13:00:16 RRSAgent has joined #webtv 13:00:16 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-irc 13:00:24 zakim, this will be webtv 13:00:24 ok, kaz, I see UW_WebTVIG()9:00AM already started 13:00:27 zakim, mute me 13:00:27 bgidon should now be muted 13:00:30 zakim, call kazuyuki-617 13:00:30 ok, kaz; the call is being made 13:00:32 + +1.650.946.aabb 13:00:33 +[IPcaller] 13:00:34 gmandyam has joined #webtv 13:00:43 zakim, call kazuyuki-617 13:00:43 ok, kaz; the call is being made 13:00:44 +Kazuyuki 13:00:46 zakim, aabb is me 13:00:47 +Bin_Hu; got it 13:00:54 +gmandyam 13:01:04 zakim, who is here? 13:01:04 On the phone I see [GVoice], bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu (muted), [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, gmandyam 13:01:06 ddavis has joined #webtv 13:01:06 On IRC I see gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:01:11 +Karen_Myers 13:01:19 +Mark_Vickers 13:01:22 giuseppep has joined #webtv 13:01:23 zakim, who is here? 13:01:23 On the phone I see [GVoice], bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu (muted), [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers 13:01:26 On IRC I see giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:01:45 +[IPcaller.a] 13:01:53 wuwei has joined #webtv 13:02:03 zakim, IPcaller is me 13:02:03 +giuseppep; got it 13:02:14 karen has joined #webtv 13:02:15 zakim, IPcaller.a is skim13 13:02:16 +skim13; got it 13:02:21 zakim, who is here? 13:02:21 On the phone I see [GVoice], bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu, giuseppep, Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers, skim13 13:02:24 On IRC I see karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:02:27 +??P33 13:02:29 zakim, ??P33 is me 13:02:29 +ddavis; got it 13:02:51 -ddavis 13:02:52 +[IPcaller] 13:02:54 the call is now? 13:02:54 +EricP 13:03:01 forgot daylight saving :( 13:03:07 +Daniel_Wester 13:03:13 zakim, who is here? 13:03:13 On the phone I see [GVoice], bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu, giuseppep, Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers, skim13, [IPcaller], EricP, Daniel_Wester 13:03:16 On IRC I see karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:03:26 +Paul_Higgs 13:03:41 zakim, GVoice is elindstrom 13:03:41 +elindstrom; got it 13:03:46 paul_higgs has joined #webtv 13:03:46 + +1.818.370.aacc 13:03:56 yosuke has joined #webtv 13:04:06 zakim, IPcaller is phil 13:04:07 +phil; got it 13:04:12 +??P38 13:04:14 zakim, who is here? 13:04:15 On the phone I see elindstrom, bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu, giuseppep, Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers, skim13, phil, wuwei, Daniel_Wester, Paul_Higgs, 13:04:17 zakim, ??P38 is me 13:04:18 ... +1.818.370.aacc, ??P38 13:04:18 On IRC I see yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, 13:04:19 ... tobie__ 13:04:19 +pal 13:04:19 +ddavis; got it 13:04:22 +Bryan_Sullivan 13:04:24 CyrilRa has joined #webtv 13:04:26 zakim, who is here? 13:04:26 On the phone I see elindstrom, bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu, giuseppep, Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers, skim13, phil, wuwei, Daniel_Wester, Paul_Higgs, 13:04:29 ... +1.818.370.aacc, ddavis, pal, Bryan_Sullivan 13:04:29 On IRC I see CyrilRa, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, 13:04:29 ... trackbot, tobie__ 13:04:33 Scribe: Daniel 13:04:34 + +33.6.77.84.aadd 13:04:36 scribenick: ddavis 13:04:40 chair: giuseppep 13:04:44 zakim, where is +33? 13:04:44 country code 33 is France 13:04:45 pal has joined #webtv 13:04:50 + +81.80.594.3.aaee 13:05:04 zakim, where is +81? 13:05:04 country code 81 is Japan 13:05:05 the conference is full :( 13:05:11 zakim, who is noisy? 13:05:22 kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Kazuyuki (8%), phil (40%) 13:05:26 zakim, mute me 13:05:26 ddavis should now be muted 13:05:33 zakim, who is here? 13:05:33 On the phone I see elindstrom, bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu, giuseppep, Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers, skim13, phil, wuwei, Daniel_Wester, Paul_Higgs, 13:05:36 bryan has joined #webtv 13:05:37 ... +1.818.370.aacc, ddavis (muted), pal, Bryan_Sullivan, +33.6.77.84.aadd, +81.80.594.3.aaee 13:05:37 On IRC I see pal, CyrilRa, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, 13:05:37 ... MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:05:38 kaz, sorry i can't call, the conference is full :( 13:05:42 jcdufourd has joined #webtv 13:05:47 zakim, who is talking? 13:05:48 present+ Bryan_Sullivan 13:05:49 zakim, call me 13:05:49 Sorry, jcverdie; you need to be more specific about your location 13:05:57 pal, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: giuseppep (25%), phil (62%), wuwei (10%) 13:05:59 The conference is full. 13:06:09 present+ JeanClaude_Dufourd 13:06:26 present+ JC Verdie (on IRC, phone bridge is full) 13:06:52 we are looking into expanding the bridge... 13:07:44 zakim, who is here 13:07:44 jcdufourd, you need to end that query with '?' 13:07:49 zakim, who is here ? 13:07:49 On the phone I see elindstrom, bgidon (muted), +325045aaaa, Bin_Hu, giuseppep, Kazuyuki, gmandyam, Karen_Myers, Mark_Vickers, skim13, phil, wuwei, Daniel_Wester, Paul_Higgs, 13:07:51 zakim, room for 30 13:07:53 ... +1.818.370.aacc, ddavis (muted), pal, Bryan_Sullivan, +33.6.77.84.aadd, +81.80.594.3.aaee 13:07:53 On IRC I see jcdufourd, bryan, pal, CyrilRa, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, 13:07:53 zakim, room for 30? 13:07:54 ... schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:07:54 I don't understand 'room for 30', kaz 13:07:57 ok, kaz; conference Team_(webtv)13:07Z scheduled with code 26633 (CONF3) for 60 minutes until 1407Z; however, please note that capacity is now overbooked 13:08:30 -Paul_Higgs 13:08:31 kawada has joined #webtv 13:08:35 -pal 13:08:36 -Mark_Vickers 13:08:45 -bgidon 13:08:51 present+ Yosuke Funahashi 13:08:53 - +33.6.77.84.aadd 13:08:57 -Bryan_Sullivan 13:09:02 -gmandyam 13:09:04 -elindstrom 13:09:04 -Karen_Myers 13:09:05 drop and call back with 26633 13:09:06 - +1.818.370.aacc 13:09:07 -Kazuyuki 13:09:07 -Daniel_Wester 13:09:08 -wuwei 13:09:09 -skim13 13:09:10 -Bin_Hu 13:09:11 - +325045aaaa 13:09:13 -giuseppep 13:09:14 -phil 13:09:19 zakim, this will be team_(webtv) 13:09:19 ok, kaz, I see Team_(webtv)13:07Z already started 13:09:22 All: Please dial in again using code 26633 (CONF3). 13:09:22 +bgidon 13:09:26 zakim, call kazuyuki-617 13:09:26 ok, kaz; the call is being made 13:09:27 +Daniel_Wester 13:09:31 +[GVoice] 13:09:33 + +33.6.77.84.aaaa 13:09:36 +Bryan_Sullivan 13:09:37 +pal 13:09:41 +Bin_Hu 13:09:41 +gmandyam 13:09:44 zakim, call kazuyuki-617 13:09:44 ok, kaz; the call is being made 13:09:45 +Kazuyuki 13:09:46 +Jean-Charles 13:09:46 +[IPcaller] 13:09:48 +EricP 13:09:49 +[IPcaller.a] 13:09:50 +Karen_Myers 13:09:57 zakim, mute me 13:09:57 bgidon should now be muted 13:09:59 Andy_Hickman_DTVL has joined #webtv 13:10:02 zakim, mute me 13:10:02 sorry, jcverdie, I do not know which phone connection belongs to you 13:10:02 zkaim, who is here? 13:10:04 zakim, +33.6.77.84.aaaa is JeanClaude_Dufourd 13:10:04 +JeanClaude_Dufourd; got it 13:10:21 +??P41 13:10:23 zakim, ??P41 is me 13:10:23 +ddavis; got it 13:10:27 Zakim, Jean-Charles is me 13:10:27 +jcverdie; got it 13:10:27 zakim, mute me 13:10:28 ddavis should now be muted 13:10:32 zakim, mute me 13:10:32 jcverdie should now be muted 13:10:37 zakim, who is here? 13:10:37 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:10:41 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, EricP, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted) 13:10:41 On IRC I see Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, CyrilRa, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, 13:10:41 ... elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:10:43 jon has joined #webtv 13:10:43 +[IPcaller.aa] 13:10:53 +[IPcaller.aaa] 13:10:53 Meeting: Web & TV IG meeting - TV workshop follow-up 13:10:54 w3c has joined #webtv 13:11:17 + +81.80.594.3.aabb 13:11:25 [ please access http://irc.w3.org and use #webtv as the IRC channel ] 13:11:28 + +325045aacc 13:11:50 Reminder: The call code has changed - please us 26633 (CONF3), NOT 932881 (WEBTV1) 13:11:53 wwu has joined #webtv 13:12:20 Reminder: The call code has changed - please us 26633 (CONF3), NOT 932881 (WEBTV1) 13:12:34 wwu has joined #webtv 13:13:00 zakim, who is here? 13:13:00 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:13:03 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, EricP, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], +81.80.594.3.aabb, +325045aacc 13:13:03 On IRC I see wwu, w3c, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, CyrilRa, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, wuwei, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, 13:13:03 ... Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:13:28 Admin__ has joined #webtv 13:13:42 https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1nQGA_g6Zp1mbO75LFVEzzHDOwxDjTjiFRas4KoF1i7M/edit#slide=id.p28 13:13:58 CyrilRa has joined #webtv 13:14:32 Missed the link to presentation. Can you repost 13:14:39 https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1nQGA_g6Zp1mbO75LFVEzzHDOwxDjTjiFRas4KoF1i7M/edit#slide=id.p28 13:15:08 Yes 13:15:19 topic: workshop next steps 13:15:52 https://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Agenda_and_Minutes/Agenda_Telco_16th_April_2014 13:16:00 + +1.818.370.aadd 13:16:36 zakim, who is ehre? 13:16:36 I don't understand your question, kaz. 13:16:39 zakim, 81.80.594.3.aabb is me 13:16:39 sorry, kawada, I do not recognize a party named '81.80.594.3.aabb' 13:16:44 zakim, who is here? 13:16:44 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:16:47 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, EricP, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], +81.80.594.3.aabb, +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd 13:16:47 On IRC I see CyrilRa, Admin__, wwu, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, 13:16:47 ... bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:17:01 giuseppep: The workshop was held in Munich a few weeks ago 13:17:23 giuseppep: The slides for the next steps are here: https://docs.google.com/presentation/d/1nQGA_g6Zp1mbO75LFVEzzHDOwxDjTjiFRas4KoF1i7M/edit#slide=id.p28 13:17:46 wuwei has joined #webtv 13:17:49 giuseppep: Firstly, there was a presentation on a new initiative called GGIE by Glenn. 13:17:57 zakim, +81.80.594.3.aabb is me 13:17:57 +kawada; got it 13:18:01 Scribenick: Daniel Davis 13:18:16 giuseppep: There was a discussion on use cases and requirements which we also do at W3C. 13:18:18 zakim, mute me 13:18:19 bgidon was already muted, bgidon 13:18:20 rrsagent, make log public 13:18:24 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:18:24 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 13:18:38 +??P54 13:18:47 giuseppep: I don't we have much next to do with regards to GGIE. 13:19:16 Glenn: The group is meeting in a couple of weeks to discuss the charter and then we can come back to W3C to see if there's any overlap. 13:19:17 + +41.22.717.aaee 13:19:24 @@@: Is GGIE a W3C activity? 13:19:44 Glenn: No, it supports other standards bodies including W3C, IETF, etc. 13:19:56 Glenn: We're not sure yet where are "home" would be. 13:20:18 giuseppep: The slides are linked from the workshop agenda: http://www.w3.org/2013/10/tv-workshop/agenda.html 13:20:38 -> http://www.w3.org/2013/10/tv-workshop/slides/Session8_GGIE-W3C-web&tv-March-2014.pptx GGIE slides 13:20:58 giuseppep: Next is synchronization of media and metadata. 13:21:21 zakim, who is here? 13:21:21 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:21:23 giuseppep: Many of these things are spread across existing specs 13:21:24 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, EricP, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], kawada, +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, +41.22.717.aaee 13:21:24 On IRC I see wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, 13:21:24 ... kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:22:23 giuseppep: There isn't any significant activity we can do, but the IG mailing list can be used to raise awareness of issues that could be reported as bugs. 13:22:37 giuseppep: Do people agree? 13:22:44 +1 13:22:55 Jean-pierre: I don't remember having such a deep discussion about metadata. 13:23:14 giuseppep: This is more about integration of existing specs and HTML5 spec. 13:23:36 giuseppep: Do you remember something different? 13:23:51 giuseppep: I'll mail a link to the slides I'm sharing. 13:24:44 N.b. GGIE is "The Glass to Glass Internet Ecosystem" 13:26:25 giuseppep: If we agree on the conclusion, I'm moving to slide #4 - testing. 13:26:56 giuseppep: Note that the slides are not automatic - you have to click on each slide. 13:27:14 giuseppep: There was a discussion about testing which is very important. 13:27:23 giuseppep: There was a request to understand more about what W3C is doing. 13:27:33 giuseppep: There's a need for more test cases. 13:27:42 giuseppep: Also, a discussion about what testing actually means. 13:27:50 giuseppep: Different people may have different goals. 13:28:09 giuseppep: If resources/tests are out there, do they match testing requirements? 13:28:35 giuseppep: What possibility is to use the IG or some other group to get a better idea of what's out there 13:28:47 giuseppep: And maybe have a Test The Web Forward event for TV. 13:29:14 giuseppep: The conclusion was the IG could facilitate a conversation. 13:29:24 giuseppep: There is already a working group and interest group. 13:29:31 giuseppep: Any comments so far? 13:29:33 q+ 13:29:56 ack b 13:29:56 @@@: We used to have a Testing Task Force within this IG. It produced analysis of what is needed for TV testing. 13:30:03 s/@@@/bryan/ 13:30:06 @@@: A lot of effort was put in - where did it go? 13:30:09 s/@@@/bryan/ 13:30:15 kaz that was not me 13:30:54 q+ bryan 13:30:54 giuseppep: Since the activity of developing steps actually got stopped, there was no progress. 13:31:16 MarkVickers: There was a lot of effort around testing. There was a set of requirements that we published. 13:31:19 s/bryan:/@@@:/ 13:31:20 s/bryan:/@@@:/ 13:31:45 MarkVickers: What it said was we need a centralised placed for tests and have them run in a consistent way. 13:31:58 MarkVickers: Some of that work has been done. We have centralised tests. 13:32:18 I asked the question 13:32:18 MarkVickers: The big challenge was getting better coverage of tests and for that, W3C built a detailed test plan. 13:32:35 s/@@@:/paul:/g 13:32:42 MarkVickers: This required possibly more staff, definitely more funding but W3C didn't receive any money. 13:33:18 MarkVickers: There is still effort going on and contributions by browser vendors. There is a backlog of tests and a requirement for test reviews. 13:33:39 MarkVickers: So there's the opportunity for people to contribute tests and reviews, or funding for testing. 13:33:52 MarkVickers: The depth of coverage is going to take a lot longer to improve. 13:34:00 can we follow the queue? 13:34:06 paul_higgs: Which group should we take ideas to? 13:34:41 igarashi has joined #webtv 13:34:53 zakim, who is here? 13:34:53 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:34:57 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, wuwei, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], kawada, +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, +41.22.717.aaee 13:34:58 On IRC I see igarashi, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, 13:34:58 ... bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:35:00 MarkVickers: I would contact the people within each working group 13:35:22 bryan: I gave an overview of the testing effort at the workshop. 13:35:38 bryan: The testing IG is not going to do anything for you, and probably not the WGs either. 13:35:59 bryan: This TV IG needs to focus much more specifically about what's needed for certain test cases. 13:36:14 bryan: Just saying fill the gaps is not enough to make headway. 13:36:29 bryan: This TV IG needs someone to focus the work and contribute resources to do that. 13:36:38 +??P9 13:36:54 bryan: I suggest you take a look at your existing HTML5 STB - map the features to web technologies, e.g. CSS opacity, etc. 13:37:11 bryan: Define which features are used and decide which tests are needed. 13:37:21 zakim, who is here? 13:37:21 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:37:24 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, wuwei, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], kawada, +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, +41.22.717.aaee, ??P9 13:37:24 On IRC I see igarashi, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, 13:37:26 ... bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:37:30 darobin has joined #webtv 13:37:34 giuseppep: What's missing is where the tests are and tools are? 13:37:54 bryan: The community has to serve itself. I said we should do this on the wiki. 13:38:06 bryan: We should detail how to do this for ourselves. 13:38:28 bryan: We have to jump in - the people who know how to run tests have to lead the others. No-one else will do it for you. 13:38:42 paul_higgs: We need to be in charge of our own destiny. 13:38:53 paul_higgs: We should collect the tests for the TV environment. 13:39:18 MarkVickers: I strongly disagree with this. The old testing group was closed down but there is a new one and a structure for submitting tests. 13:39:18 what is the active group, mark? 13:39:28 +??P11 13:39:32 MarkVickers: If you want to submit tests, there is a process and existing group to do that. 13:39:43 MarkVickers: I don't think we should collect our own group of tests. 13:39:54 MarkVickers: There's a good test plan and what's missing is people to do the tests. 13:40:03 paul_higgs: I think we agree but we're saying it differently. 13:40:11 zakim, who is here? 13:40:11 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:40:14 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, wuwei, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], kawada, +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, +41.22.717.aaee, ??P9, ??P11 13:40:14 On IRC I see darobin, igarashi, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, kawada, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, 13:40:14 ... RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:40:18 bryan: There's no W3C group any more, it's hidden behind GitHub. 13:40:29 bryan: Right now there is no focussed effort. 13:40:45 bryan: Somebody has to coordinate and organise the effort. 13:41:18 giuseppep: People want to contribute test cases but they want to know where they go. And they want to know what tools are there. 13:41:43 giuseppep: The requirement is there. 13:41:58 giuseppep: There is a need for someone to drive this. 13:42:08 giuseppep: As it stands it's a bit confusing. 13:42:14 giuseppep: How to move forward on this? 13:42:41 giuseppep: Maybe Clarke would be willing? 13:42:54 MarkVickers: Are you talking about getting a task force going again? 13:43:06 giuseppep: If everyone works on their own things could fall apart. 13:43:10 the only mechanism of communicating with the "group" is the test-infra mailing list, and following the discussions on github (pull requests, bugs etc) 13:43:17 giuseppep: I.e. if we just provide people links. 13:43:25 bryan: I agree we should start with links. 13:43:49 bryan: We have to identify what tests are there. 13:43:56 bryan: Right now there is no guidance. 13:44:14 giuseppep: Please could one of you send an email to the list summarising these points? 13:44:22 giuseppep: Maybe in the next call we could cover this. 13:44:32 bryan: I said we could do something to help fill this gap. 13:44:38 zakim, code? 13:44:38 the conference code is 26633 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), kaz 13:44:46 bryan: Help to explain how to get engaged and what to focus on. 13:45:00 may I suggest you email public-test-infra with questions, comments, and grievances? 13:45:16 giuseppep: In two weeks time we'll review it. 13:45:54 @@@: There's a view that if you've got a lot of money and engineers, all the problems would be solved. 13:45:58 kawada_ has joined #webtv 13:45:58 public-test-infra is there to help and is very helpful (also #testing) 13:46:05 @@@: But I don't believe that's the case. 13:46:15 zakim, who is speaking? 13:46:26 kaz, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: +41.22.717.aaee (9%), ??P9 (4%) 13:46:30 I strongly suggest that any work on testing in WebTV be coordinated there, it will avoid confusion, duplication, mistakes, etc. 13:46:36 @@@: I don't think you'd end up with something that HbbTV or IPTV Forum Japan could use. There's no way to handle test IDs, test waivers and certification. 13:46:50 @@@: Some of the basic infrastructure is not there and I can't see it happening. 13:47:05 robin, people don't know about those tools of communication - we can start by letting them know. but what this group needs most is to decide what features are important and to put resources onto those tests, reviewing, developing, whatever 13:47:06 MarkVickers: In the DLNA we've referenced W3C tests for some time. 13:47:32 MarkVickers: It's not a testing organisation so you're not going to get full infrastructure such as waivers. The referencing groups should do that. 13:47:34 bryan: I think you'd be more successful deciding what to do by interacting with public-test-infra right away 13:47:50 giuseppep: no, but if it's really useful I can kill this other thing I'm doing in parallel 13:47:53 robin, I will do that 13:47:56 MarkVickers: W3C is a place where the tests should be reviewed and seen to be technically correct, and hold a repository of the tests. 13:48:25 @@@: I agree with that, but what I would hope is that the infrastructure has some support in other organisations. 13:48:27 zakim, who is speaking? 13:48:36 @@@: E.g. they need unique IDs and version numbers. 13:48:37 kaz, listening for 10 seconds I could not identify any sounds 13:48:47 The speaker is Andy Hickman from DTVL. 13:48:58 +[IPcaller.aaaa] 13:48:59 bryan: HbbTV has an exacting requirement for tests. 13:49:06 Zakim, [IPcaller.aaaa] is me 13:49:06 +darobin; got it 13:49:10 bryan: That level of mapping, etc. does not exist in W3C. 13:49:16 s/@@@:/andy:/ 13:49:18 s/@@@:/andy:/g 13:49:23 bryan: That needs to exist to make it happen. 13:49:25 +??P56 13:49:30 zakim, who is here? 13:49:30 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:49:33 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, wuwei, [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], kawada, +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, +41.22.717.aaee, ??P9, 13:49:34 ... ??P11, darobin, ??P56 13:49:34 On IRC I see kawada, darobin, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, 13:49:38 ... bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:49:42 @@@: It's hard for third parties to reference in a robust way. 13:50:09 s/@@@:/andy:/ 13:50:40 giuseppep: So it's not an issue of contribution but of how they are maintained. 13:50:40 the problem is that W3C tests has been developed in an adhoc way with little specific guidelines or consistency on metadata, linking to spec/test assertions, etc. that is one of the key gaps for utility in certification programs. this was a comment I made at the workshop. 13:50:58 giuseppep: (scribe missed that) 13:51:26 bryan: that is not true, they are largely consistent — metadata is simply considered to be of lesser importance, and something that can easily be provided externally 13:51:33 it was also one of the goals for the Web Testing IG that have so far not been realized - how to change the process of test documentation and development to obtain more rigor. 13:51:33 giuseppep: Next step - you (Bryan? Robin?) will send out information then I'll try to summarise the issues that have been raised. 13:51:41 q+ 13:51:48 q- 13:51:48 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:51:48 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 13:51:54 igarashi has joined #webtv 13:52:02 andy: Do you know what the next step is? 13:52:25 -kawada 13:52:26 giuseppep: My understanding was that if there was no clear direction then it's not worth taking this to the testing group. 13:52:35 i/workshop was held/scribenick: ddavis/ 13:52:37 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:52:37 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 13:52:42 zakim, ??P11 is me 13:52:42 +kawada; got it 13:52:49 robin, OK I agree that if metadata needs to be provided externally, that is a solution if the underlying tests are structured in at least a stable, granular way. This group can provide that "external" augmentation. That's the "focus" I am talking about. 13:53:01 giuseppep: My proposal would be to not rush anything until we see that there are good tools out there that could be used. 13:53:04 q+ 13:53:10 bryan, that's certainly something we can handle 13:53:26 zakim, unmute me 13:53:27 ddavis should no longer be muted 13:53:28 q? 13:53:40 zakim, mute me 13:53:40 ddavis should now be muted 13:53:50 i/There was a discussion on/scribenick: ddavis/ 13:53:52 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:53:52 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 13:54:08 q? 13:54:13 ack darobin 13:54:14 darobin: Robin here. I work for W3C managing publication of HTML spec and help with testing effort. 13:54:35 darobin: It would be useful if any discussion of testing could be coordinated with public-test-infra mailing list. 13:54:47 darobin: There's been a lot of hearsay and misunderstanding. 13:55:03 darobin: The testing list is friendly and helpful. 13:55:17 public-test-infra@w3.org 13:55:19 darobin: Things are moving fast in terms of resources and documentation. 13:55:30 internally, we are starting here... how to build test runner scripts based upon the existing tests in the repository, that execute the tests we are more interested in - that's one of the basic metadata items - what set of tests do you want to run. Then when we have found gaps, reviewing/developing the tests for them. 13:55:42 darobin: Don't hesitate to ask someone from the testing group to join in your discussion. 13:55:57 -> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-test-infra/ testing infra email archive 13:56:08 s/resources/infrastructure, resources,/ 13:56:15 giuseppep: When you send that mail, Bryan, please include the testing mailing list. 13:56:31 rrsagent, draft minutes 13:56:31 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 13:56:33 bryan: Will do. Sorry if it seems I don't appreciate the effort - I do but I think it's better if we work as a test. 13:56:35 ack ddavis 13:56:36 I encourage anyone to take any questions to public-test-infra@w3.org 13:56:40 zakim, mute me 13:56:40 ddavis should now be muted 13:56:46 zakim, who is here? 13:56:47 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, bgidon (muted), Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), 13:56:49 ... [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, wuwei (muted), [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, +41.22.717.aaee, ??P9, 13:56:49 ... kawada, darobin, ??P56 13:56:49 On IRC I see igarashi, kawada, darobin, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, 13:56:52 +1 to working as a team, hence the suggestion to discuss with the testing team :) 13:56:54 ... RRSAgent, Zakim, bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 13:56:54 - +41.22.717.aaee 13:57:15 giuseppep: Next is rendering of linear video, aka Tuner API 13:57:28 giuseppep: We discussed this previously with Bin leading the discussion 13:57:34 kawada_ has joined #webtv 13:57:36 -darobin 13:57:51 Bin_Hu: We discussed the need to take action quickly if we want a Community Group 13:57:51 kawada has left #webtv 13:58:14 Bin_Hu: There are lots of people interested - strong interest in driving this forward. 13:58:16 -bgidon 13:58:48 Bin_Hu: We need five supporters. Last week we had a role call and got more than five supporters. 13:59:04 Bin_Hu: As a result, this will be moving forward but still no volunteer to drive the effort. 13:59:26 Bin_Hu: As a next step I'm thinking maybe we can help start off the work and see how the group proceeds. 13:59:58 Bin_Hu: There are other groups that have similar technologies so we can see how those specifications can contribute to our efforts. 14:00:14 giuseppep: So we're still missing someone to lead the group. 14:00:22 ack me 14:00:25 darobin has left #webtv 14:00:41 Bin_Hu: We have jcverdie happy to co-chair 14:00:44 zakim, mute me 14:00:44 jcverdie should now be muted 14:00:52 jcverdie: I'd be happy to do it with Bin. 14:00:55 Bin_Hu: OK. 14:00:59 jcverdie: Great. 14:01:08 + +44.178.442.aaff 14:01:15 giuseppep: So the people who expressed an interest can propose the group. 14:01:36 zakim, who is here/ 14:01:36 I don't understand 'who is here/', kaz 14:01:39 zakim, who is here? 14:01:39 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, 14:01:43 ... wuwei (muted), [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, ??P9, kawada, ??P56, +44.178.442.aaff 14:01:44 giuseppep: We have provided a lot of use cases in the past year so it's a case of deciding which one to use for the group, based on existing specs and requirements. 14:01:44 On IRC I see kawada_, igarashi, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, 14:01:44 ... bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 14:02:01 giuseppep: So the Community Group will be independent of the IG and also open to anyone, not just W3C members. 14:02:26 giuseppep: Once it's created let's announce it on the IG and maybe the CG chairs could report to the IG every month, for example. 14:02:29 -> http://www.w3.org/community/ Community Groups page 14:02:42 Bin_Hu: I think that's important because of the heritage of the IG. 14:02:45 s/IG/CG/ 14:02:57 giuseppep: Any other comments? 14:03:10 +1 to reporting progress to IG obviously 14:03:20 +[IPcaller.aaaa] 14:03:27 giuseppep: Next is slide #6 - mostly regarding bugs around video element. 14:03:32 zakim, who is here? 14:03:33 On the phone I see Mark_Vickers, Paul_Higgs, Daniel_Wester (muted), [GVoice], JeanClaude_Dufourd, Bryan_Sullivan, pal, Bin_Hu, gmandyam, jcverdie (muted), [IPcaller], Kazuyuki, 14:03:33 ... wuwei (muted), [IPcaller.a], Karen_Myers, ddavis (muted), [IPcaller.aa], [IPcaller.aaa], +325045aacc, +1.818.370.aadd, ??P54, ??P9, kawada, ??P56, +44.178.442.aaff, 14:03:33 ... [IPcaller.aaaa] 14:03:37 On IRC I see kawada_, igarashi, wuwei, CyrilRa, MarkVickers, jon, Andy_Hickman_DTVL, jcdufourd, bryan, pal, yosuke, paul_higgs, karen, giuseppep, ddavis, gmandyam, RRSAgent, Zakim, 14:03:37 ... bgidon, kaz, Bin_Hu, elindstrom, skim13, jcverdie, schuki, timeless_, MarkS, trackbot, tobie__ 14:03:57 simon has joined #webtv 14:04:03 pal_ has joined #webtv 14:04:09 giuseppep: The IG should maybe get some feedback, maybe comment on the bugs. 14:04:21 giuseppep: Do people feel our involvement would be useful? 14:04:33 giuseppep: At present we don't have task forces, just one IG call every two weeks. 14:04:40 -[IPcaller.aaaa] 14:04:57 giuseppep: The agenda for each call is open so if there's a specific spec that could benefit from being presented to the group, that's fine. 14:05:34 MarkVickers: I like a single call and having the content decided as needed. 14:05:56 paul_higgs: I think I heard you say we could discuss the bugs on the call. But how should SDOs report bugs? 14:06:15 giuseppep: Bugs should be reported to the e.g. HTML WG 14:06:32 +[IPcaller.aaaa] 14:06:40 s/the e.g./the WGs, e.g., 14:07:03 giuseppep: If there's a problem with a spec, report it to the spec on Bugzilla - https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/ 14:07:14 giuseppep: If there's a problem then raise it with this IG. 14:07:19 giuseppep: Slide #7 14:07:22 -[IPcaller.aaaa] 14:07:28 geunhyug has joined #webtv 14:07:32 giuseppep: Communication between two UAs 14:07:46 giuseppep: We discussed whether there's anything more the IG can be doing. 14:07:59 giuseppep: The answer was no, because there are already groups doing this work. 14:08:37 giuseppep: See slide #7, and if you're not sure how to join in, ask the list. 14:09:08 giuseppep: Next is #8 - performance measurement. 14:09:27 giuseppep: There was a discussion about what's needed and what W3C can do. 14:09:42 giuseppep: Is now a time to go to the web performance WG with requirements? 14:09:52 giuseppep: If so, there's a need for people to drive this discussion. 14:10:06 giuseppep: Is there anyone on the call that feels this is important enough to drive forward? 14:10:20 giuseppep: Is this related to the testing activity or outside that scope? 14:11:03 bryan: Performance measurement and benchmarks is always a tricky area. So far it's outside W3C's area. 14:11:14 bryan: Functional tests are the main focus. 14:11:23 MarkVickers: There's a performance WG, right? 14:11:34 giuseppep: Yes, but they focus on performance specs. 14:11:46 giuseppep: If someone wants to discuss this, we're open. 14:12:07 Web Performance Working Group: http://www.w3.org/2010/webperf/ 14:12:14 bryan: If it's just discussing common ideas, that's OK, but don't build your hopes up with benchmarks. 14:12:29 giuseppep: I think you need APIs for browsers to measure performance. 14:12:38 bryan: That's worthwhile talking about here. 14:13:08 giuseppep: Let's see if there's enough interest to continue the discussion. 14:13:30 yosuke: What we've learned (from HybridCast) is performance is still really important for actual production. 14:13:34 I think experience with the video API will help identify that performance data gaps exist - testing may also uncover gaps in what people were expecting the API to provide, and that can drive bugs. 14:13:45 yosuke: If no-one's willing to kick off the discussion, I'd be happy to. 14:14:05 giuseppep: It would be helpful to send a mail to the list and if there's interest it can be followed up in the next call. 14:14:23 giuseppep: If you can compile a list, e.g. of HybridCast issues, that would help start the discussion. 14:15:00 giuseppep: Slide #9 - there was a discussion about accessibility. 14:15:31 giuseppep: There's more than just subtitles and captioning. We didn't really go into details, just continue in the IG if there's enough contributors. 14:15:37 s/there's/there are 14:15:58 giuseppep: If you're interested, send a mail to the list and we can discuss it on the call. 14:16:20 Pierre: I saw a number of issues filed by Jon Piesing for HTML, e.g. caption/subtitle selection. 14:16:28 Pierre: Have they been addressed or resolved? 14:16:36 Jon: They are being addressed, slowly. 14:16:44 Pierre: Do you feel there's more that could be done? 14:17:04 Jon: It feels like it's purely a discussion between Silvia Pfeiffer and myself. 14:17:15 Jon: It's hard to know what other people think of the discussion. 14:17:32 Jon: You can assume that silence is consent, but the lack of people makes me nervous. 14:17:48 Pierre: Do you have a record of all the issues that are relevant to this group? 14:18:05 Jon: I can send something to Giuseppe who can forward to the list. There'll be more to come. 14:18:14 Pierre: Feel free to send it directly to me as well. 14:18:24 I believe anyone can send to the public list. 14:18:37 right 14:18:42 giuseppep: It's OK to send a mail to the group asking for other people to comment. 14:18:58 Pierre: Jon, I'm looking forward to that and helping if I can. 14:19:28 MarkVickers: It is a pattern for these things that one of the editors will lead the discussion. In this case it's Silvia as she's an HTML editor. 14:19:54 MarkVickers: The bugs you reported were well written. I agree it's not a fast process but when it gets done it gets adopted by all the browsers. 14:20:11 Pierre: Now that HTML is taking over video content, that video content comes from places outside the browser. 14:20:25 Pierre: I'm sure many of us in the TV industry have experience we can contribute. 14:21:11 MarkVickers: I agree. The HTML spec a few years ago was very basic for video and this IG has contributed a lot. Also, individuals from this group have gone on to work on specs directly. 14:21:33 MarkVickers: Web browser experts are not necessarily media experts so they need us to chime in on these issues. Our role will continue to be important. 14:22:14 giuseppep: Slide #10 - Pluggable CDM for EME 14:22:29 giuseppep: Jan is not on the call. I didn't feel there was anything that could be done within the IG. 14:22:43 giuseppep: It's something that could be mentioned in the HTML WG Media Task Force. 14:23:10 MarkVickers: In general, the W3C specs just cover the interface between the application and the browser. 14:23:38 MarkVickers: The W3C takes the position that specs don't touch the plugin or anything above the browser interface. 14:24:18 MarkVickers: The W3C in this area hasn't taken on any work defining CDMs or plugins. 14:24:19 sorry, gotta drop - late for WebMob 14:24:27 -Bryan_Sullivan 14:24:47 MarkVickers: The question of whether there's a plugin API that would work cross-browser is still an open issues. 14:25:15 MarkVickers: You could raise it in the HTML WG Media TF and see the response. 14:25:41 - +1.818.370.aadd 14:26:02 giuseppep: So if Jan and the people who raised the issue are not here I'll leave it but they can raise it in the IG if they want to. 14:26:04 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:26:04 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 14:26:18 giuseppep: That's all I have for the workshop next steps. Anything I forgot? 14:26:53 kaz: Maybe Daniel or I should talk with Mark Sadecki about his participation in the IG? 14:26:56 giuseppep: OK. 14:27:14 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2014Apr/0025.html 14:27:34 Topic: Request from DAP WG 14:27:48 giuseppep: They want feedback on the Network Service Discovery API 14:27:56 s/about his participation in the IG/about the possible collaboration (maybe including his direct participation in the IG)/ 14:27:59 -[IPcaller.aaa] 14:28:14 giuseppep: They want to know if the spec covers our use cases 14:28:25 giuseppep: If people are interesting in implementing it and can share plans. 14:28:57 giuseppep: And if there are additional requirements, such as if there's no support for legacy devices will they still implement it/not implement it? 14:29:22 giuseppep: As an IG we can't answer this but we can send a mail to get responses. 14:29:49 giuseppep: So I'll follow up and draft an email, sending it to our liaison contacts. 14:30:19 Bin_Hu: Based on the email that they sent to everybody, looks like if there are no further implementations then their work will be shelved. 14:30:32 -gmandyam 14:30:35 Bin_Hu: It's a good time to speak up if you're interested in it or in implementing it. 14:30:41 i|They want feedback|-> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2014Apr/0025.html DAP Request| 14:30:44 rrsagent, draft minutes 14:30:44 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html kaz 14:31:01 paul_higgs: What do you mean by implementing it? 14:31:35 paul_higgs: TV manufacturers are interested in it but it's implemented in the browser, so it's up to browser vendors. 14:31:44 giuseppep: It's not limited to the browser vendors. 14:31:56 giuseppep: Forks of WebKit would still count as implementations. 14:32:34 Also, it's up to TV manufacturers to request requirements as customers of browser vendors. 14:33:00 Topic: Update from the Media API TF 14:33:18 giuseppep: Is there a volunteer to answer requests for an update on the status of the group? 14:33:24 MarkVickers: I can draft an email. 14:33:46 giuseppep: So let's close the call there. 14:33:51 giuseppep: Anything else? 14:34:04 -??P54 14:34:08 -Paul_Higgs 14:34:08 giuseppep: Next call in two weeks then and I'll send a summary to the IG. 14:34:11 thanks giuseppep 14:34:13 bye all 14:34:26 kaz: Next call will be a normal TV IG call, right? 14:34:33 -[IPcaller.a] 14:34:34 - +44.178.442.aaff 14:34:36 -JeanClaude_Dufourd 14:34:37 -jcverdie 14:34:37 giuseppep: Yes, and sorry I got the timezones wrong. 14:34:38 -Mark_Vickers 14:34:38 -Karen_Myers 14:34:39 -[IPcaller] 14:34:39 -pal 14:34:41 -[IPcaller.aa] 14:34:41 -Bin_Hu 14:34:42 -Daniel_Wester 14:34:45 skim13 has left #webtv 14:34:45 -geunhyung 14:34:45 -[GVoice] 14:34:47 -wuwei 14:34:48 - +325045aacc 14:34:48 giuseppep: If you want an invite, please let me know and I'll send you one. 14:34:51 kawada_ has left #webtv 14:34:53 -Kazuyuki 14:35:03 lorenzo_dtvl has joined #webtv 14:35:05 giuseppep: Goodbye everyone. 14:35:13 Meeting adjourned 14:35:20 rrsagent, generate minutes 14:35:20 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/04/16-webtv-minutes.html ddavis 14:36:15 -kawada 14:36:26 karen has left #webtv 14:41:14 -??P9 15:13:40 jcverdie has joined #webtv 15:17:28 jcverdie has joined #webtv 15:51:04 glenn has joined #webtv 16:03:26 jcverdie has joined #webtv