See also: IRC log
<allanj> title: Low Vision Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
<allanj> jim+
<allanj> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/LVTF18Jan2016/
My pleasure, Shawn.
<shawn> Shawn fixes typos Laura noted in https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/LVTF18Jan2016/results
<JohnRochford> Am trying to join by phone, not by WebEx
<JohnRochford> Trying WebEx now
<JohnRochford> "Join" button is uninvokable
<Srini> Jim/Andrew, does survey requires me to login using username / password? never got to see for WCAG survey... or am I on a wrong link? I just clicked in Jim's email
<Srini> Okay. let me try. thanks,
<Srini> I'll be sure for next week.
<scribe> Scribe: Laura
<allanj> Open item 1
Jim: Good comment on ig list: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ig/2016JanMar/0081.html
<Srini> +1 to you Andrew. Seperating would be useful.
Jim: Keeping separate makes sense. different responsibilities.
Shawn: This doc user needs.
AWK: We are just focusing on requirement.
<shawn> ... reminder that for this doc, we just focus on user needs. in separate doc we will look at responsibilities of OS, UA, content, etc.
Jim: any objections for keeping together?
none
<shawn> [ Shawn has her text cursor bigger from OS setting ]
<shawn> +1 for keeping these user requirements in one point
Wayne: leave this group together.
RESOLUTION: Size of All Elements Keep Together
<allanj> +1 to being broad for flexible text area
Shawn: I fixed the typos.
AWK: How to determine what users are to see?
Shawn: overlapping content.
AWK: Feels like a different
problem.
... may be a tracking issue.
John: Thinks of it at a recognition issue.
<shawn> https://www.w3.org/WAI/images/easychecks/zoom-overlap.png
Shawn: screenshot is beyond tracking.
AWK: Not a perfect fit.
... Likes that it is included in user settings.
<allanj> seems to be a definition issue. Seeing yes you can see it. But is it understandable. Perhaps define seeing as ability to perceive and comprehend
<shawn> content adapat in a non-desctrtive way VS. interface elements are available
<shawn> poor adaptability
AWK: Maybechange the title of the section to Adaptability
<JohnRochford> Clarification: JohnR (not necessarily JohnA) thinks of it as a recognition issue
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/LVTF18Jan2016/results#xseeall
Shawn: user need is that they can see everything.
<shawn> http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#seeing-all-interface-elements
Shawn: happy to think about it more
<jon_avila_> * thanks
Wayne: Have to be careful of using the word “Zoom”
<jon_avila_> +1
Wayne: Enlarging text is something else.
<JohnRochford> +1
<shawn> ACTION: Shawn think about 3.7.1 Seeing All Interface Elements with Andrew and others input from 20 Jan telecon [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/01/20-lvtf-minutes.html#action01]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-25 - Think about 3.7.1 seeing all interface elements with andrew and others input from 20 jan telecon [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-01-27].
Wayne: People are very confused about it.
Jim: Maybe we should define terms.
<allanj> ACTION: jim to create list of other definitions we might need/use [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/01/20-lvtf-minutes.html#action02]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-26 - Create list of other definitions we might need/use [on Jim Allan - due 2016-01-27].
<shawn> ACTION: Shawn think about explaining zoom verses increase text (e-mail thread) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/01/20-lvtf-minutes.html#action03]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-27 - Think about explaining zoom verses increase text (e-mail thread) [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-01-27].
<shawn> http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#proportional-text-increase
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/LVTF18Jan2016/results#xproprtnl
<shawn> [ I also have examples of this at http://www.tader.info/element-level.html :-]
Jim: I thought of it as a
combination.
... everything should zoom the way it needs too.
Wayne: I think we need to call that out.
Shawn: Would some users not want to increase proportionately?
John: A better example would be 4 times the size.
<JohnRochford> Laura, I suggest you use JohnR and JohnA.
<JohnRochford> Sorry, just noticed spelling difference
AWK: can achieve with personal perference
Shawn: Don’t think we need this separate point.
<shawn> +1 to not needing 3.5.2 Proportional text increase because the user need is adequately covered by 3.5.1 Element-level customization and Zoom would provide proportional zoom. and Text size lets the user text an overall text size.
Wayne: not just headings need adjustments. Spacings zoom.
<shawn> ACTION: Shawn think about spacing resizing, e.g., ems for spacing [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/01/20-lvtf-minutes.html#action04]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-28 - Think about spacing resizing, e.g., ems for spacing [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-01-27].
Wayne: okay to combine 3.5.2 and 3.5.1
No other comments
RESOLUTION: 352 is adequately covered. Don’t need separate point.
<shawn> http://w3c.github.io/low-vision-a11y-tf/requirements.html#margins-and-borders
https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/81151/LVTF18Jan2016/results#xmrgnbrdr
<allanj> +1 keep together
Jim: Keeping together makes sense.
JonA: seems separate.
Shawn reads text.
AWK: Did you move these around?
Shawn: yes.
AWK: Hard to split them out.
Shawn: good point.
<allanj> awk: sees margins and borders as element identification, rather than spacing for reading.
JonA: separate one block of text from another. Usability issue.
Shawn: overlap
... more of a readability issue.
AWK: Should these 2 things be
combined?
... As long as the 2 things exist we should be okay.
Wayne: does fall under element
level.
... 2 people may want to call things out in different ways.
Jim: 3.4 is a result of 3.5
Shawn: Question in an ideal world should ewe be able to say to 3em around all blocks of text?
JonA: thinks it falls under both.
<allanj> 3.4 could have easier user interface, where 3.5.1 could be editing css. ease of use issue.
Wayne: Problem today, we can’t
write the AT.
... Wayne: target is to hard to hit.
<shawn> [ Wayne : took me 2 weeks to get a gmail style sheet ]
<Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say that's the issue - readability VS identifying elements
Shawn: 2 different issues.
<allanj> readability vs identifying elements, could be both
<shawn> ACTION: Shawn 3.4.5 Margins and Borders - clarify readability issue (John's point in 20 Jan telecon) [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2016/01/20-lvtf-minutes.html#action05]
<trackbot> Created ACTION-29 - 3.4.5 margins and borders - clarify readability issue (john's point in 20 jan telecon) [on Shawn Henry - due 2016-01-27].
AWK: adjust the language and leave in the same place.
<shawn> +1 for leaving it as a separate point in readbility section (and leaving it as subpoint in identifying elements) and making more clear how it relates to readability
Jim: belongs in both
places.
... More questions in the survey.
... will bring to the list.
Shawn: maybe leave the survey open.
Jim: Okay. Thant works.
<shawn> thanks, all -- good discussion!!!
This is scribe.perl Revision: 1.144 of Date: 2015/11/17 08:39:34 Check for newer version at http://dev.w3.org/cvsweb/~checkout~/2002/scribe/ Guessing input format: RRSAgent_Text_Format (score 1.00) Succeeded: s/ On conference line, got automated message that the access code is invalis. Entered it again, and now on phone, but I don't hear anyone else.// Succeeded: s/I will hang up and try again.// Succeeded: s/adaptabii;lity/adaptability/ Succeeded: s/WK: Maybe / AWK: Maybe/ Succeeded: s/* Can someone post a link to the content we are discussing? Thanks// Succeeded: s/reads test/reads text/ Succeeded: s/to hare/to hard/ Found Scribe: Laura Inferring ScribeNick: laura WARNING: Replacing previous Present list. (Old list: jim, AWK, Shawn, JohnRochford, Wayne, Laura, allanj) Use 'Present+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Present+ WARNING: Replacing previous Present list. (Old list: (no, one), Jim, Andrew, Srini, Laura, Wayne) Use 'Present+ ... ' if you meant to add people without replacing the list, such as: <dbooth> Present+ shawn, Jim, Andrew, Srini, Laura, Wayne Present: shawn Jim Andrew Srini Laura Wayne JohnR JonA Found Date: 20 Jan 2016 Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2016/01/20-lvtf-minutes.html People with action items: jim shawn WARNING: Input appears to use implicit continuation lines. You may need the "-implicitContinuations" option.[End of scribe.perl diagnostic output]
