14:53:33 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-media
14:53:33 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/06/02-html-media-irc
14:53:35 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
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14:53:37 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 63342
14:53:37 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see HTML_WG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 7 minutes
14:53:38 <trackbot> Meeting: HTML Media Task Force Teleconference
14:53:38 <trackbot> Date: 02 June 2015
14:54:11 <paulc> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jun/0009.html
14:58:54 <MattWolenetz> MattWolenetz has joined #html-media
15:00:09 <markw> markw has joined #html-media
15:00:10 <Zakim> HTML_WG()11:00AM has now started
15:00:17 <Zakim> + +1.206.876.aaaa
15:00:24 <MattWolenetz> zakim, aaaa is me
15:00:24 <Zakim> +MattWolenetz; got it
15:00:41 <Zakim> +markw
15:02:08 <Zakim> +ddorwin
15:03:56 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
15:04:14 <paulc> zakim, [Microsoft] is me
15:04:14 <Zakim> +paulc; got it
15:04:32 <paulc> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-html-media/2015Jun/0009.html
15:04:50 <paulc> Chair: paulc
15:04:57 <paulc> Scribenick: paulc
15:05:02 <jdsmith> jdsmith has joined #html-media
15:05:06 <paulc> Topic: Action items
15:05:10 <Zakim> +jdsmith
15:05:32 <paulc> Topic: ACTION-84
15:05:49 <paulc> ACTION-84?
15:05:49 <trackbot> ACTION-84 -- Paul Cotton to (really rustamk) to update uses cases and arrange for further discussion -- due 2015-04-22 -- OPEN
15:05:49 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/84
15:06:14 <paulc> Status: No progress and no report.
15:06:34 <paulc> Topic: ACTION-86
15:06:39 <paulc> ACTION-86?
15:06:39 <trackbot> ACTION-86 -- David Dorwin to Send an update on bug 27269 -- due 2015-06-30 -- OPEN
15:06:39 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/86
15:07:06 <paulc> David changed the due date to June 30 and was looking for other input.
15:07:24 <paulc> TOPIC: ACTIION-90
15:07:29 <paulc> ACTION-90?
15:07:29 <trackbot> ACTION-90 -- Paul Cotton to Update bug 20944 if the tf goes ahead with work on generic license request/response protocol -- due 2015-05-20 -- OPEN
15:07:29 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/90
15:07:37 <paulc> Pending.
15:07:46 <paulc> Topic: ACTION-92
15:07:50 <paulc> ACTION;92?
15:07:58 <paulc> Action-92?
15:07:58 <trackbot> Action-92 -- Paul Cotton to Build a generic wiki agenda for future tf meetings -- due 2015-04-23 -- OPEN
15:07:58 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/92
15:08:01 <paulc> Pending.
15:08:11 <paulc> Topic: ACTION-93
15:08:15 <paulc> ACTION-93?
15:08:15 <trackbot> ACTION-93 -- Paul Cotton to Get in touch with webappsec wg about the "privileged context" which is more generic than saying https, etc." (really on bob lund) -- due 2015-05-26 -- OPEN
15:08:15 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/html/wg/media/track/actions/93
15:08:34 <paulc> Bob Lund responded on June 1 that he is working on this with no firm completion date.
15:08:52 <paulc> Topic: New MSE bugs
15:09:19 <paulc> Three new bug 28710, 28727 and 27982 are MSE bugs
15:10:17 <paulc> Topic: Bug 28710
15:10:20 <paulc> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=28710
15:10:39 <paulc> Matt: This bug is about TrackBuffer and may be a duplicate.
15:10:51 <paulc> Topic: Bug 28727
15:11:07 <paulc> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=28727
15:11:49 <paulc> Matt: This one is interesting and is related to my work on Chromium.  Related to Coded Frame Removal.
15:12:02 <paulc> Matt: I will follow up on this bug
15:12:22 <paulc> Topic: Bug 27982
15:12:56 <paulc> https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=27982
15:14:47 <paulc> paulc: This is not new but is realted 28727.
15:15:04 <paulc> Matt: I will take up this item since I will be looking at 28727.
15:15:39 <paulc> Topic: MSE bugs (28557, 28573, 27239)
15:15:56 <paulc> paulc: Matt - what is the progress here?
15:16:37 <paulc> Matt: No progress on these since I have been working on Chromium problems and the CR test suite.
15:17:13 <paulc> Topic: MSE test suite status
15:17:41 <paulc> jdsmith: Can we prioritize the CR test suite to make some progress?
15:18:22 <Zakim> -paulc
15:22:01 <MattWolenetz> paul, are you online?
15:22:28 <Zakim> +[Microsoft]
15:24:56 <paulc> paulc has joined #html-media
15:25:06 <paulc> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:25:06 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/06/02-html-media-minutes.html paulc
15:26:02 <paulc> paulc: Could Matt send out a test suite report so Jerry can get engaged and use the MSE tests on his implementation?
15:26:18 <paulc> matt: yes and I am building a FAQ on how to use the existing tests
15:26:56 <paulc> Topic: EME Issue-45
15:27:43 <paulc> ISSUE-45: Remove "persistent-release-message" MediaKeySessionType
15:27:43 <trackbot> Notes added to ISSUE-45 .
15:28:08 <paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/45
15:28:27 <paulc> Mark: We agree to restore this at the F2F and I did my action item to provide text.
15:28:49 <paulc> ... David appears to be only one hesitant to put this feature back in.
15:29:11 <paulc> Mark:  It was in the document for a long and there was no agreement to remove it.
15:29:57 <paulc> paulc:  Is this a disagreement about whether we put the feature back in and then fix it OR we get agreement on how to fix the feature before we put it back in.
15:30:24 <paulc> paulc: Is that a correct description David?
15:30:45 <paulc> davidd: I am not yet convinced that it works or can be made to work across all clients.
15:31:24 <paulc> markw:  The group has NOT agreed to remove this feature and it is supported by other (non-Google) browers.
15:31:54 <paulc> ... I did the pull request four weeks ago and in the face of no agreement to remove this I would like this added back to the document.
15:32:35 <paulc> paulc: Why can't you add this back and then mark it with issues?
15:33:03 <paulc> davidd: Because people use its existence in the spec as proof that the feature has to be maintained.
15:34:13 <paulc> davidd:  The text removal was small and we need to define this feature before we put it back.
15:34:35 <paulc> markw:  There is very little difference between what I have proposed and what was there before.
15:35:55 <paulc> paulc: Let's continue this discussion for two weeks more and try to get a consensus on this feature.  If we cannot I may be forced to recommend an action.
15:36:38 <paulc> markw:  I would like to suggest we have some sort of understanding on how to handle controversial changes.  I would like to see change all done via pull requests that can be debated.
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15:38:38 <paulc> paulc:  Maybe David can do a new summary of why he is concerned about this feature and that will permit others (other than markw) to catch up on the matter.
15:38:49 <paulc> Topic: New EME issue
15:39:00 <paulc> Topic: ISSUE-63
15:39:21 <paulc> https://github.com/w3c/encrypted-media/issues/63
15:40:08 <paulc> under active discussion
15:40:59 <paulc> markw: our procedure need to be aligned with the privacy sections to follow the TAG advice
15:41:18 <paulc> davidd: I agree with mark that we need to fix the normative text and we are figuring out how to do that
15:41:39 <paulc> markw: Do you agree that the normative text should include the "inform the user" case?
15:41:56 <paulc> davidd: I believe so but I am a little fuzzy on this.
15:42:14 <paulc> markw:  Q1; Is informing users an option at all?
15:42:35 <paulc> ... Q2: Do we need to contraint when that the informing users case is used?
15:43:32 <paulc> markw:  For Q2 I would prefer that the normative procedures include both cases of informing users and gaining consent and work separately on the case where the UI has a constraint?
15:43:53 <markw> Q2: should explicit consent be required when the UI for clearing identifier si not good enough
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15:44:47 <paulc> davidd: The word RECOMMENDED (not required) is used and partially covers the case.
15:44:54 <markw> Here is my latest proposal: If the User Agent requires explicit user consent for the use of Distinctive Identifiers and if there is no persisted consent covering accumulated configuration for the origin, request user consent to use Distinctive Identifier(s).
15:45:03 <paulc> ... not sure how to remove the RECOMMENDED word without leaving a hole
15:45:34 <paulc> ... I do agree with the first case and would prefer to get it all right at once
15:46:06 <paulc> davidd:  I will reply in the bug
15:46:28 <paulc> markw:  I am concerned that the act of defining if a UI is sufficient may drag on the solution for too long.
15:47:06 <paulc> markw:  I would like to get this done ASAP rather than dragging this out
15:47:27 <paulc> davidd:  I want to take the text and turn it into algorithmic text
15:48:33 <paulc> markw: <missed text>
15:48:51 <paulc> davidd; <missed answer>
15:49:24 <paulc> paulc:  I suggest we take this into ISSUE-63 and try to get this done ASAP.
15:49:45 <markw> My concern is that making normative procedures contingent on the nature of the user interface is unusual and could cause this to drag out
15:49:50 <paulc> Topic: ISSUE-57 thru ISSUE-62
15:50:06 <paulc> We go email consensus on these new issues this week.
15:50:15 <paulc> Topic: Next meeting
15:50:33 <paulc> Paul is travelling next week and cannot chair.
15:50:35 <markw> If we can solve this quickly, by reference to existing text, that would be great, but if not I'd prefer to address the main issue of the mismatch between the Privacy section and the normative procedures first
15:50:49 <paulc> Could we meet in two weeks on Jun 16?
15:50:53 <paulc> Matt: fine with me
15:51:08 <paulc> markw: Sure
15:51:16 <paulc> davidd: oka
15:51:22 <paulc> jdsmith: okay
15:51:39 <paulc> So we will meet on Jun 16 and do both MSE and EME at that meeting.
15:52:06 <paulc> Topic: Automatic publishing on TR for EME
15:52:45 <paulc> davidd: no progress on this
15:52:55 <paulc> paulc; should I reach out to Robin for help?
15:53:01 <paulc> davidd: sure
15:53:31 <paulc> action: paul to get Robin's assistance to turn out automatic publishing on /TR for EME Editor's draft
15:53:31 <trackbot> Created ACTION-94 - Get robin's assistance to turn out automatic publishing on /tr for eme editor's draft [on Paul Cotton - due 2015-06-09].
15:53:44 <paulc> rrsagent, generate the minutes
15:53:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/06/02-html-media-minutes.html paulc
15:54:00 <Zakim> -markw
15:54:01 <Zakim> -ddorwin
15:54:03 <Zakim> -jdsmith
15:54:04 <Zakim> -MattWolenetz
15:54:06 <Zakim> -[Microsoft]
15:54:06 <Zakim> HTML_WG()11:00AM has ended
15:54:06 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.206.876.aaaa, MattWolenetz, markw, ddorwin, paulc, jdsmith, [Microsoft]
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