01:07:21 RRSAgent has joined #webapps 01:07:21 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/02/05-webapps-irc 01:07:36 RRSAgent: this meeting spans midnight 01:15:10 lgombos_ has joined #webapps 01:15:56 + +1.425.936.aaaa 01:16:35 garykac has joined #webapps 01:16:39 zakim, +1.1425. is garykac 01:16:39 sorry, Travis, I do not recognize a party named '+1.1425.' 01:16:49 zakim, +1.425. is garykac 01:16:49 +garykac; got it 01:18:52 Hi. 01:19:02 Hello 01:19:08 Hi! 01:19:37 I've had some recent conversations with HTML5 co-chairs about their references to our spec. 01:20:20 There is a concern that we may not be to Rec by the time that HTML5.0 goes to REC (anticipated by EOY). 01:20:25 Were there any places in particular that they were concerned about? 01:20:51 I don't recall any specific references, only that there was "a dependency" there. 01:21:08 I've looked through the spec recently to find the places where DOMEVENTS is referenced. 01:21:28 These seem to included references to "click", other mouse events, mutation events, and focus events. 01:21:58 Notably, I did not see any references to our spec from the input/beforeinput 01:22:36 http://www.w3.org/html/wg/drafts/html/master/single-page.html 01:22:44 (That's 5.1) 01:23:29 Latest 5.0 heartbeat: 01:23:30 http://www.w3.org/TR/2014/CR-html5-20140204/ 01:23:55 beforeinput does not seem to be there. 01:25:05 'input' is referenced. I searched for "named input" to find the occurances. 01:26:17 'input' seems to be fully specified in the spec (it's a "simple event" of Event interface). 01:28:23 Here is where beforeinput may have been used: 01:28:24 https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/editing/raw-file/tip/editing.html 01:29:23 AFAIK, no one is working on that at the moment. 01:30:26 That spec makes "beforeinput" (for editing and use in execCommand) a EditingBeforeInputEvent 01:31:01 Editing spec appears to have stalled a bit. 01:32:30 On 20 Feb 2013, Aryeh posted to public-webapps confirming that he is no longer actively working on it, but would be happy to help a new editor get up to speed. 01:32:46 So I don't expect anything to come out of that spec anytime soon. 01:32:49 Back to testing... In terms of unblocking the HTML5 spec, we may want to concentrate our efforts on testing the parts of our spec that are referenced from HTML5. 01:32:52 Happily, the Keyboard events are not called out, so that may give us some lead time. 01:34:46 We could prioritize testing the parts of the spec that HTML5 depends on (the older stable stuff), so that if anyone comes asking us, we can say that the parts that HTML5 depends on are solid and have the proof of that in hand. 01:34:55 What exactly do you mean by "testing" these parts? You mean independent vendor testing or official W3C tests? 01:35:17 Well, there are multiple definitions... :) 01:35:39 What are people looking for? These events are fairly hard to test in an automated way. 01:35:50 I think the conformance folks will want to see tests that can be used in an implementation report. 01:36:00 So, automated or not, it doesn't really matter. 01:36:01 Would they be content with manual tests? 01:36:07 Sounds like it 01:36:07 Yeah. 01:37:25 We'll have to dig into the tests and figure out where we stand... 01:37:48 While you are focused on editing the spec, I can review what tests exist for DOM3 in web-platform-tests, and whether the "basics" are already covered... 01:37:59 BTW, do we (should we) provide a link to the tests in the spec? 01:38:25 It seems like it would be useful, but I haven't seen other specs do that. 01:38:31 I noticed that reSpec has a convenient hook for reporting the test suite location... 01:38:52 One global test location? Or a pointer from each relevant section in the spec? 01:39:06 A URL to a test suite (any path) 01:39:18 It goes in header section. 01:39:40 Example: https://dvcs.w3.org/hg/innerhtml/raw-file/tip/LCWD-DOM-Parsing-20131205.html 01:40:27 garykac: We should collate all the tests we can find and point them out. 01:40:35 sounds good. I'd love to add these links in the spec. 01:42:18 garykac: AnneVK had some feedback on UI Events. 01:42:49 ... he may be hoping that UI Events details this. 01:43:02 ... doesn't seem to affect DOM3. 01:43:14 https://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/buglist.cgi?component=DOM3%20Events&list_id=31835&product=WebAppsWG&resolution=--- 01:43:20 (Bug list) 01:43:23 For next week ! 01:43:36 16 bugs 01:43:43 We can review them next week. 01:44:06 That's all I've got for today! 01:44:08 We'll meet again next week and I'll have some updates on the bugs. 01:44:15 Sounds good. 01:47:17 Talk to you all next week. 01:47:18 -[Microsoft] 01:47:21 -garykac 01:47:22 RWC_WAPI(D3E)8:00PM has ended 01:47:22 Attendees were [Microsoft], +1.425.936.aaaa, garykac 01:48:17 RRSAgent: make logs public 01:48:33 RRSAgent: generate the minutes 01:48:33 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/02/05-webapps-minutes.html Travis 01:49:28 scribe: Travis 01:49:35 scribeNick: Travis 01:49:40 Present+ garykac 01:49:44 Present+ Travis 01:49:48 Present+ masayuki 01:49:55 rrsagent, generate the minutes 01:49:55 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2014/02/05-webapps-minutes.html Travis 01:51:33 See you. 05:50:55 glenn has joined #webapps 06:18:09 sicking has joined #webapps 07:54:23 Zakim has left #webapps 07:54:38 dom has joined #webapps 08:23:22 richt has joined #webapps 09:21:28 Lachy has joined #webapps 09:37:46 chaals has joined #webapps 09:57:17 darobin has joined #webapps 10:07:58 Lachy has joined #webapps 10:46:41 abarsto has joined #webapps 10:49:15 glenn has joined #webapps 11:01:45 Lachy has joined #webapps 11:11:29 skddc has joined #webapps 11:29:41 Lachy has joined #webapps 11:50:14 glenn has joined #webapps 12:04:18 lgombos_ has joined #webapps 12:07:56 Lachy has joined #webapps 12:22:31 lgombos_ has joined #webapps 12:30:15 Lachy has joined #webapps 12:39:57 Lachy has joined #webapps 12:51:00 glenn has joined #webapps 13:17:01 Lachy has joined #webapps 13:23:42 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vegas is much more concerned with the shadow dom bruhaha 18:53:37 Seriously, the rumor is that Tab and Maciej have lined up a big money fight 19:02:53 lol 20:01:31 davidb has joined #webapps 20:37:37 Lachy has joined #webapps 20:40:28 chaals has joined #webapps 21:00:45 Lachy has joined #webapps 21:05:03 sicking has joined #webapps 21:11:39 sicking has joined #webapps 22:33:44 renoirb has left #webapps 22:48:07 Lachy has joined #webapps 23:06:19 sicking has joined #webapps 23:40:02 cwdoh has joined #webapps 23:45:00 cwdoh has joined #webapps 23:46:12 cwdoh_ has joined #webapps 00:12:42 sicking has joined #webapps 00:32:46 sgalineau has joined #webapps 03:06:54 lgombos has joined #webapps 03:36:48 lgombos has joined #webapps 03:59:03 heath has joined #webapps 08:15:58 skddc has joined #webapps 08:48:33 gavin_ has joined #webapps 09:44:43 chaals has joined #webapps 10:06:07 cwdoh has joined #webapps 10:57:28 cwdoh has joined #webapps 12:33:48 Lachy has joined #webapps 12:45:24 cwdoh has 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