14:52:46 RRSAgent has joined #xproc 14:52:46 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/11/12-xproc-irc 14:52:50 Zakim has joined #xproc 14:52:54 zakim, this will be xporc 14:52:54 I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, Norm 14:52:57 zakim, this will be xproic 14:52:57 I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, Norm 14:52:58 zakim, this will be xproc 14:52:59 ok, Norm; I see XML_PMWG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 8 minutes 14:53:02 rrsagent, set logs world-visible 14:53:02 Meeting: XML Processing Model WG 14:53:02 Agenda: http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2014/11/12-agenda 14:53:02 Date: 12 Nov 2014 14:53:02 Meeting: 257 14:53:02 Chair: Norm 14:53:04 Scribe: Norm 14:53:06 ScribeNick: Norm 14:56:46 Regrets: Loren, Henry 14:57:36 XML_PMWG()10:00AM has now started 14:57:43 +Norm 14:57:44 coming .... 14:59:29 +[IPcaller] 14:59:46 zakim, +IP is jfuller 14:59:46 sorry, Norm, I do not recognize a party named '+IP' 14:59:54 zakim, +IPcaller is jfuller 14:59:54 sorry, Norm, I do not recognize a party named '+IPcaller' 14:59:59 zakim, IPcaller is jfuller 14:59:59 +jfuller; got it 15:02:27 Vojtech has joined #xproc 15:02:51 +Vojtech 15:05:05 Present: Norm, Jim, Vojtech 15:05:24 Topic: Accept this agenda? 15:05:24 -> http://www.w3.org/XML/XProc/2014/11/12-agenda 15:05:32 Accepted. 15:05:37 Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting? 15:05:37 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-processing-model-wg/2014Nov/0004.html 15:05:46 Norm thanks Jim for taking minutes. 15:05:50 tbey were terrible 15:05:55 Accepted. 15:06:01 Topic: Next meeting 15:06:20 Proposed: 19 Nov 2014 does anyone have to give regrets? 15:06:23 No regrets heard. 15:06:50 Topic: Review of open action items 15:07:11 No progress reported. 15:07:17 Topic: Jim's proposal to make p:inline optional 15:07:26 Regrets: Loren, Henry, Alex 15:07:33 Norm: It looks good to me. 15:08:22 Vojtech: Two things. If you have PIs or comments, you need to have a p:inline, but what does it mean 15:09:16 https://xquery.github.io/xproc-specification/langspec/xproc20/head/diff.html#p.inline 15:10:02 Some discussion of what it means to have multiple top-level elements. 15:10:21 Norm: No, I don't think we should do that. 15:11:52 Norm: For exactly the reasons that Vojtech raised, I think if we have multiple top-level elements, you need the p:inline wrapper. 15:12:15 Jim: I thought comments and PIs would always throw an error. 15:12:23 Vojtech: No, if there's only one top-level element, they're ok. 15:12:46 Jim: So instead of foreign element(s), you're saying foreign element (not plural) and go for the singular. 15:12:59 Vojtech: The spec of p:inline is any element, but we also allow PIs and comments around it. 15:14:25 Norm: I think if you have multiple documents, you need the wrapper. 15:14:55 Vojtech: At the moment, if you use p:inline then comments and PIs are ignored outside the p:inline elements. 15:15:05 ...If you remove the wrapper, then they become part of the document. 15:16:32 Vojtech: Another thing, at the moment the exclude-inline-prefixes attribute is on p:inline and p:input. 15:17:13 ...But I think the p:inline should be optional in the other places as well. On output, on connections, etc. 15:17:30 Norm: I agree. 15:17:46 Jim: I didn't propose that because I was trying to make the change very narrow. 15:18:46 Norm: I think if the p:inline can be left out in one context, it should be legal to leave it out everywhere that it can occur. 15:19:15 Jim: What about expand-text? 15:19:28 Norm: I think that needs to be available on all of the possible parents of p:inline. 15:19:54 ACTION: Jim to revise the p:inline proposal to cover all of the places where p:inline can occur and to handle expand-text as well as exclude-inline-prefixes. 15:20:06 s/Jim/ACTION A-257-01 Jim/ 15:20:16 -jfuller 15:20:29 happy with that (my connection dropped coming back) 15:21:38 frak .... will need a few mins 15:21:39 brb 15:21:48 Topic: Norm's proposal to split the spec into two documents 15:21:48 -> https://ndw.github.io/specification/ 15:22:18 Norm thinks he made it work. 15:23:43 +[IPcaller] 15:23:51 back sorry bout that 15:23:59 +1 15:24:01 yes 15:25:55 Norm: Consensus is that we should do this. The editor asserts it's entirely editorial. No technical changes except putting p:template and p:in-scope-namespaces into the steps document. 15:26:14 Vojtech: There are also references to p:try and such. They are still in the language spec. 15:26:30 Norm: Yes. 15:26:55 Vojtech: The document could also be called something else; the compound steps are also "standard steps". 15:27:15 ...I would expect them in the steps document, but that would probably not be as easy to do. 15:27:51 Norm: But if we moved them all into the steps document, we'd really be back to a single document... 15:28:15 Vojtech: I see that for p:declare-step or p:pipeline, but things like p:viewport or p:choose are more like standard steps that we provide out of the box. 15:28:32 ...It's really just atomic steps. 15:28:46 ...The main spec is compound steps and the rest of the language. 15:28:50 Norm: That's right. 15:29:15 Vojtech: On one level all these things like viewport and for-each are really just steps. 15:29:46 Norm: So should we wait on splitting... 15:30:00 Vojtech: No, but maybe we should consider moving viewport, for-each, etc. into the steps document. 15:30:33 ...The second document is really a library of atomic steps; maybe that's ok. 15:30:45 I think its ok as well 15:30:59 Proposal: Accept the two-spec version as the new consensus draft. 15:31:54 No objections heard. 15:31:55 Accepted. 15:32:04 Norm: I will make a pull request and make it so. 15:32:51 Topic: Liam's message 15:33:01 Norm: It's a useful collection of first-time-user-concerns. 15:33:22 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-xml-processing-model-wg/2014Nov/0007.html 15:33:37 Norm: I propose that we make one-or-more issues out of these and see that we address them. 15:35:21 The WG walks through Liam's message, muses about the changes. 15:40:35 alternately we could put an errors port on top level p:pipeline 15:48:06 +1 to beercoin 15:48:08 Topic: Any other business? 15:48:13 None heard. 15:48:23 Adjourned. 15:48:30 -Norm 15:48:32 -[IPcaller] 15:48:34 -Vojtech 15:48:34 XML_PMWG()10:00AM has ended 15:48:34 Attendees were Norm, jfuller, Vojtech, [IPcaller] 15:48:46 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:48:46 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/11/12-xproc-minutes.html Norm 16:31:38 Norm has joined #xproc 17:18:01 Zakim has left #xproc