Meeting Record

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RDFa in XHTML Task Force

Minutes of 12 November 2009

Present

Unknown Manu_Sporny, Unknown Mark_Birbeck, Unknown Ivan_Herman, Unknown Shane_McCarron

Regrets

Unknown Ben_Adida

Chair

Unknown Sporny

Scribe

Unknown Sporny

Previous Meeting

http://www.w3.org/2009/11/05-rdfa-minutes.html

IRC Log

Original

Resolutions

None.

Topics

Action Items
RDFa WG charter updates
URIs in @rel, @rev, @property, @typeof and @datatype
Triggering experimental behavior
Test Case 140

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15:38:52 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc

RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc ←

15:38:57 <manu> zakim, this will be rdfa

Scribe problem: the name 'manu' does not match any of the 3 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown manu: zakim, this will be rdfa ←

15:38:57 <Zakim> ok, manu; I see SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM scheduled to start in 22 minutes

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, manu; I see SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM scheduled to start in 22 minutes ←

15:39:46 <manu> Scribe: Manu Sporny

Scribe problem: the name 'Manu Sporny' does not match any of the 3 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

(Scribe set to Unknown Sporny)

15:39:49 <manu> Chair: Manu Sporny

Scribe problem: the name 'Manu Sporny' does not match any of the 0 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names:

15:40:03 <manu> Present: Manu_Sporny, Mark_Birbeck, Ivan_Herman, Shane_McCarron

Scribe problem: the name 'Manu_Sporny' does not match any of the 0 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names:

Scribe problem: the name 'Mark_Birbeck' does not match any of the 0 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names:

Scribe problem: the name 'Ivan_Herman' does not match any of the 0 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names:

Scribe problem: the name 'Shane_McCarron' does not match any of the 0 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names:

15:40:12 <manu> Regrets: Ben_Adida

Scribe problem: the name 'Ben_Adida' does not match any of the 0 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names:

15:41:07 <manu> rrsagent, draft minutes

Unknown Manu_Sporny: rrsagent, draft minutes ←

15:41:07 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu ←

15:41:11 <manu> rrsagent, make log public

Unknown Manu_Sporny: rrsagent, make log public ←

15:56:24 <manu> Previous: http://www.w3.org/2009/11/05-rdfa-minutes.html

15:56:47 <manu> Meeting: RDFa in XHTML Task Force

15:57:54 <Zakim> SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has now started

(No events recorded for 16 minutes)

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has now started ←

15:58:00 <Zakim> +??P20

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P20 ←

15:58:05 <manu> zakim, I am ??P20

Unknown Manu_Sporny: zakim, I am ??P20 ←

15:58:05 <Zakim> +manu; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +manu; got it ←

15:58:48 <Zakim> +McCarron

Zakim IRC Bot: +McCarron ←

15:58:54 <ShaneM> zakim, McCarron is ShaneM

Scribe problem: the name 'ShaneM' does not match any of the 7 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Unknown Manu_Sporny Unknown Mark_Birbeck Unknown Ivan_Herman Unknown Shane_McCarron Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown ShaneM: zakim, McCarron is ShaneM ←

15:58:54 <Zakim> +ShaneM; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +ShaneM; got it ←

16:00:13 <manu> Topic: Action Items

1. Action Items

16:01:01 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip

Unknown Ivan_Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←

16:01:01 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←

16:01:03 <Zakim> +Ivan

Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←

16:01:12 <manu> ACTION: Manu to update the charter to talk about RDFa API [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action08]

ACTION: Manu to update the charter to talk about RDFa API [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/11/05-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] ←

16:01:14 <manu> -- done

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- done ←

16:01:22 <markbirbeck> zakim, code?

Scribe problem: the name 'markbirbeck' does not match any of the 7 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Unknown Manu_Sporny Unknown Mark_Birbeck Unknown Ivan_Herman Unknown Shane_McCarron Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown markbirbeck: zakim, code? ←

16:01:22 <Zakim> the conference code is 7332 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 7332 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 tel:+33.4.89.06.34.99 tel:+44.117.370.6152), markbirbeck ←

16:01:44 <manu> ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#action08]

ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] ←

16:01:48 <manu> -- continues

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- continues ←

16:02:08 <Zakim> +??P29

Zakim IRC Bot: +??P29 ←

16:02:17 <markbirbeck> zakim, i am ??

Unknown markbirbeck: zakim, i am ?? ←

16:02:17 <Zakim> +markbirbeck; got it

Zakim IRC Bot: +markbirbeck; got it ←

16:02:33 <Steven> zakim, dial steven-617

Scribe problem: the name 'Steven' does not match any of the 7 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Unknown Manu_Sporny Unknown Mark_Birbeck Unknown Ivan_Herman Unknown Shane_McCarron Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown Steven: zakim, dial steven-617 ←

16:02:33 <Zakim> ok, Steven; the call is being made

Zakim IRC Bot: ok, Steven; the call is being made ←

16:02:34 <Zakim> +Steven

Zakim IRC Bot: +Steven ←

16:02:47 <Steven> zakim, mute me

Unknown Steven: zakim, mute me ←

16:02:47 <Zakim> Steven should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Steven should now be muted ←

16:02:48 <manu> Present+ Steven_Pemberton

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Present+ Steven_Pemberton ←

16:03:31 <manu> Manu: any additions/changes to agenda?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: any additions/changes to agenda? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:05:14 <Steven> Nothing from me.

Unknown Steven: Nothing from me. ←

16:05:16 <manu> Manu: We had discussed RDFa API last week, any input Mark, Steven?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: We had discussed RDFa API last week, any input Mark, Steven? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:05:43 <manu> Mark: Some input - there are "Storage APIs" in Prototype, mootols, etc. They allow you to store name-value pairs.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: Some input - there are "Storage APIs" in Prototype, mootols, etc. They allow you to store name-value pairs. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:06:00 <ivan> q+

Unknown Ivan_Herman: q+ ←

16:06:25 <manu> Mark: LIttle storage packets at level of element. We should look at all of the APIs - the foundations... it would be good if the thing we came up with extended what developers are already working with.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: LIttle storage packets at level of element. We should look at all of the APIs - the foundations... it would be good if the thing we came up with extended what developers are already working with. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:06:53 <manu> Mark: We may look at looking at the "name" in the name-value pair as a full URI....

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: We may look at looking at the "name" in the name-value pair as a full URI.... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:07:10 <manu> Mark: We should do it in such a way as to get it to fit with present tools.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: We should do it in such a way as to get it to fit with present tools. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:07:12 <manu> ack ivan

Unknown Manu_Sporny: ack ivan ←

16:07:29 <manu> Ivan: We agreed that RDFa API is a part of the charter...

Unknown Ivan_Herman: We agreed that RDFa API is a part of the charter... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:07:57 <manu> Ivan: We also want to say we will look at a more general case, will most probably publish a W3C NOTE on the issue, and we /may/ go beyond that.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: We also want to say we will look at a more general case, will most probably publish a W3C NOTE on the issue, and we /may/ go beyond that. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:08:05 <manu> Ivan: So, what you said Mark, is in line with what we discussed.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: So, what you said Mark, is in line with what we discussed. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:08:32 <Steven> ack me

Unknown Steven: ack me ←

16:09:05 <manu> Ivan: We try to make the distinction that we don't have the obligation to produce an TripleStore API.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: We try to make the distinction that we don't have the obligation to produce an TripleStore API. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:09:07 <Steven> zakim, mute me

Unknown Steven: zakim, mute me ←

16:09:07 <Zakim> Steven should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Steven should now be muted ←

16:09:14 <manu> ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#action08]

ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] ←

16:09:57 <manu> -- continues

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- continues ←

16:10:44 <Steven> I approve test #142

Unknown Steven: I approve test #142 ←

16:11:01 <manu> Shane: You raised an issue about TC 140 and why it shouldn't generate a triple.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: You raised an issue about TC 140 and why it shouldn't generate a triple. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:11:18 <manu> Manu: Adding to agenda, review TC140

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Adding to agenda, review TC140 [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:11:27 <manu> ACTION: Ben to finish authoring RDFa WG charter. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#action07]

ACTION: Ben to finish authoring RDFa WG charter. [recorded in ACTION-07]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-07] ←

16:11:36 <manu> -- continues

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- continues ←

16:11:42 <manu> ACTION: Manu to try and find other interested parties in RDFa WG. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#action08]

ACTION: Manu to try and find other interested parties in RDFa WG. [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] ←

16:11:45 <manu> -- continues

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- continues ←

16:12:36 <Steven> q+

Unknown Steven: q+ ←

16:12:39 <Steven> ack me

Unknown Steven: ack me ←

16:13:15 <manu> Manu: Any ideas on who we'd like to invite? Browser vendors?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Any ideas on who we'd like to invite? Browser vendors? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:13:42 <ivan> q+

Unknown Ivan_Herman: q+ ←

16:15:18 <manu> Mark: We may want to discuss this with the browser vendors because we haven't been focusing on that in the past.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: We may want to discuss this with the browser vendors because we haven't been focusing on that in the past. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:15:35 <manu> Steven: It would be good to get browser vendors involved.

Unknown Steven: It would be good to get browser vendors involved. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:16:16 <manu> Steven: This could be of interest to browser vendors as semantic objects in pages could be used to do commerce.

Unknown Steven: This could be of interest to browser vendors as semantic objects in pages could be used to do commerce. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:16:36 <manu> Steven: This would give browser vendors an incentive to participate - there is an economic incentive.

Unknown Steven: This would give browser vendors an incentive to participate - there is an economic incentive. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:16:50 <manu> Ivan: I think we should be very conservative in what we sign ourselves up to do.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I think we should be very conservative in what we sign ourselves up to do. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:17:01 <manu> Ivan: This could become a great deal of work.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: This could become a great deal of work. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:18:01 <manu> Ivan: We want to make sure that the group is independent and if we go toward browser vendors too much, it could be interpreted as we're doing all HTML5 work, which is not true.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: We want to make sure that the group is independent and if we go toward browser vendors too much, it could be interpreted as we're doing all HTML5 work, which is not true. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:18:38 <manu> ACTION: Shane to look at XML spec and see if xml: is illegal in RDF/XML re: TC 142 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#action09]

ACTION: Shane to look at XML spec and see if xml: is illegal in RDF/XML re: TC 142 [recorded in ACTION-09]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-09] ←

16:18:40 <manu> -- done

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- done ←

16:18:55 <manu> Shane: They're reserved, but they can start with 'xml'

Unknown Shane_McCarron: They're reserved, but they can start with 'xml' [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:19:06 <manu> ACTION: Shane to re-draft XMLLiteral errata text [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action04]

ACTION: Shane to re-draft XMLLiteral errata text [recorded in ACTION-04]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/15-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-04] ←

16:19:08 <manu> -- continues

Unknown Manu_Sporny: -- continues ←

16:21:32 <manu> Manu: Update on sparql.org - bug in librdfa. It uses datatype="rdf:XMLLiteral" not parseType="Literal"

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Update on sparql.org - bug in librdfa. It uses datatype="rdf:XMLLiteral" not parseType="Literal" [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:21:42 <manu> Ivan: I disagree - you should canonicalize in both cases.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I disagree - you should canonicalize in both cases. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:22:07 <manu> Ivan: It's not clear, but I don't think we should pursue it.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: It's not clear, but I don't think we should pursue it. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:22:25 <manu> Shane: I do emit parsetype="Literal"

Unknown Shane_McCarron: I do emit parsetype="Literal" [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:22:29 <manu> Topic: RDFa WG charter updates

2. RDFa WG charter updates

16:23:25 <manu> Manu: I have started asking others to join... what happens if they don't get back to us in time?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: I have started asking others to join... what happens if they don't get back to us in time? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:23:34 <manu> Ivan: I have started working at charter at W3C.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I have started working at charter at W3C. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:23:50 <manu> Ivan: The process has been started.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: The process has been started. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:23:53 <manu> Manu: Anything you need?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Anything you need? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:24:19 <manu> ACTION: Manu to convert WG Charter page to W3C charter format

ACTION: Manu to convert WG Charter page to W3C charter format ←

16:24:32 <manu> Ivan: Would be nice to convert wiki page to HTML charter.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: Would be nice to convert wiki page to HTML charter. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:25:29 <Steven> zakim, mute me

Unknown Steven: zakim, mute me ←

16:25:29 <Zakim> Steven should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Steven should now be muted ←

16:25:44 <manu> Shane: The only place CURIEs are defined normatively are in XHTML and RDFa.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: The only place CURIEs are defined normatively are in XHTML and RDFa. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:25:52 <manu> Shane: CURIE spec is never going to be published as a REC...

Unknown Shane_McCarron: CURIE spec is never going to be published as a REC... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:26:04 <manu> Shane: There are other specs that need to refer to CURIEs normatively.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: There are other specs that need to refer to CURIEs normatively. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:26:22 <manu> Shane: Do we need to separate out CURIE spec and make it normative?

Unknown Shane_McCarron: Do we need to separate out CURIE spec and make it normative? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:26:40 <manu> Shane: @role, access and XMLEvents refer to CURIE normatively.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: @role, access and XMLEvents refer to CURIE normatively. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:26:41 <Steven> WAI ARIA

Unknown Steven: WAI ARIA ←

16:26:46 <Steven> ack me

Unknown Steven: ack me ←

16:27:12 <manu> Steven: I don't think we're going to take them out of XML Events 2 - we'll still use the notation.

Unknown Steven: I don't think we're going to take them out of XML Events 2 - we'll still use the notation. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:27:35 <manu> Ivan: Having it as a separate REC in RDFa group would be bad.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: Having it as a separate REC in RDFa group would be bad. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:28:29 <manu> Topic: URIs in @rel, @rev, @property, @typeof and @datatype

3. URIs in @rel, @rev, @property, @typeof and @datatype

16:29:05 <manu> Mark: So, the only real sustained objection to RDFa has been the use of CURIEs.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: So, the only real sustained objection to RDFa has been the use of CURIEs. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:29:18 <manu> Mark: We do like CURIEs, and it does help more than it hinders in most cases.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: We do like CURIEs, and it does help more than it hinders in most cases. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:29:28 <manu> Mark: But, it wouldn't hurt to support an alternative.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: But, it wouldn't hurt to support an alternative. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:29:43 <manu> Mark: We could allow URIs where only CURIEs can be used.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: We could allow URIs where only CURIEs can be used. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:29:59 <manu> Mark: It's a useful feature in it's own right... we should make it a greater priority.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: It's a useful feature in it's own right... we should make it a greater priority. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:30:29 <manu> Mark: If we can address this issue, we should.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: If we can address this issue, we should. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:31:16 <manu> Mark: In terms of the actual solution itself, the core of what I've argued is that we may be able to solve this by thinking about the problem differently.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: In terms of the actual solution itself, the core of what I've argued is that we may be able to solve this by thinking about the problem differently. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:31:29 <ShaneM> q+ to ask about relative URIs

Unknown ShaneM: q+ to ask about relative URIs ←

16:31:35 <ivan> q+

Unknown Ivan_Herman: q+ ←

16:31:42 <manu> Mark: We could say that a CURIE without a prefix defined is certainly not a CURIE and certainly is something else... a URI, for example.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: We could say that a CURIE without a prefix defined is certainly not a CURIE and certainly is something else... a URI, for example. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:32:05 <manu> Mark: This solution is backwards-compatible.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: This solution is backwards-compatible. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:32:14 <manu> ack ShaneM

Unknown Manu_Sporny: ack ShaneM ←

16:32:14 <Zakim> ShaneM, you wanted to ask about relative URIs

Zakim IRC Bot: ShaneM, you wanted to ask about relative URIs ←

16:32:37 <manu> Shane: I want to confirm that we're discussing absolute URIs, not relative URIs.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: I want to confirm that we're discussing absolute URIs, not relative URIs. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:32:57 <manu> Shane: What about rel="/foo/bar" ?

Unknown Shane_McCarron: What about rel="/foo/bar" ? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:33:21 <manu> Shane: you can't do that... you have to start with a scheme name... it has to be an absolute URI.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: you can't do that... you have to start with a scheme name... it has to be an absolute URI. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:33:38 <manu> Mark: There are two RFCs on this - one of them allows it, one of them discourages it... it's undefined.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: There are two RFCs on this - one of them allows it, one of them discourages it... it's undefined. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:33:53 <manu> Mark: So, if you do "file:FILENAME" - in lots of systems, that will be your desktop.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: So, if you do "file:FILENAME" - in lots of systems, that will be your desktop. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:34:52 <manu> Shane: If we are talking about absolute URIs, this solution is dead-easy.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: If we are talking about absolute URIs, this solution is dead-easy. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:35:00 <manu> Shane: We should go ahead and plan to do it.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: We should go ahead and plan to do it. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:35:11 <manu> Shane: Mark, you use the term protocol, I think the term is "scheme"

Unknown Shane_McCarron: Mark, you use the term protocol, I think the term is "scheme" [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:35:26 <manu> ack ivan

Unknown Manu_Sporny: ack ivan ←

16:35:37 <manu> Ivan: I agree, but there is one more step that we could make.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I agree, but there is one more step that we could make. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:35:55 <manu> Ivan: What about CURIEs for @about and @resource?

Unknown Ivan_Herman: What about CURIEs for @about and @resource? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:36:56 <manu> Ivan: So, it's okay for @about and @resource, but what about @href and @resource?

Unknown Ivan_Herman: So, it's okay for @about and @resource, but what about @href and @resource? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:37:20 <manu> Ivan: What about safe curies in @href?

Unknown Ivan_Herman: What about safe curies in @href? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:37:25 <manu> Steven: We don't allow it in @href.

Unknown Steven: We don't allow it in @href. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:37:30 <manu> Ivan: I meant @href and @src.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I meant @href and @src. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:37:46 <manu> Ivan: We don't even allow safe CURIEs in @href and @src...

Unknown Ivan_Herman: We don't even allow safe CURIEs in @href and @src... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:38:01 <manu> Shane: The RDFa spec doesn't talk about it in @href and @src - we defer to the host language.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: The RDFa spec doesn't talk about it in @href and @src - we defer to the host language. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:38:29 <manu> Ivan: Do we have a test case for this? Test case to test safe CURIEs in @href and @src.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: Do we have a test case for this? Test case to test safe CURIEs in @href and @src. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:38:54 <manu> Steven: Safe CURIEs wouldn't validate in @href and @src.

Unknown Steven: Safe CURIEs wouldn't validate in @href and @src. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:39:48 <manu> Manu: Any objections to moving forward with this?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Any objections to moving forward with this? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:40:03 <manu> Manu: Perhaps Mark can author some spec text and post it to the list?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Perhaps Mark can author some spec text and post it to the list? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:41:48 <manu> ACTION: Mark to author URIs in @about, @rel, @rev, @typeof and @datatype spec text

ACTION: Mark to author URIs in @about, @rel, @rev, @typeof and @datatype spec text ←

16:44:04 <manu> Mark: What about having a way to trigger this experimental behavior?

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: What about having a way to trigger this experimental behavior? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:44:11 <manu> Topic: Triggering experimental behavior

4. Triggering experimental behavior

16:44:33 <manu> Shane: Do we have an announcement mechanism for enabling this new URIs everywhere feature?

Unknown Shane_McCarron: Do we have an announcement mechanism for enabling this new URIs everywhere feature? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:45:53 <manu> Mark: Perhaps we don't need that for this feature?

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: Perhaps we don't need that for this feature? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:46:33 <manu> Manu: What if we do rel="rdfa:featureX"?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: What if we do rel="rdfa:featureX"? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:47:52 <manu> Mark: I think it isn't correct to do that. In-band triples shouldn't change the triples that the the processor is generating.

Unknown Mark_Birbeck: I think it isn't correct to do that. In-band triples shouldn't change the triples that the the processor is generating. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:49:30 <manu> Topic: Test Case 140

5. Test Case 140

16:50:03 <ShaneM> the test says <p xmlns:_="http://example.org/" property="_:test">Test</p>

Unknown ShaneM: the test says <p xmlns:_="http://example.org/" property="_:test">Test</p> ←

16:50:17 <ivan> q+

Unknown Ivan_Herman: q+ ←

16:51:09 <Steven> property="rdfa:version"

Unknown Steven: property="rdfa:version" ←

16:51:11 <manu> Ivan: I think we got confused? Maybe had an HTTP 400 error.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I think we got confused? Maybe had an HTTP 400 error. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:51:44 <manu> Ivan: I think this is perfectly legal, and we should generate a triple?

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I think this is perfectly legal, and we should generate a triple? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:51:48 <manu> Ivan: Wait a second...

Unknown Ivan_Herman: Wait a second... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:51:52 <ivan> _:test

Scribe problem: the name '_' is ambiguous. It could be any of: RRSAgent IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot Unknown Ivan_Herman Unknown Manu_Sporny Unknown Shane_McCarron Unknown Mark_Birbeck Zakim IRC Bot . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.

Unknown _: test [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Ivan_Herman ] ←

16:52:23 <manu> Shane: We say that '_' is a reserved prefix for bnodes.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: We say that '_' is a reserved prefix for bnodes. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:52:46 <ShaneM> http://www.w3.org/TR/rdfa-syntax/#s_curies

Unknown ShaneM: http://www.w3.org/TR/rdfa-syntax/#s_curies ←

16:53:29 <manu> Shane: spec text says -  the mapping to use with the '_' prefix, is not explicitly stated, but since it is used to generate [bnode]s, its implementation needs to be compatible with the RDF definition.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: spec text says - the mapping to use with the '_' prefix, is not explicitly stated, but since it is used to generate [bnode]s, its implementation needs to be compatible with the RDF definition. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:53:45 <manu> Ivan: RDF doesn't say anything about '_'

Unknown Ivan_Herman: RDF doesn't say anything about '_' [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:54:14 <manu> Ivan: We have to agree how we specify blank-nodes.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: We have to agree how we specify blank-nodes. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:54:28 <manu> Ivan: In TURTLE, the _ as a prefix defines blank nodes.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: In TURTLE, the _ as a prefix defines blank nodes. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:55:29 <manu> Manu: That sentence isn't clear.

Unknown Manu_Sporny: That sentence isn't clear. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:55:36 <manu> Ivan: What is intended is clear to me...

Unknown Ivan_Herman: What is intended is clear to me... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:55:52 <manu> Manu: I think we need errata text.

Unknown Manu_Sporny: I think we need errata text. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:56:03 <manu> Ivan: Yes, we should have more errata text.

Unknown Ivan_Herman: Yes, we should have more errata text. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:56:38 <manu> Shane: Yes, more errata text.

Unknown Shane_McCarron: Yes, more errata text. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:56:55 <manu> Manu: any objections to moving to ASK WHERE { ?s ?p ?o. } ?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: any objections to moving to ASK WHERE { ?s ?p ?o. } ? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:57:14 <manu> Ivan: I may generate warning triples...

Unknown Ivan_Herman: I may generate warning triples... [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

16:57:49 <ivan> <> ?p "Test" .

Unknown Ivan_Herman: <> ?p "Test" . ←

16:58:30 <manu> Manu: Everybody okay about using that SPARQL instead?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Everybody okay about using that SPARQL instead? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

17:01:53 <Steven> zakim, mute me

Unknown Steven: zakim, mute me ←

17:01:53 <Zakim> Steven should now be muted

Zakim IRC Bot: Steven should now be muted ←

17:01:53 <ivan> <> <http://example.org/test> "Test"

Unknown Ivan_Herman: <> <http://example.org/test> "Test" ←

17:02:36 <Zakim> -markbirbeck

Zakim IRC Bot: -markbirbeck ←

17:02:50 <Zakim> -Steven

Zakim IRC Bot: -Steven ←

17:02:51 <Zakim> -Ivan

Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan ←

17:02:54 <Zakim> -ShaneM

Zakim IRC Bot: -ShaneM ←

17:02:54 <manu> Manu: Yes, we'll change the SPARQL to that.

Unknown Manu_Sporny: Yes, we'll change the SPARQL to that. [ Scribe Assist by Unknown Manu_Sporny ] ←

17:02:58 <manu> rrsagent, draft minutes

Unknown Manu_Sporny: rrsagent, draft minutes ←

17:02:58 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu ←

17:03:20 <ShaneM> Question: in Mark's proposal for URI processing, should the parser ensure it is a valid URI ?

Scribe problem: the name 'Question' does not match any of the 7 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: Unknown Manu_Sporny Unknown Mark_Birbeck Unknown Ivan_Herman Unknown Shane_McCarron Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot

Unknown Question: in Mark's proposal for URI processing, should the parser ensure it is a valid URI ? [ Scribe Assist by Unknown ShaneM ] ←

17:03:47 <manu> syntactically valid?

Unknown Manu_Sporny: syntactically valid? ←

17:03:50 <manu> probably.

Unknown Manu_Sporny: probably. ←

17:03:56 <ShaneM> kk thanks

Unknown ShaneM: kk thanks ←

17:04:05 <manu> although, that's going to be a PITA for my parser.

Unknown Manu_Sporny: although, that's going to be a PITA for my parser. ←

17:04:39 <manu> rrsagent, draft minutes

Unknown Manu_Sporny: rrsagent, draft minutes ←

17:04:39 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu ←

17:07:55 <Zakim> disconnecting the lone participant, manu, in SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM

Zakim IRC Bot: disconnecting the lone participant, manu, in SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM ←

17:07:58 <Zakim> SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has ended

Zakim IRC Bot: SW_SWD(RDFa)11:00AM has ended ←

17:08:00 <Zakim> Attendees were manu, ShaneM, Ivan, markbirbeck, Steven

Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were manu, ShaneM, Ivan, markbirbeck, Steven ←

17:26:22 <manu> ACTION: Manu to ask somebody to draft errata text, clarifying that prefixes cannot be '_' character

(No events recorded for 18 minutes)

ACTION: Manu to ask somebody to draft errata text, clarifying that prefixes cannot be '_' character ←

17:28:02 <manu> rrsagent, draft minutes

Unknown Manu_Sporny: rrsagent, draft minutes ←

17:28:02 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-minutes.html manu ←

17:31:30 <manu> rrsagent, bye

Unknown Manu_Sporny: rrsagent, bye ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> I see 10 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-actions.rdf :

RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see 10 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-actions.rdf : ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to update the charter to talk about RDFa API [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/05-rdfa-minutes.html#action08] [1]

ACTION: Manu to update the charter to talk about RDFa API [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/11/05-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] [1] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-01-12

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-01-12 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#action08] [2]

ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] [2] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-01-44

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-01-44 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#action08] [3]

ACTION: Manu to aggressively push review of test cases via mailing list [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/29-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] [3] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-09-14

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-09-14 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Ben to finish authoring RDFa WG charter. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#action07] [4]

ACTION: Ben to finish authoring RDFa WG charter. [recorded in ACTION-07]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-07] [4] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-11-27

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-11-27 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to try and find other interested parties in RDFa WG. [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#action08] [5]

ACTION: Manu to try and find other interested parties in RDFa WG. [recorded in ACTION-08]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-08] [5] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-11-42

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-11-42 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to look at XML spec and see if xml: is illegal in RDF/XML re: TC 142 [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#action09] [6]

ACTION: Shane to look at XML spec and see if xml: is illegal in RDF/XML re: TC 142 [recorded in ACTION-09]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/22-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-09] [6] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-18-38

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-18-38 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Shane to re-draft XMLLiteral errata text [recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/10/15-rdfa-minutes.html#action04] [7]

ACTION: Shane to re-draft XMLLiteral errata text [recorded in ACTION-04]">http://www.w3.org/2009/10/15-rdfa-minutes.html#ACTION-04] [7] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-19-06

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-19-06 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to convert WG Charter page to W3C charter format [8]

ACTION: Manu to convert WG Charter page to W3C charter format [8] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-24-19

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-24-19 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Mark to author URIs in @about, @rel, @rev, @typeof and @datatype spec text [9]

ACTION: Mark to author URIs in @about, @rel, @rev, @typeof and @datatype spec text [9] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-41-48

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T16-41-48 ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent> ACTION: Manu to ask somebody to draft errata text, clarifying that prefixes cannot be '_' character [10]

ACTION: Manu to ask somebody to draft errata text, clarifying that prefixes cannot be '_' character [10] ←

17:31:30 <RRSAgent>   recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T17-26-22

RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2009/11/12-rdfa-irc#T17-26-22 ←

17:31:33 <manu> zakim, bye

Unknown Manu_Sporny: zakim, bye ←

Formatted by CommonScribe