12:56:50 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #tvapi
12:56:50 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/04/14-tvapi-irc
12:56:52 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs 385
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12:56:54 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
12:56:54 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
12:56:55 <trackbot> Meeting: TV Control API Community Group Teleconference
12:56:55 <trackbot> Date: 14 April 2015
12:57:15 <kaz> zakim, code?
12:57:15 <Zakim> sorry, kaz, I don't know what conference this is
12:57:20 <kaz> zakim, this will be tv
12:57:20 <Zakim> ok, kaz; I see WEBT_TVAPICG()9:00AM scheduled to start in 3 minutes
12:57:28 <kaz> zakim, call kazuyuki-617
12:57:28 <Zakim> ok, kaz; the call is being made
12:57:29 <Zakim> WEBT_TVAPICG()9:00AM has now started
12:57:30 <skim13> skim13 has joined #tvapi
12:57:31 <Zakim> +Kazuyuki
12:57:32 <cpn> cpn has joined #tvapi
12:57:50 <seanlin> seanlin has joined #tvapi
12:58:20 <kaz> agenda: https://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-tvapi/2015Apr/0010.html
12:58:28 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
12:58:32 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
12:58:32 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/04/14-tvapi-minutes.html kaz
12:59:35 <Bin_Hu> Bin_Hu has joined #tvapi
12:59:43 <kaz> zakim, who is here?
12:59:43 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki
12:59:45 <Zakim> On IRC I see Bin_Hu, seanlin, cpn, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, kaz, tidoust, AlexErk_, alexerk, trackbot, ted
12:59:50 <paul_higgs> paul_higgs has joined #TVAPI
13:00:05 <Zakim> + +44.303.040.aaaa
13:00:21 <kaz> zakim, aaaa is cpn
13:00:21 <Zakim> +cpn; got it
13:00:27 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
13:00:38 <kaz> zakim, IPcaller is skim13
13:00:38 <Zakim> +skim13; got it
13:00:55 <Zakim> + +1.650.946.aabb
13:01:02 <Bin_Hu> zakim, aabb is me
13:01:02 <Zakim> +Bin_Hu; got it
13:01:07 <Zakim> + +1.647.727.aacc
13:01:33 <kaz> zakim, who is here?
13:01:33 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki, cpn, skim13, Bin_Hu, +1.647.727.aacc
13:01:35 <Zakim> On IRC I see paul_higgs, Bin_Hu, seanlin, cpn, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, kaz, tidoust, AlexErk_, alexerk, trackbot, ted
13:01:39 <Zakim> -Kazuyuki
13:01:40 <Zakim> +??P12
13:01:44 <tidoust> zakim, ??P12is me
13:01:44 <Zakim> I don't understand '??P12is me', tidoust
13:01:46 <tidoust> zakim, ??P12 is me
13:01:47 <Zakim> +tidoust; got it
13:01:49 <kaz> zakim, call kazuyuki-617
13:01:49 <Zakim> ok, kaz; the call is being made
13:01:50 <Zakim> +Kazuyuki
13:01:57 <nigel> nigel has joined #tvapi
13:02:08 <Zakim> -Kazuyuki
13:02:14 <kaz> zakim, call kazuyuki-617
13:02:15 <Zakim> ok, kaz; the call is being made
13:02:15 <Zakim> +Kazuyuki
13:02:25 <Zakim> +Paul_Higgs
13:02:36 <kaz> zakim, who is here?
13:02:36 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki, cpn, skim13, Bin_Hu, +1.647.727.aacc, tidoust, Paul_Higgs
13:02:39 <Zakim> On IRC I see nigel, paul_higgs, Bin_Hu, seanlin, cpn, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, kaz, tidoust, AlexErk_, alexerk, trackbot, ted
13:02:53 <Zakim> +nigel
13:03:19 <kaz> zakim, aacc is seanlin
13:03:19 <Zakim> +seanlin; got it
13:03:49 <kaz> zakim, who is here?
13:03:49 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki, cpn, skim13, Bin_Hu, seanlin, tidoust, Paul_Higgs, nigel
13:03:51 <Zakim> On IRC I see nigel, paul_higgs, Bin_Hu, seanlin, cpn, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, kaz, tidoust, AlexErk_, alexerk, trackbot, ted
13:04:33 <Zakim> +Andreas
13:04:38 <kaz> zakim, who is here?
13:04:38 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki, cpn, skim13, Bin_Hu, seanlin, tidoust, Paul_Higgs, nigel, Andreas
13:04:41 <Zakim> On IRC I see nigel, paul_higgs, Bin_Hu, seanlin, cpn, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, kaz, tidoust, AlexErk_, alexerk, trackbot, ted
13:05:08 <kaz> scribenick: cpn
13:05:13 <kaz> Scribe: Chris
13:06:19 <kaz> zakim, Andreas is AlexErk_
13:06:19 <Zakim> +AlexErk_; got it
13:06:22 <cpn> cpn has changed the topic to: Review action items
13:06:38 <kaz> Present: Kazuyuki, cpn, skim13, Bin_Hu, seanlin, tidoust, Paul_Higgs, nigel, Alex
13:06:46 <kaz> topic: Action items
13:06:53 <cpn> cpn has changed the topic to: tvapi
13:07:04 <tidoust> Present+ AndreasBosl
13:07:09 <kaz> topic: TVAPI
13:07:43 <cpn> Paul: the item is can we use the media capture API for recording, but we think it's currently unlikely
13:07:57 <cpn> ... one of the authors is from Ericsson, we've discussed it internally
13:08:16 <cpn> ... the API wasn't really designed for that kind of recording, i.e., long durations of media content
13:08:41 <cpn> ... we could possibly use the File API, which is doing the recording
13:09:02 <cpn> ... there doesn't seem to be a way to append to an exsting file, so we may end up with lots of individual snippets recorded
13:09:28 <cpn> Bin: so we may have to define our own mechanism for this, is that right?
13:09:49 <cpn> Paul: the spec as written today wouldn't enable us to write an app that does background recording of programmes
13:10:30 <cpn> ... if someone can show how to do it with these APIs, as an example, that would be helpful
13:11:48 <cpn> Chris: the timeshifting requirement has similar problems, the existing APIs don't do what we need
13:12:40 <cpn> Alex: but capture from a webcam  is quite different to from a TV tuner
13:13:35 <cpn> Paul: The existing / current TV API spec uses the MediaStream from WebRTC, which doesn't meet our needs
13:15:13 <cpn> Bin: We should update the requirements mapping table to update what we've found
13:15:37 <tidoust> [I note that there is more than just the "how to record" issue here, there is also the possibility to record streams in the background (and schedule recordings) which cannot be done either for the time being]
13:16:24 <cpn> Paul: It should say 'not supported', but there it could with alterations to the other APis we've mentioned
13:16:59 <cpn> Bin: so we can close action 24
13:17:25 <tidoust> ACTION-24?
13:17:25 <trackbot> ACTION-24 -- Paul Higgs to Look at the media capture and streams api and compare against our recording and timeshifting requirements -- due 2015-04-14 -- OPEN
13:17:25 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/community/tvapi/track/actions/24
13:17:31 <tidoust> close ACTION-24
13:17:31 <trackbot> Closed ACTION-24.
13:18:52 <tidoust> Chris: Similar story with the timeshifting, because the output of the tuner uses a MediaStream which essentially prevents any sort of buffering for the time being. It is a realtime stream, which makes sense in WebRTC scenarios. So, no change of playbackrate, no timeshifting.
13:19:26 <tidoust> ... It seems to be a case where we would need to implement our own interface.
13:20:19 <tidoust> ... The use of existing capabilities from MediaElements would be good. It's the underlying state machine that is different. In the OIPF specification, there is quite of a different model there.
13:21:16 <tidoust> ... That's really as far as I got. I haven't done any work on how the API might need to look like. If we want to support this requirement and have playback that can support this timeshifting, then we would need to define our own interface and see how it integrates with MediaElements and the rest.
13:21:29 <tidoust> i/Chris: Similar/scribenick: tidoust/
13:21:44 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:21:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/04/14-tvapi-minutes.html kaz
13:22:19 <cpn> Paul: I agree, i don't see how we can use the existing APIs for a TV-like experience
13:22:38 <tidoust> i/Paul: I agree/scribenick: cpn/
13:23:34 <paul_higgs> We need to define some type of media pipelining model then APIs around managing that
13:24:53 <cpn> Bin: So we should put more time into looking at this
13:25:01 <cpn> Paul: It's a substantial topic, but yes
13:25:01 <kaz> q+
13:26:30 <cpn> Chris: I'm interested to do more on this, but I think implementation experience would be valuable
13:27:37 <cpn> Paul: I wonder if someone could look at the IPTV Forum Japan spec, but their spec may be more browser-aligned, is there something we can learn from it?
13:27:41 <cpn> Kaz: I agree
13:27:45 <kaz> -> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/MPTF media pipeline tf discussion
13:28:05 <cpn> ... There was previous discussion in the media pipleline task force  we could review
13:28:18 <kaz> ack k
13:28:23 <cpn> ... and we can talk to people from the IPTV forum Japan
13:28:35 <cpn> Bin: what's the status of that task force?
13:29:09 <cpn> Kaz: It's closed, but we can look at their previous discussions  andd documents
13:29:50 <cpn> s/andd/and/
13:30:00 <kaz> s/... There/... Also there/
13:30:51 <cpn> Paul: By pipeline I was meaning something gstreamer-like, not necessarily this TF
13:31:52 <kaz> action: kaz to skim the work done by the media pipeline tf and let this cg know
13:31:52 <trackbot> Created ACTION-30 - Skim the work done by the media pipeline tf and let this cg know [on Kazuyuki Ashimura - due 2015-04-21].
13:32:48 <cpn> Bin: I updated the wiki for action 25, to say its not supporting, the same as for programme recording
13:33:21 <cpn> close action-25
13:33:21 <trackbot> Closed action-25.
13:33:47 <cpn> Bin: Re action 26, there has been discussion between Sean and Paul about emergency notifications
13:34:43 <cpn> Sean: we've added a new 'type' attribute to reflect the nature of the emergency, e.g., earthquake
13:35:09 <cpn> ... and also region information, if broadcasters can supply this information, allows the client to do further filtering
13:36:00 <kaz> q+
13:36:10 <cpn> Paul: This update makes the spec more in line with how it should work outside of Japan, eg, in North America it's now closer
13:36:36 <cpn> Bin: So, is the emergency notifications part of the spec is now stable?
13:36:50 <cpn> Paul: I think we're close, but should check the requirements
13:37:42 <cpn> Paul: I've just checked the requirements - they're are generic enough that they are supported now by the TV control API
13:38:04 <cpn> close action-26
13:38:04 <trackbot> Closed action-26.
13:38:28 <cpn> Bin: Re action 27, triggered interactive overlay requirements
13:38:55 <cpn> Sean: We have extended the TextTrackCue and added our own trigger type
13:39:01 <kaz> q=
13:39:03 <kaz> q-
13:39:16 <cpn> ... we have a generic object there now
13:39:34 <cpn> ... Looking at the requirements, we now have minimum support for those items
13:41:06 <cpn> Bin: so let's leave this action open, until we get more example data objects
13:41:21 <kaz> q+
13:41:43 <cpn> Bin: Re action 28, for Daniel, sharing the results of the Japan meeting
13:42:13 <cpn> Kaz: Daniel added a note on the wiki, Yosuke is writing up a detailed report of the meet-up, which we can share with the group
13:42:50 <cpn> ... It should be ready soon, I'll ask him to share it with the group
13:43:04 <cpn> close action-28
13:43:04 <trackbot> Closed action-28.
13:43:23 <kaz> ack k
13:44:05 <cpn> Bin: action 29 is similar to 25, we've covered that
13:44:09 <cpn> close action-29
13:44:09 <trackbot> Closed action-29.
13:44:36 <cpn> action: Kaz to ask Yosuke to share the meet-up report with the group
13:44:36 <trackbot> Created ACTION-31 - Ask yosuke to share the meet-up report with the group [on Kazuyuki Ashimura - due 2015-04-21].
13:44:57 <cpn> Bin: We've made some good progress
13:46:12 <cpn> Bin: There are still some gaps in our requirements, where capabilities are not supported
13:47:00 <cpn> ... such as: recording, time  shifting, conditional access, parental control
13:47:36 <cpn> Bin: Can anyone look into the conditional access and parental control requirements?
13:48:38 <cpn> Bin: no takers... so I'll invite all to think about these, and hopefully someone will be able to work on these gaps
13:49:15 <cpn> Topic: AOB
13:50:08 <cpn> Paul: There spec has an EIT information event, defined only as an object. What properties would this have, e.g., title, start time?
13:50:58 <cpn> Alex: This is the TVEITBroadcastedEvent, which has a programs attribute
13:51:16 <cpn> ... This is the schedule of future programmes
13:51:42 <cpn> Paul: What fields does each object in the list have?
13:53:11 <cpn> Alex: So we should introduce a Program object with known properties
13:53:36 <cpn> close action-31
13:53:36 <trackbot> Closed action-31.
13:54:38 <cpn> Paul: So this is an object that needs to be cast to a sequence of programmes
13:56:01 <Zakim> -Paul_Higgs
13:56:02 <Zakim> -AlexErk_
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13:56:09 <Zakim> -nigel
13:56:10 <Zakim> -seanlin
13:56:18 <Zakim> -Kazuyuki
13:56:19 <cpn> Bin: Thanks everybody, speak again in 4 weeks
13:56:38 <kaz> [ adjourned ]
13:56:42 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:56:42 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/04/14-tvapi-minutes.html kaz
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14:05:00 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, tidoust, in WEBT_TVAPICG()9:00AM
14:05:02 <Zakim> WEBT_TVAPICG()9:00AM has ended
14:05:02 <Zakim> Attendees were Kazuyuki, +44.303.040.aaaa, cpn, skim13, +1.650.946.aabb, Bin_Hu, +1.647.727.aacc, tidoust, Paul_Higgs, nigel, seanlin, AlexErk_
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14:21:13 <kaz> Chair: Bin
14:21:16 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:21:16 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/04/14-tvapi-minutes.html kaz
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