12:54:41 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #sdw
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12:54:43 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
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12:54:45 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be SDW
12:54:45 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
12:54:46 <trackbot> Meeting: Spatial Data on the Web Working Group Teleconference
12:54:46 <trackbot> Date: 19 August 2015
12:55:18 <jtandy> present+ jtandy
12:57:14 <Frans> present+ Frans
12:57:52 <Frans> I wonder if more people will show up
12:58:53 <Frans> phila, are you there? I don't see you on webex
12:59:10 <phila> Yes, I'm joining now fr
13:01:09 <Linda> Linda has joined #sdw
13:02:31 <phila> chair: Frans
13:02:54 <phila> agenda: https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Meetings:Telecon20150819
13:02:57 <phila> scribe: phila
13:03:15 <phila> Frans: Main topic is the homework that people have been done
13:03:33 <phila> ... It's not clear who is doing what homework. There were some action items but not for everyone
13:03:40 <Linda> There's some minor construction work going on in our office so it could be noisy in my background.
13:03:45 <Linda> present+ Linda
13:03:47 <phila> regrets+ Ed Parsons, Kerry Taylor, Simon Cox, Josh Lieberman, Payam, Andreas, Lars, Bill
13:03:52 <phila> present+ phila
13:03:58 <phila> present+ Jeremy, Frans
13:04:55 <phila> General agreement that we are not quorate so we'll have an informal chat
13:05:10 <phila> Topic: Cross referecning homework
13:05:17 <phila> Frans: I saw 2 action items
13:05:17 <Frans> http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/61
13:05:22 <phila> action-61?
13:05:22 <trackbot> action-61 -- Phil Archer to cross-reference "identifiers" issue with DoW and WA -- due 2015-08-19 -- OPEN
13:05:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/track/actions/61
13:05:54 <Linda> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Consolidated_Narratives
13:05:59 <phila> -> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/BP_Consolidated_Narratives Narratives Page
13:06:43 <phila> jtandy: There are 7 narratives on that page
13:07:00 <phila> ... and an 8th that I haven't worked out what to do with yet. Was there any discussion about the other stuff
13:07:20 <phila> phila: Is pretty sure that no, the 'other stuff, hasn't been classified
13:08:08 <phila> jtandy: We can come back to the other stuff anotehr time. There are things there that we should cover. Like how to we handle large aounts of data that don't fit into an RDF-centric view of the world
13:08:31 <phila> Frans: We did discuss the narratives in general... one idea was to have the amateur vs expert perspective
13:08:51 <phila> Frans: The big datasets might fit into the expert aspects of a data publisher
13:09:13 <phila> jtandy: And there's stuff that talks about lineage and provenance (the data linking bit). How to do linking when it's 5TB of LIDAR data
13:09:35 <phila> Frans: You could probably group a lot under such a narrative, a researcher wanting to publish data in a meaningful way
13:10:30 <phila> Frans: It also seems realted to the diff between publishing a web page with some microdata and publishing an entire dataset through a service endpoint
13:11:34 <phila> jtandy: Any highlights about the discussions about the 7 narratives as laid out?
13:11:54 <phila> Frans: I don't think were discussed in depth. The main topics have been finding volunteers to do the cross referencing work
13:12:09 <phila> ... And before that we discussed the nature of the narratives but that was before they took form.
13:12:21 <phila> jtandy: I think I have a quick run through 3 weeks ago.
13:13:44 <Frans> jtendy: current format of narratives looks a lot like the format of the Data on the Web BP
13:16:57 <phila> jtandy: Is DWBO meeting at TPAC?
13:16:58 <Frans> TOPIC: how to communicate with the Data on the Web WG
13:17:01 <phila> phila: No.
13:17:41 <phila> jtandy: There are things that we want to say that may be applicable beyond spatial data, but we'll say it in the context of spatial data. DWBP might want to broaden it
13:17:56 <phila> ... and we'd help them do that, but we should keep delivery decoupled
13:18:17 <phila> phila: Dependencies eitehr way are bad
13:18:56 <jtandy> s/eitehr/either/
13:19:25 <Frans> phila: I think I am the only member of both groups
13:21:41 <phila> Discussion about DWBp relationship. Agreement that liaison doesn't mean dependencies.
13:22:02 <phila> If DWBP has a BP that is useful/applicable, SDW can cite it, modulo any changes that SDW might ask for
13:22:36 <phila> Problem only arises if the two BP docs present best practices that are not in alignment/contradictory
13:22:42 <phila>  which is unlikely
13:23:22 <phila> action: Archer to invite Hadley Beeman to a meeting with the SDW WG at TPAC
13:23:23 <trackbot> Created ACTION-68 - Invite hadley beeman to a meeting with the sdw wg at tpac [on Phil Archer - due 2015-08-26].
13:24:08 <phila> Discussion of wiki page to be established to record areas where SDW thinks a Bp should/could/might like to cover an issue
13:26:11 <phila> Frans: The prob with the DWBP is that the scope is so broad
13:26:12 <phila> phila: Yes
13:26:18 <phila> Frans: So we should protect our scope
13:26:45 <phila> Frans: I think it would be useful to list things that we think are important but that re out of scope for our WG
13:27:06 <phila> jtandy: That's a meta question for how to cross reference.
13:27:19 <phila> jtandy: I wonder whetehr we should go through the homework as bets we can
13:27:23 <phila> s/bets/best/
13:28:03 <phila> jtandy: In terms of cross referencing, Kerry has put some stuff in about linking data, Ed has done the same about APIs, Linda has put in some stuff about enablign discovery
13:28:24 <phila> jtandy: Nothing on identifiers, spaitiotemporal
13:28:43 <phila> jtandy: Linda, could you talk us through what you discovered for enabling discovery
13:29:01 <phila> Linda: Mainly what I found was that the DWBP doc there was a big section about metadata
13:29:15 <phila> ... the point of providing it, largely for discovery, so there's an overlap there
13:29:35 <phila> ... so we should take a good look at thats section. And then maybe extend it with spatial aspects
13:30:06 <phila> ... Anotehr thing they mentioned was that discovery depends fundamentally on the use of HTTP URIs - which is right
13:33:04 <phila> jtandy: Both of those sound like sensible observations. Extending existing BPs, and use of HTTP URIs which Phil is looking at
13:33:34 <phila> ... I see there wasn't any coverage of Architecture of the Web/inconsistencies
13:34:01 <phila> jtandy: That's been around a long time and it's remarkably relevant today. So we need to be consistent with it if we're talking about spatial data on the Web.
13:34:06 <phila> ... We are consistent with it
13:34:13 <phila> Linda: Yes, just more specific
13:34:34 <phila> jtandy: Are there other citable resources that we should be ... citing
13:34:42 <phila> Linda: I'd have to think about it.
13:34:46 <phila> phila: Maybe some OGC stuff?
13:35:04 <phila> Linda: Some OGC, INSPIRE??
13:35:21 <phila> jtandy: There's the DCAT-Geo-AP
13:35:47 <phila> .. that's expressing ISO19115 plus DCAT etc.
13:36:09 <phila> ... Things like DCAT-GeoAP should be consistent with what we're saying.
13:36:15 <phila> Frans: That looks like a BO to me already
13:36:23 <phila> jtandy: That's more than a BP
13:36:45 <phila> ... It says if you're going to use 19115 attributes, then do it like this - that's more detailed than we want?
13:37:12 <phila> Frans: People are looking for that kind of guidance. It's a mapping from OGC to W3C mapping, it's what publishers are looking for
13:37:13 <phila> q+
13:37:34 <phila> Frans: I;m not saying that it is a BP, but it's a good candidate
13:37:44 <phila> ... that might be identified in the deliverable
13:37:53 <phila> q-
13:40:59 <Frans> Linda: missing discovery of data vs. discovery of data sets in DotWWG
13:42:15 <phila> phila: Bangs on about longevity, give examples, maybe on example - comply or explain maybe
13:42:18 <Frans> phila: yes, that is an issue and the DotWWG should tackle it
13:42:53 <phila> Linda: Does it talk about data on the Web cf. datasets on the web?
13:43:12 <phila> jtandy: Thank you for doing your homework. I was very pelased to see stuff happening even though i hadn't push it
13:43:14 <Frans> jtandy: pleased to see stuff happening
13:43:24 <phila> phila: (Kerry was pretty forceful last week)
13:43:42 <phila> jtandy: We could look through what Ed and Kerry wrote or do it offline
13:43:49 <phila> Frans: I think it makes more sense if more people are present
13:44:04 <phila> ... esp Ed and Kerry as they wrote their contribution
13:44:13 <phila> jtandy: Ed has put in BP23, 26 nad 22
13:44:16 <phila> s/nad/and/
13:44:26 <phila> ... so he's been though it and put some brief notes in
13:44:35 <phila> jtandy: Regarding next week, I'll be on vacation again
13:44:38 <phila> phila: Me too
13:45:08 <phila> Frans: I am being forceful too - do your homework
13:45:34 <Linda> Me too - on vacation next week I mean
13:46:05 <phila> jtandy: 61 is identifiers - Phil
13:46:19 <phila> ... 62 is same thing with Phil
13:46:31 <phila> s/Phil/Armin
13:46:50 <phila> jtandy: 63 is clear semantics, assigned to Bill, prob done before next week's meeting
13:46:59 <phila> jtandy: 64 is discovery that Linda has done
13:47:04 <phila> close action-64
13:47:04 <trackbot> Closed action-64.
13:47:17 <phila> jtandy: 65 is spatial and temporal info, that's Chris
13:47:28 <phila> Frans: I think he volunteered for temporal
13:47:41 <phila> Linda: Yes, but Kerry twisted his arm
13:47:49 <phila> jtandy: Chris is on holiday this week.
13:48:02 <phila> ... Those issues are so specific they won't be covered anywhere else
13:48:20 <phila> jtandy: 66 is data exposed via APIs which is on Ed - because no one else took it
13:48:31 <phila> jtandy: 67 is linking data which is Kerry
13:48:38 <phila> Frans: Sensor data is still missing
13:48:55 <phila> jtandy: I know Payam and Kerry are involved in the SSN stuff
13:49:26 <phila> jtandy: Maybe we can ping Payam... but he's on holiday too
13:49:42 <phila> Frans: He's a co-editor of the BP doc
13:50:38 <phila> jtandy: We are making progress. Given that we want to have an FPWD by middle of October, time is of the essence
13:50:57 <phila> ... I hope we'll have a structure, with the themes we'll be covering, maybe on eof them drawn out
13:51:14 <jtandy> s/eof/of/
13:55:14 <phila> phila: Suggests a frozen copy by Friday 16th, but not formal publication until after TPAC
13:57:38 <Linda> +1
13:57:38 <phila> General agreement to this
13:57:47 <jtandy> +1
13:57:48 <phila> jtandy: I'd ask the chairs to promote that so people know what to expect
13:58:17 <phila> RRSAgent, draft minutes
13:58:17 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/08/19-sdw-minutes.html phila
13:59:13 <jtandy> bye
14:01:29 <jtandy> q+ to ask about bruce bannerman's climate data use case
14:02:02 <jtandy> will type ...
14:02:57 <jtandy> https://www.w3.org/2015/spatial/wiki/Working_Use_Cases#Provenance_of_climate_data_.28Best_Practice.2C_Time-series.2C_Observations.2C_Coverages.2C_Data_Provenance.2C_DOI.2C_Metadata.29
14:04:02 <jtandy> bye
14:04:18 <phila> RRSAgent, draft minutes
14:04:18 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/08/19-sdw-minutes.html phila
14:04:27 <phila> trackbot, end meeeting
14:04:27 <trackbot> Sorry, phila, I don't understand 'trackbot, end meeeting'. Please refer to <http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for help.
14:04:32 <phila> trackbot end meeeting
14:04:32 <trackbot> Sorry, phila, I don't understand 'trackbot end meeeting'. Please refer to <http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc> for help.
14:04:37 <phila> trackbot end meeting
14:04:37 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
14:04:37 <Zakim> sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
14:04:45 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
14:04:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/08/19-sdw-minutes.html trackbot
14:04:46 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
14:04:46 <RRSAgent> I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/19-sdw-actions.rdf :
14:04:46 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Archer to invite Hadley Beeman to a meeting with the SDW WG at TPAC [1]
14:04:46 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/08/19-sdw-irc#T13-23-22