None.
14:58:53 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc ←
14:58:55 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs world ←
14:58:57 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be 73394
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be 73394 ←
14:58:57 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_RDFWG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_RDFWG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 2 minutes ←
14:58:58 <trackbot> Meeting: RDF Working Group Teleconference
14:58:58 <trackbot> Date: 19 October 2011
15:01:02 <AndyS1> zakim, who is on the phone
Andy Seaborne: zakim, who is on the phone ←
15:01:02 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is on the phone', AndyS1
Zakim IRC Bot: I don't understand 'who is on the phone', AndyS1 ←
15:01:07 <Guus> zakim, who is here?
Guus Schreiber: zakim, who is here? ←
15:01:07 <Zakim> SW_RDFWG()11:00AM has not yet started, Guus
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_RDFWG()11:00AM has not yet started, Guus ←
15:01:09 <Zakim> On IRC I see Scott_Bauer, Zakim, RRSAgent, AndyS1, danbri, SteveH, MacTed, LeeF, Guus, AndyS, mischat, ivan, gavinc, davidwood, NickH, ericP, manu, trackbot, manu1, sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Scott_Bauer, Zakim, RRSAgent, AndyS1, danbri, SteveH, MacTed, LeeF, Guus, AndyS, mischat, ivan, gavinc, davidwood, NickH, ericP, manu, trackbot, manu1, sandro ←
15:01:12 <MacTed> Zakim, this is rdfwg
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, this is rdfwg ←
15:01:13 <Zakim> ok, MacTed; that matches SW_RDFWG()11:00AM
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, MacTed; that matches SW_RDFWG()11:00AM ←
15:01:18 <MacTed> Zakim, who's here?
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, who's here? ←
15:01:18 <Zakim> On the phone I see [IPcaller], guus, Sandro, OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see [IPcaller], guus, Sandro, OpenLink_Software ←
15:01:20 <Zakim> On IRC I see Arnaud, Scott_Bauer, Zakim, RRSAgent, AndyS1, danbri, SteveH, MacTed, LeeF, Guus, AndyS, mischat, ivan, gavinc, davidwood, NickH, ericP, manu, trackbot, manu1, sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Arnaud, Scott_Bauer, Zakim, RRSAgent, AndyS1, danbri, SteveH, MacTed, LeeF, Guus, AndyS, mischat, ivan, gavinc, davidwood, NickH, ericP, manu, trackbot, manu1, sandro ←
15:01:21 <MacTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
15:01:21 <MacTed> zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: zakim, mute me ←
15:01:25 <Zakim> +MacTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +MacTed; got it ←
15:01:25 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
15:01:27 <Zakim> MacTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should now be muted ←
15:01:29 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
15:01:31 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
15:01:44 <Zakim> -[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: -[IPcaller] ←
15:01:46 <Zakim> +gavinc
Zakim IRC Bot: +gavinc ←
15:01:52 <ivan> zakim, drop me
Ivan Herman: zakim, drop me ←
15:01:53 <Zakim> Ivan is being disconnected
Zakim IRC Bot: Ivan is being disconnected ←
15:01:54 <Zakim> -Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ivan ←
15:02:02 <ivan> zakim dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim dial ivan-voip ←
15:02:12 <Zakim> +Tony
Zakim IRC Bot: +Tony ←
15:02:20 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
Ivan Herman: zakim, dial ivan-voip ←
15:02:20 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, ivan; the call is being made ←
15:02:21 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
15:02:25 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
15:02:28 <Scott_Bauer> Zakim, Tony is me
Scott Bauer: Zakim, Tony is me ←
15:02:28 <Zakim> +Scott_Bauer; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Scott_Bauer; got it ←
15:02:30 <AndyS1> zakim, IPcaller is me
Andy Seaborne: zakim, IPcaller is me ←
15:02:30 <Zakim> +AndyS1; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +AndyS1; got it ←
15:02:36 <davidwood> zakim, code?
David Wood: zakim, code? ←
15:02:36 <Zakim> the conference code is 73394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), davidwood
Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 73394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), davidwood ←
15:02:48 <Zakim> +david
Zakim IRC Bot: +david ←
15:02:51 <Zakim> +Arnaud_LeHors
Zakim IRC Bot: +Arnaud_LeHors ←
15:03:22 <Zakim> +Souri
Zakim IRC Bot: +Souri ←
15:03:42 <Zakim> +??P16
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P16 ←
15:03:52 <pchampin_> zakim, ??P16 is me
Pierre-Antoine Champin: zakim, ??P16 is me ←
15:03:52 <Zakim> +pchampin_; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +pchampin_; got it ←
15:03:59 <pchampin_> zakim, mute me
Pierre-Antoine Champin: zakim, mute me ←
15:03:59 <Zakim> pchampin_ should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: pchampin_ should now be muted ←
15:05:03 <Zakim> +AlexHall
Zakim IRC Bot: +AlexHall ←
15:05:40 <Zakim> +AZ
Zakim IRC Bot: +AZ ←
15:05:40 <gavinc> [08:03] <Zakim> +Souri
Gavin Carothers: [08:03] <Zakim> +Souri ←
15:05:52 <Guus> zakim, who is here?
Guus Schreiber: zakim, who is here? ←
15:05:52 <Zakim> On the phone I see guus, Sandro, MacTed (muted), Ivan, gavinc, Scott_Bauer, AndyS1, david, Arnaud_LeHors (muted), Souri, pchampin_ (muted), AlexHall, AZ
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see guus, Sandro, MacTed (muted), Ivan, gavinc, Scott_Bauer, AndyS1, david, Arnaud_LeHors (muted), Souri, pchampin_ (muted), AlexHall, AZ ←
15:05:56 <Zakim> On IRC I see AZ, AlexHall, Souri, pchampin_, Arnaud, Scott_Bauer, Zakim, RRSAgent, AndyS1, danbri, SteveH, MacTed, LeeF, Guus, AndyS, mischat, ivan, gavinc, davidwood, NickH,
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see AZ, AlexHall, Souri, pchampin_, Arnaud, Scott_Bauer, Zakim, RRSAgent, AndyS1, danbri, SteveH, MacTed, LeeF, Guus, AndyS, mischat, ivan, gavinc, davidwood, NickH, ←
15:05:59 <Zakim> ... ericP, manu, trackbot, manu1, sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: ... ericP, manu, trackbot, manu1, sandro ←
15:06:12 <zwu2> zakim, code?
15:06:12 <Zakim> the conference code is 73394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), zwu2
Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 73394 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), zwu2 ←
15:06:49 <Zakim> + +1.650.265.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.650.265.aaaa ←
15:06:50 <gavinc> scribenick: Souri
(Scribe set to Souripriya Das)
15:06:58 <zwu2> zakim, .aaaa is me
15:06:59 <Zakim> sorry, zwu2, I do not recognize a party named '.aaaa'
Zakim IRC Bot: sorry, zwu2, I do not recognize a party named '.aaaa' ←
15:07:09 <zwu2> zakim, +1.650.265.aaaa is me
Zhe Wu: zakim, +1.650.265.aaaa is me ←
15:07:10 <Zakim> +zwu2; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +zwu2; got it ←
15:07:14 <zwu2> zakim, mute me
15:07:14 <Zakim> zwu2 should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: zwu2 should now be muted ←
15:07:36 <Souri> guus: short meeting today, addressing couple of issues
Guus Schreiber: short meeting today, addressing couple of issues ←
15:07:45 <Zakim> + +1.415.586.aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.415.586.aabb ←
15:07:47 <pchampin_> topic: admin
15:07:53 <AZ> The link is broken
Antoine Zimmermann: The link is broken ←
15:07:59 <AZ> http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/meeting/2011-10-05
Antoine Zimmermann: http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/meeting/2011-10-05 ←
15:08:32 <davidwood> Minutes are linked from http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/F2F2 and the links worl
David Wood: Minutes are linked from http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/F2F2 and the links worl ←
15:08:40 <Souri> davidwood: the link from F2F page works for me
David Wood: the link from F2F page works for me ←
15:09:43 <Souri> guus: we will leave it and come back to it next time
Guus Schreiber: we will leave it and come back to it next time ←
15:09:54 <pchampin_> topic: action items
15:10:14 <Souri> guus: Issue-3.
15:10:46 <Souri> davidwood: old comments list for the old RDF group, summarizing things that we may want to take a look at
David Wood: old comments list for the old RDF group, summarizing things that we may want to take a look at ←
15:10:58 <Souri> ... get some students to look at them
... get some students to look at them ←
15:11:01 <sandro> (the scribe -- Yves -- never did the post meeting stuff. it's now in place, but still has various scribe errors. http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/meeting/2011-10-05 )
Sandro Hawke: (the scribe -- Yves -- never did the post meeting stuff. it's now in place, but still has various scribe errors. http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/meeting/2011-10-05 ) ←
15:11:32 <JeremyCarroll> q- aabb
Jeremy Carroll: q- aabb ←
15:11:35 <Souri> ACTION: guus To find volunteers for ISSUE-3
ACTION: guus To find volunteers for ISSUE-3 ←
15:11:35 <trackbot> Created ACTION-111 - Find volunteers for ISSUE-3 [on Guus Schreiber - due 2011-10-26].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-111 - Find volunteers for ISSUE-3 [on Guus Schreiber - due 2011-10-26]. ←
15:11:45 <JeremyCarroll> Zakim, I am aabb
Jeremy Carroll: Zakim, I am aabb ←
15:11:46 <Zakim> +JeremyCarroll; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +JeremyCarroll; got it ←
15:11:58 <JeremyCarroll> ack JeremyCarroll
Jeremy Carroll: ack JeremyCarroll ←
15:12:13 <Souri> guus: davidwood to work with Pat to see Issue-76 can be closed
Guus Schreiber: davidwood to work with Pat to see ISSUE-76 can be closed ←
15:12:38 <Souri> davidwood: action can be closed, but ISSUE-76 needs to remain open
David Wood: action can be closed, but ISSUE-76 needs to remain open ←
15:13:02 <Zakim> +??P24
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P24 ←
15:13:09 <NickH> Zakim, ??P24 is me
Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, ??P24 is me ←
15:13:09 <Zakim> +NickH; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +NickH; got it ←
15:13:14 <NickH> Zakim, mute me
Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, mute me ←
15:13:14 <Zakim> NickH should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: NickH should now be muted ←
15:13:24 <pchampin_> I met Fabien RL recently; he's well, but has been very very busy
Pierre-Antoine Champin: I met Fabien RL recently; he's well, but has been very very busy ←
15:13:37 <Souri> guus: pending review action RDF/XML syntax spec
Guus Schreiber: pending review action RDF/XML syntax spec ←
15:13:38 <gavinc> ack +1.415.586.aabb
Gavin Carothers: ack +1.415.586.aabb ←
15:14:27 <Souri> davidwood: we may need a new editor for that document
David Wood: we may need a new editor for that document ←
15:15:50 <Souri> guus: action for gen id continues
Guus Schreiber: action for gen id continues ←
15:16:35 <Souri> guus: action item for richard: update the page on the graph task force, won't close it because richard is not here
Guus Schreiber: action item for richard: update the page on the graph task force, won't close it because richard is not here ←
15:17:51 <Souri> guus: Action-97 update for RDF Conepts, continues
Guus Schreiber: ACTION-97 update for RDF Conepts, continues ←
15:18:25 <gavinc> ACTION-98?
15:18:25 <trackbot> ACTION-98 -- Sandro Hawke to rdf: and rdfs: namespace should resolve to something that meets best practices -- due 2011-10-20 -- OPEN
Trackbot IRC Bot: ACTION-98 -- Sandro Hawke to rdf: and rdfs: namespace should resolve to something that meets best practices -- due 2011-10-20 -- OPEN ←
15:18:25 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/actions/98
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/actions/98 ←
15:18:44 <gavinc> I think the theory was to assign it to Sandro until Ivan was here?
Gavin Carothers: I think the theory was to assign it to Sandro until Ivan was here? ←
15:20:09 <Souri> Ivan: wonders if this is not something we should rather do when we have the RDF vocab doc updated, add the necessary RDFa for that instead of redoing
Ivan Herman: wonders if this is not something we should rather do when we have the RDF vocab doc updated, add the necessary RDFa for that instead of redoing ←
15:20:12 <pchampin_> +1 to using the RDFS rec + RDFa as the RDFS namespace document
Pierre-Antoine Champin: +1 to using the RDFS rec + RDFa as the RDFS namespace document ←
15:22:45 <Souri> guus: taking up the minutes from F2F2
Guus Schreiber: taking up the minutes from F2F2 ←
15:23:07 <MacTed> Zakim, unmute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, unmute me ←
15:23:07 <Zakim> MacTed should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: MacTed should no longer be muted ←
15:23:14 <sandro> +1 be explicit that we need to ask for feedback on terms like "RDF Graph"
Sandro Hawke: +1 be explicit that we need to ask for feedback on terms like "RDF Graph" ←
15:23:53 <Souri> guus: explicitly need to ask for feedback on terms like RDF Graph
Guus Schreiber: explicitly need to ask for feedback on terms like RDF Graph ←
15:24:09 <Souri> guus: revisit once we get community feedback
Guus Schreiber: revisit once we get community feedback ←
15:24:49 <Souri> davidwood: SPARQL and Provenance group feedback as well
David Wood: SPARQL and Provenance group feedback as well ←
15:25:27 <Souri> ACTION: guus to add the resolution text on the graph terminology
ACTION: guus to add the resolution text on the graph terminology ←
15:25:27 <trackbot> Created ACTION-112 - Add the resolution text on the graph terminology [on Guus Schreiber - due 2011-10-26].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-112 - Add the resolution text on the graph terminology [on Guus Schreiber - due 2011-10-26]. ←
15:26:09 <gavinc> for example +â for test cases
Gavin Carothers: for example +â for test cases ←
15:26:28 <JeremyCarroll> q+ to mention class extension under 71
Jeremy Carroll: q+ to mention class extension under 71 ←
15:26:40 <Souri> guus: any more remarks on the first day's minutes
Guus Schreiber: any more remarks on the first day's minutes ←
15:27:14 <Souri> guus: going to F2F2 day 2 minutes
Guus Schreiber: going to F2F2 day 2 minutes ←
15:27:52 <Zakim> +LeeF
Zakim IRC Bot: +LeeF ←
15:28:02 <Zakim> -NickH
Zakim IRC Bot: -NickH ←
15:28:09 <gavinc> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-wg/2011Sep/0083.html text for resolving issue-71
Gavin Carothers: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-wg/2011Sep/0083.html text for resolving ISSUE-71 ←
15:28:28 <Zakim> +??P24
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P24 ←
15:28:32 <NickH> Zakim, ??P24 is me
Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, ??P24 is me ←
15:28:32 <Zakim> +NickH; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +NickH; got it ←
15:28:35 <NickH> Zakim, mute me
Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, mute me ←
15:28:35 <Zakim> NickH should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: NickH should now be muted ←
15:29:48 <sandro> I understood it to be really sections, not appendices.
Sandro Hawke: I understood it to be really sections, not appendices. ←
15:29:50 <JeremyCarroll> ACTION: JeremyCarroll to propose modification to issue 71 to give class ext to lang-string
ACTION: JeremyCarroll to propose modification to ISSUE-71 to give class ext to lang-string ←
15:29:50 <trackbot> Created ACTION-113 - Propose modification to issue 71 to give class ext to lang-string [on Jeremy Carroll - due 2011-10-26].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-113 - Propose modification to ISSUE-71 to give class ext to lang-string [on Jeremy Carroll - due 2011-10-26]. ←
15:30:30 <Zakim> +Peter_Patel-Schneider
Zakim IRC Bot: +Peter_Patel-Schneider ←
15:31:07 <Souri> guus: accept the minutes for Boston F2F2 with the amendments
Guus Schreiber: accept the minutes for Boston F2F2 with the amendments ←
15:31:33 <gavinc> Zakim, mute me
Gavin Carothers: Zakim, mute me ←
15:31:33 <Zakim> gavinc should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: gavinc should now be muted ←
15:32:19 <sandro> issue-21?
15:32:19 <trackbot> ISSUE-21 -- Can Node-IDs be shared between parts of a quad/multigraph format? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-21 -- Can Node-IDs be shared between parts of a quad/multigraph format? -- open ←
15:32:19 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/issues/21
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/issues/21 ←
15:32:19 <Souri> guus: two smaller issues: first, scope of bnode in TriG: does it raise new issues?
Guus Schreiber: two smaller issues: first, scope of bnode in TriG: does it raise new issues? ←
15:32:38 <Souri> sandro: it is already there ISSUE-21, right?
Sandro Hawke: it is already there ISSUE-21, right? ←
15:32:48 <Souri> guus: right
Guus Schreiber: right ←
15:33:12 <sandro> issue-77?
15:33:13 <trackbot> ISSUE-77 -- Should we mark rdf:Seq as archaic (cf ISSUE-24) -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-77 -- Should we mark rdf:Seq as archaic (cf ISSUE-24) -- open ←
15:33:13 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/issues/77
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/issues/77 ←
15:33:21 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:33:27 <Souri> guus: second issue ISSUE-77: should we mark rdf:seq as archaic
Guus Schreiber: second issue ISSUE-77: should we mark rdf:seq as archaic ←
15:34:00 <ivan> ack JeremyCarroll
Ivan Herman: ack JeremyCarroll ←
15:34:01 <Zakim> JeremyCarroll, you wanted to mention class extension under 71
Zakim IRC Bot: JeremyCarroll, you wanted to mention class extension under 71 ←
15:34:14 <JeremyCarroll> Zakim, mute me
Jeremy Carroll: Zakim, mute me ←
15:34:14 <Zakim> JeremyCarroll should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: JeremyCarroll should now be muted ←
15:34:49 <ivan> q-
Ivan Herman: q- ←
15:35:29 <JeremyCarroll> q+ to suggest minimize informative txt on Seq
Jeremy Carroll: q+ to suggest minimize informative txt on Seq ←
15:35:47 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:35:56 <Souri> sandro: simple lists can be called well-formed lists, gently say don't use non-well-formed lists
Sandro Hawke: simple lists can be called well-formed lists, gently say don't use non-well-formed lists ←
15:36:45 <JeremyCarroll> ack me
Jeremy Carroll: ack me ←
15:36:46 <Zakim> JeremyCarroll, you wanted to suggest minimize informative txt on Seq
Zakim IRC Bot: JeremyCarroll, you wanted to suggest minimize informative txt on Seq ←
15:36:46 <gavinc> -0.5 to reopening archaic vs. deprecated conversation
Gavin Carothers: -0.5 to reopening archaic vs. deprecated conversation ←
15:37:10 <AndyS1> Maybe something like "Using well-formed lists maximises interoperability"
Andy Seaborne: Maybe something like "Using well-formed lists maximises interoperability" ←
15:37:41 <AndyS1> ... or "usability" (bit more opinioned)
Andy Seaborne: ... or "usability" (bit more opinioned) ←
15:37:44 <sandro> JeremyCarroll: move the "archaic" stuff to an appendix.
Jeremy Carroll: move the "archaic" stuff to an appendix. [ Scribe Assist by Sandro Hawke ] ←
15:38:04 <Souri> jeremycarroll: put informative text in the appendix of the primer (use words such as 'archaic' in there ...)
Jeremy Carroll: put informative text in the appendix of the primer (use words such as 'archaic' in there ...) ←
15:39:19 <Souri> jeremycarroll: ... have a link to the old text
Jeremy Carroll: ... have a link to the old text ←
15:40:55 <Souri> Ivan: its not only a question of labeling them as archaic etc, do you also change the RDFsemantics such as rdf:_1, rdf:_2, etc. These are problems for inferencing because they lead to infinite number of things. Propose taking them out of RDF and RDFS core.
Ivan Herman: its not only a question of labeling them as archaic etc, do you also change the RDFsemantics such as rdf:_1, rdf:_2, etc. These are problems for inferencing because they lead to infinite number of things. Propose taking them out of RDF and RDFS core. ←
15:41:16 <Souri> Ivan: these are not editorial changes
Ivan Herman: these are not only editorial changes ←
15:41:32 <pchampin_> s/are not/are not only/
15:42:17 <Souri> ... does the RDF and RDFS rules need to take care of the rdf:_n? if not, we should adjust them ...
... does the RDF and RDFS rules need to take care of the rdf:_n? if not, we should adjust them ... ←
15:42:24 <JeremyCarroll> q+ to comment on ivan's comment
Jeremy Carroll: q+ to comment on ivan's comment ←
15:42:34 <Souri> pfps: agree with Ivan, might be a good idea
Peter Patel-Schneider: agree with Ivan, might be a good idea ←
15:42:37 <Guus> ack ivan
Guus Schreiber: ack ivan ←
15:42:40 <JeremyCarroll> ack me
Jeremy Carroll: ack me ←
15:42:41 <Zakim> JeremyCarroll, you wanted to comment on ivan's comment
Zakim IRC Bot: JeremyCarroll, you wanted to comment on ivan's comment ←
15:42:49 <Souri> ... not just an RDF and RDFS only issue
... not just an RDF and RDFS only issue ←
15:43:53 <Zakim> -NickH
Zakim IRC Bot: -NickH ←
15:43:59 <pfps> I don't think that anyone at the OWL level worries about the infinite base of RDFS, as there are an infinite number of entailments in OWL anyway.
Peter Patel-Schneider: I don't think that anyone at the OWL level worries about the infinite base of RDFS, as there are an infinite number of entailments in OWL anyway. ←
15:44:09 <AndyS1> rdfs:member is used.
Andy Seaborne: rdfs:member is used. ←
15:44:09 <JeremyCarroll> Zakim, mute me
Jeremy Carroll: Zakim, mute me ←
15:44:09 <Zakim> JeremyCarroll should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: JeremyCarroll should now be muted ←
15:44:13 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:44:30 <Guus> ack ivan
Guus Schreiber: ack ivan ←
15:44:37 <JeremyCarroll> Jeremy said that ivan's point, that some RDF semantics rules are complicated for rdf:_8 etc
Jeremy Carroll: Jeremy said that ivan's point, that some RDF semantics rules are complicated for rdf:_8 etc ←
15:44:41 <Zakim> +??P24
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P24 ←
15:44:42 <NickH> Zakim, ??P24 is me
Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, ??P24 is me ←
15:44:43 <Zakim> +NickH; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +NickH; got it ←
15:44:44 <NickH> Zakim, mute me
Nicholas Humfrey: Zakim, mute me ←
15:44:44 <Zakim> NickH should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: NickH should now be muted ←
15:44:56 <pchampin_> jeremy: agree with Ivan, and I don't think people that use rdf:Seq are relying on rdf:_n implying membership
Jeremy Carroll: agree with Ivan, and I don't think people that use rdf:Seq are relying on rdf:_n implying membership [ Scribe Assist by Pierre-Antoine Champin ] ←
15:44:57 <JeremyCarroll> Jeremy: does anyone really use these rules?
Jeremy Carroll: does anyone really use these rules? [ Scribe Assist by Jeremy Carroll ] ←
15:45:12 <gavinc> rdfs:member is implemented a property function in Jena ARQ isn't it?
Gavin Carothers: rdfs:member is implemented a property function in Jena ARQ isn't it? ←
15:45:45 <AndyS1> gavinc, yes (usually) and also by Jena rules for RDFS so API as well as SPARQL
Andy Seaborne: gavinc, yes (usually) and also by Jena rules for RDFS so API as well as SPARQL ←
15:45:46 <SteveH> rdfs:member was implemented as an inference rule in 3store, but no-ones asked for it in 4store
Steve Harris: rdfs:member was implemented as an inference rule in 3store, but no-ones asked for it in 4store ←
15:45:52 <pfps> in some sense the gain may be too small to overcome *any* pain, so why bother even trying
Peter Patel-Schneider: in some sense the gain may be too small to overcome *any* pain, so why bother even trying ←
15:45:54 <Souri> Ivan: theoretical possibility of a problem ... SPARQL on a member of a bag or seq may rely on rdf:_n being subproperty of rdfs:member
Ivan Herman: theoretical possibility of a problem ... SPARQL on a member of a bag or seq may rely on rdf:_n being subproperty of rdfs:member ←
15:46:07 <ivan> ok SteveH, good to know that
Ivan Herman: ok SteveH, good to know that ←
15:46:19 <AndyS1> People use rdfs:member a bit : as list more common, list:member used more.
Andy Seaborne: People use rdfs:member a bit : as list more common, list:member used more. ←
15:46:20 <JeremyCarroll> Zakim, mute me
Jeremy Carroll: Zakim, mute me ←
15:46:20 <Zakim> JeremyCarroll was already muted, JeremyCarroll
Zakim IRC Bot: JeremyCarroll was already muted, JeremyCarroll ←
15:46:22 <gavinc> SteveH, I did! And you said to use lists instead... which we did ;)
Gavin Carothers: SteveH, I did! And you said to use lists instead... which we did ;) ←
15:46:44 <SteveH> gavinc, oh! sorry :) doubt it was me that said use lists though
Steve Harris: gavinc, oh! sorry :) doubt it was me that said use lists though ←
15:46:54 <SteveH> ok, at least one person asked for rdfs:member :)
Steve Harris: ok, at least one person asked for rdfs:member :) ←
15:47:47 <Souri> Ivan: have a slight difference with sandro
Ivan Herman: one problem is that Sandro's proposal uses specific terminology, but Guus says that's already decided ←
15:47:56 <SteveH> FWIW, in the last commonly-used schema I had a hand in we had to invent our own ordinal system as both Seq and List weren't up to the job
Steve Harris: FWIW, in the last commonly-used schema I had a hand in we had to invent our own ordinal system as both Seq and List weren't up to the job ←
15:48:18 <SteveH> [ :foo "a" ; :ordinal 1 ] etc.
Steve Harris: [ :foo "a" ; :ordinal 1 ] etc. ←
15:48:21 <Souri> guus: hopefully by next week we can get to the resolution
Guus Schreiber: hopefully by next week we can get to the resolution ←
15:49:02 <sandro> s/have a slight difference with sandro/one problem is that Sandro's proposal uses specific terminology, but Guus says that's already decided/
15:49:08 <pfps> +1
15:49:20 <pfps> +1 to sandro
Peter Patel-Schneider: +1 to sandro ←
15:49:45 <gavinc> +1 for progress
Gavin Carothers: +1 for progress ←
15:49:48 <AndyS1> email better for wordsmithing IMO
Andy Seaborne: email better for wordsmithing IMO ←
15:49:57 <Souri> +1 to next week or emails
+1 to next week or emails ←
15:50:17 <JeremyCarroll> +1 for e-mail, I want to get feedback
Jeremy Carroll: +1 for e-mail, I want to get feedback ←
15:50:39 <gavinc> unmute me
Gavin Carothers: unmute me ←
15:50:43 <gavinc> Zakim, unmute me
Gavin Carothers: Zakim, unmute me ←
15:50:43 <Zakim> gavinc should no longer be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: gavinc should no longer be muted ←
15:50:44 <AndyS1> AndyS -- regrets for next week: ISWC
Andy Seaborne: AndyS -- regrets for next week: ISWC ←
15:51:02 <ivan> Ivan -- regrets for next week: ISWC
Ivan Herman: Ivan -- regrets for next week: ISWC ←
15:52:03 <pfps> could we set up a room at ISWC for the meeting?
Peter Patel-Schneider: could we set up a room at ISWC for the meeting? ←
15:52:12 <Souri> guus: I'll be at ISWC as well, but expect to join telcon via IRC
Guus Schreiber: I'll be at ISWC as well, but expect to join telcon via IRC ←
15:53:08 <Zakim> -LeeF
Zakim IRC Bot: -LeeF ←
15:53:16 <Zakim> -Peter_Patel-Schneider
Zakim IRC Bot: -Peter_Patel-Schneider ←
15:53:17 <Zakim> -NickH
Zakim IRC Bot: -NickH ←
15:53:20 <gavinc> trackbot, end meeting
Gavin Carothers: trackbot, end meeting ←
15:53:20 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, list attendees ←
15:53:20 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been guus, Sandro, MacTed, Ivan, gavinc, Scott_Bauer, AndyS1, david, Arnaud_LeHors, Souri, pchampin_, AlexHall, AZ, zwu2, +1.415.586.aabb,
Zakim IRC Bot: As of this point the attendees have been guus, Sandro, MacTed, Ivan, gavinc, Scott_Bauer, AndyS1, david, Arnaud_LeHors, Souri, pchampin_, AlexHall, AZ, zwu2, +1.415.586.aabb, ←
15:53:21 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, please draft minutes ←
15:53:21 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-minutes.html trackbot
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-minutes.html trackbot ←
15:53:22 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, bye ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-actions.rdf :
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see 3 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-actions.rdf : ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> ACTION: guus To find volunteers for ISSUE-3 [1]
ACTION: guus To find volunteers for ISSUE-3 [1] ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc#T15-11-35
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc#T15-11-35 ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> ACTION: guus to add the resolution text on the graph terminology [2]
ACTION: guus to add the resolution text on the graph terminology [2] ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc#T15-25-27
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc#T15-25-27 ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> ACTION: JeremyCarroll to propose modification to issue 71 to give class ext to lang-string [3]
ACTION: JeremyCarroll to propose modification to ISSUE-71 to give class ext to lang-string [3] ←
15:53:22 <RRSAgent> recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc#T15-29-50
RRSAgent IRC Bot: recorded in http://www.w3.org/2011/10/19-rdf-wg-irc#T15-29-50 ←
15:53:23 <gavinc> Done ;)
Gavin Carothers: Done ;) ←
15:53:23 <Zakim> ... JeremyCarroll, NickH, LeeF, Peter_Patel-Schneider
Zakim IRC Bot: ... JeremyCarroll, NickH, LeeF, Peter_Patel-Schneider ←
15:53:29 <Zakim> -AZ
Zakim IRC Bot: -AZ ←
15:53:35 <Zakim> -AlexHall
Zakim IRC Bot: -AlexHall ←
Formatted by CommonScribe