15:59:19 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #hcls
15:59:19 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-irc
15:59:21 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
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15:59:23 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be HCLS
15:59:23 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see SW_HCLS()11:00AM already started
15:59:24 <trackbot> Meeting: Semantic Web Health Care and Life Sciences Interest Group Teleconference
15:59:24 <trackbot> Date: 13 January 2015
15:59:33 <Zakim> +Kerstin_Forsberg
15:59:40 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> Marc_Twagirumukiza has joined #HCLS
16:00:08 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:00:21 <dbooth> zakim, IPcaller is me
16:00:21 <Zakim> +dbooth; got it
16:00:28 <Zakim> +PeterHendler
16:00:33 <Zakim> -Kerstin_Forsberg
16:00:41 <dbooth> zakim, who is here?
16:00:41 <Zakim> On the phone I see pknapp, dbooth, PeterHendler
16:00:42 <Ingeborg> Ingeborg has joined #HCLS
16:00:43 <Zakim> On IRC I see Marc_Twagirumukiza, Zakim, RRSAgent, pknapp, dbooth, cloudcell, trackbot, ericP
16:01:06 <charlie> charlie has joined #HCLS
16:01:14 <Zakim> +[GVoice]
16:01:22 <Zakim> +Marc
16:01:32 <Zakim> +Ingeborg
16:01:42 <Zakim> +Kerstin_Forsberg
16:01:49 <Tony> Tony has joined #HCLS
16:02:17 <Zakim> +rhausam
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16:02:38 <Zakim> +Charlie
16:02:39 <Zakim> +Tony
16:02:54 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
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16:03:07 <dbooth> zakim, IPcaller is Lloyd
16:03:07 <Zakim> +Lloyd; got it
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16:03:48 <drjava> Peter hendler
16:04:32 <Zakim> +Guoqian
16:04:37 <kerstin> i'm in a noisy place so will be on mute for the first 15 mins
16:04:41 <dbooth> Agenda: http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=ITS_RDF_ConCall_Agenda
16:05:09 <dbooth> Topic: Approve minutes
16:05:10 <dbooth> http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=ITS_RDF_Concall_Minutes_20150106
16:05:22 <Claude> Claude has joined #hcls
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16:05:55 <Claude> https://global.gotomeeting.com/join/157514853
16:06:02 <dbooth> RESOLVED: Minutes approved unanimously
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16:07:05 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:07:07 <dbooth> Topic: FHIR Ontology Requirments
16:07:08 <dbooth> http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=FHIR_Ontology_Requirements
16:07:32 <dbooth> zakim, IPcaller is Claude
16:07:32 <Zakim> +Claude; got it
16:08:00 <Zakim> +Tony.a
16:08:07 <dbooth> Topic: Review of action items
16:08:10 <dbooth> ACTION: Claude to work up use case example of RDF benefit to present in San Antonio [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/06-hcls-minutes.html#action02]  -- PENDING
16:08:10 <trackbot> Error finding 'Claude'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2014/HCLS/track/users>.
16:10:00 <dbooth> Claude: Will show DoD federation example.   Tony slides on  comparing ont approaches?
16:10:06 <dbooth> Topic: FHIR Ont Requirements
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16:10:26 <dbooth> http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=FHIR_Ontology_Requirements
16:12:41 <Zakim> + +1.469.226.aaaa
16:13:06 <dbooth> Rob: Lots of overlap between #1 and #3.
16:15:26 <Zakim> -[GVoice]
16:15:30 <dbooth> David: change #1 and #3 to split instance level from meta/ontology?
16:15:36 <dbooth> others: yes
16:15:57 <dbooth> ACTION: David to change #1 and #3 to separate instance level from ontology level
16:15:57 <trackbot> 'David' is an ambiguous username. Please try a different identifier, such as family name or username (e.g., dderour, dhansen2, dhau2, dnewman, dshotton, dwild).
16:16:57 <dbooth> David: Comments on #2?
16:16:57 <Zakim> +[GVoice]
16:17:12 <dbooth> Marc: includes extensions?
16:17:20 <dbooth> David: Yes.  Needs to be more explicit?
16:18:23 <dbooth> ACTION: Lloyd to ensure that extensions are explicitly mentioned in #2
16:18:23 <trackbot> Error finding 'Lloyd'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2014/HCLS/track/users>.
16:20:24 <dbooth> Guoqian: Talking about FHIR instances.  What does the FHIR instance include?
16:21:43 <dbooth> Paul: FHIR data would be serialized in RDF.
16:22:03 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> I would understand FHIR instances as an example of patient data. RDF instances as an abstract model and FHIR ontology as a vocabulary where classes and properties are defined.
16:22:43 <dbooth> Lloyd: Anything that can be a FHIR resource can be represented in RDF.
16:22:50 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> am I right?
16:22:57 <dbooth> ... And anything in a profile can be represented in OWL.
16:23:20 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> +1 Anything that can be a FHIR resource can be represented in RDF.
16:25:11 <Sajjad_Hussain> I think it is important not mix the two: RDF as a model vs RDF-XML as a serialization language
16:27:36 <Sajjad_Hussain> If I understood correctly, I think the use of RDF on FHIR instances is only using RDF-XML as a serialization language for exchange purposes
16:28:37 <dbooth> Guoqian: Suggest not using the word 'instances' when talking about FHIR.
16:29:56 <dbooth> David: need to align our terminology with existing FHIR terminology
16:31:41 <Zakim> -Kerstin_Forsberg
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16:35:22 <dbooth> Claude: modifying extensions wreak havoc on RDF semantics.  Maybe we do a low level ont and then build one on top of that to handle modifying extensions properly
16:37:13 <dbooth> Lloyd: My expectation with #4 is tha we would provide a base translation of FHIR instances into RDF that would NOT be safe for reasoning, becuase of modifier extnesions.  But we'd also define a mechanism for creating refined RDF representations that would exclude all modifiers or unknown modifiers, and that would be safe.
16:37:41 <dbooth> ... So in your "reasoning safe" ontology you would exclude modifiers that you do not understand.
16:37:53 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> It would help if we have a wiki page for definitions (like a glossary) to list all definitions of list of terms. i.e what we mean by xxx term. As those definitions may not always following native meaning in our WG
16:38:05 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> Maybe start with FHIR glossary
16:38:31 <dbooth> Claude: suggest we do an initial RDF that is unsafe.
16:38:39 <dbooth> Tony: I think that would lead to a mess.
16:39:27 <dbooth> q+ to say I think it's important to design it to be monotonic
16:40:38 <dbooth> q-
16:40:47 <dbooth> David:  I think it's important to design it to be monotonic
16:43:25 <dbooth> David: Dig into this in San Antonio
16:44:03 <dbooth> #5. Vocabulary Bindings
16:44:03 <dbooth> (SHOULD?) The FHIR ontology must support vocabulary bindings to code, Coding and CodeableConcept - including dealing with extensible value sets and multi-code system value sets.
16:44:16 <dbooth> Rob: I think this should MUST
16:44:34 <dbooth> Lloyd: Doing it is complicated
16:46:51 <dbooth> Lloyd: Instances cannot declare vocab bindings
16:50:01 <Zakim> -Tony.a
16:50:25 <dbooth> 6. Enforce Constraints
16:50:26 <dbooth> (SHOULD?) The FHIR ontology should enforce constraints that are representable in OWL/RDF whenever possible, e.g. schema constraints, regular expressions, etc.
16:51:09 <dbooth> 7. Annotation Information
16:51:09 <dbooth> (SHOULD? COULD?) In the RDFS/OWL, should expose at least minimal annotation information for display.
16:53:33 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> Sorry I have to leave
16:54:23 <Marc_Twagirumukiza> I put some comments on 9. Datatype IRIs
16:55:27 <dbooth> Topic: San Antonio
16:55:28 <dbooth> http://wiki.hl7.org/index.php?title=ITS_RDF_ConCall_Agenda
16:55:58 <Zakim> -Marc
16:57:42 <dbooth> Tony: don't have the bandwidth to prepare
16:57:53 <dbooth> Okay, we'll drop ' Tony (on teleconference) show different ontology approaches? (NOT YET CONFIRMED) "
16:58:03 <dbooth>  Claude show example of using RDF to merge and federate FHIR data?
16:58:11 <dbooth> Claude: I'll show the TAPS example.
16:59:01 <dbooth> Claude: I will also present work from Davide Sottara on Mayo work.
17:00:32 <Zakim> -Ingeborg
17:01:27 <Zakim> -pknapp
17:03:55 <Zakim> -Claude
17:04:20 <Zakim> -Charlie
17:04:21 <Zakim> -Guoqian
17:04:22 <Zakim> -Tony
17:04:24 <Zakim> -rhausam
17:04:26 <Zakim> -Lloyd
17:04:26 <dbooth> ADJOURNED
17:04:34 <Zakim> -dbooth
17:04:47 <Zakim> -[GVoice]
17:04:53 <Zakim> - +1.469.226.aaaa
17:04:55 <Zakim> -PeterHendler
17:04:56 <Zakim> SW_HCLS()11:00AM has ended
17:04:56 <Zakim> Attendees were pknapp, Kerstin_Forsberg, dbooth, PeterHendler, [GVoice], Marc, Ingeborg, rhausam, Charlie, Tony, Lloyd, Guoqian, Claude, +1.469.226.aaaa
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17:50:44 <dbooth> rrsagent, draft minutes
17:50:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-minutes.html dbooth
17:50:51 <dbooth> Chair: David Booth and Paul Knapp
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18:07:53 <dbooth> Present: Paul_Knapp Kerstin_Forsberg David_Booth Peter_Hendler Sajjad_Hussain Marc Ingeborg Rob_Hausam Charlie_Mead Tony_Mallia Lloyd_McKenzie Guoqian Claude_Nanjo
18:08:00 <dbooth> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:08:00 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-minutes.html dbooth
18:10:29 <dbooth> s/Topic: FHIR Ontology Requirments//
18:10:51 <dbooth> s/Ont Requirments/Ontology Requirements/
18:11:01 <dbooth> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:11:01 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-minutes.html dbooth
18:11:07 <egonw> egonw has joined #HCLS
18:11:48 <dbooth> s/Ont Requirements/Ontology Requirements/
18:11:51 <dbooth> rrsagent, draft minutes
18:11:51 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-minutes.html dbooth
18:40:08 <dbooth> trackbot, bye
18:40:08 <trackbot> trackbot has left #hcls
18:40:12 <dbooth> zakim, bye
18:40:12 <Zakim> Zakim has left #hcls
18:40:16 <dbooth> rrsagent, bye
18:40:16 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-actions.rdf :
18:40:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Claude to work up use case example of RDF benefit to present in San Antonio [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/06-hcls-minutes.html#action02]  -- PENDING [1]
18:40:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-irc#T16-08-10
18:40:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: David to change #1 and #3 to separate instance level from ontology level [2]
18:40:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-irc#T16-15-57
18:40:16 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Lloyd to ensure that extensions are explicitly mentioned in #2 [3]
18:40:16 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2015/01/13-hcls-irc#T16-18-23