12:28:29 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #eo
12:28:29 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/09/05-eo-irc
12:28:31 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
12:28:31 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #eo
12:28:33 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 3694
12:28:33 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see WAI_EOWG()8:30AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
12:28:34 <trackbot> Meeting: Education and Outreach Working Group Teleconference
12:28:34 <trackbot> Date: 05 September 2014
12:28:54 <Zakim> WAI_EOWG()8:30AM has now started
12:29:00 <Zakim> +Shawn
12:29:07 <AnnaBelle> AnnaBelle has joined #eo
12:29:40 <kevin> kevin has joined #eo
12:30:05 <Zakim> +AnnaBelle
12:30:35 <Zakim> + +33.1.74.64.aaaa
12:30:40 <metzessive> metzessive has joined #eo
12:30:47 <Sylvie> zakim, aaaa is Sylvie
12:30:47 <Zakim> +Sylvie; got it
12:31:00 <Zakim> +??P2
12:31:22 <Zakim> +??P3
12:31:35 <Zakim> +metzessive
12:31:41 <yatil> zakim, call EricE-Skype
12:31:41 <Zakim> ok, yatil; the call is being made
12:31:43 <Zakim> +EricE
12:31:58 <Zakim> -EricE
12:32:06 <yatil> zakim, call EricE-Skype
12:32:06 <Zakim> ok, yatil; the call is being made
12:32:07 <Zakim> +EricE
12:32:23 <Sharron> Sharron has joined #eo
12:32:29 <yatil> zakim, nick yatil is EricE
12:32:29 <Zakim> ok, yatil, I now associate you with EricE
12:32:34 <yatil> zakim, mute me
12:32:34 <Zakim> EricE should now be muted
12:32:36 <Zakim> +Jon
12:32:37 <Sharron> tracbot, start meeting
12:32:39 <Zakim> -??P3
12:32:53 <shawn> zakim, ??P2 is Bim
12:32:53 <Zakim> +Bim; got it
12:32:55 <paulschantz> paulschantz has joined #eo
12:33:26 <yatil> ack me
12:33:29 <Zakim> +??P3
12:33:36 <kevin> zakim, ??P3 is me
12:33:36 <Zakim> +kevin; got it
12:33:50 <metzessive> Zakim, metzessive is Jon
12:33:50 <Zakim> +Jon; got it
12:33:51 <Zakim> +PaulSchantz
12:34:05 <yatil> Zakim, applaude metzessive
12:34:05 <Zakim> I don't understand 'applaude metzessive', yatil
12:34:22 <yatil> zakim, mute me
12:34:22 <Zakim> EricE should now be muted
12:34:32 <Zakim> + +1.562.256.aabb
12:34:34 <shawn> zakim, who is on the pone?
12:34:34 <Zakim> I don't understand your question, shawn.
12:34:39 <shawn> zakim, who is on the phone?
12:34:39 <Zakim> On the phone I see Shawn, AnnaBelle, Sylvie, Bim, Jon.a, EricE (muted), Jon, kevin, PaulSchantz, +1.562.256.aabb
12:34:58 <shadi> zakim, call shadi-617
12:34:58 <Zakim> ok, shadi; the call is being made
12:35:00 <Zakim> +Shadi
12:35:07 <Wayne> zakim, aabb is wayne
12:35:07 <Zakim> +wayne; got it
12:35:20 <Zakim> + +1.512.797.aacc
12:35:43 <shawn> https://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/wiki/EOWG_Meetings#5_September_2014_teleconference
12:35:51 <shawn> zakim, aacc is Jan
12:35:51 <Zakim> +Jan; got it
12:35:54 <shadi> zakim, who is on the phone?
12:35:54 <Zakim> On the phone I see Shawn, AnnaBelle, Sylvie, Bim, Jon.a, EricE (muted), Jon, kevin, PaulSchantz, wayne, Shadi, Jan
12:36:28 <Sylvie> zakim, mute me
12:36:28 <Zakim> Sylvie should now be muted
12:36:52 <Sharron> Topic: WCAG-EM Reprt Tool
12:37:05 <shawn> https://www.w3.org/WAI/EO/wiki/EOWG_Meetings#5_September_2014_teleconference  has specific questions
12:37:07 <yatil> s/Reprt/Report/
12:37:14 <Sharron> zakim, Jan is Sharron
12:37:14 <Zakim> +Sharron; got it
12:37:57 <shawn> report tool page 2 http://w3c.github.io/wcag-em-report-tool/dist/#/audit/explore
12:37:58 <shadi> http://w3c.github.io/wcag-em-report-tool/dist/
12:39:15 <Sharron> Shadi: First is the cosideration of the fact that the tool follows WCAG_EM verbatim. So Step 2 is the Exploration part, where you determine what is to be included in the sample.
12:39:46 <Zakim> +??P10
12:40:17 <yatil> Zakim, P10 is Wilco
12:40:17 <Zakim> sorry, yatil, I do not recognize a party named 'P10'
12:40:33 <yatil> Zakim, ??P10 is Wilco
12:40:33 <Zakim> +Wilco; got it
12:40:35 <Sharron> ...if you find for example that HTML5 is in your site, then you know you must select pages that contain that technology. Similarly with Flash video players or something. But the common pages - site map, Home page, etc - will always be inlcuded.
12:41:06 <Sharron> ...So in Step2 you have the option to make notes to yourself about your selection process, etc
12:41:12 <kevin> zakim, mute me
12:41:12 <Zakim> kevin should now be muted
12:43:02 <Sharron> ...Then is Step 3 you have your sample pages as well as the notes, but also allows you to add the additional pages. There is concern about the complexity of this process. For those of us who are very familiar with WCAG-EM it is clear but maybe not as much as the remaining 6 billion people in the world.
12:43:47 <Sharron> ...The suggestion is to keep Step 2 but leave only the introduction and link to Step2 in WCAG-EM for the detail.
12:44:59 <paulschantz> keep it the way it is
12:45:08 <Sharron> ...it has the advantage to keep Step2 within the tool, consistent with the methodology. The disadvantage is that it is a bit of a disconnect, nd makes Step 3 very long and with references to both Step 2 and 3
12:45:17 <shawn> ack me
12:45:25 <paulschantz> +1 sharron
12:45:28 <Wilco> +1 :D
12:45:37 <Jan> Jan has joined #eo
12:46:20 <Sharron> Paul: I see it in step 3
12:46:24 <Sharron> Shadi: Yes it is in both that is the problem
12:46:35 <Sharron> Paul: It makes complete sense to me
12:46:38 <kevin> q+ to comment on the multiple web page entry points
12:46:54 <shawn> ack k
12:46:55 <Zakim> kevin, you wanted to comment on the multiple web page entry points
12:46:56 <Sharron> Shawn: Did anyone ask others to do this, informal usability testing?
12:47:05 <Sharron> Paul: No but that is an excellent suggestion.
12:47:32 <Sharron> Scribe: Sharron
12:47:41 <Sharron> Scribe: Sharron
12:48:24 <kevin> zakim, mute me
12:48:24 <Zakim> kevin should now be muted
12:48:31 <shawn> zakim, who is on the call?
12:48:31 <Zakim> On the phone I see Shawn, AnnaBelle, Sylvie (muted), Bim, Jon.a, EricE (muted), Jon, kevin (muted), PaulSchantz, wayne, Shadi, Sharron, Wilco
12:48:37 <Sharron> Kevin: It is including the idea of adding pages to the sample in multiple places which adds to the complexity.
12:49:05 <Sharron> Shadi: We have not put this into the hands of evaluators and gotten their feedback.
12:49:50 <Sharron> Paul: We have a universal design center that monitors tools and I could ask them to look, but have no guarantee of time
12:50:03 <metzessive> q+
12:50:40 <Sharron> Shadi: I would be very interested in asking them to do that. The tool has a particular audience and that sounds like a good test group
12:51:15 <shawn> ack m
12:51:41 <Sharron> Sharron: I asked folks at Texas state agencies (web accessibility monitors) and that feedback did not come up.
12:52:09 <Sharron> Jon: I have a group I could ask and get feedback by next week
12:52:50 <Sharron> Shawn: Yes we would love that. If you have people who are familiar with WCAG it would be most useful.
12:53:50 <shadi> [[Following the steps of WCAG-EM and using this tool to carry out a comprehensive accessibility evaluation of a website requires experience in evaluating accessibility using Web Content Accessibility Guidelines (WCAG) 2.0]]
12:53:53 <Sharron> Jon: People with a range of technical abilities I know would be very interested in doing this
12:54:54 <Sharron> Shadi: But note the introductory explanation of the audience, knowledgable about WCAG not expert consultants or anything but really must have knowledge of WCAG
12:55:04 <metzessive> I have a job because people are aware of WCAG, to a point of knowing it exists and what it's for.
12:55:14 <paulschantz> CSUN Universal Design Center uses WCAG 2.0 in web accessibility evals
12:55:33 <Sharron> ...information outside of this core group is less useful
12:57:27 <Sharron> Shadi: This is the time to use it in practice. I have asked some of the folks from the Task Force to use this tool as they do their own evaluations. Time is really important, if you need more time let me know
12:57:38 <paulschantz> I'll try to get feedback by next Thursday
12:57:51 <Sharron> Jon: I will try to get that by Wednesday but for sure by Friday
12:57:55 <Zakim> -Jon.a
12:59:01 <shawn> q+ to say an inbetween possibility
12:59:10 <Sharron> Bim: I have used the tool for doing evaluations the one thing I missed on the heading for instruction for sample pages there was no link to more informaiton about that. I happened to know because of my experience with WCAG-EM but otherwise would not know
12:59:28 <shawn> ack me
12:59:28 <Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say an inbetween possibility
12:59:30 <Sharron> Shadi: Good suggestion
13:00:59 <Sharron> Shawn: Here is a brainstorm   what if we keep it like this to more closely match WCAG-EM and also address the usability issues.  Add on step 2 that is visible all the time sayin something like here you can enter information about the essential functionality, next you will add specific pages
13:03:43 <Sharron> Shadi: The reason the notes show first is to give you  reminder of how to elect pages that address the things you ahve found
13:04:16 <Sharron> ...we missed the technologies relied upon because it is something that I need to know
13:04:28 <Wayne> q+
13:04:50 <Sharron> ...let's keep this open, see what input we get, and see if we need to do a major change
13:05:21 <Sharron> Shawn: If we decide to leave it, it will still be important to let people know on page 2 that they will be able to add more pages
13:06:06 <Sharron> Shadi: Sure that doesn't take a lot of effort and maybe add clarifiers to address Bim's experince as well and then see what feedback comes from usability testing
13:06:07 <shawn> ack w
13:06:38 <Sharron> Wayne: Did I read wrong? I thought when you discover a certain functionality on stpe 2 you add the page there?
13:07:04 <Zakim> +Jon.a
13:07:32 <kevin> s/stpe/step
13:07:51 <Sharron> Shadi: Yes it is one of the confusing things in WCAG-EM and now the tool continues that
13:07:56 <metzessive> Zakim, mute me
13:07:56 <Zakim> sorry, metzessive, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
13:08:10 <metzessive> Zakim, metzessive is Jon
13:08:10 <Zakim> sorry, metzessive, I do not recognize a party named 'metzessive'
13:08:20 <yatil> Zakim, metzessive is Jon.a
13:08:20 <Zakim> sorry, yatil, I do not recognize a party named 'metzessive'
13:08:29 <Sharron> Shadi: OK for now we will make the minor edits for clarification and see what comes out of the testing
13:08:38 <yatil> Zakim, nick metzessive is Jon.a
13:08:38 <Zakim> ok, yatil, I now associate metzessive with Jon.a
13:08:38 <kevin> zakim, Jon.a is metzessive
13:08:39 <Zakim> +metzessive; got it
13:08:44 <shawn> ack me
13:09:04 <Sharron> ...please let me know when you have collegues using the tool so we can gauge the responses and know what to expect
13:09:18 <Sharron> Wayne: Looks great at 300% too
13:09:41 <Sharron> Shawn: Yes I am super impressed by so much about the tool, inlcuding this
13:10:42 <Sharron> ...in terms of the timing. Last week Sharron sent the deadline info in an email. If at all possible get comments in by Wednesday, prepar on Thursday in advance of the meeting on Friday
13:11:25 <Sharron> Shadi: Would that work that EO people can get feedback in by Wednesday and if you need more time just let me know
13:11:47 <Sharron> ...Sharron will you send a rminder
13:11:52 <Sharron> Sharron: Yes
13:12:05 <kevin> s/rminder/reminder
13:12:15 <shawn> s/prepar on Thursday /so we can review them on Thursday and prepare
13:14:12 <Sharron> Shadi: In step 1 when you select your conformance target, only those SCs that match your selection will be displayed. But if you want to evaluate to Level2 but wish to inlcude some of AAA SCs there is a suggestion to be able to select beyond your conformance selection.
13:14:51 <Sharron> ...at this time we do not have a way to do this except to ask for a higher level of confomrnace
13:15:29 <Sharron> ...can show them all all the time, could have a toggle to say I want level2 conformance but show all.
13:16:12 <Sharron> Shawn: So the evaluator wants to report on some AAA but the conformance Level is only AA, how to report?
13:16:37 <Wilco> q+
13:16:55 <Sharron> Shadi: Conformance target vs evaluation target
13:17:04 <shawn> ack w
13:17:47 <shadi> http://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG-EM/#step1b
13:17:58 <shadi> [[Part of initiating the evaluation process is to define the target WCAG 2.0 conformance level ("A", "AA", or "AAA") for evaluation. WCAG 2.0 Level AA is the generally accepted and recommended target.]]
13:19:09 <shawn> Sharron: a lot of times people will say we want Level AA conformance, but we think it will be easy to do some parts of AAA. I've had several people ask for AA+ (a few of AAA).
13:19:30 <Sharron> Wilco: Seems to me that the conformance target term is confusing. Renaming it evaluation target does not match WCAG-EM. But in the final reports, we could make the distintion
13:21:04 <Wilco> WCAG-EM has "Additional evaluation requirements" for this
13:21:35 <Sharron> Sharron: My experience is that some companies pick and choose from higher levels than the conformance level.
13:21:39 <shawn> +1 for any solution that encourages people to look at all the SC ;-)
13:22:18 <kevin> q+
13:22:27 <shawn> ack k
13:22:27 <kevin> ack me
13:22:32 <Sharron> Shadi: My suggestion would be to have all of them in and then you would remove the ones you are not using
13:22:50 <Wayne> q+
13:23:09 <Sharron> Kevin: When you are in the define scope phase what would the selct conformance level do?
13:23:16 <Sharron> Shadi: Yes
13:23:50 <Sharron> Kevin: I don't agree with that because it will add tremendous visual complexity
13:24:10 <paulschantz> +1 to Kevin's comment
13:24:26 <Sharron> ...it changes the way people can concentrate and focus on what they actually need to do
13:24:48 <Sharron> ...additionally the difference between the conformance level and the evaluation level
13:25:33 <Wayne> +1 with Kevin
13:25:36 <Sharron> ...the evaluation is really what the tool focuses on and the terms are confusing rather than clarifying
13:25:49 <Wilco> q-
13:25:53 <Wilco> Kevin pretty much said it all
13:26:08 <shawn> ack w
13:26:09 <kevin> zakim, mute me
13:26:09 <Zakim> kevin should now be muted
13:26:09 <Sharron> Shadi: We have a selection by level but people may want to add a few items from a highr level
13:26:49 <Sharron> Wayne: I agree with Kevin and I think it should be additive rather than having to remove the ones you don't want to use
13:26:49 <shawn> q+ to say now plus
13:26:55 <shawn> ack me
13:26:55 <Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say now plus
13:27:56 <Sharron> Shawn: In the usablity testing, it seemed to require a person to cheat the tool. I woould have to select AAA as my conformance target and then go back and edit the report
13:28:35 <Sharron> Shadi: How often did the issue arise? We are asking for something more finer grained?
13:29:07 <kevin> q+ to suggest "Hide 'Not Checked' in report"
13:29:19 <Wilco> q+
13:29:41 <Sharron> Shawn: Sharron does. But for now lets define something we want in the future but accept certain limitations in version 1. So in future I coudl choose like = all A, all AA and cherry pick a few AAA
13:29:57 <Wilco> I'll make sure that feature is added to github
13:30:15 <kevin> ack me
13:30:17 <Zakim> kevin, you wanted to suggest "Hide 'Not Checked' in report"
13:30:18 <shawn> ack k
13:30:19 <Sharron> ...but for now, we need another solution
13:30:46 <Zakim> -EricE
13:30:56 <yatil> zakim, call EricE-Skype
13:30:58 <Zakim> ok, yatil; the call is being made
13:30:58 <Zakim> +EricE
13:31:03 <shawn> q+ to say (later) still keep all SC in the report?
13:31:21 <Sharron> Kevin: To a certain extent we have that ability. It is not as clearly straightforward. A quick solution might be to simply hide not checked in the report
13:31:50 <kevin> zamin, mute me
13:31:54 <kevin> zakim, mute me
13:31:54 <Zakim> kevin should now be muted
13:31:55 <Sharron> Shawn: One concern about that is that a person makes a mistake and it would not be found
13:32:02 <shawn> ack b
13:32:04 <kevin> s/zamin, mute me//
13:32:56 <Sharron> Bim: Could tere be an addiitonal option in the combo box that will say "out of scope"
13:33:25 <kevin> Unless there is an 'Out of Scope' section in the report?
13:33:43 <Sharron> Shadi: You could mistakenly choose that as well and it could be give misleading results
13:34:05 <Sharron> Bim: If it only says that this SC was out of scope in the report
13:35:22 <shawn> q+ to say what ex-col for each SC, it's just one line so not as cluttering?
13:35:22 <Sharron> Wilco: I like Kevin's solution. Also a filter that allows you to choose SCs in process. When you choose AA it sets up those SCs and then in the following step you would add a function that allows you to add
13:35:30 <shawn> q?
13:35:33 <shawn> ack w
13:35:47 <paulschantz> q+
13:36:08 <shawn> q+ to say nice to simplify step 4, too (not just report)!
13:36:19 <Sharron> Shadi: What I like about Bim and Kevin's suggestion to cherry pick is that it addresses partial conformance of higher levels
13:36:50 <paulschantz> The conformance level filter would not necessarily be obtrusive
13:37:16 <Sharron> ...so let's say I select AA and in step 4 perhaps only the titles of AAA SCs are here and can be opted into.
13:38:22 <Zakim> -Jon
13:39:19 <Sharron> Sharron: Can I ask about beta testing the tool at the AccessibilitySummit?
13:40:00 <Sharron> Shawn: With the caveats that it has not been announced or leaked, maybe but lets follow up later
13:40:02 <shawn> q?
13:40:39 <shawn> q+ to say showstopper is making it clear what happensd anyway ;-)
13:40:40 <shawn> ack me
13:40:40 <Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say (later) still keep all SC in the report? and to say what ex-col for each SC, it's just one line so not as cluttering? and to say nice to simplify step 4,
13:40:41 <Sharron> Shadi: We can come up with a solution but must balance resources
13:40:44 <Zakim> ... too (not just report)! and to say showstopper is making it clear what happensd anyway ;-)
13:42:03 <yatil> +1 Shawn :-)
13:42:19 <Sharron> Shawn: Comments about doing stuff and deleting from the report seems too complex. I love the idea that on Step 4 you see the text of all SCs with the ones you ahve slected expanded. But an allowance is made to add the others - I love it!
13:42:25 <Sharron> Sharron: +1
13:42:27 <shawn> ack paul
13:43:27 <Sharron> Paul: 2 things. A conformance level filter would fit well on Step 4. The evaluator sets the target at the very start. so why would you need this?
13:44:13 <Sharron> Shadi: But you may want to let the web site owner know about a few other SCs, so I am in favor of the opt in/ opt out
13:44:51 <shawn> zakim, who is making noise?
13:45:02 <Zakim> shawn, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Shawn (9%)
13:45:29 <Sharron> ...one other thing is in doing a usabilty test - what happens when you click "New report"
13:46:11 <Sharron> ...it opens a new window landing on the start page
13:46:23 <Sharron> ...was that what you expected?
13:46:37 <kevin> q+ to ask what happens to data in any existing report?
13:47:44 <Sharron> Shawn: If I click new report, it goes back to the page, no new windo. In FF I do get a new window
13:47:45 <shawn> q?
13:47:57 <Sharron> Shadi: What do you expect?
13:48:01 <paulschantz> What platforms & browsers are we targeting?  Current version minus one, or something else?
13:48:14 <kevin> ack me
13:48:15 <Zakim> kevin, you wanted to ask what happens to data in any existing report?
13:48:16 <yatil> ack me
13:48:17 <Sharron> Shawn: New window is good, would ahve expected to be at step 1
13:48:43 <kevin> s/ahve/have/
13:49:14 <yatil> zakim, mute me
13:49:14 <Zakim> sorry, yatil, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you
13:49:15 <kevin> ack me
13:49:17 <Sharron> Eric: I would expect a new tab and I wonder what happened to the things I entred before. I expected a confirmation message - do you really want to srat over - and get to Step 1 with all filds reset
13:49:28 <yatil> zakim, nick yatil is EricE
13:49:28 <Zakim> ok, yatil, I now associate you with EricE
13:49:31 <yatil> zakim, mute me
13:49:31 <Zakim> EricE should now be muted
13:50:02 <Sharron> Kevin: I wondered what happens to the data in your current report. Can you ahve mulitple reports with multiple window and multiple sets of data?
13:50:19 <metzessive> shouldn't it warn you that you are opening a new window?
13:50:20 <kevin> zakim, mute me
13:50:20 <Zakim> kevin should now be muted
13:50:31 <Sharron> Wilco: yes absolutely. You get a clean slate and the other one is sustained
13:50:35 <yatil> q+
13:50:37 <kevin> s/ahve/have/
13:50:39 <Wayne> that behavior is what I expected
13:51:58 <Sharron> Shadi: So OK some like it, Eric was surprised
13:52:12 <yatil> q+ to say that an indicator is needed on which page shows what
13:52:18 <yatil> ack me
13:52:20 <Zakim> EricE, you wanted to say that an indicator is needed on which page shows what
13:52:25 <Sharron> Shawn: Can we simply give the instruction about what till happen "opens a new window"
13:52:58 <paulschantz> +1 to Eric's comment
13:52:59 <Sharron> Eric: Yes it should have a title bar with the name of the different ones
13:53:04 <kevin> +1 to Eric
13:53:05 <paulschantz> very good
13:53:13 <yatil> zakim, mute me
13:53:13 <Zakim> EricE should now be muted
13:53:22 <Sharron> Shadi: When did you come across start a new report?
13:53:44 <Sharron> Shawn: I did not, it was only when I was investigating function.
13:54:23 <Sharron> Shadi: We will look at clarification of labeling. OK are there any other things to discuss?
13:56:21 <Sharron> ...if you go to "Explore Web Site" there are common pages, type in short name and web address. You can add a new page and it jumps. Shawn has suggested more of a cycle which will improve the experince of adding pages one by one. Any thoughts on this from keyboard users?
13:56:59 <Wilco> +1
13:57:45 <Sharron> Bim: Yes it is something that I wanted as an ask. Taking the focus back to the new short name is useful, they are unlikely to be doing it all in a block
13:58:23 <Sharron> ...I had to tab backwards three times so this would be an improvement
14:00:49 <Sharron> Shadi: We really need that feedback at this time, will bring in more questions and perhaps an updated tool.
14:01:03 <Zakim> -Wilco
14:01:11 <Sharron> Topic: Implementation Planning
14:01:50 <Sharron> Shadi: Kevin has been busily hammering away , got great comments from Paul thank you for those
14:02:18 <shawn> +1 to Paul's comment that the new organization works will with the key topics being ex-col
14:02:48 <kevin> s/works will with/works well with/
14:03:16 <Sharron> ...especially like for people to look at Introduction section it is being rewritten to address framing and emphasize the iterative aspect of accessiiblity. Let's look at that and see if it helps positioning the approach and how to use it.
14:03:19 <shawn> [minor: mention the Improving doc, too?]
14:04:00 <shawn> Sharron: going in right direction. gives sense much better.
14:04:38 <shawn> ... so many people get handed the responsibility for accessibility, and this will be really helpful. I'd like to go through it in more detail
14:05:17 <paulschantz> It's REALLY different
14:05:26 <kevin> ack me
14:05:33 <paulschantz> ...in a good way
14:05:40 <AnnaBelle> q+
14:05:43 <Sharron> Shadi: Areas where Key actions are expandable those are the sections ready for review
14:06:02 <shawn> Sharron: much improved
14:06:40 <Sharron> AnnaBelle: Thanks for the changes to the Intro it is a huge improvement, I REALLY like the rearrangement
14:08:10 <shawn> minor: "You may be planning to create a new website, have already begun the process and now need to consider accessibility, or looking to improve your organizational processes and policies." -- move new website last since that's least common? [I think Sharron will have good input on this text when she reviews it]
14:08:40 <Sharron> Shawn: The new organziation is beautiful
14:09:11 <shawn> q+ to say ex-col all button placement
14:09:14 <shawn> ack a
14:09:20 <AnnaBelle> q-
14:10:10 <shawn> [minor - key action "bullets" I think could be left aligned]
14:10:10 <Sharron> Shadi: For those who haven't reviewed it yet, consider the clarity of the intro, the ease of skimming, the flexible use of the docuemnt understanding that it will be used in various environments to support people in very different circumstances and nvironments
14:10:27 <shawn> ack me
14:10:27 <Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say ex-col all button placement
14:11:50 <Sharron> Shawn: Placement of expand all buttons may be presented below the intro text so that it comes just before the first set of expandable buttons
14:12:43 <Sharron> Kevin: yes we can consider placement no final decisions were made
14:13:08 <Sharron> Shadi: Do people ge tthe sense of expand collapse from these buttons? Any design questions or comments?
14:13:55 <Sharron> Shawn: It underlines the whole line, which is great and teaches me right away that i don't have to just click on the little box
14:15:00 <Sharron> Wayne: Using this document is to make the point that it is circular, that you will come back to various steps
14:15:06 <Sharron> Sharron: +1
14:16:41 <Sharron> Bim: I've got three buttons for each point before the text. They are not all in the tab order, but are found with arrowing down
14:17:16 <Sharron> Shadi: Thanks for this input, Shawn back to you.
14:18:05 <Sharron> Shawn: Kudos to Kevin, would it be easy to put the headings ready for review easy to find?
14:18:42 <Sharron> Shawn: Any other questions on the implementation plan?
14:18:57 <kevin> zakim, mute me
14:18:57 <Zakim> kevin should now be muted
14:19:08 <Sharron> ...on the tool saving, do we need more discussion?
14:19:57 <Sharron> Topic: WCAG-EM Report Tool
14:20:18 <paulschantz> can the tool auto-save similar to Google Docs?
14:20:30 <Wayne> Wayne has joined #eo
14:21:05 <shawn> http://w3c.github.io/wcag-em-report-tool/dist/#/
14:21:49 <Sharron> Shadi: For simplicity we called the landing page "Start" but in reality the Start occurs at Step 1. Suggestion to change the word
14:22:22 <paulschantz> New?
14:22:24 <Sharron> Bim: Introduction?
14:22:47 <paulschantz> Go?
14:22:56 <yatil> +1 to introduction or overview
14:23:02 <shawn> Sharron: agree to find another word. introdcution probably most useful. so what if it's boring
14:23:26 <Sharron> Shadi: Is Start just that bad that it needs changing?
14:23:54 <Sharron> Shawn: There are 2 start buttons
14:25:08 <Sharron> Shadi: If we rename the button, and consider design changes, does Start still work?
14:25:24 <Sharron> Shawn: Then I am fine calling it Start
14:27:25 <shawn> [ Shawn doesn't feel strongly either way]
14:27:46 <Sharron> Shadi: What do people feel about using the actual name (recognition) vs shortening?
14:27:58 <yatil> ack me
14:28:37 <Sharron> Eric: I just noticed that the WCAGs are not the same but it is not confusing in the context. How about not using the subtitle in How to Meet?
14:28:42 <shawn> "How to Meet WCAG 2.0: A customizable quick reference"
14:29:01 <Sharron> Shawn: We might want to put more in the title
14:29:06 <yatil> +1 to shawn
14:29:09 <yatil> zakim, mute me
14:29:09 <Zakim> EricE should now be muted
14:29:24 <Sharron> Bim: That particular control is brilliant and accessible
14:29:50 <Sharron> ...it even collapses when you use the ESC key
14:30:07 <Sharron> Shawn: Thanks for the extra time, anything else
14:30:27 <Sharron> Wayne: Magnificatin issue in knowing were I am, will take it up with Wilco
14:30:39 <Zakim> -PaulSchantz
14:30:48 <Zakim> -metzessive
14:30:49 <Zakim> -Bim
14:30:53 <Zakim> -Sylvie
14:30:53 <Sharron> Shawn: Thanks for all the good considertion and problem solving today.
14:30:53 <metzessive> bye!
14:30:54 <Zakim> -wayne
14:30:57 <yatil> zakim, drop me
14:30:57 <Zakim> EricE is being disconnected
14:30:59 <Zakim> -EricE
14:31:02 <Zakim> -kevin
14:31:03 <Zakim> -Sharron
14:31:05 <Zakim> -AnnaBelle
14:31:10 <shawn> zakim, who is on the phone?
14:31:10 <Zakim> On the phone I see Shawn, Shadi
14:31:23 <Sharron> trackbot, end meeting
14:31:23 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
14:31:23 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Shawn, AnnaBelle, +33.1.74.64.aaaa, Sylvie, EricE, Jon, Bim, kevin, PaulSchantz, +1.562.256.aabb, Shadi, wayne, +1.512.797.aacc, Sharron,
14:31:26 <Zakim> ... Wilco, metzessive
14:31:31 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
14:31:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/09/05-eo-minutes.html trackbot
14:31:32 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
14:31:32 <RRSAgent> I see no action items