15:41:26 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #mobile-a11y
15:41:26 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/11/13-mobile-a11y-irc
15:41:27 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
15:41:27 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #mobile-a11y
15:41:29 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be WAI_MATF
15:41:29 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_MATF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 19 minutes
15:41:30 <trackbot> Meeting: Mobile Accessibility Task Force Teleconference
15:41:30 <trackbot> Date: 13 November 2014
15:41:43 <Kathy>  zakim, this will be 6283
15:41:43 <Zakim> ok, Kathy; I see WAI_MATF()11:00AM scheduled to start in 19 minutes
15:42:04 <Kathy> rrsagent, make log world
15:42:13 <Kathy> meeting: Mobile A11Y TF
15:42:20 <Kathy> Chair: Kim & Kathy
15:43:01 <Kathy> agenda?
15:43:06 <Kathy> agenda+ Note framework
15:43:27 <Kathy> agenda+ .     Reframing existing WCAG 2.0 techniques – click, activate discussion
15:44:14 <Kathy> agenda?
15:46:02 <Kim> Kim has joined #mobile-a11y
15:46:30 <Kim> agenda?
15:53:24 <jon_avila> jon_avila has joined #mobile-a11y
15:53:59 <Zakim> WAI_MATF()11:00AM has now started
15:54:06 <Zakim> +Kim_Patch
15:54:53 <Zakim> +Kathy_Wahlbin
16:00:37 <Zakim> +AWK
16:01:24 <Zakim> +Detlev
16:01:37 <Brent> Brent has joined #mobile-a11y
16:02:02 <AWK> AWK has joined #mobile-a11y
16:02:12 <Zakim> +jon_avila
16:02:34 <Detlev> Detlev has joined #mobile-a11y
16:03:43 <jon_avila> scribe: jon_avila
16:03:45 <Jan> Jan has joined #mobile-a11y
16:03:56 <Kim> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Note:_WCAG_2.0_and_Mobile
16:03:59 <Jan> zakim, code?
16:03:59 <Zakim> the conference code is 6283 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), Jan
16:04:45 <jon_avila> kw: Some open questions regarding how we will structure mobile techniques.  Question into where this fits or doesn't fit due to gaps.  e.g. touch
16:05:00 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
16:05:12 <Jan> zakim, [IPcaller] is really Jan
16:05:12 <Zakim> +Jan; got it
16:05:24 <jon_avila> kw: don't have answers and clear direction from where these will fit within WCAG.  Discussion on Monday on what we can do now to get information out to developers.
16:05:43 <jon_avila> kw: Can say how WCAG is applicable  to mobile dev so they can thing about the things that are needed for mobile over all.
16:06:05 <jon_avila> kw: We are going to create a note - interim deliverable - where we have info that can get out faster while we are wokring.
16:06:19 <jon_avila> kw: This will allow us to get something published and then we can work on published techniques.
16:06:27 <Zakim> + +1.408.425.aaaa
16:06:28 <Zakim> + +1.312.957.aabb
16:06:36 <jon_avila> kw: Similar to issues with cognitive TF and overall direction
16:07:01 <jon_avila> kw: Jan had taken a first pass on outline with Jeanne and Kathy contributing.
16:08:20 <jon_avila> kw: Gap analysis has been done and we may find more.  we will discuss how we present that information.
16:08:48 <Brent> zakim, +1.312.957.aabb is really Brent
16:08:48 <Zakim> +Brent; got it
16:08:51 <jon_avila> kw: 3 parts, note, gap analysis, and techniques themselves.  For now we will concentrate on this note.  The note would have 4 sections.
16:09:31 <jon_avila> kw: First one is how it applies, touch on some techniques,
16:10:03 <jon_avila> kw: Second section is on mobile specific issues.
16:10:09 <Shebanek> Shebanek has joined #mobile-a11y
16:10:22 <jon_avila> kw: Third section is note on UAAG.
16:10:39 <jon_avila> kw: Fourth section is a case study on sample mobile website/app that is designed to be accessible
16:11:30 <jon_avila> kw: want to get your thoughts on structure and content and how this will be used.  Is this going to get the information developers, managers, etc?  Is there something that is missing?
16:12:39 <jon_avila> kp: wanted to mention what we've talked about the what and how it fits in WCAG.  Good solution to how it fits issues.
16:12:42 <Kathy> q?
16:12:45 <Detlev> q+
16:14:15 <jon_avila> kp: a lot of new m techniques are in here
16:15:06 <Jan> q+
16:15:15 <Jan> ack detlev
16:15:16 <jon_avila> detlev: some mobile principles such as touch also apply to mouse operation.  Some things in our list have been left out from WCAG.  e.g. make sure things look actionable.
16:16:20 <jon_avila> Detlev: Somethings like this apply to desktop as well as mobile.   Consider why WCAG group had not included it for a reason - e.g. because it was a usability.
16:16:57 <jon_avila> kw: One reason why we are stepping away from techniques so we can get more clear direction from WCAG WG.
16:16:59 <Jan> q-
16:18:21 <jon_avila> kw: Discussion has shown  that we need to discuss whether these are the right techniques.  We will need to get that list clearly defined with details on whether this is something we should write for and whether it fits in mobile.
16:18:38 <jon_avila> kw: Perhaps some of these are not specific to mobile but the interaction mode, touch, screen size, etc.
16:19:05 <jeanne> jeanne has joined #mobile-a11y
16:19:29 <Zakim> +Jeanne
16:19:32 <jon_avila> kw: Valid concerns and things that we have reaslized of the last month.  So that is why we are going to focus on mobile accessibility in general.
16:20:06 <jon_avila> kp: We have been working on the trees but now we will focus on the forest.  We will take this as a template for techniques to come.
16:20:12 <Kathy> q?
16:20:36 <jon_avila> kw: Other thoughts on the note?
16:20:47 <Tim> Tim has joined #mobile-a11y
16:22:03 <jon_avila> detlev: no WCAG guidelines for items appearing actionable.  We could think about how we could work it into existing techniques.  To move forward we need a place where these discussions take place.
16:22:29 <jon_avila> detlev: This document might not be the place but we need a place to discuss.
16:22:43 <Zakim> -jon_avila
16:23:00 <jon_avila> got kicked off call.
16:23:42 <jon_avila> My phone is down can someone else scribe until I can get back in?
16:23:56 <Kathy> yes
16:24:23 <Kathy> kp: many of these we have talked about, this would eventually go into a github document
16:24:35 <Jan> q+
16:24:50 <Kathy> kp: this would be document that would inform "what to do"
16:25:11 <Kathy> kp: we would have people write paragraphs for the different items
16:25:27 <Kathy> jan: the wiki page is where we will start the writing
16:25:35 <Jan> ack Jan
16:25:59 <Kathy> kw: is there sections missing or content to be added
16:26:25 <Kathy> detlev: people may wonder if this is an explanation of the mobile best practices
16:26:51 <Kathy> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Note:_WCAG_2.0_and_Mobile#Discussion_of_Mobile-Specific_Issues
16:27:16 <Kathy> jan: doesn't think that there would be confusion
16:27:30 <Kathy> detlev: maybe have it in the introduction
16:28:13 <Zakim> + +1.703.862.aacc
16:28:14 <Kathy> detlev: if I am designer I would want a subset of these
16:28:25 <jon_avila> I am back
16:28:28 <Kathy> detlev: may want to talk about responsive images
16:28:34 <jon_avila> zakim, I am aacc
16:28:34 <Zakim> +jon_avila; got it
16:28:38 <jon_avila> ok
16:28:54 <jon_avila> kw: Do you think we should have a section on responsive images?
16:29:22 <jon_avila> detlev: We need to see what we are trying to achieve.    Take into the whole development context?
16:29:57 <jon_avila> detlev: need to get overview so we can see how these overall development activities fit in.
16:30:21 <jon_avila> kw: You detlev talked about how we might break it up by roles such as designer.  Do you think we should break it up that way?
16:30:59 <jon_avila> detlev: Map WCAG SC to roles is helpful -- there is a document that does that.
16:31:13 <Shebanek> Q+
16:31:26 <jon_avila> jan: at this point that is a layer complexity that is too much.
16:31:36 <jon_avila> kp: It is all very connected so we want developers to think about it all.
16:32:04 <jon_avila> mike: like outline and structure
16:37:15 <Kathy> q-
16:39:58 <Shebanek> +1 for adding a page for each numbered item
16:44:46 <Jan> q+
16:44:54 <Jan> ack Shebanek
16:46:22 <Kim> Making assignments – Kathy adding names to wiki
16:47:55 <Kim> Jan: workflow here, if everything is off in the sub pages it's going to be really hard to read this thing for flow.
16:47:57 <Kim> Kathy: draft sections, can combine later
16:48:24 <Kim> Jan: make sure not to edit the document as a whole, just under one heading
16:48:46 <Kim> Detlev: I like the concise overview
16:49:01 <jon_avila> jon_avila has joined #mobile-a11y
16:49:31 <Kim> Kathy: will create everything is a separate section – make sure to use the edit buttons
16:50:30 <Kim> Kathy: contents block gives an overview
16:52:23 <Kim> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/index.php?title=Click_language&action=edit&redlink=1
16:53:11 <Kim> https://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/mobile-a11y-tf/wiki/Subset_of_WCAG_2.0_Techniques_Applicable_to_Mobile_without_Changes_that_need_language_update
16:55:28 <Shebanek> +1 for activate!
17:01:52 <Zakim> -jon_avila
17:02:25 <Zakim> -Jan
17:02:27 <Zakim> - +1.408.425.aaaa
17:02:32 <Zakim> -AWK
17:02:33 <Zakim> -Detlev
17:02:50 <Zakim> -Jeanne
17:05:26 <Zakim> -Brent
17:05:27 <Zakim> -Kim_Patch
17:05:45 <Zakim> -Kathy_Wahlbin
17:05:46 <Zakim> WAI_MATF()11:00AM has ended
17:05:46 <Zakim> Attendees were Kim_Patch, Kathy_Wahlbin, AWK, Detlev, jon_avila, Jan, +1.408.425.aaaa, Brent, Jeanne, +1.703.862.aacc
17:06:59 <Kim>  rrsagent, make log world
17:07:33 <Kim>  rrsagent, make minutes
17:07:33 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/11/13-mobile-a11y-minutes.html Kim
17:09:05 <Kim>  rrsagent, bye
17:09:05 <RRSAgent> I see no action items