18:53:22 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #aapi
18:53:22 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/10/20-aapi-irc
18:53:24 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
18:53:24 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #aapi
18:53:26 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAI_PF
18:53:26 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
18:53:27 <trackbot> Meeting: Protocols and Formats Working Group Teleconference
18:53:27 <trackbot> Date: 20 October 2015
18:53:37 <clown> chair:  Joseph_Scheuhammer
18:54:19 <clown> agenda: this
18:54:28 <clown> agenda+ Check that all new ARIA 1.1 spec have actions.
18:54:36 <clown> agenda+ Add interfaces where appropriate, e.g. IAccessibleText
18:55:28 <clown> agenda+ Action/issue triage for ARIA 1.1 (https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/23, https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=Core%20AAM&product=ARIA, https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=AccName%20AAM&product=ARIA)
18:55:40 <clown> agenda+ be done
18:59:39 <richardschwerdtfeger> richardschwerdtfeger has joined #aapi
19:00:36 <clown> present+ Joseph_Scheuhammer
19:01:08 <joanie> I am, though busy
19:01:12 <joanie> but I'm here
19:01:16 <joanie> sorry, guess I should call in
19:01:28 <joanie> give me a few minutes
19:04:19 <richardschwerdtfeger> present+ Rich_Schwerdtfeger
19:04:27 <joanie> present+ Joanmarie_Diggs
19:05:26 <bgaraventa1979> bgaraventa1979 has joined #aapi
19:05:45 <bgaraventa1979> present+ Bryan_Garaventa
19:06:50 <joanie> scribe: joanie
19:07:47 <joanie> Zakim, take up item 1
19:07:47 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Check that all new ARIA 1.1 spec have actions." taken up [from clown]
19:08:09 <joanie> JS: The main purpose of this meeting is to start getting ready for ARIA 1.1.
19:08:23 <joanie> JS: In particular getting the mapping spec and name computation spec ready for CR.
19:08:49 <joanie> JS: My concern is that there might be some items that fell through the cracks and are in the ARIA spec, but not the mapping spec.
19:09:02 <joanie> JS: So I want to put that on people's radar.
19:09:25 <joanie> RS: Michael is supposed to identify testing criteria and write the testable statements.
19:09:28 <joanie> JS: That will work.
19:11:12 <joanie> Zakim, take up item 2
19:11:12 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Add interfaces where appropriate, e.g. IAccessibleText" taken up [from clown]
19:11:24 <joanie> JS: This came up in an email last week about role="text".
19:11:33 <joanie> JS: The mapping spec just says to give it a role.
19:11:47 <joanie> JS: Rich asked if it should also implement the accessible text interface.
19:12:01 <joanie> JS: I looked at the HTML spec and noticed it indicates interfaces that should be implemented.
19:12:11 <joanie> JS: Our mapping spec doesn't make this indiciation. Should it?
19:12:29 <clown> http://rawgit.com/w3c/aria/master/html-aam/html-aam.html#el-figure
19:12:54 <joanie> JS: For example, in the HTML mapping spec (link above), if you look at their entries, they have a role, object attributes, name:, and relations.
19:13:13 <joanie> JS: We don't generally go into that detail; we identify the role for mapping.
19:13:18 <clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-grid
19:13:28 <joanie> RS: We indicate the table interface for table/grid.
19:13:34 <joanie> JS: Confirmed.
19:13:44 <joanie> RS: I don't think we need to get into fine granularity.
19:14:00 <joanie> RS: I think we have to implement the accessible text interface.
19:14:03 <joanie> JS: For grid??
19:14:29 <joanie> RS: For IA2, for instance, you can get a given header for a specified cell.
19:14:45 <clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#role-map-grid
19:16:06 <joanie> JS: Does ATK have a table interface, and should it be implemented for grid?
19:16:22 <joanie> JD: Yes.
19:16:42 <joanie> JD: For what it's worth, in practice implementors already do that for my platform.
19:16:50 <joanie> JD: But it should be added to our mapping spec.
19:17:13 <joanie> RS + JS: (notes that the new table role is not listed in our spec)
19:17:21 <joanie> JS: Volunteers?
19:17:49 <joanie> RS: I could do it after TPAC.
19:18:12 <joanie> RS: It should pretty much be what we have for grid.
19:19:03 <joanie> JS: Did we also add new roles for row?
19:19:06 <clown> action:  Rich to determine mappings for ARIA 1.1 table and cell role for all AAPI platforms.
19:19:06 <trackbot> Created ACTION-1737 - Determine mappings for aria 1.1 table and cell role for all aapi platforms. [on Richard Schwerdtfeger - due 2015-10-27].
19:19:10 <joanie> JD: No. But we did for cell.
19:19:13 <clown> action-1737
19:19:13 <trackbot> action-1737 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to Determine mappings for aria 1.1 table and cell role for all aapi platforms. -- due 2015-10-27 -- OPEN
19:19:13 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1737
19:19:33 <joanie> JD: There was some discussion about possibly deprecating gridcell, but nothing has been done in that regard yet.
19:24:09 <clown> action-1737
19:24:09 <trackbot> action-1737 -- Richard Schwerdtfeger to Determine mappings for ARUA 1.1 table and cell role for all AAPI platforms. -- due 2015-11-13 -- OPEN
19:24:09 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1737
19:30:26 <joanie> present+ Cynthia_Shelly
19:30:49 <cyns> cyns has joined #aapi
19:31:15 <joanie> Group: (Does mapping for table and cell roles during the meeting)
19:35:42 <cyns> https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/desktop/ee671624(v=vs.85).aspx
19:36:27 <richardschwerdtfeger> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1737
19:38:14 <joanie> Zakim, take up next item
19:38:14 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Check that all new ARIA 1.1 spec have actions." taken up [from clown]
19:38:25 <joanie> Zakim, take up item 3
19:38:25 <Zakim> agendum 3. "agenda+ Action/issue triage for ARIA 1.1 (https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/23,
19:38:27 <Zakim> ... https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=Core%20AAM&product=ARIA, https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=AccName%20AAM&product=ARIA,
19:38:27 <Zakim> ... https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/products/26)" taken up
19:39:02 <joanie> JS: The process today is to say if we can do items in the 1.1 timeframe or need to punt it to 2.0.
19:39:03 <clown> action-842?
19:39:03 <trackbot> action-842 -- Cynthia Shelly to Create a diagram to support section 1.2 A11Y vs DOM tree -- due 2015-09-30 -- OPEN
19:39:03 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/842
19:39:14 <joanie> JS: The first one is Cynthia's (action-842).
19:39:30 <joanie> CS: This will not happen in the 1.1 timeframe.
19:39:59 <joanie> JS: Do we want to kill this entirely?
19:40:18 <joanie> Group: Let's close this action.
19:40:38 <joanie> RESOLUTION: Close action-842.
19:41:18 <clown> action-1104
19:41:18 <trackbot> action-1104 -- Cynthia Shelly to Define what the accessibility API mapping is for UIA on aria-describedby in section 5.5.1 table when the element does not exist in the accessibility tree such as when css: display:none applies -- due 2015-09-15 -- OPEN
19:41:19 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1104
19:41:32 <joanie> JS: Action-1104 is also Cynthia's.
19:42:52 <joanie> CS: Give me three months, until January 1st.
19:43:00 <joanie> JS: Does that fit in the ARIA 1.1 time frame?
19:43:13 <joanie> RS: We want to go into CR during the first quarter as I understand it.
19:44:05 <joanie> RS: It doesn't have to be done by January 1st; it needs to be in the spec by January 1st. However, before then would be better. We need to lock things down.
19:44:15 <joanie> CS: I will try to do it earlier.
19:45:01 <clown> action-1309
19:45:01 <trackbot> action-1309 -- Cynthia Shelly to Determine the best place to map aria-colindex and aria-rowindex for UIA. -- due 2015-08-01 -- OPEN
19:45:01 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1309
19:45:12 <joanie> JS: This one is also Cynthia's.
19:45:27 <joanie> CS: I haven't done it yet. But it can be done in the ARIA 1.1. timeframe.
19:45:38 <joanie> CS: December 1st.
19:45:55 <clown> action-1373
19:45:55 <trackbot> action-1373 -- Cynthia Shelly to Create a test case for when aria-posinset and aria-setsize are provided explicitly on some but not all elements. -- due 2015-09-15 -- OPEN
19:45:55 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1373
19:46:10 <joanie> JS: Cynthia?
19:46:17 <joanie> CS: Also December 1st.
19:46:30 <joanie> JS: It's a test case so you might want to sync up with Michael Cooper.
19:47:04 <clown> action-1409
19:47:04 <trackbot> action-1409 -- Joanmarie Diggs to Monitor progress of bug against atk in gnome's bugzilla requesting new position, level, and other api be added (https://bugzilla.gnome.org/show_bug.cgi?id=727453) -- due 2015-10-27 -- OPEN
19:47:04 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1409
19:47:30 <joanie> JD: I haven't had time to add new API to ATK yet.
19:47:35 <joanie> JD: I still plan to.
19:47:51 <clown> scribenick: clonw
19:48:01 <clown> scribenick: clown
19:48:10 <clown> JD:  Let's move it to aria 2.0
19:48:20 <clown> JD: But it's not blocking, it simply doesn't change anything
19:48:29 <clown> JD:  There is a mapping through the object attributes.
19:49:54 <joanie> scribe: joanie
19:50:16 <clown> action-1527
19:50:16 <trackbot> action-1527 -- Cynthia Shelly to Investigate the proper uia mappings for aria-current -- due 2015-10-01 -- OPEN
19:50:16 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1527
19:50:26 <joanie> JS: Cynthia, this one is yours.
19:50:37 <joanie> CS: Is aria-current still current?
19:50:42 <joanie> JS: It's still there.
19:51:07 <clown> http://w3c.github.io/aria/core-aam/core-aam.html#ariaCurrent
19:51:30 <joanie> JD: If memory serves me, James Craig raised some concerns. Have those been resolved?
19:51:56 <joanie> (Group is not sure. It was raised on list but not at a meeting. Therefore, we need to go back and look.)
19:52:25 <joanie> JS: We have a mapping for ATK. I don't know if a test will pass, but it is mapped.
19:52:46 <clown> action-1527
19:52:46 <trackbot> action-1527 -- Cynthia Shelly to Investigate the proper uia mappings for aria-current -- due 2015-10-01 -- OPEN
19:52:46 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1527
19:52:55 <joanie> JS: Cynthia, could you update the action since you have an idea about the mapping for your platform?
19:53:14 <joanie> CS: Is core-aam normative? Can I change it?
19:53:37 <joanie> JS: As long as it's a working draft, you can change it.
19:54:13 <joanie> CS: For now the mapping will be in aria-properties. But we may wish to improve the situation down the road.
19:54:26 <joanie> JS: To me, that change would be for 2.0.
19:54:55 <joanie> CS: It wouldn't make the existing mapping wrong, but there'd be another (better) place for implementors.
19:55:08 <joanie> RS: We could probably update the spec for something like that.
19:58:37 <joanie> JD: Based on my experience (1.0 hit CR before Igalia was a W3C member), I pointed out a number of things that were incorrect in the 1.0 mapping spec. I was told that the changes which would make things correct were substantial and would have to be postponed to 1.1. Thus I think we would have to roll a 1.2 release of the mapping spec to make any changes.
19:58:52 <joanie> JD: I think rolling such a release would be easy and worth doing.
19:59:51 <joanie> JS: So do we want to put it in aria-properties for now?
20:00:07 <clown> action-1527
20:00:07 <trackbot> action-1527 -- Cynthia Shelly to Investigate the proper uia mappings for aria-current -- due 2015-10-01 -- OPEN
20:00:07 <trackbot> https://www.w3.org/WAI/PF/Group/track/actions/1527
20:01:00 <clown> scribenick: clown
20:01:17 <clown> CS:  I've put a note in the action to use AriaProperties for now.
20:01:40 <clown> JS:  Assign the action to me now.
20:01:55 <clown> JS:  You have given me the information, and I can now do the edits.
20:02:12 <clown> JS:  And, that will be it for this meeting.
20:02:29 <clown> JS:  Have a good meeting at TPAC next week, everyone (who is going).
20:03:40 <joanie> scribe: joanie
20:03:55 <joanie> Zakim, part
20:03:55 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees have been Joseph_Scheuhammer, Rich_Schwerdtfeger, Joanmarie_Diggs, Bryan_Garaventa, Cynthia_Shelly
20:03:55 <Zakim> Zakim has left #aapi
20:04:06 <joanie> scribeOptions: -final
20:04:14 <joanie> RRSAgent, stop
20:07:12 <joanie> s/I am, though busy//
20:07:22 <joanie> s/but I'm here//
20:07:30 <joanie> s/sorry, guess I should call in//
20:07:41 <joanie> s/give me a few minutes//
20:07:47 <joanie> RRSAgent, make minutes
20:07:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/10/20-aapi-minutes.html joanie
20:08:09 <joanie> RRSAgent, stop