13:59:04 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #tt
13:59:04 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/07/17-tt-irc
13:59:06 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
13:59:06 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #tt
13:59:08 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be TTML
13:59:08 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute
13:59:09 <trackbot> Meeting: Timed Text Working Group Teleconference
13:59:09 <trackbot> Date: 17 July 2014
14:00:08 <Zakim> SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM has now started
14:00:15 <Zakim> +glenn
14:00:17 <Courtney> Courtney has joined #tt
14:00:32 <Zakim> +Thierry
14:00:34 <Zakim> +nigel
14:00:47 <atai> atai has joined #tt
14:01:04 <Zakim> + +1.408.771.aaaa
14:01:13 <Zakim> +pal
14:01:31 <pal> pal has joined #tt
14:01:31 <Zakim> +Andreas
14:01:49 <nigel> zakim, aaaa is Courtney
14:01:49 <Zakim> +Courtney; got it
14:02:07 <nigel> chair: nigel
14:02:55 <nigel> Regrets: plh
14:03:53 <nigel> scribeNick: nigel
14:05:19 <nigel> Present: glenn, Thierry, nigel, atai, Courtney, pal
14:06:39 <nigel> topic: Prioritise discussion for this meeting
14:07:08 <nigel> thierry: Can we put a deadline for the F2F?
14:07:18 <nigel> nigel: I've opened the questionnaire until 15th August.
14:07:51 <nigel> thierry: Can we encourage everyone to attend and/or complete the registration form?
14:08:06 <nigel> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/34314/TTWG_Geneva_F2F_Planning/
14:08:20 <nigel> topic: Geneva f2f
14:09:01 <nigel> Courtney: re the agenda, spending a long time on the code/tests for the transforms is really important so I'm glad it's on the agenda.
14:09:19 <nigel> ... I'm largely happy with the agenda as it stands.
14:09:43 <nigel> https://www.w3.org/wiki/TimedText/geneva2014
14:11:21 <nigel> atai: We want to propose a mapping from a restricted TTML subset to WebVTT
14:11:59 <nigel> glenn: One point of advice for that mapping: The best approach is to map TTML document to an ISD sequence, and then map the individual ISDs to VTT cues.
14:12:41 <nigel> ... my plan is to include in TTML2 a formal definition of an interchangeable form of a sequence of ISD documents. I'll probably define a format: either a single XML document where each child is an ISD document
14:13:04 <nigel> ... and maybe a second format that is a ZIPped sequence of ISDs with a specific naming format to sequence them in the ZIP file.
14:14:38 <nigel> nigel: That's an interesting point because there's an alternative which is to create a cue per piece of text with a distinct lifetime, by semantic analysis of the document. I can see merits to both.
14:14:49 <nigel> glenn: I may have some working code by the F2F to drive some discussion.
14:15:10 <nigel> topic: Action Items
14:15:32 <nigel> action-296?
14:15:32 <trackbot> action-296 -- Glenn Adams to Define default for @validationaction to be warn if @validation is optional; otherwise, default is abort -- due 2014-06-12 -- PENDINGREVIEW
14:15:32 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/296
14:16:30 <nigel> close action-296
14:16:30 <trackbot> Closed action-296.
14:16:35 <nigel> action-302
14:16:35 <trackbot> action-302 -- Nigel Megitt to Re-review issue-313 -- due 2014-06-26 -- PENDINGREVIEW
14:16:36 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/302
14:17:20 <nigel> issue-313?
14:17:20 <trackbot> issue-313 -- Presented Region section is informative only -- open
14:17:20 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/313
14:18:12 <nigel> close action-302
14:18:12 <trackbot> Closed action-302.
14:20:57 <nigel> issue-313: An acceptable proposal would be to change the wording in §4.6.1 specifically to define the term "Presented region".
14:20:57 <trackbot> Notes added to issue-313 Presented Region section is informative only.
14:21:22 <nigel> action-303?
14:21:22 <trackbot> action-303 -- Nigel Megitt to Add priority column to change proposal index -- due 2014-06-26 -- PENDINGREVIEW
14:21:22 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/303
14:21:59 <nigel> https://www.w3.org/wiki/TTML/ChangeProposalIndex
14:23:49 <nigel> nigel: I've added the priority column - please could the owners of each change proposal now review each and edit the index page to assign the appropriate priority value.
14:24:05 <nigel> ... We can use this to choose which issues and changes to tackle soonest.
14:24:21 <nigel> close action-303
14:24:21 <trackbot> Closed action-303.
14:25:32 <nigel> ACTION: glenn Assign priorities to change proposals owned by glenn
14:25:32 <trackbot> Created ACTION-304 - Assign priorities to change proposals owned by glenn [on Glenn Adams - due 2014-07-24].
14:25:46 <nigel> ACTION: pal Assign priorities to change proposals owned by pal
14:25:46 <trackbot> Created ACTION-305 - Assign priorities to change proposals owned by pal [on Pierre-Anthony Lemieux - due 2014-07-24].
14:25:58 <nigel> ACTION: jdsmith Assign priorities to change proposals owned by jdsmith
14:25:58 <trackbot> Created ACTION-306 - Assign priorities to change proposals owned by jdsmith [on Jerry Smith - due 2014-07-24].
14:26:08 <nigel> ACTION: mdolan Assign priorities to change proposals owned by mdolan
14:26:08 <trackbot> Created ACTION-307 - Assign priorities to change proposals owned by mdolan [on Mike Dolan - due 2014-07-24].
14:26:42 <nigel> action-207?
14:26:42 <trackbot> action-207 -- Glenn Adams to Add round-down clarification to "closest" language, see issue-259 -- due 2014-04-01 -- PENDINGREVIEW
14:26:42 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/207
14:27:45 <nigel> glenn: I've implemented this clarification.
14:29:05 <nigel> glenn: I've clarified the distinction between scalar and vector component comparisons for border and padding. There was also a comment about rounding up vs down.
14:29:34 <nigel> ... For extent and lineHeight we round up so I added a comment on extent that explains the rationale for this.
14:29:40 <nigel> nigel: Looks good to me.
14:30:52 <nigel> pal: I'll take a look.
14:31:06 <nigel> action-258?
14:31:06 <trackbot> action-258 -- Glenn Adams to Work with pal to resolve edits needed for issue-259 comments -- due 2014-04-01 -- PENDINGREVIEW
14:31:06 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/actions/258
14:31:42 <nigel> glenn: this is related to action-207.
14:31:44 <Zakim> -Thierry
14:33:02 <nigel> topic: Issues
14:33:12 <nigel> issue-263?
14:33:12 <trackbot> issue-263 -- profile feature set may not match intended feature constraints -- pending review
14:33:12 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/263
14:33:44 <Zakim> +Thierry
14:33:49 <nigel> glenn: I think we're looking for Mike's review of this.
14:34:18 <nigel> issue-316?
14:34:18 <trackbot> issue-316 -- Wording of 5.2 doesn't make sense -- pending review
14:34:18 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/316
14:35:24 <nigel> close issue-316
14:35:24 <trackbot> Closed issue-316.
14:36:16 <nigel> issue-309?
14:36:16 <trackbot> issue-309 -- Image profile needs to permit text equivalent -- open
14:36:16 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/309
14:38:18 <nigel> nigel: We met the accessibility folk on Monday. The feeling is that as long as there's availability of a text equivalent and a method to find it then the WCAG requirement is met.
14:38:36 <nigel> pal: Reviewing the changes I've made:
14:39:42 <nigel> https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/ttml/raw-file/tip/ttml-ww-profiles/ttml-ww-profiles.html
14:39:56 <nigel> ... in §3.1 the text is clarified to say that distributors should provide a text form of image data that the system can find automatically.
14:40:31 <nigel> ... in §4.5.4 there's an altText attribute to allow a text string to be added.
14:40:34 <nigel> q+
14:41:03 <nigel> ack nigel
14:41:21 <nigel> nigel: The normative text doesn't mention accessibility - shouldn't it?
14:42:05 <nigel> pal: The harm for IMSC to say MAY have accessibility is we don't want accessibility /only/ to be in the alt text because it's better to have a complete alternate text profile document.
14:42:49 <nigel> pal: Of course there's no prohibition on usage of altText but it's not at all a recommendation.
14:44:23 <nigel> glenn: defining the contents as #PCDATA is appropriate for an element that can contain text.
14:45:12 <nigel> atai: This section says "{any attribute not in the IMSC 1.0 Metadata namespace}" which would allow any attribute in TTML 1 namespace, which doesn't seem right.
14:45:40 <nigel> glenn: That's correct - the table near the top of TTML defines all the tt namespaces that should not be permitted here.
14:46:32 <nigel> pal: I'll change it to "any attribute not in the default namespace or in the TT namespace or in the IMSC 1.0 Metadata namespace"
14:46:54 <nigel> s/Metadata /
14:47:53 <nigel> pal: John Birch provided some text re WCAG so I've moved that to Annex C.
14:47:57 <nigel> q+
14:48:06 <nigel> ack nigel
14:49:39 <nigel> nigel: The term "application" has been used in various places normatively so I think it needs to be defined.
14:49:44 <nigel> pal: Or I could remove it.
14:49:52 <nigel> nigel: Either way - but application is used in several places now.
14:52:44 <nigel> nigel: I wonder if we should say "In order to meet the guidelines of [WCAG20] the following considerations apply:"
14:52:50 <nigel> pal: I like that.
14:53:18 <nigel> pal: I'll create an issue prior to committing those changes.
14:53:55 <nigel> pal: I've added in Annex D.5 the #altText extension designator is defined.
14:54:44 <nigel> nigel: I think the #altText extension needs to be added to §6.4.
14:54:46 <nigel> pal: I'll add that.
14:56:25 <nigel> glenn: I just added a new issue for IMSC - issue-326.
14:56:47 <nigel> issue-317?
14:56:47 <trackbot> issue-317 -- IMSC should not require frame alignment -- open
14:56:47 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/AudioVideo/TT/tracker/issues/317
14:57:21 <nigel> pal: I've added a note that hopefully captures the use case.
14:57:36 <nigel> ... in §4.4
15:01:16 <nigel> nigel: We're close on this one but I need to come back with some proposals for edits.
15:06:24 <nigel> nigel: adjourns meeting
15:06:49 <Zakim> -Andreas
15:07:49 <nigel> rrsagent, generate minutes
15:07:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/07/17-tt-minutes.html nigel
15:07:55 <Zakim> -Courtney
15:08:01 <Zakim> -glenn
15:08:04 <Zakim> -Thierry
15:08:06 <Zakim> -pal
15:08:10 <Zakim> -nigel
15:08:11 <Zakim> SYMM_TTWG()10:00AM has ended
15:08:11 <Zakim> Attendees were glenn, Thierry, nigel, +1.408.771.aaaa, pal, Andreas, Courtney
17:16:15 <Zakim> Zakim has left #tt