14:51:16 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-media
14:51:16 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-irc
14:51:18 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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14:51:20 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 63342
14:51:20 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
14:51:21 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Media Task Force Teleconference
14:51:21 <trackbot> Date: 21 July 2015
14:51:44 <paulc> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0022.html
14:57:23 <markw> markw has joined #html-media
14:58:41 <paulc> present+ paulc
14:59:39 <paulc> Teleconference information: +1-617-324-0000 Access code: 649 602 452
15:00:44 <joesteele> joesteele has joined #html-media
15:01:15 <ddorwin> ddorwin has joined #html-media
15:01:48 <davide1> davide1 has joined #html-media
15:01:57 <paulc> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0022.html
15:02:38 <joesteele> scribenick: joesteele
15:02:40 <markw> present+ markw
15:02:44 <joesteele> chair: paulc
15:02:49 <joesteele> present + joesteele
15:03:08 <paulc> Teleconference information: +1-617-324-0000+1-617-324-0000 Access code: 649 602 452
15:03:15 <paulc> present+ joesteele
15:04:17 <jdsmith> jdsmith has joined #html-media
15:04:24 <ddorwin> present+ ddorwin
15:04:30 <davide1> present+ davide
15:05:08 <joesteele> topic: New Issues related to Issue #39
15:05:11 <paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/39
15:05:21 <paulc> Issues 68, 69, 70 and 75 are related to the solution to ISSUE-39
15:05:40 <paulc> Issue-75 is new (after the agenda was sent out)
15:06:07 <joesteele> paulc: seems to be active discussion — anything to add
15:06:28 <joesteele> ddorwin: I think 68-70 make sense regardless, but 75 should go first to make sure we dont need to rewrite
15:06:39 <paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/75 should be done first
15:06:43 <joesteele> … need input from the WebIDL people about the intent of iterable
15:06:47 <jdsmith_> jdsmith_ has joined #html-media
15:06:53 <jdsmith_> present+
15:06:59 <joesteele> … or whether the spec is wrong, but see some reasoning for the way they have done it
15:07:06 <joesteele> … ideally their spec is wrong and will be fixed
15:07:31 <joesteele> paulc: 70 is marked to be implemented, neeed to discuss 68 then?
15:07:42 <paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/70
15:07:49 <joesteele> ddorwin: I have text I need to add, 69 is define key ID sort order, we can address that
15:07:59 <joesteele> … can figure out what they look like but not imoement yet
15:08:06 <joesteele> … folks should comment though
15:08:21 <joesteele> … different byte ordering might be an ssue to consider
15:08:40 <joesteele> paulc: have the other folks looked at this?
15:08:46 <joesteele> markw: I have looked and agree so far
15:08:57 <joesteele> jdsmitth: I have not looked yet
15:09:10 <joesteele> joesteele: I have only read it over not talked about internally yet
15:09:22 <joesteele> paulc: having people review would be good then
15:09:38 <joesteele> topic ISSUE-71 - Be explicit about aborting steps when resolving a promise early
15:09:44 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/71
15:09:55 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-71 - Be explicit about aborting steps when resolving a promise early
15:10:02 <joesteele> paulc: no comments yet
15:10:17 <joesteele> joesteele: just saw this morning, seems reasonable but need to review our implementation
15:10:57 <joesteele> paulc: would like to resolve as this came out 2 weeks ago
15:11:06 <paulc> Resolve steps proposal: "Therefore, I think we should remove "resolving or " from this statement (and the other two instances) and explicitly abort the  load()  algorithm in step 8.8.1."
15:11:15 <joesteele> jdsmith: my instinct is that a general rule does not make sense
15:11:28 <joesteele> … but what David is proposing makes senses
15:11:48 <joesteele> markw: nothing from me
15:12:05 <paulc> Reject Steps questions: "I forget why we removed " and abort these steps" from all the reject steps and added these three instances of this statement. Perhaps to be more concise and highlight the unique portions of each such step. It's certainly less text than including that phrase in the approximately 40 such steps, but it is less explicit."
15:12:10 <joesteele> paulc: Jerry, David has a question — does this chaneg anything?
15:12:22 <joesteele> jdsmith: think it is best to be more explicit, is there a style guide?
15:13:00 <joesteele> … dont remember why we removed that — he is saying it should be restored and that makes sense
15:13:15 <joesteele> ddorwin: no other questions from me
15:13:34 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-72 - Explicitly define the initial state of the `keyStatuses` attribute
15:13:43 <joesteele> ddorwin: just making this look like the other ones
15:14:04 <joesteele> … Mark avoided “empty” in a bunch of places — this is editorial
15:14:11 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/72
15:14:16 <markw> lgtm
15:14:22 <joesteele> joesteele: +1
15:14:32 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-73 -  Get Supported Capabilities for Media Type algorithm uses both "media type" and "media types
15:14:38 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/73
15:14:50 <joesteele> ddorwin: also editorial — need a new name though
15:14:55 <joesteele> … current name is confusing
15:15:24 <joesteele> paulc: why not “X”?
15:15:31 <markw> "parameterized codecs"
15:15:46 <joesteele> … I say just pick a new name and move on
15:16:03 <markw> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parkinson%27s_law_of_triviality
15:16:40 <markw> "Parkinson observed and illustrated that a committee whose job was to approve plans for a nuclear power plant spent the majority of its time with pointless discussions on relatively trivial and unimportant but easy-to-grasp issues, such as what materials to use for the staff bike-shed,"
15:16:44 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-74 - The WebIDL reference points to the first edition
15:16:50 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/74
15:17:13 <joesteele> paulc: suggested that you split the references as a 1st step
15:17:26 <joesteele> … I think a new working draft is going out soon, maybe next week
15:17:33 <joesteele> … we have some of the same issues in DOM4
15:18:18 <joesteele> … it is not obvious when and where WebIDL v2 will get to a state where it is not too far behind us
15:18:22 <paulc> See https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/74#issuecomment-123080711
15:19:01 <joesteele> paulc: some folks think WebIDL v1 is dead (live spec folks)
15:19:17 <joesteele> … but dont want to end up being in a place where WebIDL v2 is behind us
15:19:29 <joesteele> ddorwin: think all new web specs are starting to depend on v2
15:19:45 <joesteele> paulc: I will continue to track, but you can resolve by splitting the references
15:19:54 <joesteele> … we can deal with it at last call
15:20:16 <joesteele> topic: Issues awaiting actions, re-opened or awaiting implementation
15:20:29 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-17 Replace "fire a simple event" with "fire an event" for non-simple Events, Assigned to Jerry
15:20:37 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/17
15:20:51 <joesteele> jdsmith: have not sent a note ot the WG yet on this — will do today
15:20:57 <paulc> See http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item03
15:21:03 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-20 Ensure session type is correct for loaded sessions, Assigned to Jerry
15:21:09 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/20
15:21:23 <joesteele> paulc: some commentary on this issue — Jerry re-opened
15:21:28 <paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/20#issuecomment-121788748
15:21:41 <joesteele> jdsmith: my edit was not correct — want to revert and do something that meets the intent of the bug
15:21:49 <joesteele> … should correspond to sessions being reloaded
15:21:57 <joesteele> … doesn’t confirm there is a match currently
15:22:08 <joesteele> topic: Initialization Data issue cluster
15:22:32 <joesteele> joesteele: I did not do any external here — still discussing internal and got sidetracked
15:22:39 <paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item04
15:23:03 <paulc> This is about ISSUEs 41, 52 and 53.
15:23:04 <joesteele> joesteele: will get something to the TF email list today
15:23:23 <joesteele> topic: Event handler and message cluster
15:23:30 <paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item05
15:23:48 <joesteele> jdsmith: busy working on impelemtnations, not enough time to work on the document
15:23:53 <paulc> Issues 19, 14 and 31.
15:24:13 <joesteele> paulc: try for two weeks out?
15:24:29 <joesteele> jdsmith: pretty busy, will prioritize the edits but will try to get this done by Friday
15:24:31 <joesteele> topic: Active EME issues and open pull requests
15:24:40 <joesteele> topic: Issue-63: Align normative text on user consent for Distinctive Identifiers with privacy section
15:24:47 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/63
15:24:52 <joesteele> paulc: David was going to review
15:24:54 <paulc> See Pull request 66
15:24:55 <paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item07
15:25:00 <joesteele> ddorwin: I reviewed, need to review more
15:25:11 <joesteele> … try to get that done by next meeting
15:25:21 <joesteele> topic: ISSUE-45: Remove "persistent-release-message" MediaKeySessionType
15:25:28 <joesteele> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/45
15:25:40 <joesteele> ddorwin: these are all wiating for the key renewal to be published
15:25:51 <joesteele> … we is Google
15:25:56 <paulc> http://www.w3.org/2015/07/07-html-media-minutes.html#item09
15:26:24 <joesteele> markw: pointing out that I will be out for next 2.5 weeks — will not see a response form me in that timeframe
15:26:32 <joesteele> … but you will see a response from me
15:26:37 <joesteele> … back on August 11th
15:26:48 <joesteele> … still working tomorrow though
15:27:13 <joesteele> topic: [EME] Netflix's secure release is unreliable without tamper-proof secure persistent storage and/or delayed shutdown
15:27:19 <joesteele> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jun/0021.html
15:27:29 <joesteele> paulc: think this one is covered by issue 45?
15:27:41 <joesteele> ddorwin: yes — these are all related
15:27:50 <joesteele> topic: Media Task Force F2F meeting, TPAC, Sapporo, Japan, Oct 2015
15:27:59 <paulc> https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jul/0020.html
15:28:11 <joesteele> paulc: F2F coming up — proposing that we meet at TPAC
15:28:19 <joesteele> … Oct 26th - Oct 30th
15:28:21 <paulc> Oct 26-30 see http://www.w3.org/2015/10/TPAC/
15:28:50 <joesteele> paulc: the W3C extended the HTML-WG until end of Sept. This TF will continue in some form on after that
15:28:59 <joesteele> … may be proposed as a separate media working group
15:29:15 <joesteele> … the scope would subsume the MSE and EME work maybe other work as well
15:29:47 <joesteele> … proposal is that we should think about having a F2F of the TF and maybe this new WG that the TF would morph into
15:30:12 <joesteele> … possible that the changes to the new HTML WG wont be finalized by then so we think might be worth starting the discussion now
15:30:22 <joesteele> … since folks are taking breaks over the summer
15:30:35 <joesteele> … any comments?
15:31:37 <paulc> The proposed charter for a new (HTML + WebApps) WG = Web Platform WG and the Timed Media WG is at https://github.com/w3c/charter-html
15:32:22 <joesteele> paulc: basically would fold WebApps and HTML together, the exception would be the media work
15:32:43 <joesteele> … possible that the TimedMedia WG would own the media elements in the HTML5 spec and would be responsible for changes to those
15:32:49 <joesteele> … e.g. a Transcript element
15:33:29 <joesteele> paulc: concensus that HTML WG has acheived its goal and would go away
15:33:36 <joesteele> … we want to make some changes
15:33:55 <paulc> New ideas for the Web Platform will be incubated in the ICG: https://www.w3.org/community/wicg/
15:34:22 <paulc> The WICG was created on Jul 1 and it came out of discussions at https://github.com/w3c/charter-html
15:34:25 <joesteele> paulc: this was created on July 1 and came out of that same git hub discussion
15:35:23 <joesteele> paulc: might be that we get so much feedback we can’t finish by TPAC, that would mean we extend the WG and TF until later
15:35:39 <joesteele> … if AC approves the charter changes, then the new gorup would meet at TPAC
15:35:57 <joesteele> paulc: any strong objections?
15:36:47 <joesteele> … questions can be sent to Paul or Phillipe or to the public github
15:37:29 <joesteele> paulc: Registration for TOAC is OPEN. Location is in Sapporo, Japan.
15:37:40 <joesteele> s/TOAC/TPAC/
15:37:53 <joesteele> … start your planning now. Likely to meet Thursday and Friday
15:38:11 <joesteele> … encourage you to attend Wednesday
15:38:28 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate minutes
15:38:28 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:38:42 <joesteele> topic: Next meeting
15:38:57 <joesteele> paulc: was going to suggest Augst 4th — but with Makr out might go further
15:39:04 <joesteele> markw: you can meet without me
15:39:10 <joesteele> s/Makr/Mark/
15:39:24 <joesteele> paulc: OK then we will meet on the 4th and the 18th
15:39:46 <joesteele> ddorwin: lets see what topics we have for the 4th
15:39:58 <joesteele> … I will be out as well
15:40:13 <joesteele> paulc: I will sen a note the previous week to confirm then
15:40:22 <joesteele> … minutes are clear on what folks actions are
15:40:34 <joesteele> … Aug 3rd is a holiday for me
15:40:45 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate minutes
15:40:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:40:48 <paulc> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:40:48 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html paulc
15:40:50 <joesteele> Zakim, who is here?
15:40:50 <Zakim> sorry, joesteele, I don't know what conference this is
15:40:52 <Zakim> On IRC I see jdsmith_, davide1, ddorwin, joesteele, markw, Zakim, RRSAgent, paulc, cwilso, adrianba, trackbot
15:41:04 <joesteele> paulc: thanks for the hard work David
15:41:47 <davide1> davide1 has left #html-media
15:42:01 <joesteele> s/Issue-/ISSUE-/
15:42:08 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:42:08 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:42:24 <joesteele> s/an ssue/an issue/
15:42:38 <joesteele> s/imoement/implement/
15:42:51 <joesteele> s/dont/don’t/
15:42:59 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:42:59 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:43:24 <joesteele> s/topic ISSUE-71 - Be explicit about aborting steps when resolving a promise early//
15:43:34 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:43:34 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:44:12 <joesteele> s/dont/don’t/
15:44:26 <joesteele> s/dont/don\’t/
15:45:11 <joesteele> s/do any external/do anything external/
15:45:12 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:45:12 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:45:38 <joesteele> s/form me/from me/
15:45:39 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:45:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:45:46 <joesteele> s/wiating/waiting/
15:45:47 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:45:47 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:46:07 <joesteele> s/wont/won\’t/
15:46:09 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:46:09 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:46:31 <joesteele> s/git hub/Github/
15:46:33 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:46:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:46:53 <joesteele> s/Augst/August/
15:46:54 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:46:54 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:47:22 <joesteele> s/attend Wednesday/attend Wednesday technical plenary/
15:47:24 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:47:24 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:47:39 <joesteele> s/lets/let\’s/
15:47:40 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:47:40 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:48:05 <joesteele> present + jdsmith
15:48:12 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:48:12 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:48:34 <joesteele> present + adrianba
15:48:38 <joesteele> present + cwilso
15:48:49 <joesteele> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:48:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/21-html-media-minutes.html joesteele
15:50:12 <joesteele> Zakim, bye
15:50:12 <Zakim> Zakim has left #html-media
15:50:17 <joesteele> rrsagent, bye
15:50:17 <RRSAgent> I see no action items