14:02:05 RRSAgent has joined #tt 14:02:05 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-irc 14:02:07 RRSAgent, make logs public 14:02:07 Zakim has joined #tt 14:02:09 Zakim, this will be TTML 14:02:09 ok, trackbot; I see SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM scheduled to start 2 minutes ago 14:02:10 Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference 14:02:10 Date: 02 October 2014 14:03:33 zakim, who is here ? 14:03:33 SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM has not yet started, tmichel 14:03:35 On IRC I see RRSAgent, trackbot, glenn, courtney, tmichel, pal, nigel_, nigel 14:03:50 chair: nigel 14:04:29 Present: glenn, courtney, tmichel, pal, nigel 14:04:51 Regrets: frans_de_jong 14:05:14 zakim, who is on the phone? 14:05:14 SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM has not yet started, nigel 14:05:15 jdsmith has joined #tt 14:05:17 On IRC I see RRSAgent, trackbot, glenn, courtney, tmichel, pal, nigel_, nigel 14:05:28 Present+ jdsmith 14:06:14 zakim, this is ttwg 14:06:16 ok, nigel; that matches SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM 14:06:28 zakim, who is on the phone? 14:06:29 On the phone I see pal, nigel, courtney, glenn, ??P26, jdsmith 14:07:00 Zakim, ??P26 is me 14:07:00 +tmichel; got it 14:07:07 scribeNick: nigel 14:08:55 Topic: This Agenda 14:10:31 nigel: notes that Further Ahead section needs to extend into November. 14:10:41 Topic: Santa Clara F2F TPAC 14:11:03 http://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/tpac2014 14:11:29 nigel: I've updated the wiki page. Please fill in the Attendee section. 14:12:31 nigel: For agenda items, please go through me. 14:12:51 glenn: I expect to have more on TTML2 as I wrap up some more things. 14:15:04 nigel: Lists members and observers registered for TPAC. I plan to allow all observer requests. 14:15:44 Topic: IMSC 1 WD External liaisons 14:16:02 nigel: I've sent liaisons internally to all the relevant W3C groups on our charter. 14:19:55 nigel: I've drafted an external liaison and discussed some edits with Pierre. The main question is who should we write to. 14:20:24 ... There's a very long list of potential recipients, taking into account the charter and the liaisons. There are 38 liaisons including 27 for WAI. 14:20:55 pal: It would be a useful reference point to consider the wide review requirement in the 2005 process for LC -> CR. 14:21:22 ... I'm concerned that we could send this to too many groups. 14:21:38 glenn: I agree that we should only send to those groups that we can expect a timely response from. 14:21:58 tmichel: I agree too - the Director will be satisfied if we only talk to the groups on the charter. 14:24:07 http://www.w3.org/2001/11/StdLiaison.html 14:24:51 nigel: I would propose to send to the charter groups and the liaisons noted as interested in Timed Text and Web and TV. 14:25:22 pal: I'm concerned about generating too many conversations. 14:26:02 glenn: DLNA may just come back to me, if at all. HbbTV may be interested in it though. 14:26:23 ... Remember that we need to demonstrate primarily that there's been wide review and secondly some technical feedback. 14:27:48 nigel: I've decided to send to the charter list and the liaisons listed for Timed Text and Web and TV. 14:31:30 nigel: Summarises content of note. 14:32:23 Topic: Action items pending review 14:32:31 action-236? 14:32:31 action-236 -- Glenn Adams to Review consistent use of "root temporal extent" in both ttml 2 and ttml 1 se -- due 2014-08-31 -- PENDINGREVIEW 14:32:31 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/236 14:33:29 nigel: The link doesn't work for me. 14:33:43 glenn: This is a known issue with the Mercurial server, and occurs sporadically. 14:34:31 glenn: I introduced the mediaOffset, however we have some ongoing discussion on that. 14:34:48 close action-236 14:34:48 Closed action-236. 14:35:27 glenn: The biggest question for me on this whole topic is: what is the meaning of BEGIN(document) - is it 0s always or something else? Nigel's asked that too. 14:35:32 ... I'm still considering this. 14:36:04 ... In other words is BEGIN(document)-ORIGIN(document)=0 in all cases or is it possibly non-zero in some cases. 14:36:37 action-286? 14:36:37 action-286 -- Glenn Adams to Send an email to public-tt describing the ttv hosting site at w3c -- due 2014-08-31 -- PENDINGREVIEW 14:36:37 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/286 14:36:47 close action-286 14:36:47 Closed action-286. 14:37:21 glenn: To get the w3c version back up I need to interact with some staff - I'm not sure when I can do that. Use the backup site in the meantime. 14:37:30 pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective 14:37:32 action-287? 14:37:32 action-287 -- Glenn Adams to Elaborate on wording in ยง4 on namespace extension in ttml2 and as an errata to ttml1 -- due 2014-08-31 -- PENDINGREVIEW 14:37:32 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/287 14:40:39 glenn: I couldn't identify an issue that needed a specific change here. 14:41:03 ... I reviewed the notes from when this was created. 14:41:13 close action-287 14:41:13 Closed action-287. 14:41:22 action-320? 14:41:22 action-320 -- Glenn Adams to Review https://www.w3.org/wiki/ttml/codecsregistry w.r.t. recent ttml2 changes in profile definition mechanisms -- due 2014-08-21 -- PENDINGREVIEW 14:41:22 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/320 14:42:18 glenn: I made a minor editorial note to the codecs registry page. I'd note that we haven't concluded on this topic. 14:42:45 ... This should be an agenda topic at the F2F, because we should have the right people present, hopefully. 14:42:57 +1 14:43:08 Action: nigel Add codecs registry to F2F agenda at TPAC 14:43:09 Created ACTION-336 - Add codecs registry to f2f agenda at tpac [on Nigel Megitt - due 2014-10-09]. 14:43:21 close action-320 14:43:21 Closed action-320. 14:43:43 Topic: Actions overdue 14:43:49 nigel: These are both mine and I haven't done them. 14:44:27 Topic: Action items due next week 14:44:31 Action-332? 14:44:31 Action-332 -- Glenn Adams to Add schema support for ISD vocabulary -- due 2014-10-01 -- OPEN 14:44:31 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/332 14:44:59 glenn: I have coded the newly defined ISD spec into the TTV and created a TTX transformer tool that allows ISDs to be created from a TTML file. 14:45:14 ... In this way I'm verifying the viability of the newly defined vocabulary. 14:45:57 action-333? 14:45:57 action-333 -- Pierre-Anthony Lemieux to Create a one pager to cover the plan for the director's meeting for taking imsc1 to cr. -- due 2014-10-02 -- OPEN 14:45:57 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/333 14:47:51 nigel: Let's postpone this one due to the change in plan for IMSC. 14:48:31 Topic: TTML2 FPWD 14:48:48 nigel: We planned to do this last week; that didn't happen. 14:49:24 glenn: I'd like to retarget this to around the time of TPAC, to get some substantial pieces in, primarily the ISD creation rules and the HTML mapping. 14:50:38 nigel: Okay I'll rejig the timeline and discuss with you. I'm tempted to go just after TPAC so the group can feedback if necessary. 14:51:02 glenn: Sounds good. I'm making good progress on a variety of issues and it's better to get more in than less, if we can. 14:51:30 ... Also, once we have the FPWD published it's simple to publish new ones - we don't have to go long between them. 14:53:33 glenn: I'm expecting to close the P1 CPs by FPWD. 14:53:35 Topic: Issues Pending Review 14:53:41 issue-228? 14:53:41 issue-228 -- Ruby text support -- pending review 14:53:41 http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/228 14:54:21 glenn: I mapped 3 style properties that map to the CSS ruby display styles for the base and different container types and delimiter. 14:55:07 ... And there are position and align attributes. This gives us a good baseline to work with and supports the basic Ruby text needs. 14:55:35 ... There's one open technical issue that was posted by pal for SMPTE compatibility, which is the need to specify the offset of the container boxes from the base box. 14:55:58 ... I didn't do that because HTML and CSS don't support that at the moment. We could define properties but they wouldn't have a mapping. 14:56:52 nigel: I also noted that it uses a syntax different to the HTML syntax, and requires nested spans. I don't have an issue with that though. 14:57:01 pal: So now would be a good time to review? 14:57:03 glenn: yes. 14:58:46 glenn: There are different flavours of syntax in XHTML and HTML5 and the CSS formulation shows that no markup is needed, just some style properties. 14:59:05 ... I took the more CSS approach to make the Ruby more orthogonal via styling than adding new markup with the extra overhead for that. 14:59:37 pal: The SMPTE submission from ST4287 is in use today with content being made today with that Ruby markup so we should have a good rationale for 14:59:42 ... ignoring the recommendations there. 15:00:03 glenn: The proposal didn't say to adopt the syntax from SMPTE. 15:00:37 pal: Re the need to offset, that caught my attention. We should be careful about not supporting features from things that are actually in use today. 15:01:29 glenn: If what is proposed is functionally inadequate then I suggest that issues are raised with the specifics. 15:03:26 nigel: I suggest pal reviews and we leave this as Pending Review in the meantime. 15:03:53 -glenn 15:03:56 -pal 15:03:57 -courtney 15:03:57 -nigel 15:03:59 -jdsmith 15:04:16 nigel: Adjourns meeting. We have 1 hour scheduled for next week. Thanks everyone. 15:04:24 rrsagent, make logs public 15:04:30 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:04:30 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:26:48 d/pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective 15:26:50 i/Topic: Action items pending/pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective 15:26:54 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:26:54 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:27:55 s/pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective/ 15:27:57 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:27:57 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:29:12 s|d/pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective| 15:29:16 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:29:16 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:30:18 s|d/or who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective/or | 15:30:22 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:30:22 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:30:48 s|who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective| 15:30:50 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:30:50 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:31:26 s|who the right contact is): (a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective| 15:31:28 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:31:28 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:31:52 s|d/pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or | 15:32:01 s/s|/ 15:32:03 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:32:03 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:32:42 s/(a) it generates work for both TTWG and the target group with only limited chances of feedback, (b) many of these groups have members that are already members of W3C and TTWG and (c) it looks like it is not required from a process perspective/ 15:33:06 s|pal: the notes above did not capture my input correctly re: sending an email blast to multiple groups without a clear knowledge of whether the group is interested (and/or who the right contact is): | 15:33:11 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:33:11 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 15:34:16 s/|/ 15:34:18 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:34:18 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/10/02-tt-minutes.html nigel 16:00:26 nigel_ has left #tt 16:05:00 disconnecting the lone participant, tmichel, in SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM 16:05:01 SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM has ended 16:05:01 Attendees were pal, nigel, courtney, glenn, jdsmith, tmichel 16:08:55 glenn has joined #tt 16:12:30 Zakim has left #tt