16:41:08 RRSAgent has joined #ua 16:41:08 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc 16:41:10 RRSAgent, make logs public 16:41:10 Zakim has joined #ua 16:41:12 Zakim, this will be WAI_UAWG 16:41:12 ok, trackbot; I see WAI_UAWG()1:00PM scheduled to start in 19 minutes 16:41:13 Meeting: User Agent Accessibility Guidelines Working Group Teleconference 16:41:13 Date: 28 August 2014 16:41:20 rrsagent, set logs public 16:41:32 regrets: Jan, Eric 16:41:42 rrsagent, make minutes 16:41:42 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-minutes.html allanj 16:42:06 rrsagent, set logs public 16:42:30 chair: jimallan, KellyFord 16:47:28 Agenda+ CfC name change for Implementation document 16:47:42 Agenda+ 1.10.1 review comments 16:48:17 Agenda+ Action 1019 - definition of user interface 16:49:06 Agenda+ Action 1018 response to MS07 16:52:02 Agenda+ 1.10.1 comment 16:56:57 agenda+ vote on publication 17:00:35 WAI_UAWG()1:00PM has now started 17:00:42 +Jeanne 17:01:04 +Jim_Allan 17:02:07 +Kim_Patch 17:03:23 +Greg_Lowney 17:03:49 Greg has joined #ua 17:04:31 scribe: allanj 17:06:59 KimPatch has joined #ua 17:10:25 zakim, agenda 17:10:25 I don't understand 'agenda', allanj 17:10:31 zakim, agenda? 17:10:31 I see 6 items remaining on the agenda: 17:10:33 1. CfC name change for Implementation document [from allanj] 17:10:33 2. 1.10.1 review comments [from allanj] 17:10:33 3. Action 1019 - definition of user interface [from allanj] 17:10:33 4. Action 1018 response to MS07 [from allanj] 17:10:33 5. 1.10.1 comment [from allanj] 17:10:33 6. vote on publication [from jeanne] 17:11:17 zakim, open item 1 17:11:17 agendum 1. "CfC name change for Implementation document" taken up [from allanj] 17:13:34 RESOLUTION: Change the name of Implementing UAAG 2.0 to UAAG 2.0 Reference 17:13:35 ​​ 17:13:59 close item 1 17:14:15 Zakim, open item 2 17:14:15 agendum 2. "1.10.1 review comments" taken up [from allanj] 17:14:55 original change: 17:14:58 1.10.1 Access Related Information: The user can access information from explicitly-defined relationships in the content, including at least the following (Level AA): 17:14:59 * label for a control or image (e.g. HTML label element, figcaption and aria-labelledby attributes) 17:15:01 * caption for a table 17:15:03 * row and column labels for a table cell 17:17:08 discussion of 'control' in forms vs form control vs form fields 17:18:31 gl: change wording or add the parenthetical back in 17:19:53 action: jeanne to add the (e.g. HTML label element, figcaption and aria-labelledby attributes) on 1.10.1 first bullet 17:19:53 Created ACTION-1025 - Add the (e.g. html label element, figcaption and aria-labelledby attributes) on 1.10.1 first bullet [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2014-09-04]. 17:20:48 close item 2 17:21:01 zakim, open item 3 17:21:01 agendum 3. "Action 1019 - definition of user interface" taken up [from allanj] 17:21:45 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/w3c-wai-ua/2014JulSep/0076.html 17:23:44 original: 17:23:46 user interface 17:23:48 For the purposes of UAAG 2.0, the user interface includes both: 17:23:57 • user agent user interface: The controls (e.g. menus, buttons, prompts, native audio/video player controls, and other components for input and output) and mechanisms (e.g. selection and focus) provided by the user agent that are not created on the basis of the author-supplied content. The user agent user interface may include extensions that become part of the user agent user interface... 17:23:58 ...(e.g. toolbars, additional menus). 17:24:06 • content user interface: The user interface that emerges from the user agent rendering of the author-supplied content. It includes all rendered content (e.g. text, headings, enabled elements, disabled elements, author-supplied audio/video controls). 17:24:24 Note: There may be a mix of recognized and unrecognized user interface controls depending on the author-supplied content. 17:24:25 This document distinguishes user agent user interface and content user interface only where required for clarity. 17:24:31 proposed: 17:24:44 user interface 17:24:45 The controls (e.g. menus, buttons, prompts, native audio/video player controls, and other components for input and output) and mechanisms (e.g. selection and focus) provided by the user agent that are not created on the basis of the author-supplied content. The user agent user interface may include extensions that become part of the user agent user interface (e.g. toolbars, additional menus). 17:26:40 user interface 17:26:41 The controls (e.g. menus, buttons, prompts, native audio/video player controls, and other components for input and output) and mechanisms (e.g. selection and focus) provided by the user agent that are not created on the basis of the author-supplied content. The user interface may include extensions that become part of the user agent user interface (e.g. toolbars, additional menus). 17:28:39 user interface 17:28:41 The controls (e.g. menus, buttons, prompts, native audio/video player controls, and other components for input and output) and mechanisms (e.g. selection and focus) provided by the user agent that are not created on the basis of the author-supplied content. The user interface may include extensions that become part of the user interface (e.g. toolbars, additional menus). 17:29:43 gl: 17:32:48 gl: should we put a note, that 'user interface' is used only for the user agent user interface and not anything created by the author. 17:33:37 -Jeanne 17:33:57 kford has joined #ua 17:34:20 +Jeanne 17:34:22 ... in content 17:34:40 +[Microsoft] 17:34:54 rrsagent, make minutes 17:34:54 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-minutes.html allanj 17:35:38 js: written by the author...an author could write a User Agent such as a media player 17:37:34 js: User Agent as noted in the conformance document....phrase it so if you are looking at this as a browser it applies to the browser, if a media player it refers to the media player 17:39:42 js: because user agents can be nested, the term user interface applies to the application seeking conformance 17:40:26 "Note: In this document the term user interface is reserved only for controls and mechanisms of the user agent that is being considered for conformance. It does not include controls and mechanisms created by content or other user agents. For example..." (stuff about nested and hosting UA) 17:40:42 kp: use definition for user agent user interface, and refer to it in the document as UA user interface 17:40:53 js: sounds good to me 17:41:27 gl: can we just create an acronym 17:41:32 js: sure 17:42:29 "considered for conformance" or "evaluated for conformance"? 17:43:31 ja: UI or UAUI? or UA user interface 17:44:15 js: keep existing User Agent User Interface and use UA user interface in the document 17:44:51 delete 'content user interface'? 17:45:13 -Jeanne 17:45:46 use the following: 17:45:49 user agent user interface: The controls (e.g. menus, buttons, prompts, native audio/video player controls, and other components for input and output) and mechanisms (e.g. selection and focus) provided by the user agent that are not created on the basis of the author-supplied content. The user agent user interface may include extensions that become part of the user agent user interface (e.g.... 17:45:51 ...toolbars, additional menus). 17:46:25 use the term UA user interface in the document to replace User Agent User Interface 17:47:36 delete: content user interface definition and its Note. 17:52:23 action: jeanne to revise definition user agent user interface 17:52:23 Created ACTION-1026 - Revise definition user agent user interface [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2014-09-04]. 17:52:57 action: jeanne to change user agent user interface to UA user interface in SC and GL to facilitate reading 17:52:58 Created ACTION-1027 - Change user agent user interface to ua user interface in sc and gl to facilitate reading [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2014-09-04]. 17:53:17 action: jeanne to delete definition of content user interface. 17:53:18 Created ACTION-1028 - Delete definition of content user interface. [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2014-09-04]. 17:54:25 action: jim to fleshout note for conformance of nested UA user interfaces 17:54:25 Created ACTION-1029 - Fleshout note for conformance of nested ua user interfaces [on Jim Allan - due 2014-09-04]. 17:54:49 close item 3 17:55:11 zakim, open item 4 17:55:11 agendum 4. "Action 1018 response to MS07" taken up [from allanj] 17:55:36 proposed: 17:56:23 UAWG put non-desktop examples throughout Implementing UAAG and published a separate Note of Mobile Accessibility Examples from Implementing UAAG. UAWG chose to put most of their non-desktop examples in Implementing UAAG (a W3C Note), so it could be kept up to date without undermining the stability of UAAG success criteria. In addition, UAAG contains broad definitions of keyboard and a note... 17:56:25 ...under Principle 2 on Modality independence which also includes references to Indie UI. The term "keyboard" is not limited to physical keyboards, or even the on-screen keyboards provided by the platform. In our document the term also includes physical keyboards that can be connected externally, third-party on-screen keyboards that can add modifiers and navigation keys, and software... 17:56:26 ...interfaces that can be used by assistive technology software. UAWG has updated Conformance and success criteria to improve the clarity that UAAG applies to mobile and many forms of input and navigation. 17:57:42 gl: change Implementing UAAG to UAAG20 Reference 17:59:34 Might change "In our document the term" to add a reference to the fact that the glossary makes this clear. 17:59:43 E.g. "In our document the glossary clarifies that the term..." 18:02:03 We could even go so far as to add a poke such as "If a platform cannot accommodate an on-screen keyboard or third-party software that provides navigation commands, that is a flaw which is likely to prevent compliance." 18:02:19 UAWG put non-desktop examples throughout UAAG20 Reference and published a separate Note of Mobile Accessibility Examples from Implementing UAAG. UAWG chose to put most of their non-desktop examples in Implementing UAAG (a W3C Note), so it could be kept up to date without undermining the stability of UAAG success criteria. In addition, UAAG contains broad definitions of keyboard and a note... 18:02:20 ...under Principle 2 on Modality independence which also includes references to Indie UI. In our document the glossary clarifies that the term "keyboard" is not limited to physical keyboards, or even the on-screen keyboards provided by the platform. In our document the term also includes physical keyboards that can be connected externally, third-party on-screen keyboards that can add... 18:02:22 ...modifiers and navigation keys, and software interfaces that can be used by assistive technology software. UAWG has updated Conformance and success criteria to improve the clarity that UAAG applies to mobile and many forms of input and navigation. 18:04:08 If a platform cannot accommodate an on-screen keyboard or third-party software that provides navigation commands, that is a flaw which is likely to prevent compliance. 18:07:19 If a platform cannot accommodate an on-screen keyboard or third-party software that provides navigation commands, this is a flaw that is likely to prevent compliance. 18:09:40 action: jeanne to add "UAWG put non-desktop examples throughout UAAG20 Reference and published a separate Note of Mobile Accessibility Examples from Implementing UAAG. UAWG chose to put most of their non-desktop examples in Implementing UAAG (a W3C Note), so it could be kept up to date without undermining the stability of UAAG success criteria. In addition, UAAG contains broad definitions of... 18:09:40 Created ACTION-1030 - Add "uawg put non-desktop examples throughout uaag20 reference and published a separate note of mobile accessibility examples from implementing uaag. uawg chose to put most of their non-desktop examples in implementing uaag (a w3c note), so it could be kept up to date without undermining the stability of uaag success criteria. in addition, uaag contains broad definitions of... [on Jeanne F Spellman 18:09:41 ... - due 2014-09-04]. 18:09:41 ...keyboard and a note under Principle 2 on Modality independence that also includes references to Indie UI. In our document the glossary clarifies that the term "keyboard" is not limited to physical keyboards, or even the on-screen keyboards provided by the platform. In our document the term also includes physical keyboards that can be connected externally, third-party on-screen keyboards... 18:09:43 ...that can add modifiers and navigation keys, and software interfaces that can be used by assistive technology software. UAWG has updated Conformance and success criteria to improve the clarity that UAAG applies to mobile and many forms of input and navigation. If a platform cannot accommodate an on-screen keyboard or third-party software that provides navigation commands, this is a flaw... 18:09:44 ...that is likely to prevent compliance." to the Disposition document for MS07 18:09:53 close item 4 18:10:14 close Action-1018 18:10:14 Closed Action-1018. 18:10:24 Close Action-1019 18:10:24 Closed Action-1019. 18:10:56 close item 5 18:11:04 rrsagent, make minutes 18:11:04 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-minutes.html allanj 18:11:56 Topic: 1.7.4 de-minification of CSS on save 18:12:53 proposed: While it is customary for authors to compress stylesheets and scripts to save load time, it would be highly beneficial if the user agent saved the stylesheets in a user understandable formatted manner to facilitate authoring by users. 18:15:10 "in a format that facilitates reading and editing by users (e.g. without stripping out line breaks)"? 18:17:23 While it is customary for authors to compress stylesheets and scripts to save load time, it would be highly beneficial if the user agent saved the stylesheets in a format that facilitates reading and editing by users (e.g. without stripping out line breaks) to facilitate authoring by users. 18:18:33 action: jeanne to add "While it is customary for authors to compress stylesheets and scripts to save load time, it would be highly beneficial if the user agent saved the stylesheets in a format that facilitates reading and editing by users (e.g. without stripping out line breaks)." to the Reference document for 1.7.4 18:18:34 Created ACTION-1031 - Add "while it is customary for authors to compress stylesheets and scripts to save load time, it would be highly beneficial if the user agent saved the stylesheets in a format that facilitates reading and editing by users (e.g. without stripping out line breaks)." to the reference document for 1.7.4 [on Jeanne F Spellman - due 2014-09-04]. 18:18:56 close Action-987 18:18:56 Closed Action-987. 18:21:05 RESOLUTION: Publish a draft of the guidelines document. 18:21:12 rrsagent, make minutes 18:21:12 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-minutes.html allanj 18:22:49 gl: wants a resolution to funding for F2F, as to who will actually attend. 18:22:58 rrsagent, make minutes 18:22:58 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-minutes.html allanj 18:23:15 -Jim_Allan 18:23:34 zakim, please part 18:23:34 leaving. As of this point the attendees were Jeanne, Jim_Allan, Kim_Patch, Greg_Lowney, [Microsoft] 18:23:34 Zakim has left #ua 18:24:07 rrsagent, make minutes 18:24:07 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-minutes.html allanj 18:24:30 rrsagent, please part 18:24:30 I see 7 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-actions.rdf : 18:24:30 ACTION: jeanne to add the (e.g. HTML label element, figcaption and aria-labelledby attributes) on 1.10.1 first bullet [1] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T17-19-53 18:24:30 ACTION: jeanne to revise definition user agent user interface [2] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T17-52-23 18:24:30 ACTION: jeanne to change user agent user interface to UA user interface in SC and GL to facilitate reading [3] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T17-52-57 18:24:30 ACTION: jeanne to delete definition of content user interface. [4] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T17-53-17 18:24:30 ACTION: jim to fleshout note for conformance of nested UA user interfaces [5] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T17-54-25 18:24:30 ACTION: jeanne to add "UAWG put non-desktop examples throughout UAAG20 Reference and published a separate Note of Mobile Accessibility Examples from Implementing UAAG. UAWG chose to put most of their non-desktop examples in Implementing UAAG (a W3C Note), so it could be kept up to date without undermining the stability of UAAG success criteria. In addition, UAAG contains broad definitions of... [6] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T18-09-40 18:24:30 ACTION: jeanne to add "While it is customary for authors to compress stylesheets and scripts to save load time, it would be highly beneficial if the user agent saved the stylesheets in a format that facilitates reading and editing by users (e.g. without stripping out line breaks)." to the Reference document for 1.7.4 [7] 18:24:30 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2014/08/28-ua-irc#T18-18-33