13:59:00 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/09/29-ldp-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2014/09/29-ldp-irc ←
13:59:02 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
13:59:04 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be LDP
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be LDP ←
13:59:04 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 1 minute ←
13:59:05 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference
13:59:05 <trackbot> Date: 29 September 2014
13:59:43 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started ←
13:59:50 <Zakim> +Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: +Arnaud ←
14:01:05 <Zakim> +[IBM]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IBM] ←
14:01:17 <SteveS> zakim, [IBM] is me
Steve Speicher: zakim, [IBM] is me ←
14:01:18 <Zakim> +SteveS; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +SteveS; got it ←
14:01:47 <Zakim> +deiu
Zakim IRC Bot: +deiu ←
14:01:54 <Zakim> +Ashok_Malhotra
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ashok_Malhotra ←
14:04:33 <Zakim> +OpenLink_Software
Zakim IRC Bot: +OpenLink_Software ←
14:04:42 <TallTed> Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, OpenLink_Software is temporarily me ←
14:04:42 <Zakim> +TallTed; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +TallTed; got it ←
14:04:44 <TallTed> Zakim, mute me
Ted Thibodeau: Zakim, mute me ←
14:04:44 <Zakim> TallTed should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: TallTed should now be muted ←
14:05:08 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
14:05:21 <bblfish_> Zakim, IPcaller is me
Henry Story: Zakim, IPcaller is me ←
14:05:21 <Zakim> +bblfish_; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +bblfish_; got it ←
14:05:29 <bblfish> hi
Henry Story: hi ←
14:05:51 <Zakim> +Roger
Zakim IRC Bot: +Roger ←
14:05:59 <Zakim> +Alexandre
Zakim IRC Bot: +Alexandre ←
14:07:06 <SteveS> Scribe: SteveS
(Scribe set to Steve Speicher)
<SteveS> chair: Arnaud
<SteveS> agenda: https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/wiki/Meetings:Telecon2014.09.29
14:07:25 <Arnaud> Proposal: Approve the minutes of the 22 September teleconf: http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-09-22
PROPOSED: Approve the minutes of the 22 September teleconf: http://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-09-22 ←
14:07:34 <SteveS> Topic: Admin
<SteveS> Proposed: approve last week's minutes: https://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-09-22
PROPOSED: approve last week's minutes: https://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-09-22 ←
14:07:53 <SteveS> Arnaud: no objectsion, approved
Arnaud Le Hors: no objections, approved ←
14:08:06 <SteveS> s/objectsion/objections/
<SteveS> Resolved: Minutes of 22 September 2014: https://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-09-22 approved
RESOLVED: Minutes of 22 September 2014: https://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/ldp/2014-09-22 approved ←
14:08:28 <SteveS> Next meeting 10.06, not conflicts
Next meeting 10.06, not conflicts ←
14:08:32 <betehess> https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/101
Alexandre Bertails: https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/101 ←
14:08:35 <SteveS> Topic: Tracking of Actions and Issues
14:08:54 <SteveS> Arnaud: new issue opened around ldpatch ISSUE-101
Arnaud Le Hors: new issue opened around ldpatch ISSUE-101 ←
14:09:24 <SteveS> betehess: Summarizes what is being requested in 101, via plain ole turtle
Alexandre Bertails: Summarizes what is being requested in 101, via plain ole turtle ←
14:09:42 <SteveS> Arnaud: any objections to opening issue?
Arnaud Le Hors: any objections to opening issue? ←
14:09:55 <SteveS> RESOLVED: Open Issue-101
14:10:04 <SteveS> Topic: 2NN
14:10:24 <SteveS> Arnaud: It is basically dead, based on a forwarded note from mnot to sandro
Arnaud Le Hors: It is basically dead, based on a forwarded note from mnot to sandro ←
14:11:22 <SteveS> mnot has reported that the WG is not in support of it, though he has invited someone to come to F2F meeting in November to present/defend it
mnot has reported that the WG is not in support of it, though he has invited someone to come to F2F meeting in November to present/defend it ←
14:12:19 <SteveS> (Arnaud summarizes approval process on issues within HTTP WG)
(Arnaud summarizes approval process on issues within HTTP WG) ←
14:12:20 <Zakim> +Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: +Sandro ←
14:13:07 <SteveS> Arnaud: will need to pull from LDP-Paging, 2NN specifically
Arnaud Le Hors: will need to pull from LDP-Paging, 2NN specifically ←
14:13:29 <SteveS> sandro: there are some other options on the table that meet some of our requirements
Sandro Hawke: there are some other options on the table that meet some of our requirements ←
14:13:32 <Zakim> +ericP
Zakim IRC Bot: +ericP ←
14:14:46 <SteveS> sandro: idea would be to possibly have a request header to indicate to follow the link for the client and respond with 200
Sandro Hawke: idea would be to possibly have a request header to indicate to follow the link for the client and respond with 200 ←
14:15:03 <SteveS> …tbl thinks this doesn’t match quite 200 but ok with it
…tbl thinks this doesn’t match quite 200 but ok with it ←
14:15:39 <SteveS> …another proposal is to use Prefer header, such as follow-303
…another proposal is to use Prefer header, such as follow-303 ←
14:16:10 <SteveS> …a header has a lower bar than status code, prefer even lower bar
…a header has a lower bar than status code, prefer even lower bar ←
14:16:12 <bblfish> That last one I like the most - put the body in the 303
Henry Story: That last one I like the most - put the body in the 303 ←
14:16:47 <SteveS> …3rd was to reply with 303 response code and entity body
…3rd was to reply with 303 response code and entity body ←
14:17:24 <bblfish> agree
Henry Story: agree ←
14:17:51 <bblfish> q+
Henry Story: q+ ←
14:18:49 <SteveS> …last option was to supply link or content-location headers with 200 response
…last option was to supply link or content-location headers with 200 response ←
14:19:20 <Zakim> +??P19
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P19 ←
14:19:32 <nmihindu> Zakim, ??P19 is me
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: Zakim, ??P19 is me ←
14:19:32 <Zakim> +nmihindu; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +nmihindu; got it ←
14:19:41 <nmihindu> Zakim, mute me
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: Zakim, mute me ←
14:19:41 <Zakim> nmihindu should now be muted
Zakim IRC Bot: nmihindu should now be muted ←
14:20:05 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
14:20:27 <SteveS> bblfish: likes the 303 option the best, to include the entity body
Henry Story: likes the 303 option the best, to include the entity body ←
14:20:58 <SteveS> bblfish: summarizes some experience with atompub wg
Henry Story: summarizes some experience with atompub wg ←
14:22:24 <SteveS> bblfish: perhaps we could suggest a clarification with use of our options, such as with 303 option
Henry Story: perhaps we could suggest a clarification with use of our options, such as with 303 option ←
14:23:02 <SteveS> sandro: things the Prefer header option is the best one
Sandro Hawke: thinks the Prefer header option is the best one ←
14:23:23 <SteveS> s/things/thinks/
14:24:03 <SteveS> Arnaud: sounds like we get the same behavior as 2nn with the Prefer header
Arnaud Le Hors: sounds like we get the same behavior as 2nn with the Prefer header ←
14:24:32 <bblfish> I don't really like the Prefer header
Henry Story: I don't really like the Prefer header ←
14:25:33 <SteveS> sandro: has the nice feature, that servers will know that clients can handle getting a 200 with redirect content included and Preference-applied response header
Sandro Hawke: has the nice feature, that servers will know that clients can handle getting a 200 with redirect content included and Preference-applied response header ←
14:26:43 <SteveS> ericP: there is a chance that a f2f discussion with mnot and tbl in coming days can determine the health of 2nn proposal
Eric Prud'hommeaux: there is a chance that a f2f discussion with mnot and tbl in coming days can determine the health of 2nn proposal ←
14:28:18 <SteveS> Arnaud: anyone want to go to Hawaii to defend 2nn proposal?
Arnaud Le Hors: anyone want to go to Hawaii to defend 2nn proposal? ←
14:28:24 <SteveS> …not hearing anyone
…not hearing anyone ←
14:29:43 <SteveS> sandro: trying to get a read on direction of various proposals, if wg is good with prefer and stop effort on 2nn
Sandro Hawke: trying to get a read on direction of various proposals, if wg is good with prefer and stop effort on 2nn ←
14:30:40 <bblfish> q+
Henry Story: q+ ←
14:31:12 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
14:31:38 <SteveS> SteveS: don’t have a big need for 2nn, though the prefer option seems reasonable
Steve Speicher: don’t have a big need for 2nn, though the prefer option seems reasonable ←
14:32:08 <betehess> +1 to don’t have a big need for 2nn, though the prefer option seems reasonable
Alexandre Bertails: +1 to don’t have a big need for 2nn, though the prefer option seems reasonable ←
14:32:27 <SteveS> bblfish: things the prefer option is a bit odd, seems like the need to is request the information as fast as possible
Henry Story: things the prefer option is a bit odd, seems like the need to is request the information as fast as possible ←
14:35:15 <SteveS> Arnaud: think we should agree 2nn is a dead end, then agree which is the nest best option
Arnaud Le Hors: think we should agree 2nn is a dead end, then agree which is the nest best option ←
14:35:26 <Ashok> q+
Ashok Malhotra: q+ ←
14:35:43 <SteveS> STRAWPOLL: To use Prefer header to follow 303 (instead of 2nn)
STRAWPOLL: To use Prefer header to follow 303 (instead of 2nn) ←
14:35:58 <deiu> 0
Andrei Sambra: 0 ←
14:36:04 <Arnaud> ack Ashok
Arnaud Le Hors: ack Ashok ←
14:36:17 <bblfish> is this followed by 303 + some type of content right
Henry Story: is this followed by 303 + some type of content right ←
14:36:29 <SteveS> SteveS: +0.5
Steve Speicher: +0.5 ←
14:36:49 <nmihindu> +0
Nandana Mihindukulasooriya: +0 ←
14:36:50 <SteveS> bblfish, 303 or 200 (most likely 200) whatever we define
bblfish, 303 or 200 (most likely 200) whatever we define ←
14:37:09 <Ashok> +1
Ashok Malhotra: +1 ←
14:37:10 <betehess> +0.5, not against 303+Prefer, would prefer 2NN, but I don't care enough anyway
Alexandre Bertails: +0.5, not against 303+Prefer, would prefer 2NN, but I don't care enough anyway ←
14:37:46 <bblfish> +0.5 for 303, less with 200, I'd rather have the server decide from knowledge of the client if it should or not return 303
Henry Story: +0.5 for 303, less with 200, I'd rather have the server decide from knowledge of the client if it should or not return 303 ←
14:38:20 <SteveS> Arnaud: seems like people are leaning towards Prefer header approach
Arnaud Le Hors: seems like people are leaning towards Prefer header approach ←
14:38:32 <SteveS> Topic: Paging
14:38:42 <sandro> bblfish, one could do both... the client could say it wants the body of a 303 returned as a 200 or as a 303. not sure why.
Sandro Hawke: bblfish, one could do both... the client could say it wants the body of a 303 returned as a 200 or as a 303. not sure why. ←
14:39:35 <SteveS> Arnaud: JohnArwe had some back and forward on the mailing list, not sure if accepting of response or no time to respond
Arnaud Le Hors: JohnArwe had some back and forward on the mailing list, not sure if accepting of response or no time to respond ←
14:39:46 <SteveS> …need to get them to say they are ok with response
…need to get them to say they are ok with response ←
14:39:48 <bblfish> ( I'd rather 303 - makes more sense to me - with a hint from the client making it more regular . Perhaps the client could just say that it is LDP aware )
Henry Story: ( I'd rather 303 - makes more sense to me - with a hint from the client making it more regular . Perhaps the client could just say that it is LDP aware ) ←
14:40:15 <bblfish> complicated issue really
Henry Story: complicated issue really ←
14:40:28 <bblfish> wonder what happens with 303 and caches.
Henry Story: wonder what happens with 303 and caches. ←
14:41:24 <SteveS> ACTION: on SteveS to response confirming agreement from paging commenters
ACTION: on SteveS to response confirming agreement from paging commenters ←
14:41:24 <trackbot> Error finding 'on'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/users>.
Trackbot IRC Bot: Error finding 'on'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/users>. ←
14:41:43 <SteveS> Topic: LDP spec
14:42:53 <SteveS> SteveS: have responded to Reto’s comment, awaiting respond
Steve Speicher: have responded to Reto’s comment, awaiting respond ←
14:43:10 <SteveS> Ashok: has read it and ok with the change
Ashok Malhotra: has read it and ok with the change ←
14:43:35 <SteveS> Arnaud: if anyone has any feedback, then please give, otherwise we’ll continue down this road.
Arnaud Le Hors: if anyone has any feedback, then please give, otherwise we’ll continue down this road. ←
14:43:53 <SteveS> Topic: LDP Implementation progress
14:44:12 <SteveS> bblfish: making progress with indirection containers
Henry Story: making progress with indirection containers ←
14:44:20 <SteveS> Topic: Primer
14:44:51 <SteveS> Arnaud: issue with primer, went out as rec-track unintentionally, triggered call for exception for patents
Arnaud Le Hors: issue with primer, went out as rec-track unintentionally, triggered call for exception for patents ←
14:46:02 <SteveS> roger: did some updates to the primer, not quite ready for re-publication
Roger Menday: did some updates to the primer, not quite ready for re-publication ←
14:46:29 <SteveS> Topic: LD Patch
14:47:38 <SteveS> betehess: talking about ISSUE-101, some complex turtle to add in would be difficult with current Add statements
Alexandre Bertails: talking about ISSUE-101, some complex turtle to add in would be difficult with current Add statements ←
14:48:15 <SteveS> …impls would need to deal with full turtle
…impls would need to deal with full turtle ←
14:49:52 <SteveS> SteveS: if just appending triples, then one could just use PATCH or POST with text/turtle
Steve Speicher: if just appending triples, then one could just use PATCH or POST with text/turtle ←
14:50:17 <SteveS> betehess: this really isn’t defined and only supports append, it wouldn’t be too much to add to LD-Patch
Alexandre Bertails: this really isn’t defined and only supports append, it wouldn’t be too much to add to LD-Patch ←
14:50:23 <bblfish> q+
Henry Story: q+ ←
14:50:31 <Arnaud> ack bblfish
Arnaud Le Hors: ack bblfish ←
14:50:49 <SteveS> bblfish: does this make LD Patch closer to Turtle Patch?
Henry Story: does this make LD Patch closer to Turtle Patch? ←
14:50:53 <SteveS> betehess: no, not related
Alexandre Bertails: no, not related ←
14:52:22 <ericP> q+
Eric Prud'hommeaux: q+ ←
14:52:33 <Arnaud> ack ericP
Arnaud Le Hors: ack ericP ←
14:53:14 <SteveS> ACTION on betehess to add support for arbitrary text/turtle for the Add operation in LDPatch
ACTION on betehess to add support for arbitrary text/turtle for the Add operation in LDPatch ←
14:53:14 <trackbot> Error finding 'on'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/users>.
Trackbot IRC Bot: Error finding 'on'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/users>. ←
14:54:21 <betehess> ACTION: betehess to add support for arbitrary text/turtle for the Add operation in LDPatch
ACTION: betehess to add support for arbitrary text/turtle for the Add operation in LDPatch ←
14:54:21 <trackbot> Created ACTION-150 - Add support for arbitrary text/turtle for the add operation in ldpatch [on Alexandre Bertails - due 2014-10-06].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-150 - Add support for arbitrary text/turtle for the add operation in ldpatch [on Alexandre Bertails - due 2014-10-06]. ←
14:55:20 <Arnaud> https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/100
Arnaud Le Hors: https://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/100 ←
14:55:33 <deiu> q+
Andrei Sambra: q+ ←
14:55:37 <SteveS> ISSUE-100?
14:55:37 <trackbot> ISSUE-100 -- Should ld-patch use a slash like sparql does, instead of as it currently does? -- open
Trackbot IRC Bot: ISSUE-100 -- Should ld-patch use a slash like sparql does, instead of as it currently does? -- open ←
14:55:37 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/100
Trackbot IRC Bot: http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/100 ←
14:55:48 <deiu> q-
Andrei Sambra: q- ←
14:55:52 <deiu> q+
Andrei Sambra: q+ ←
14:55:57 <Arnaud> ack deiu
Arnaud Le Hors: ack deiu ←
14:56:52 <betehess> PROPOSAL: resolve ISSUE-100 by not changing how it's done today
PROPOSED: resolve ISSUE-100 by not changing how it's done today ←
14:56:59 <SteveS> betehess: believes should leave it as is
Alexandre Bertails: believes should leave it as is ←
14:58:01 <deiu> +1 to leaving it as is (easier for parsing and checking for reverse order)
Andrei Sambra: +1 to leaving it as is (easier for parsing and checking for reverse order) ←
14:59:40 <SteveS> SteveS: +0, just be clear what the syntax is
Steve Speicher: +0, just be clear what the syntax is ←
15:01:17 <SteveS> (scribe wasn’t able to capture all the things sandro said regarding ldpatch)
(scribe wasn’t able to capture all the things sandro said regarding ldpatch) ←
15:01:28 <betehess> SteveS, with ISSUE-100, `/schema:performerIn[/schema:url = <http://conferences.ted.com/TED2009/>]` would become `schema:performerIn[schema:url = <http://conferences.ted.com/TED2009/>]`
Alexandre Bertails: SteveS, with ISSUE-100, `/schema:performerIn[/schema:url = <http://conferences.ted.com/TED2009/>]` would become `schema:performerIn[schema:url = <http://conferences.ted.com/TED2009/>]` ←
15:01:36 <betehess> this is *not* SPARQL anyway
Alexandre Bertails: this is *not* SPARQL anyway ←
15:03:11 <bblfish> I kind of agree with Arnaud and Sandro, it's better to be close to Turtle
Henry Story: I kind of agree with Arnaud and Sandro, it's better to be close to Turtle ←
15:03:23 <TallTed> +1 where it's easy to align grammars, definitely better practice to do so.
Ted Thibodeau: +1 where it's easy to align grammars, definitely better practice to do so. ←
15:03:23 <bblfish> due to getting friends everywhere
Henry Story: due to getting friends everywhere ←
15:03:23 <betehess> *how* would you explain `schema:performerIn[schema:url = <http://conferences.ted.com/TED2009/>]` then?
Alexandre Bertails: *how* would you explain `schema:performerIn[schema:url = <http://conferences.ted.com/TED2009/>]` then? ←
15:03:26 <Zakim> -nmihindu
Zakim IRC Bot: -nmihindu ←
15:03:27 <Zakim> -Sandro
Zakim IRC Bot: -Sandro ←
15:03:29 <SteveS> Arnaud: meeting adjourned
Arnaud Le Hors: meeting adjourned ←
15:03:30 <Zakim> -Alexandre
Zakim IRC Bot: -Alexandre ←
15:03:31 <Zakim> -TallTed
Zakim IRC Bot: -TallTed ←
15:03:33 <Zakim> -Arnaud
Zakim IRC Bot: -Arnaud ←
15:03:33 <Zakim> -SteveS
Zakim IRC Bot: -SteveS ←
15:03:34 <Zakim> -Roger
Zakim IRC Bot: -Roger ←
15:03:36 <Zakim> -ericP
Zakim IRC Bot: -ericP ←
15:03:38 <Zakim> -bblfish_
Zakim IRC Bot: -bblfish_ ←
15:03:40 <Zakim> -Ashok_Malhotra
Zakim IRC Bot: -Ashok_Malhotra ←
15:03:40 <Zakim> -deiu
Zakim IRC Bot: -deiu ←
15:03:41 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended ←
15:03:41 <Zakim> Attendees were Arnaud, SteveS, deiu, Ashok_Malhotra, TallTed, bblfish_, Roger, Alexandre, Sandro, ericP, nmihindu
Zakim IRC Bot: Attendees were Arnaud, SteveS, deiu, Ashok_Malhotra, TallTed, bblfish_, Roger, Alexandre, Sandro, ericP, nmihindu ←
<SteveS> present: Arnaud, SteveS, deiu, Ashok_Malhotra, TallTed, bblfish, Roger, Alexandre, Sandro, ericP, nmihindu
15:05:48 <SteveS> deiu, I think the thread that might help is http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2014Sep/0018.html
deiu, I think the thread that might help is http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-ldp-wg/2014Sep/0018.html ←
15:06:05 <deiu> thanks!
Andrei Sambra: thanks! ←
15:06:44 <SteveS> or a reply to that, of course post the question if this doesn’t help
or a reply to that, of course post the question if this doesn’t help ←
15:07:40 <deiu> I don't think that thread was reflected in the primer though
Andrei Sambra: I don't think that thread was reflected in the primer though ←
15:13:23 <SteveS> deiu, you may want to send something to roger and nminindu about that, seems like they are actively updating it and be good to add
(No events recorded for 5 minutes)
deiu, you may want to send something to roger and nminindu about that, seems like they are actively updating it and be good to add ←
15:13:53 <deiu> will do, thanks SteveS
Andrei Sambra: will do, thanks SteveS ←
Formatted by CommonScribe