w3c/sensors/blob/gh-pages/sensor-types.md 15:30:12 tobie: need reporting mode - on data change or continuous 15:30:36 … if same on Android and IOS can go with that 15:31:05 tobie: checking if we can get same output on both 15:31:18 tobie: look at outstanding issues 15:31:22 https://github.com/w3c/sensors/milestones/Level%201 15:31:51 tobie: answered #81, anssik added text 15:32:10 .. 79 imposed by platform 15:33:06 fjh: can you add proposed resolution for 79 and for 81 15:33:20 tobie: yes 15:33:40 … need to improve lanugage, workgin on 15:33:51 … just talked about 75 15:34:12 … 66, need to document properl;y 15:34:19 …62 punt 15:34:43 … remaining ones require edits to spec and can be closed when done 15:34:51 … last blocker is permissions API 15:34:54 … issue 22 15:35:04 https://github.com/w3c/sensors/issues/22 15:35:11 tobie: nice to have, not must 15:35:17 … adding enums into webIDL 15:35:47 … avoid need to avoid modifying permissions API, but may not get support 15:36:26 https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-script-coord/2015AprJun/0061.html 15:36:32 … discussion was on public-script-coords 15:36:52 … could also use domString instead of enum 15:37:18 fjh: cannot expect to modify permissions API for every new API 15:37:32 tobie: easier to argue once have generic sensor API 15:37:47 … reason against is not to spread enums across specs, makes it hard 15:38:00 … but want permission tied to implementing the sensor 15:39:17 Present+ Anssi_Kostiainen 15:39:36 fjh: suggest putting it into generic sensor API by default with note explaining rationale 15:39:45 … better to have it there rather than starting without it 15:40:11 tobie: yes, good idea 15:40:43 … benefit of domString does not require webIDL change 15:41:12 … will do issue cleanup once spec is updated 15:42:58 fjh: for issues not from Tobie we need to be able to show resolutions as we move through the process 15:43:28 list of issues not opened by editor: https://github.com/w3c/sensors/issues?utf8=%E2%9C%93&q=+is%3Aissue+-author%3Atobie+ 15:45:33 action: fjh to discuss with tobie how to generate report showing issues reported by others and how resolved 15:45:33 Created ACTION-743 - Discuss with tobie how to generate report showing issues reported by others and how resolved [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2016-02-11]. 15:46:33 Topic: Minutes approval 15:46:40 Approve minutes from 21 Jan 2016 15:46:41 proposed RESOLUTION: Minutes from 21 Jan 2016 are approved, https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jan/att-0062/minutes-2016-01-21.html 15:46:46 RESOLUTION: Minutes from 21 Jan 2016 are approved, https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2016Jan/att-0062/minutes-2016-01-21.html 15:46:55 Topic: Battery Status API 15:47:37 fjh: where are we now, including delays on tests 15:48:03 anssik: spec gives leeway, so some tests are hard, cannot predict time for test to run to completion, so get some failures 15:48:22 … looking at test results, close to complete now 15:49:06 https://w3c.github.io/test-results/battery-status/all.html 15:49:23 fjh: this is much better than before 15:49:46 anssik: still have IDL failure related to harness, Dom had patch 15:49:56 … webIDL implementation issues 15:50:18 … total of 4 failures in both of two implementations 15:50:38 fjh: will need Dom’s help 15:50:45 … what is yellow 15:50:52 anssik: manual tests 15:51:22 … tobie do you know what yellow means 15:51:26 tobie: not sure 15:51:37 … but think so 15:52:33 … undefined - means was not run 15:52:50 anssik: does this tool even work with manual tests 15:53:18 fjh: need to clarify what bottom of table means 15:53:40 anssik: yes, can do this. But China new year starts Monday 15:54:16 action: anssik to clarify battery test report , removing or explaining yellow at bottom of report 15:54:16 Created ACTION-744 - Clarify battery test report , removing or explaining yellow at bottom of report [on Anssi Kostiainen - due 2016-02-11]. 15:54:34 Topic: Vibration 15:54:50 fjh: Clarification errata item, ISSUE-171 15:57:46 fjh: first need proposal for change, then CfC for agreement, then update Errata and do PER 16:01:10 fjh: Focus should be on agreement to change then mechanics to get it done 16:01:16 Topic: WakeLock 16:01:44 fjh: remaining issues are here https://github.com/w3c/wake-lock/issues 16:01:56 … looks like these need to be resolved. 16:02:00 … defer discussion 16:02:06 Topic: Other business 16:02:09 fjh: none 16:02:13 Topic: Adjourn 16:02:18 rrsagent, generate minutes 16:02:18 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/02/04-dap-minutes.html fjh 16:03:00 i/hey/Topic: Welcome , Agenda Review, Scribe Selection 16:03:40 rrsagent, generate minutes 16:03:40 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/02/04-dap-minutes.html fjh 16:04:09 fjh_ has joined #dap 16:04:46 rrsagent, generate minutes 16:04:46 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/02/04-dap-minutes.html fjh_ 16:04:47 rrsagent, generate minutes 16:04:47 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2016/02/04-dap-minutes.html fjh_