20:33:46 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #svg
20:33:46 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/07/16-svg-irc
20:33:48 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
20:33:48 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #svg
20:33:50 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG
20:33:50 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
20:33:51 <trackbot> Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference
20:33:51 <trackbot> Date: 16 July 2015
20:33:53 <heycam> Chair: Cameron
20:33:55 <heycam> Agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/www-svg/2015Jul/0014.html
20:34:00 <heycam> present+ Cameron
20:34:51 <Tav> present+ Tav
20:34:53 <AmeliaBR> present+ AmeliaBR
20:35:01 <Rossen> present+ Rossen
20:35:08 <Rossen> present+ present
20:36:19 <nikos> present+ Nikos
20:37:35 <BogdanBrinza> BogdanBrinza has joined #svg
20:37:35 <heycam> Scribe: Cameron
20:37:39 <Rossen> Scribe: Rossen
20:37:49 <stakagi> present+ stakagi
20:38:07 <Rossen> heycam: Topic is checkpoint of progress
20:38:36 <Rossen> heycam: quick attendance check - everyone seems to be here
20:39:54 <Rossen> chatter about the "usefullness" of webex - everyone seems to be "happy"
20:42:39 <Rossen> heycam: checkpoint was spposed to be - how is everyone tracking towards finishing for f2f as well as a reminder that we need to be done by then
20:42:53 <Rossen> heycam: first one is Rendering chapter
20:43:00 <Rossen> heycam: how is that tracking
20:43:05 <heycam> https://www.w3.org/Graphics/SVG/WG/wiki/SVG2_Chapter_Assessment
20:43:28 <Rossen> nikos: comming along OK
20:43:42 <Rossen> ...: added a few checkins yesterday
20:44:18 <Rossen> ... identified a change from 1.1 in respect to viewports of foreignObject
20:44:32 <Rossen> ... the section is ready for review
20:44:50 <Rossen> ... needs to verify/finish clipping in the same chapter... not a lot left to do
20:45:18 <Rossen> heycam: next is one of mine - Data Types
20:45:18 <shepazu> agenda+ Canvas 2D API
20:45:39 <Rossen> ... I haven't done anything or on any of the other chapters
20:45:48 <Rossen> ... planing to work on all of this next week
20:46:12 <Rossen> ... worried about the ones listed as "needs discussion" - not sure what was already covered and what not
20:46:40 <Rossen> ... will check minutes and bring back issues as needed otherwise will
20:47:22 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: there's an open issue with xforms and how they work/integrate with CSS
20:47:32 <Rossen> heycam: recalls discussing xforms to elements
20:48:40 <shepazu> s/xforms/transforms/g
20:48:53 <Rossen> ... the intent was to add a method in the Geometry spec for methods that work on all elements thus SVG will not be handled in a different way.
20:48:53 <AmeliaBR> http://dev.w3.org/fxtf/geometry/#DOMMatrix
20:49:25 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: currently there's only methods for handling matrix maniputlations but that's about it
20:49:50 <Rossen> heycam: again, no progress on my end but promisse to do it next week
20:50:29 <Rossen> ... next checkpoint is Paths - this is ready and should be set to 5 now
20:50:41 <Rossen> Tav: I just noticed something about bearing there
20:51:21 <Rossen> heycam: recalls a discussions in AUS f2f resolving to move the catmulrom curves but not beagrings
20:51:45 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: makes sense - prefers to see bearings sooner than later
20:52:06 <Rossen> shepazu: inserts inapropriate joke
20:52:34 <Rossen> heycam: next chapter for review is Text
20:52:55 <Rossen> Tav: have been doing a number of changes
20:53:08 <Rossen> ... has a plan to finish but is missing one seciton from heycam
20:53:17 <Rossen> heycam: sorry, will get it to you soon
20:53:25 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: promisses to review the changes
20:54:01 <Rossen> ... there was a discussion on the mailling list about text on a path and a stretch mode - calls for a better definition and hopfully implementation
20:54:12 <Rossen> Tav: if you want it - write it :)
20:54:27 <Rossen> shepazu: but this will be "at risk"
20:55:07 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: it's not really new but it isn't implemented and is important for i18n
20:55:19 <Rossen> shepazu: recalls an impl from Opera in Presto
20:55:34 <Rossen> Tav: there was a problem that isn't speced well
20:55:43 <Rossen> shepazu: interoperable?
20:55:48 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: don't know
20:56:12 <Rossen> shepazu: interop is what matters
20:56:47 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: will try to get feedback from implementers to see what would be easier
20:57:03 <Rossen> ... straight line stretch will be probably easier to implement
20:57:10 <Rossen> ... will look for algos
20:57:21 <Rossen> shepazu: sounds like a stretch goal for SVG 2
20:57:42 <Rossen> heycam: thank you for the update Tav
20:57:55 <Rossen> ... next is Embeded content - Bogdan?
20:58:16 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: haven't done anything for anything but promisse to have them done by end of July
20:58:27 <Rossen> heycam: so end of July?
20:58:30 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: yes
20:58:49 <Rossen> heycam: next is Paining - same as others that are assigned to me
20:59:19 <Rossen> heycam: next is Paint Servers
20:59:25 <Rossen> Tav: made some progress
20:59:41 <Rossen> ... want to discuss open issues about how to fit a mesh inside bbox
21:00:35 <Rossen> ... there are few things that needs ed help with
21:00:46 <Rossen> ... the content model for hatches needs to be reviewd
21:00:54 <Rossen> ... sees some inconsistency with other modules
21:01:13 <Rossen> heycam: not sure about ed's availability so feel free to reach out to me instead
21:01:31 <Rossen> heycam: next is Interactivity - ed
21:01:49 <Rossen> ... not many issues on the wiki about this one
21:02:03 <Rossen> ... will have to wait for ed
21:02:09 <Rossen> heycam: next is Linking
21:02:22 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: I have few outstanding integration actions
21:02:35 <Rossen> ... not sure if BogdanBrinza has been doing anything else with it
21:02:39 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: no
21:03:04 <Rossen> ... will be done with the rest of the spec work
21:03:26 <Rossen> heycam: last is Animation
21:03:54 <Rossen> ... since Brian is not here and not sure if he has time for it
21:04:21 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: wasn't the plan be to move the chapter to its own nodule?
21:04:34 <Rossen> Rossen: yes that was the POR
21:04:44 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: I'll try to do the split off
21:04:54 <Rossen> heycam: advices that this might be a lot of work
21:05:50 <Rossen> heycam: shepazu you had some issues you wanted to discuss?
21:06:01 <Rossen> shepazu: yes, it was about canvas2d
21:06:24 <Rossen> Topic: Canvas2D API
21:06:31 <AmeliaBR> http://www.w3.org/TR/2dcontext/
21:06:51 <Rossen> shepazu: I was talking with PLH about future plans for HTML
21:07:06 <Rossen> ... he noteed that Canvas2D API has no clear API
21:07:26 <Rossen> ... it will possibly move to a new IG
21:07:34 <shepazu> s/clear API/clear WG/
21:07:43 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: general Canvas2D API or path API?
21:07:46 <Rossen> shepazu: both
21:08:11 <Rossen> ... PLH was noting that there are a lot of similarities btwn the SVG and Canvas2D API
21:08:30 <Rossen> ... he asked if we can own the Canvas2D API space?
21:08:39 <Rossen> Rossen: yes, as soon as we ship SVG 2
21:09:02 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: it's really more of a graphics area
21:09:27 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: notes that one is retained and the other is declarative from impl POV
21:09:40 <Rossen> ... thus the abcking models are quite different
21:09:59 <Rossen> shepazu: the question is how much are they related but who owns the work?
21:10:26 <Rossen> ... alternative is the whole "web platform thing"...
21:10:59 <Rossen> ... since there won't be HTML WG PLH wants to move it to SVG WG
21:11:29 <Rossen> heycam: wornders how working with whatwg is going to be etc.
21:11:50 <Rossen> shepazu: there is no whatwg editor at the moment for either HTML or Canvas2D
21:12:33 <Rossen> nikos: The mailing lists are very quiet - why?
21:12:42 <Rossen> shepazu: not much being done at the moment
21:13:31 <Rossen> nikos: likes the general idea and thinks that Canon might be able to contribute
21:13:51 <Rossen> shepazu: summarizes that we are open to the idea but we want to prioritize SVG2
21:15:40 <Rossen> shepazu: what if we park it at SVG but encourage th ecurrent authors to join and work on it
21:16:20 <Rossen> Rossen: is still opposed to the idea based on the fact that we'll be spending time for things that don't contribute to finalizing SVG
21:16:45 <Rossen> BogdanBrinza: this doesn't seem to align with the charter of declarative graphics
21:17:03 <Rossen> ... perhaps a Graphics rendering TF will be better
21:20:24 <Rossen> [discussion about how appropriate this to the SVGWG]
21:20:51 <Rossen> shepazu: any objections other than Microsoft?
21:21:21 <Rossen> heycam: no objections but it should be a separate TF
21:22:10 <Rossen> ... if it is more of an administrative move then fine, but not if it means who are the people who work on this
21:22:51 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: it would be great to have the new people join
21:23:02 <Rossen> shepazu: it will be better from a11y POV as well
21:23:20 <Rossen> heycam: with 11 mins left, Tav floor is yours
21:23:30 <Rossen> Topic: Fitting mesh in a bbx
21:23:52 <Rossen> Tav: suggested at previous f2f to not use bbox for fitting a mesh
21:24:07 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: thought that we can just use 0-1 coords
21:24:28 <Rossen> heycam: so the question was about "how to treat the objects bbox"
21:24:44 <Rossen> ... in respect to the mesh
21:25:01 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: I did suggest to use a vbox pattern
21:25:03 <Tav> http://tavmjong.free.fr/SVG/PSERVERS/
21:25:26 <Rossen> Tav: I looked at how pattern treats it and not sure if bbox is correct
21:26:09 <Rossen> ... the patern unit is used to determine the size of the tile relative to the object you're filling with the pattern
21:26:13 <Rossen> shepazu: the ratio
21:26:34 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: as far as mesh we don't have equivalent to pattern units
21:27:21 <Rossen> Tav: anyway there are the pattern units and the pattern content units
21:27:30 <Rossen> nikos: you can ignore the pattern units
21:27:40 <Rossen> ... it is closer to gradients
21:28:02 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: does a mesh normally path-out to a rect
21:28:05 <Rossen> nikos: no
21:28:56 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: this is different from other paint servers which have a path outside
21:29:23 <Rossen> ... so basically it is up to authors to make sure it looks good
21:29:38 <AmeliaBR> s/have a path/have padded content/
21:29:49 <Rossen> Tav: ok so we have mesh units
21:30:13 <Rossen> nikos: gradient units should match to mesh units
21:30:23 <Rossen> ... should we have a general unit for such?
21:30:42 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: it will be hard because of patterns - there are two different ones
21:30:59 <Rossen> shepazu: not necessary because patterns can have the general one and a special one
21:31:08 <Rossen> AmeliaBR: yeah but they don't map well
21:31:48 <Rossen> Tav: OK so we can use gradient units
21:31:55 <Rossen> ... but then what if there's not bbox?
21:33:41 <heycam> shepazu: this might want to be reused by HTML and canvas, so let's be mindful of that
21:34:37 <heycam> trackbot, end telcon
21:34:37 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
21:34:37 <Zakim> sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is
21:34:45 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
21:34:45 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/07/16-svg-minutes.html trackbot
21:34:46 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
21:34:46 <RRSAgent> I see no action items