14:32:48 RRSAgent has joined #wai-wcag 14:32:48 logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/05/05-wai-wcag-irc 14:32:50 RRSAgent, make logs public 14:32:50 Zakim has joined #wai-wcag 14:32:52 Zakim, this will be WAI_WCAG 14:32:52 ok, trackbot; I see WAI_WCAG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 28 minutes 14:32:53 Meeting: Web Content Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference 14:32:53 Date: 05 May 2015 14:33:47 Chair: Joshue 14:34:13 agenda+ Survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/5thMay2015/ 14:35:05 agenda+ review 14:35:05 and feedback on Issue Sorting https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/IssueSorting/ 14:35:36 zakim, agenda? 14:35:36 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda: 14:35:37 1. Survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/5thMay2015/ [from Kenny] 14:35:37 2. review [from Kenny] 14:36:02 zakim, clear agenda 14:36:02 agenda cleared 14:36:10 agenda+ Survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/5thMay2015/ 14:36:28 agenda+ review and feedback on Issue Sorting https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/IssueSorting/ 14:36:38 zakim, agenda? 14:36:38 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda: 14:36:40 1. Survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/5thMay2015/ [from Kenny] 14:36:40 2. review and feedback on Issue Sorting https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/IssueSorting/ [from Kenny] 14:37:46 regrets+ Jonathan_Avila, Eric_Eggert, Alan 14:50:41 marcjohlic has joined #wai-wcag 14:55:23 laura has joined #wai-wcag 14:56:10 Makoto has joined #wai-wcag 14:57:02 WAI_WCAG()11:00AM has now started 14:57:07 +AWK 14:57:09 +Laura_Carlson 14:57:37 AWK has joined #wai-wcag 14:58:12 zakim, who is on the phone? 14:58:12 On the phone I see Laura_Carlson, AWK 14:58:18 Zakim, agenda? 14:58:18 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda: 14:58:19 1. Survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/5thMay2015/ [from Kenny] 14:58:19 2. review and feedback on Issue Sorting https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/IssueSorting/ [from Kenny] 14:58:43 agenda+ new member 14:59:00 +[IPcaller] 14:59:17 zakim, [IPcaller] is Makoto 14:59:17 +Makoto; got it 14:59:52 +David_MacDonald 15:00:14 David has joined #wai-wcag 15:02:09 +Kenny 15:02:27 +cstrobbe 15:02:50 +Marc_Johlic 15:03:52 +??P27 15:04:04 zakim, who is on the phone? 15:04:04 On the phone I see Laura_Carlson, AWK, Makoto, David_MacDonald, Kenny (muted), cstrobbe, Marc_Johlic, Michael_Cooper 15:04:15 MoeKraft has joined #wai-wcag 15:05:26 regrets+ Alan_Smith, Eric_Eggert. Joshue 15:05:39 Chair: AWK 15:06:07 cstrobbe has joined #wai-wcag 15:06:10 scribe: marcjohlic 15:06:36 Loretta has joined #wai-wcag 15:06:52 -David_MacDonald 15:07:07 +MoeKraft 15:07:14 Zakim, take up item 3 15:07:14 agendum 3. "new member" taken up [from AWK] 15:07:42 +[IPcaller] 15:07:48 AWK: New invited expert Laura Carlson 15:07:54 zakim, IPCaller is Loretta 15:07:54 +Loretta; got it 15:08:18 LC: Working in a11y since around 2000 - was in HTML a11y Task Force 15:08:22 +David_MacDonald 15:08:39 ZAkim, take up item 1 15:08:39 agendum 1. "Survey: https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/5thMay2015/" taken up [from Kenny] 15:09:10 TOPIC: Fix 2 code errors in Ex. 3 of ARIA2: Identifying a required field with the aria-required property 15:09:11 ARIA2 http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/ARIA2.html 15:09:28 zakim, mute me 15:09:28 cstrobbe should now be muted 15:10:00 AWK: Only complaint is in the extra tag - should be removed or changed 15:10:01 where is the code? 15:10:13 code: https://github.com/w3c/wcag/commit/4e7c715badacf6ff19717a01631e6b3f9986d549?diff=unified 15:10:22 https://github.com/w3c/wcag/commit/4e7c715badacf6ff19717a01631e6b3f9986d549 15:11:15 AWK: Upper right above the code has a "Unified" and "Split" button. Split view may be easier to see the changes 15:12:07 MC: Still hard to see where the fix was in the issue 15:12:23 AWK: Second to last comment "Fix for Issue 90" 15:12:44 MC: Can't really tell that's a link - usability problem w/ GitHub that we'll have to look into 15:12:58 Kathy has joined #wai-wcag 15:13:03 +Kathy_Wahlbin 15:14:45 AWK: We could get rid of and either say "here are the css files" or we could just style the line 15:14:53 ack me 15:15:17 DM: Agree we don't need to have complete page code for all of the examples - just the snippet as if you were jumping into the middle of the page 15:15:22 MC: Agree w/ David 15:16:13 AWK: Proposing in between

 blocks, "this is the CSS code that would be included"
15:16:26  DM:  Agreed
15:17:03  KW:  Agree w/ the changes
15:17:06  LC:  Good solution
15:17:46  RESOLUTION:  Accepted as amended - AWK will remove  and add line of text saying here's the CSS
15:18:07  Zakim, take up item 2
15:18:07  agendum 2. "review and feedback on Issue Sorting https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/IssueSorting/" taken up [from Kenny]
15:18:46  https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Post_WCAG_2_Issues_Sorted
15:19:30  AWK:  Only 5 respondents to date.
15:19:50  AWK:  As we think about extensions for WCAG, the idea is to get some thoughts from these comments
15:20:01  q+
15:20:08  AWK:  Asking folks to sign up for a group of five and provide feedback
15:20:22  AWK:  Would like to have at least 2 for each group of comments
15:20:39  AWK:  Have at least a couple of people vetting these comments
15:20:49  ack moe
15:21:14  MK:  If we see only 1 person assigned, then that one is still open, correct?
15:21:19  AWK:  Correct
15:21:32  MK:  Is that the same for the articles as well?
15:21:53  AWK:  Think that there are enough articles right now that would rather we just have 1 person per article right now
15:22:48  AWK:  Looking for folks to review articles, then add any new found issues to the top table
15:23:18  AWK:  Expect that we will end up with a lot of new comments added to the top table that we will have to review
15:24:00  AWK:  Would like to be able to start going through these next week - ensure that we have a common understanding
15:25:03  +Katie_Haritos-Shea
15:25:19  Ryladog has joined #wai-wcag
15:26:25  AWK:  An example would be in Jared's article he talks about removing CAPTCHA - so Marc or David would take that suggestion and add it to the top table
15:27:42  I will help with this starting next Sunday, Mothers Day. Don;t forget your mothers....:-)
15:27:58  "save early and often"
15:28:19  I can help with this too.
15:29:13  ack me
15:29:24  AWK:  Suggest crafting your wiki entry in another app first, then copy - paste - save in the wiki and get back out in order to avoid collisions
15:30:16  MC:  Wiki login is same username and pw as the surveys
15:32:00  AWK:  Purpose behind this activity is that we've got this long list of things people want us to do with WCAG - things at the time we felt were worthwhile - so they were added to the Post WCAG 2 wiki.  So as we're looking into adding extensions, we should review what has already been suggested.  Some of these may have already been tackled via task forces - such as cognitive.
15:32:31  ack me
15:32:42  TOPIC: Charter update
15:32:45  q+
15:33:17  AWK:  AC meeting in Paris this week.  Accessibility and the charter is one of the topics there this week
15:33:28  AWK:  A lot of discussion around the updates to the charters
15:33:52  ack me
15:33:56  AWK:  Our draft charter appears to be generally agreed to by people
15:34:27  AWK:  Been some discussion around the need for a combined working group - WCAG, ATAG, UAG, ERT etc
15:34:35  AWK:  It would be a new group
15:34:49  AWK:  We will know more by the end of this week
15:35:36  MC:  Proposal to combine guidelines working groups wouldn't be immediate, but rather about a year from now
15:35:54  MC:  One thing that could impact us would be moving ERT wg into a WCAG task force
15:36:14  MC:  If that happens we will have to add deliverables to our charter
15:36:36  MC:  Expect that this would have to come with people in order to be successful
15:37:38  MC:  If we add / change deliverables, there would a requirement for everyone to re-join the working group.  There is a grace period and as long as you accept during that time it's pretty simple.  Can be more difficult if you miss the grace period so try to respond during that grace period
15:40:38  AWK:  Would need to figure out the best way to work - asynchronous work - time zone challenges etc
15:46:05  AWK:  We have talked about doing more work asynchronously via the list - and having calls for consensus via the list.
15:46:31  AWK:  Even items that we discuss on the call we would do a call for consensus via the list?
15:47:44  Marc: How would that work on the list?  A separate email on the list?
15:48:23  +Cooper
15:49:44  AWK:  In other groups there are discussions that might happen in multiple threads, but then ultimately on the email list, once the chairs feel like there is a consensus - when it seems like the vast majority of folks are in agreement on how it should be settled, then a separate email is sent out w/ the the issue - links to where it's been discussed - and what has been decided - and final...
15:49:45  ...call for agreement.   Something along those lines - would have to check w/ how other groups are doing it.
15:50:32  DM:  Think GitHub could be core to this whole thing as we are moving forward.  Would be great if we could get Eric or someone to spend a full call with us on how to properly use GitHub
15:50:34  +1
15:50:55  LGR:  Let's not just do it on a call - cuz everyone can't join calls - but get it written down - all the steps
15:51:06  +1
15:51:31  KOS:  Next time we get together for a F2F would be very helpful to have a session on GH
15:51:55  AWK:  Can't imagine we are the only W3C group with challenges here
15:52:12  LC:  There's probably documentation already out there
15:52:35  LGR:  True that GH is well documented, but that documentation is not necessarily geared toward us
15:53:00  AWK:  We need to assemble a list of tasks that we expect WG members to be able to do in GH - then put together documentation around that
15:53:17  DM:  Even link those tasks to parts of larger documentation
15:53:36  -Cooper
15:54:16  AWK:  How to suggest a small change to a technique or understanding document would be useful, how to assign an issue or get an issue assigned to you, create a new issue - those 3 would help people quite a bit
15:55:06  ack me
15:55:13  AWK:  Any other suggestions from folks that have been in a group that has worked asynchronously?
15:55:40  DM:  HTML5 is working that way - Steve has even pointed out that he can get more done not being on the calls and just working
15:56:38  MC:  W3C has different bars for what is considered "consensus" for the group.  Can be hard at times to tell if there is full consensus.  WCAG WG is one that has a bit higher bar for consensus
15:57:05  MC:  As we look at these different ways of working, we need to look at the affect on call for consensus and if we want to accept that or not
15:59:47  KHS:  Confirming there will not be a F2F in Japan?
15:59:57  AWK:  Correct - no F2F in Japan (TPAC)
16:00:09  KHS:  Any alternate suggestions for a F2F?
16:00:24  AWK:  Some have suggestion next CSUN
16:00:53  AWK:  As we start talking about more normative work we may have a need for more F2F meetings
16:01:33  KHS:  We should start planning rather than waiting for a last minute thing.
16:01:51  ack me
16:01:57  AWK:  I agree.  Michael where is TPAC in 2016
16:02:03  MC:  Looks like it will be in Lisbon
16:02:32  MC:  Close to being official..  fairly certain..
16:04:19  AWK:  Benefit of TPAC is that there are other W3C folks there..   CSUN sometimes there is too much other stuff going on
16:05:03  MC:  2016 TPAC is expected to be in September
16:06:11  AWK:  Wrapping up 25 mins early - great time to take a look at the issues and articles in the wiki so that we can discuss them next week
16:06:17  trackbot, end meeting
16:06:17  Zakim, list attendees
16:06:17  As of this point the attendees have been AWK, Laura_Carlson, Makoto, David_MacDonald, Kenny, cstrobbe, Marc_Johlic, Michael_Cooper, MoeKraft, Loretta, Kathy_Wahlbin,
16:06:20  ... Katie_Haritos-Shea, Cooper
16:06:20  -Katie_Haritos-Shea
16:06:20  -Kathy_Wahlbin
16:06:22  -Michael_Cooper
16:06:23  +James_Nurthen
16:06:25  RRSAgent, please draft minutes
16:06:25  I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/05/05-wai-wcag-minutes.html trackbot
16:06:26  RRSAgent, bye
16:06:26  I see no action items