11:51:15 RRSAgent has joined #dwbp 11:51:15 logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/01/31-dwbp-irc 11:51:24 Zakim has joined #dwbp 11:51:29 zakim, this will be dwbp 11:51:29 I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, PhilA 11:51:56 ah, no, you wouldn't zakim, as I didn't book it. Ah well. We'll do an ad hoc shortly 11:52:15 yaso has joined #dwbp 11:52:23 Meeting: DWBP 2nd meeting 11:52:28 Chair: Yaso 11:52:32 Agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Meetings#Agenda_31_Jan_2014 11:54:48 MTCarrasco has joined #dwbp 11:55:32 Hi, what is the conference code? 11:55:45 I'll get the conference code shortly, Ig_Bittencourt 11:55:57 zaki, conference code 11:56:00 Thanks. 11:56:08 zakim, conference code 11:56:08 I don't understand 'conference code', MTCarrasco 11:56:18 There is no conference code yet MTCarrasco 11:56:24 (but there soon will be) 11:56:28 zakim, code 11:56:28 I don't understand 'code', MTCarrasco 11:57:06 The conference code should be 3927 11:58:17 CarlosIglesias has joined #dwbp 11:58:30 deirdrelee has joined #dwbp 11:58:38 zakim, room for 20? 11:58:38 This conf code does not work, Caroline_ 11:58:39 ok, PhilA; conference Team_(dwbp)11:58Z scheduled with code 3927 (DWBP) for 60 minutes until 1258Z 11:58:51 zakim, code? 11:58:51 the conference code is 3927 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), PhilA 11:59:23 Team_(dwbp)11:58Z has now started 11:59:23 what is the conference code? 11:59:28 +[IPcaller] 11:59:30 +[IPcaller.a] 11:59:35 Look at the screen MTCarrasco! 11:59:41 zakim, code? 11:59:41 the conference code is 3927 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), PhilA 11:59:47 zakim, ipcaller is me 11:59:47 +PhilA; got it 11:59:50 +??P2 11:59:59 +??P3 12:00:00 zakim, ipcaller.a is deirdrelee 12:00:01 +deirdrelee; got it 12:00:17 Ig_bittencourt, try Dial details: 1.617.761.6200 or sip:zakim@voip.w3.org code 3927 12:00:17 zakim, P2 is me 12:00:17 sorry, CarlosIglesias, I do not recognize a party named 'P2' 12:00:24 Seiji_Isoani has joined #dwbp 12:00:25 zakim, ??P2 is me 12:00:25 +CarlosIglesias; got it 12:00:26 +??P4 12:00:57 Does it work now, Ig? 12:01:03 zakim, ??P4 is MTCarrasco 12:01:03 +MTCarrasco; got it 12:01:21 herrmann has joined #dwbp 12:01:36 It works Caroline_ 12:01:39 Thanks 12:01:55 +??P5 12:02:08 Nitai has joined #dwbp 12:02:12 martin has joined #dwbp 12:02:16 zapim, ??p3 is Ig_Bittencourt 12:02:43 zakim, who's noisy? 12:02:54 MTCarrasco, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: deirdrelee (56%), PhilA (56%), ??P3 (14%), MTCarrasco (23%), ??P5 (80%) 12:03:02 +Caroline 12:03:23 zakim, ??P3 is Ig_Bittencourt 12:03:23 +Ig_Bittencourt; got it 12:03:28 HadleyBeeman has joined #dwbp 12:03:47 +??P7 12:03:50 zakim, code? 12:03:50 the conference code is 3927 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), martin 12:04:32 +??P8 12:04:39 zakim, ??p8 is me 12:04:39 +martin; got it 12:05:11 zakim, please mute me 12:05:11 martin should now be muted 12:05:11 +??P5 12:05:16 -Caroline 12:05:37 JohnGoodwin has joined #dwbp 12:05:39 Sorry, Phil. Dialing Augusto Hermann from here 12:06:17 zakim, ??P5 12:06:17 I don't understand '??P5', Seiji_Isoani 12:06:22 +HadleyBeeman 12:06:32 +Caroline 12:06:51 HadleyBeeman has changed the topic to: Agenda: https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Agenda31 12:07:30 nathalia has joined #dwbp 12:07:37 zakim, +??P5 12:07:37 I saw ??P5 arrive 5 minutes ago 12:07:49 We need volunteers for scribing 12:07:56 zakim, ??P5 is Seiji_Isoani 12:07:56 +Seiji_Isoani; got it 12:07:57 zakim, +??P5 is Seiji_Isoani 12:07:57 sorry, PhilA, I do not recognize a party named '+??P5' 12:07:57 scribe: deirdrelee 12:08:10 zakim, who is speaking? 12:08:21 HadleyBeeman, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Ig_Bittencourt (25%), Caroline (55%) 12:08:42 +[IPcaller] 12:08:58 zakim, who is here? 12:08:58 On the phone I see deirdrelee, PhilA, CarlosIglesias, Ig_Bittencourt, MTCarrasco (muted), Seiji_Isoani, ??P7, martin (muted), HadleyBeeman, Caroline, [IPcaller] 12:09:01 On IRC I see nathalia, JohnGoodwin, HadleyBeeman, martin, Nitai, herrmann, Seiji_Isoani, deirdrelee, CarlosIglesias, MTCarrasco, yaso, Zakim, RRSAgent, PhilA, Caroline_, 12:09:01 ... Ig_Bittencourt, Bernadette, sandro, trackbot 12:09:14 zakim, mute Ig_Bittencourt 12:09:14 Ig_Bittencourt should now be muted 12:09:28 Im here calling from skype 12:09:28 I can hear 12:09:56 scribe: deirdrelee 12:10:02 yaso: Start by looking at agenda, see who will lead the task forces, we need names 12:10:02 scribeNick: deirdrelee 12:10:15 rrsagent, make logs public 12:10:18 ...and also how to describe deliverables 12:10:23 herrmann_ has joined #dwbp 12:10:38 ...we have to decide if we will use github to track deliverables 12:11:11 ...a task force is a separate group that will work on one deliverable 12:11:37 q+ 12:11:42 +1 to that. It may get too confusing to have those conversations all together. 12:12:06 ...I suggest that we have three task forces, one for each of the deliverables: bps, and each of the vocabs 12:12:21 ...what does everyone think? 12:12:50 q+ 12:13:16 q? 12:13:20 ack MTCarrasco 12:13:28 ack MTCarrasco 12:14:06 MTCarrasco: we could chop the big document into smaller documents, so that one chapter doesn't stand in the way of the whole document 12:14:14 ...it's also easier to divide the work 12:14:32 ...suggests to start writing straight away 12:14:39 q? 12:14:41 ack CarlosIglesias 12:14:45 ...and that wiki should be enough, no need for github 12:14:47 q? 12:15:32 CarlosIglesias: it is better to focus the overall group on the best practices, as it looks like the most complex. 12:15:41 zakim, who's noisy? 12:15:45 ...and create taskforces for the other vocabularies 12:15:53 yaso, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Caroline (9%) 12:16:16 q? 12:16:20 q+ 12:16:33 ack HadleyBeeman 12:16:36 ...if there is a taskforce for everything, what is the need for the group as a whole? this is another reason to keep the BP doc as a group doc 12:16:39 q+ 12:16:39 q+ 12:17:10 HadleyBeeman: last week lots of people nominated themselves for different aspects of the BP doc 12:17:16 q- 12:17:31 ace deirdrelee 12:17:32 ...why not split the BP into the components that people nominated themselves for 12:17:36 newton has joined #dwbp 12:17:38 ack deirdrelee 12:17:41 q 12:17:43 q? 12:18:12 deirdrelee: Looking through the charter, can the chairs explain how technical is the BP doc expected to be? 12:18:16 for reference: http://www.w3.org/2013/05/odbp-charter.html 12:18:28 ... GLD was tech focussed but is that the case in this group? 12:18:41 ... where do we stand for tech suggestions? 12:18:55 HadleyBeeman: Thyat depends on the editors I think and what the appetitie is within the group 12:19:11 ... it needs to be as useful as possible. The more we can tie the work to independent use cases the better 12:19:23 ... but I don't thinkw e can define that this second 12:19:25 q+ 12:19:40 q? 12:19:41 q? 12:19:43 ack me 12:19:45 ack Phil 12:19:54 Yaso: need to balance tech & non-tech 12:20:04 PhilA: use-case is the magic word 12:20:16 ...deirdrelee offered to work on use-cases last week 12:20:16 zakim, who is making noise? 12:20:26 martin, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Caroline (56%) 12:20:28 Document must be technical, though explained in a tutorial-like style 12:20:29 ...it would be great if someone could help 12:20:44 ...we are a technical standards body, we shouldn't be afraid of it 12:21:10 ...but as yaso says we are not defining new technology, but we are offering guidelines on technical details 12:21:10 zakim, who is making noise? 12:21:21 Caroline_, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: Caroline (46%), [IPcaller] (4%) 12:21:23 q+ 12:21:25 ...strongly urge group to work on use-cases before anything else 12:21:26 Use Cases and Requirements 12:22:11 q? 12:22:18 ack MTCarrasco 12:22:20 yaso: we could describe use-cases as a tutorial style, this is a good reason to use github 12:22:31 zakim, who is making noise? 12:22:32 zakim, who's noisy? 12:22:43 PhilA, listening for 11 seconds I heard sound from the following: Caroline (45%), [IPcaller] (4%) 12:22:56 yaso, listening for 13 seconds I heard sound from the following: Caroline (8%), [IPcaller] (7%) 12:23:01 MTCarrasco: we must be technical, in a tutorial style, for example the html standard 12:23:08 EricStephan has joined #DWBP 12:23:11 zakim, mute ipcaller 12:23:11 [IPcaller] should now be muted 12:23:22 ...a demo would also be useful. I need a web server that everyone can have access to 12:23:42 zakim, who's noisy? 12:23:43 +ericstephan 12:23:53 yaso, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: PhilA (9%), HadleyBeeman (29%), Caroline (50%) 12:24:55 HadleyBeeman has joined #dwbp 12:25:06 I will work in a demo in local server. In addition, I will be looking for a public one. 12:25:18 Demo to illustrate and verify. 12:25:33 yaso: should we do a demo? a project? a real case, as opposed to a use-case that would just describe 12:26:06 PhilA: this group is more focused on use-cases and best practices, as opposed to implementing something 12:26:10 Not a lot of coding: parametrization of Apache and a few CGIs 12:26:22 HadleyBeeman: use-cases are key 12:26:32 zakim, who is here? 12:26:32 On the phone I see deirdrelee, PhilA, CarlosIglesias, Ig_Bittencourt (muted), MTCarrasco (muted), Seiji_Isoani, ??P7, martin (muted), HadleyBeeman, Caroline, [IPcaller] (muted), 12:26:33 Nitai, 12:26:36 ... ericstephan 12:26:36 On IRC I see HadleyBeeman, EricStephan, newton, herrmann_, nathalia, JohnGoodwin, martin, Nitai, Seiji_Isoani, deirdrelee, CarlosIglesias, MTCarrasco, yaso, Zakim, RRSAgent, PhilA, 12:26:36 ... Caroline_, Ig_Bittencourt, Bernadette, sandro, trackbot 12:26:38 yaso: we could work with data.gov.br team 12:26:44 zakim, unmute ipcaller 12:26:45 [IPcaller] should no longer be muted 12:27:08 ...for a use-case 12:27:23 Nitai and herrmann_ I was just suggesting that you and Nitai can help with data.gov.br 12:27:25 zakim, ipcaller is Augusto 12:27:25 +Augusto; got it 12:27:46 herrmann has joined #dwbp 12:28:14 Augusto: we could make an implementation of the vocabularies 12:28:25 q+ to talk about implementations for vocabs 12:28:40 ...we could not only help with the BP guide, but follow through as part of our data.gov.br open data initiative 12:29:02 q? 12:29:05 ...we still haven't got authorisation to give time to WG, so can't commit to anything specific yet 12:29:09 ack PhilA 12:29:09 PhilA, you wanted to talk about implementations for vocabs 12:29:13 ack me 12:29:57 PhilA: There are two kinds of documents that this group can produce, recommendations (also known as standards) 12:30:20 ...important part of recommendation is that there are at least two implementations 12:30:26 Vagner_Br has joined #dwbp 12:31:04 ...but a BP guide is like advice, so how to 'implement' that? what we need is for specific groups to refer to our BP doc 12:31:06 q+ 12:31:45 ...so evidence of the BP doc would be other groups pointing to our BP doc, for example, from the European Commission or national governemtns 12:31:47 q+ 12:31:55 q+ 12:32:08 ack deirdrelee 12:32:36 ...we have JohnGoodwin on call, expert on Linked Data & geo spatial. As an example of evidence, he could point to BP doc ?? 12:33:03 s/BP doc/his organisation's work with linked geodata in the UK. 12:33:12 ...in relation to the vocabularies, they are WG Notes, not recommendations, so the bar is lower 12:34:01 ...we don't have to have proven implementation. But if we do have implementations, then great, because they WG Notes could then be pushed through as recommendations 12:34:11 ack Bernadette 12:34:19 ...which are more reputable and carry more weight 12:34:53 \o/ 12:35:01 VanessaTonini has joined #dwbp 12:35:08 Bernadette: In ?? we have an Open Data portal, perhaps we can ues this as a use-case. They are very motivated 12:35:38 s/??/what it should say/ 12:35:52 s/what it should say/??/ 12:36:00 q? 12:36:12 s/??/Recife 12:36:23 Recife 12:36:29 In Recife 12:37:18 ack JohnGoodwin 12:37:24 q? 12:37:52 For ref: JohnGoodwin is referring to http://data.ordancesurvey.org.uk 12:37:57 JohnGoodwin: happy to provide usecases 12:37:59 q? 12:37:59 +q 12:38:03 ack MTCarrasco 12:38:06 q? 12:38:28 s/http://data.ordancesurvey.org.uk/http://data.ordnancesurvey.co.uk 12:38:34 Correcting the link: http://data.ordnancesurvey.co.uk/ 12:38:51 MTCarrasco: BP is a simplification, so we should only have most common use-cases 12:39:29 ...demo is just to illustrate the recommendation, not a system/product for usage 12:39:30 q? 12:39:38 ack EricStephan 12:39:45 q? 12:40:08 EricStephan: I'm on the csv on the web WG, and there is potential to collaborate, as they are starting to identify use-cases as well 12:40:13 q+ to talk about CSV WG f2f meeting 12:40:15 ...there is potential for collaboration 12:40:19 herrmann has joined #dwbp 12:40:40 Bernadette was talking about http://dados.recife.pe.gov.br/ 12:40:57 yaso: what comes first, the use-cases, the description of technologies, the requirements, etc. 12:41:07 q+ to talk about Use Cases 12:41:16 PhilA: it's normal to produce use-cases and requirements first 12:41:16 mute me 12:41:17 ack PhilA 12:41:17 PhilA, you wanted to talk about CSV WG f2f meeting 12:41:20 q? 12:41:50 PhilA: use the wiki to gather use-cases; editors will then take care of that, 12:41:59 ack HadleyBeeman 12:41:59 HadleyBeeman, you wanted to talk about Use Cases 12:42:06 ...the UCs and requirements could be a stand-alone WG Note 12:42:06 q? 12:42:20 ...which feeds into BP document 12:42:36 Example from Data Cube vocabularies Gov Linked Data Working Group: Use case doc http://www.w3.org/TR/2013/NOTE-vocab-data-cube-use-cases-20130801/ 12:43:06 Implementation: http://www.w3.org/2011/gld/wiki/Data_Cube_Implementations 12:43:09 HadleyBeeman: To give an example of previous groups, here are a couple of examples for use-case documents from the GLD WG 12:43:18 zakim, who's muted? 12:43:18 I see Ig_Bittencourt, martin muted 12:43:29 these are great examples! 12:43:29 q? 12:43:33 zakim, mute me 12:43:33 MTCarrasco should now be muted 12:43:37 zakim, who's muted? 12:43:37 I see Ig_Bittencourt, MTCarrasco, martin muted 12:43:45 ...it's good to have a page to gather evidence from the field 12:43:55 ...easy to create and for people to add to 12:44:02 q- 12:44:13 yaso: we should create this page and gather volunteers to create the work, and editors? 12:44:18 zakim, unmute Ig_Bittencourt 12:44:18 Ig_Bittencourt should no longer be muted 12:44:22 HadleyBeeman: editors will drive this work 12:44:26 ack Ig_Bittencourt 12:44:35 q? 12:45:01 PhilA: we have made a decision! 12:45:40 yes 12:46:02 Proposed Resolution: That the WG collects sued cases on the wiki and then creates a UCR doc from that as a WG NOTE 12:46:08 s/sued/use 12:46:09 +1 12:46:17 s/sued/used/ 12:46:28 s/used/use/ 12:46:46 +1 12:46:46 +1 12:46:47 +1 12:46:47 +1 12:46:47 +1 12:46:49 +1 12:46:50 +1 12:46:50 +1 12:46:51 +1 12:46:54 +1 12:47:00 \o 12:47:03 +1 12:47:06 Resolution: That the WG collects use cases on the wiki and then creates a UCR doc from that as a WG NOTE 12:47:09 o/ 12:47:16 +1 12:47:27 Vagner_Br has joined #dwbp 12:47:45 +1 12:48:04 q+ 12:48:26 http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/dwbp/2014-01-24 12:48:42 HadleyBeeman: there were some volunteers from last week, recorded in the minutes 12:48:46 akc deirdrelee 12:48:48 q? 12:49:05 ack deirdrelee 12:49:14 deirdrelee: I wanted to ask what we mean by use cases? 12:49:36 ... is a data portal a use case? What do we mean by use case? 12:49:46 q? 12:50:00 HadleyBeeman: I think that does need to be defined by the editors 12:50:24 zakimm unmuted me 12:50:35 zakim, unmuted me 12:50:35 I don't understand 'unmuted me', MTCarrasco 12:50:35 q+ 12:50:48 ack Berenadette 12:50:50 zakim, umuted me 12:50:50 I don't understand 'umuted me', MTCarrasco 12:50:53 yaso: volunteers for editors were manuel, Bernadette and ?? 12:51:03 Antoine 12:51:09 zakim, unmute mtcarrasco 12:51:09 MTCarrasco should no longer be muted 12:51:15 s/manual/Tomas/ 12:51:20 s/manuel/Tomas/ 12:51:34 sorry bernadette 12:51:39 q+ 12:51:44 Bernadette: I would like to contribute to BP document, but would like to be an editor for the Quality and Granularity Description Vocabulary 12:51:46 ack Bernadete 12:51:54 q- Bernadette 12:52:09 ack MTCarrasco 12:52:47 Thank you, PhilA 12:53:01 s/editor for the Quality and Granularity Description Vocabulary/contributor for the Quality and Granularity Description Vocabulary 12:53:02 https://www.w3.org/2013/dwbp/wiki/Data_on_the_Web_URI_Best_Practices 12:53:31 MTCarrasco: has already started contributing to BP doc, this is his main interest 12:54:16 ...intention is to write some code to illustrate what he means with the document 12:54:50 PhilA: need to decide on editors of use-case documents 12:55:41 Antoine Isaac 12:55:43 Deirdrelee: I'm willing to be co-editor of the Best Practices document 12:55:45 deirdrelee: will be co-editor of use-case doc 12:55:57 q+ 12:56:17 Ack Bernadette 12:56:50 yaso has left #dwbp 12:56:56 Bernadette: will also be co-editor of use-case document 12:57:02 Yaso: Antoine said last week that he would like to be co-editor 12:57:07 So Deirdre, Bernadette and Antoine will be co-editors on the UCR 12:57:10 yaso has joined #dwbp 12:57:29 +1 12:57:35 +1 12:57:39 +1 12:57:45 PhilA: Let's decide the regular time for this meeting 12:57:48 +1 12:57:53 +1 12:57:55 +1 12:57:59 +1 12:57:59 +1 12:58:03 +1 12:58:03 HadleyBeeman: task forces may need their own meetings too 12:58:03 12 GMT 12:58:04 PROPOSED RESOLUTION: That the WG's regular meeting time is the same as this one was today. Noon GMT, Fridays 12:58:09 +1 12:58:11 +1 12:58:14 +1 12:58:14 +1 12:58:17 +1 12:58:20 +1 12:58:20 +1 12:58:22 As long as my alarm clocks works :-) 12:58:24 +1 12:58:24 +1 12:58:26 +1 12:58:28 +1 12:58:35 +1 12:59:00 q+ 12:59:06 ack Caroline_ 12:59:17 No prob 12:59:32 We should really take into account the people in other time zone: West USA, Korea 13:00:19 PhilA: we're only getting the +1s from those present, it is very early for some participants, and some participants have other committments, e.g. classes 13:00:22 PROPOSED RESOLUTION: That the WG's regular meeting time is the same as this one was today. 13:00 GMT, Fridays 13:00:24 PROPOSED RESOLUTION: That the WG's regular meeting time is the same as this one was today. 13 GMT, Fridays 13:00:28 +1 13:00:32 +1 13:00:34 +1 13:00:34 +1 13:00:35 +1 13:00:36 +1 13:00:36 +1 13:00:37 +1 13:00:37