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14:04:20 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/09/14-dpub-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2015/09/14-dpub-irc ←
14:04:22 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
14:04:24 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be dpub
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be dpub ←
14:04:24 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot
Zakim IRC Bot: I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, trackbot ←
14:04:25 <trackbot> Meeting: Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
14:04:25 <trackbot> Date: 14 September 2015
14:04:33 <ivan> zakim, code?
Ivan Herman: zakim, code? ←
14:04:33 <Zakim> no conference has been identified yet, ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: no conference has been identified yet, ivan ←
14:05:19 <ivan> zakim, this will be https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m09c698f2da7d2f28d301b85cf2d76b08 with password dpub, dial in 644 278 410
Ivan Herman: zakim, this will be https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m09c698f2da7d2f28d301b85cf2d76b08 with password dpub, dial in 644 278 410 ←
14:05:19 <Zakim> I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: I do not see a conference matching that name scheduled within the next hour, ivan ←
14:05:34 <ivan> zakim, this is https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m09c698f2da7d2f28d301b85cf2d76b08 with password dpub, dial in 644 278 410
Ivan Herman: zakim, this is https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m09c698f2da7d2f28d301b85cf2d76b08 with password dpub, dial in 644 278 410 ←
14:05:34 <Zakim> got it, ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: got it, ivan ←
14:05:53 <ivan> Chair: Ivan
14:06:31 <ivan> Regrets+ Tzviya, Markus, Vlad, Deborah, Heather, Julie, Ben, Laura, Jeff, Luc
Ivan Herman: Regrets+ Tzviya, Markus, Vlad, Deborah, Heather, Julie, Ben, Laura, Jeff, Luc ←
14:06:50 <ivan> Agenda: http://www.w3.org/mid/43a7dc9cea074b3e98b0381db0bcf776@CAR-WNMBP-006.wiley.com
14:07:02 <ivan> ivan has changed the topic to: https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m09c698f2da7d2f28d301b85cf2d76b08 with password dpub, dial in 644 278 410
Ivan Herman: ivan has changed the topic to: https://mit.webex.com/mit/j.php?MTID=m09c698f2da7d2f28d301b85cf2d76b08 with password dpub, dial in 644 278 410 ←
14:58:43 <ivan> Present+ Mike_Miller
(No events recorded for 51 minutes)
Ivan Herman: Present+ Mike_Miller ←
14:58:46 <Ralph> present+ Ralph_Swick
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: present+ Ralph_Swick ←
14:59:20 <pkra> Present+ Peter Krautzberger
Peter Krautzberger: Present+ Peter Krautzberger ←
14:59:50 <ivan> Regrets+ Chris
Ivan Herman: Regrets+ Chris ←
15:00:34 <astearns> present+ Alan Stearns
Alan Stearns: present+ Alan Stearns ←
15:01:04 <TimCole> present+ Tim_Cole
Timothy Cole: present+ Tim_Cole ←
15:01:30 <clapierre> present+ Charles_LaPierre
Charles LaPierre: present+ Charles_LaPierre ←
15:01:41 <brady_duga> present+ duga
Brady Duga: present+ duga ←
15:02:06 <Karen> present+ Karen
Karen Myers: present+ Karen ←
15:02:55 <Karen> Scribe: Karen
(Scribe set to Karen Myers)
15:03:12 <Karen> Ivan; We have a lot of regrets today, likely related to today being the Jewish New Year
Ivan; We have a lot of regrets today, likely related to today being the Jewish New Year ←
15:03:21 <Karen> …Let's have first agenda item
...Let's have first agenda item ←
15:03:23 <ivan> http://www.w3.org/2015/08/31-dpub-minutes.html
Ivan Herman: http://www.w3.org/2015/08/31-dpub-minutes.html ←
15:03:26 <NickRuffilo> I'm calling in shortly
Scribe problem: the name 'NickRuffilo' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'NickRuffilo' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown NickRuffilo: I'm calling in shortly ←
15:03:29 <Karen> …minutes from last time
...minutes from last time ←
15:03:30 <NickRuffilo> then i can scribe if necessary
Scribe problem: the name 'NickRuffilo' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'NickRuffilo' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown NickRuffilo: then i can scribe if necessary ←
15:03:39 <Karen> …any problems accepting?
...any problems accepting? ←
15:03:45 <Karen> …Let's record that minutes are accepted
...Let's record that minutes are accepted ←
15:03:56 <ivan> Topic: MathML
15:03:56 <Karen> …Let's go next to topic of the day
...Let's go next to topic of the day ←
15:03:59 <Karen> …MathML
...MathML ←
15:04:08 <Karen> …the reason why we thought it would be worthwhile to have this discussion item
...the reason why we thought it would be worthwhile to have this discussion item ←
15:04:18 <Karen> …because there has been a lot of discussion within MathML on where and how to go
...because there has been a lot of discussion within MathML on where and how to go ←
15:04:24 <Karen> …and consider some radical changes
...and consider some radical changes ←
15:04:28 <Ralph> s/…/.../G
15:04:29 <Karen> …so Peter is going to explain this to us
...so Peter is going to explain this to us ←
15:04:36 <Bill_Kasdorf> present+ Bill_Kasdorf
Bill Kasdorf: present+ Bill_Kasdorf ←
15:04:42 <Karen> …Peter, please take the floor
...Peter, please take the floor ←
15:04:52 <tmichel> present+ Thierry Michel
Thierry Michel: present+ Thierry Michel ←
15:05:09 <Karen> Speaker: Peter
Scribe problem: the name 'Speaker' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Speaker: Peter ←
15:05:23 <Karen> Peter: one of reasons to have this on the agenda, is the discussion on the DigPub mailing list
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Krautzberger Peter Linss . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: one of reasons to have this on the agenda, is the discussion on the DigPub mailing list ←
15:05:40 <Karen> …what came together at last MathML WG meeting is the rechartering of the MathML WG
...what came together at last MathML WG meeting is the rechartering of the MathML WG ←
15:05:50 <Karen> …it is up for rechartering next year
...it is up for rechartering next year ←
15:05:52 <Bert> Present+ Bert
15:06:01 <Karen> …the group has been primarily in maintenance mode and has not created new specs
...the group has been primarily in maintenance mode and has not created new specs ←
15:06:15 <Karen> …it seems that W3C does not want to have WGs just do maintenance work
...it seems that W3C does not want to have WGs just do maintenance work ←
15:06:29 <Karen> …so big discussion just kicked off on last call is what the future of the Math WG would be like
...so big discussion just kicked off on last call is what the future of the Math WG would be like ←
15:06:39 <Karen> …if just maintenance, then it would be turned into a Community Group
...if just maintenance, then it would be turned into a Community Group ←
15:06:46 <Karen> …seems to be the new status for maintenance focused groups
...seems to be the new status for maintenance focused groups ←
15:06:58 <Karen> …if that does not happen, then the Math WG needs some other kind of work item
...if that does not happen, then the Math WG needs some other kind of work item ←
15:07:18 <Karen> …This had not yet led to a lot of discussion on Math WG side, but it has coincided with discussions on Digital Publishing group
...This had not yet led to a lot of discussion on Math WG side, but it has coincided with discussions on Digital Publishing group ←
15:07:26 <Karen> …and the general direction for MathML
...and the general direction for MathML ←
15:07:46 <Karen> …and my general background working for MathJax, library that renders MathML on web browsers
...and my general background working for MathJax, library that renders MathML on web browsers ←
15:07:55 <Karen> …we are working on white paper about potential major revisions
...we are working on white paper about potential major revisions ←
15:08:02 <Karen> …And our long-term goals
...And our long-term goals ←
15:08:09 <Karen> …One goal is to further mathematics on the web
...One goal is to further mathematics on the web ←
15:08:22 <Karen> …and have people publish MathML in browsers
...and have people publish MathML in browsers ←
15:08:31 <Karen> …native MathML support in browsers has been a long-term goal
...native MathML support in browsers has been a long-term goal ←
15:08:48 <Karen> …so thinking about this problem, we have come to realization that we have not been successful in that
...so thinking about this problem, we have come to realization that we have not been successful in that ←
15:09:00 <Karen> …we don't see how we can successfully trigger native browser development for MathML
...we don't see how we can successfully trigger native browser development for MathML ←
15:09:16 <Karen> …so thinking about how mathematics can be realized on the web if native support is not realistic goal
...so thinking about how mathematics can be realized on the web if native support is not realistic goal ←
15:09:24 <Karen> …One of things I brought up
...One of things I brought up ←
15:09:24 <ivan> Present+ Nick
Ivan Herman: Present+ Nick ←
15:09:34 <Karen> …see if feasible to focus on work of DigPub and ARIA
...see if feasible to focus on work of DigPub and ARIA ←
15:09:39 <Ralph> -> http://caniuse.com/#feat=mathml "Can I use MathML? report"
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: -> http://caniuse.com/#feat=mathml "Can I use MathML? report" ←
15:09:39 <Karen> …possibly work on the ARIA side of things
...possibly work on the ARIA side of things ←
15:09:44 <pbelfanti> Present+ Paul Belfanti (Having trouble logging into WebEx)
Paul Belfanti: Present+ Paul Belfanti (Having trouble logging into WebEx) ←
15:09:50 <Karen> …ARIA spec has a glaring hole when it comes to mathematics
...ARIA spec has a glaring hole when it comes to mathematics ←
15:09:56 <Karen> …Seems to be some interest from ARIA folks
...Seems to be some interest from ARIA folks ←
15:10:16 <Karen> …Other side connects to Houdini work and would revolve around the problem of mathematical layout in browser engines
...Other side connects to Houdini work and would revolve around the problem of mathematical layout in browser engines ←
15:10:24 <Karen> …to spec out the math layouts that are challenging in CSS
...to spec out the math layouts that are challenging in CSS ←
15:10:31 <Karen> …this was discussed at last Math WG meeting
...this was discussed at last Math WG meeting ←
15:10:38 <Karen> …There was not that much interest from Math WG itself
...There was not that much interest from Math WG itself ←
15:10:48 <Karen> ..but there is interest by myself personally and from MathJax
..but there is interest by myself personally and from MathJax ←
15:10:57 <Karen> …we don't see how we can get MathML implmented
...we don't see how we can get MathML implmented ←
15:11:09 <Karen> …Let me stop here and open the queue
...Let me stop here and open the queue ←
15:11:12 <ivan> q?
Ivan Herman: q? ←
15:11:18 <Karen> …Does that make sense? Did I miss anything, Ivan?
...Does that make sense? Did I miss anything, Ivan? ←
15:11:23 <Karen> Ivan: Maybe one more fact to add
Ivan Herman: Maybe one more fact to add ←
15:11:37 <Karen> …is of course a Working Group at W3C produces recommendations
...is of course a Working Group at W3C produces recommendations ←
15:11:47 <TimCole> q+
Timothy Cole: q+ ←
15:11:50 <Karen> …under the new charter this group has the possibility to do proof of concept technical work
...under the new charter this group has the possibility to do proof of concept technical work ←
15:11:56 <Karen> …we have more possibilities to do things
...we have more possibilities to do things ←
15:12:09 <Karen> …so some of work and possible directions could very well be done in this group and published by this group
...so some of work and possible directions could very well be done in this group and published by this group ←
15:12:17 <Karen> …so we could help to move things forward; it's an extra liberty
...so we could help to move things forward; it's an extra liberty ←
15:12:19 <Karen> ack Tim
ack Tim ←
15:12:20 <ivan> ack tmichel
Ivan Herman: ack tmichel ←
15:12:25 <ivan> ack TimCole
Ivan Herman: ack TimCole ←
15:12:25 <Karen> Tim: So Peter, one of the other
Scribe problem: the name 'Tim' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Tim Clark Timothy Cole . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Tim: So Peter, one of the other ←
15:12:33 <Karen> …issues that comes up in discussions about MathML
...issues that comes up in discussions about MathML ←
15:12:39 <Karen> …and wonder about its impact of support
...and wonder about its impact of support ←
15:12:54 <Karen> …It is in competition in some circles with LATEX
...It is in competition in some circles with LATEX ←
15:13:08 <Karen> …is there a problem that the community is a little divided about what needs to be decided
...is there a problem that the community is a little divided about what needs to be decided ←
15:13:15 <Karen> …regarding use of mathematics on the web?
...regarding use of mathematics on the web? ←
15:13:21 <Karen> Peter: I would say that is not a real debate
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Krautzberger Peter Linss . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: I would say that is not a real debate ←
15:13:41 <Karen> …certainly the case that LATEC and other input forms are still prevalent and successful
...certainly the case that LATEX and other input forms are still prevalent and successful ←
15:13:52 <ivan> s/LATEC/LATEX/
15:13:52 <Karen> …it's rather verbose so you don't author by hand
...it's rather verbose so you don't author by hand ←
15:13:58 <Karen> …simple syntax
...simple syntax ←
15:14:00 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
Bill Kasdorf: q+ ←
15:14:05 <Karen> …WISIWG has not succeeded
...WISIWG has not succeeded ←
15:14:16 <Karen> …Math WG has overlap with largest group in form of David @
...Math WG has overlap with largest group in form of David @ ←
15:14:32 <Karen> …there is no competition because LATEC tools can understand and render MathML
...there is no competition because LATEC tools can understand and render MathML ←
15:14:39 <Karen> …lots of tools do this
...lots of tools do this ←
15:14:49 <Karen> …more like saying mark-down and HTML are in competition; not a big issue
...more like saying mark-down and HTML are in competition; not a big issue ←
15:14:54 <Karen> …there is one exception
...there is one exception ←
15:15:01 <Karen> …@ academies @
...@ academies @ ←
15:15:04 <Karen> …precursor
...precursor ←
15:15:11 <Karen> …focused on LATEC as a rendering model for the web
...focused on LATEX as a rendering model for the web ←
15:15:19 <ivan> s/LATEC/LATEX/
15:15:23 <Karen> …in our view, since MathJax went another way, not a good strategy
...in our view, since MathJax went another way, not a good strategy ←
15:15:28 <Ralph> -> https://khan.github.io/KaTeX/ KaTeX
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: -> https://khan.github.io/KaTeX/ KaTeX ←
15:15:32 <Bill_Kasdorf> q- Just want to reinforce Peter's point that MathML is overwhelmingly preferred in publishing, TeX and LaTex are more for authoring but are usually converted to HTML+MathML when published.
Bill Kasdorf: q- Just want to reinforce Peter's point that MathML is overwhelmingly preferred in publishing, TeX and LaTex are more for authoring but are usually converted to HTML+MathML when published. ←
15:15:47 <ivan> ack Bill_Kasdorf
Ivan Herman: ack Bill_Kasdorf ←
15:15:48 <Karen> Ivan: Peter, could you put name on irc that Karen did not catch
Ivan Herman: Peter, could you put name on irc that Karen did not catch ←
15:15:56 <Karen> Bill: I undid my query
Bill Kasdorf: I undid my query ←
15:16:13 <Karen> …just reinforcing Peter's point that MathML overwhelmingly preferred by publishing
...just reinforcing Peter's point that MathML overwhelmingly preferred by publishing ←
15:16:20 <ivan> ack Ralph
Ivan Herman: ack Ralph ←
15:16:20 <Zakim> Ralph, you wanted to probe on "native" browser support
Zakim IRC Bot: Ralph, you wanted to probe on "native" browser support ←
15:16:40 <Karen> Peter: deep down there are some deep technical discussions but don't want to get into those
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Krautzberger Peter Linss . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: deep down there are some deep technical discussions but don't want to get into those ←
15:16:43 <Karen> Ralph: Thank you, Peter
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: Thank you, Peter ←
15:16:55 <Karen> …I work closely with Ivan; he encouraged me to attend this call today
...I work closely with Ivan; he encouraged me to attend this call today ←
15:17:05 <Karen> …I am with you on frustrations for native browser support
...I am with you on frustrations for native browser support ←
15:17:13 <Karen> …I'll paste the "can I use folk"
...I'll paste the "can I use folk" ←
15:17:14 <clapierre> q+
Charles LaPierre: q+ ←
15:17:18 <Ralph> -> http://caniuse.com/#feat=mathml CanIUse MathML
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: -> http://caniuse.com/#feat=mathml CanIUse MathML ←
15:17:19 <Karen> …show that at least some browsers
...show that at least some browsers ←
15:17:27 <Karen> …2.5 who do support MathML natively
...2.5 who do support MathML natively ←
15:17:40 <Karen> …there is some sense in the browser world that polyfils are not a bad way to go
...there is some sense in the browser world that polyfils are not a bad way to go ←
15:17:54 <Karen> …especially with a domain specific markup language
...especially with a domain specific markup language ←
15:17:56 <pbelfanti> q+
Paul Belfanti: q+ ←
15:18:18 <Karen> …and doing as a polyfill initially and building a corpus of published stuff on web is the way to encourage browsers to provide embedded support and not rely on polyfill
...and doing as a polyfill initially and building a corpus of published stuff on web is the way to encourage browsers to provide embedded support and not rely on polyfill ←
15:18:30 <Karen> …can you say more about what is making MathJax less of a direction that publishers want to go
...can you say more about what is making MathJax less of a direction that publishers want to go ←
15:18:39 <Karen> …Bill is saying MathML is preferred format for pubishers
...Bill is saying MathML is preferred format for pubishers ←
15:18:48 <Karen> …and MathJax works; so what is impeding its use?
...and MathJax works; so what is impeding its use? ←
15:19:06 <Karen> Peter: The first thing about the browser support; 'can I use this' is misleading
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Krautzberger Peter Linss . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: The first thing about the browser support; 'can I use this' is misleading ←
15:19:13 <Karen> …the implementations are partial
...the implementations are partial ←
15:19:23 <Karen> …biggest problem is that WebKit is not anywhere near production ready
...biggest problem is that WebKit is not anywhere near production ready ←
15:19:33 <Karen> …Geco is much better
...Gecko is much better ←
15:19:45 <Karen> …biggest issue with browser support is that browser vendors are not doing it
...biggest issue with browser support is that browser vendors are not doing it ←
15:19:51 <AH_Miller> The fact that Antenna House supports MathML with our XSL-FO engine sells a lot of licenses for us.
Michael Miller: The fact that Antenna House supports MathML with our XSL-FO engine sells a lot of licenses for us. ←
15:19:58 <Karen> …code is almost exclusively written by volunteers
...code is almost exclusively written by volunteers ←
15:20:10 <Karen> …WebKit went through several volunteers and failed to gain interest
...WebKit went through several volunteers and failed to gain interest ←
15:20:12 <Ralph> s/Geco is/Gecko is/
15:20:17 <Karen> …Apple invested in voice-over
...Apple invested in voice-over ←
15:20:26 <Karen> …Google, Chrome speaks but does not render it
...Google, Chrome speaks but does not render it ←
15:20:30 <Karen> …With Gecko it is different
...With Gecko it is different ←
15:20:43 <Karen> …clear that they don't currently have their own developers working on the code
...clear that they don't currently have their own developers working on the code ←
15:20:55 <Karen> …Mozilla will invest time to fix issues they create
...Mozilla will invest time to fix issues they create ←
15:21:04 <Karen> …but they don't actively implement which is a huge issue
...but they don't actively implement which is a huge issue ←
15:21:11 <Karen> …have been some spurts along the way
...have been some spurts along the way ←
15:21:22 <Karen> …if we wait around, it would take five years to get to production levels
...if we wait around, it would take five years to get to production levels ←
15:21:28 <Karen> …Why is MathJax not good enough?
...Why is MathJax not good enough? ←
15:21:29 <dauwhe> present+ Dave_Cramer
Dave Cramer: present+ Dave_Cramer ←
15:21:38 <Karen> …We are mission driven, we want to see native driven
...We are mission driven, we want to see native driven ←
15:21:52 <Karen> …and math is fundamental to communications; MathML fills that language gap
...and math is fundamental to communications; MathML fills that language gap ←
15:21:59 <Karen> …still lots to do in MathML3
...still lots to do in MathML3 ←
15:22:03 <ivan> q?
Ivan Herman: q? ←
15:22:05 <Karen> …practically speaking it's performance
...practically speaking it's performance ←
15:22:13 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
15:22:16 <Karen> …MathML is a very complex spec and math layout itself is complex
...MathML is a very complex spec and math layout itself is complex ←
15:22:32 <Karen> …expects a high level of typography that web does not yet have
...expects a high level of typography that web does not yet have ←
15:22:38 <Karen> …polyfill does not cut it yet
...polyfill does not cut it yet ←
15:22:59 <Karen> …in next release of MathJax we have a new output component that does not require rendering on the client
...in next release of MathJax we have a new output component that does not require rendering on the client ←
15:23:11 <Karen> …pragmatic reasons where you don't have Java scrip under your control
...pragmatic reasons where you don't have Java scrip under your control ←
15:23:13 <Ralph> [thanks for this data, Peter; it will be useful as we continue push on browser developers]
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: [thanks for this data, Peter; it will be useful as we continue push on browser developers] ←
15:23:23 <Karen> …or suffer from network congestion on mobile devices
...or suffer from network congestion on mobile devices ←
15:23:28 <ivan> ack clapierre
Ivan Herman: ack clapierre ←
15:23:30 <Karen> …not depending on JS is crucial
...not depending on JS is crucial ←
15:23:31 <Karen> ack Charles
ack Charles ←
15:23:39 <clapierre> https://mathml-cloud.cloudapp.net
Charles LaPierre: https://mathml-cloud.cloudapp.net ←
15:23:43 <Karen> Charles: I wanted to touch on a couple things about what we are doing at Benetech
Charles LaPierre: I wanted to touch on a couple things about what we are doing at Benetech ←
15:23:58 <Karen> …MathML cloud to take either LATEX or MathML to give an accessibility description
...MathML cloud to take either LATEX or MathML to give an accessibility description ←
15:24:04 <Karen> …we have some publishers using this in their pipeline
...we have some publishers using this in their pipeline ←
15:24:09 <Karen> …using as alt text
...using as alt text ←
15:24:15 <Karen> …or description document
...or description document ←
15:24:21 <Karen> …Benetech is also working on a matrix
...Benetech is also working on a matrix ←
15:24:39 <Karen> …a datebase, volunteer driven, as to what browsers, AT tech, MathJax
...a datebase, volunteer driven, as to what browsers, AT tech, MathJax ←
15:24:46 <Karen> …depending on OS, to fill that out
...depending on OS, to fill that out ←
15:24:52 <Karen> …currently in alpha we are working on that
...currently in alpha we are working on that ←
15:25:03 <Karen> …and working with Readium folks who are working on MathML support in their products
...and working with Readium folks who are working on MathML support in their products ←
15:25:12 <Karen> …We are fully behind this and want to see it succeed
...We are fully behind this and want to see it succeed ←
15:25:16 <ivan> ack pbelfanti
Ivan Herman: ack pbelfanti ←
15:25:19 <Karen> …success of MathML is key
...success of MathML is key ←
15:25:25 <Karen> Paul: quick question...
Paul Belfanti: quick question... ←
15:25:34 <Karen> Peter: point out that Readium includes MathJax
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Krautzberger Peter Linss . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: point out that Readium includes MathJax ←
15:25:44 <Karen> …problem is that reading system developers don't integrate it into their reader
...problem is that reading system developers don't integrate it into their reader ←
15:25:55 <Karen> …like Apple OS claims they have support but they don't...
...like Apple OS claims they have support but they don't... ←
15:26:00 <Karen> …why include a tool like MathJax
...why include a tool like MathJax ←
15:26:05 <Karen> …uses math on server
...uses math on server ←
15:26:30 <Karen> Paul: I had a question about the previous statements on using polyfills as a viable option from an accessibility POV
Paul Belfanti: I had a question about the previous statements on using polyfills as a viable option from an accessibility POV ←
15:26:44 <Karen> Peter: older than that
Scribe problem: the name 'Peter' is ambiguous. It could be any of: Peter Krautzberger Peter Linss . Either change the name used or insert a 'PRESENT: ...' line to restrict the active names.
Unknown Peter: older than that ←
15:26:55 <Karen> …MathJax is not built in way to leverage partial implementations
...MathJax is not built in way to leverage partial implementations ←
15:27:09 <Karen> …looking to future you could look at web components; shadow DOM
...looking to future you could look at web components; shadow DOM ←
15:27:11 <Ralph> i|Scribe: Karen|scribenick: Karen
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: i|Scribe: Karen|scribenick: Karen ←
15:27:15 <Karen> …we are disregarding
...we are disregarding ←
15:27:27 <Karen> …simply because it does not buy us anything; does not solve the rendering issues
...simply because it does not buy us anything; does not solve the rendering issues ←
15:27:35 <Karen> …Houdini has hope of simplifying the rendering
...Houdini has hope of simplifying the rendering ←
15:27:39 <Karen> …and doing the main job
...and doing the main job ←
15:27:43 <Karen> …that is something you can do
...that is something you can do ←
15:27:46 <Karen> …but at same time
...but at same time ←
15:28:07 <Karen> …you have actually a mark-up that should be possible to make HTML and SVG accessible on a level for MathML; that's what ARIA
...you have actually a mark-up that should be possible to make HTML and SVG accessible on a level for MathML; that's what ARIA ←
15:28:09 <Karen> ...does
...does ←
15:28:14 <Karen> …would be prudent to have a tool set
...would be prudent to have a tool set ←
15:28:34 <Karen> …whatever direction math on web takes, it should supercede MathML
...whatever direction math on web takes, it should supercede MathML ←
15:28:40 <Ralph> i|Peter: older|[Peter notes that MathJax is not a polyfill in the modern sense]
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Scribe problem: the name 'Ralph' does not match any of the 99 active names. Either change the name used, or request the list of names be altered.Active names: ASOK BANDYOPADHYAY Akshat Joshi Alan Tam Alan Stearns Anton Leskovets Avneesh Singh Ayla Stein Ben Holden-Crowther Ben De Meester Bert Bos Bill Kasdorf Brady Duga Bryan Croft Casey Dougherty Charles LaPierre Chris Lilley Daniel Schwabe Dave Cramer David Stroup David Singer Dean Jackson Deborah Kaplan Dmitry Shkolnik Don Brutzman Doug Schepers Edward O'Connor Erik Mannens Frank Liu George Kerscher George Walkley Graham Bell Hajar Ghaem Sigarchian Heather Flanagan Heather Reid Ivan Herman Jeff Xu Jiphun Satapathy Jirka Kosek Johannes Wilm John Shaw Julie Morris Jun Fujisawa Karen Myers Kasar Masood Kenny Zhang Koji Ishii Laura Fowler Leonard Rosenthol Liam Quin Livio Mondini Liza Daly Luc Audrain Madi Solomon Mahesh Kulkarni Manuel Rego Casasnovas Markku Hakkinen Markus Gylling Matt Garrish Mia Lipner Michael Miller Michael Cooper Miel Vander Sande Mohamed ZERGAOUI Naitik Tyagi Nicholas Ruffilo Nishit Jain Paolo Ciccarese Patrick Keating Paul Belfanti Peter Linss Peter Krautzberger Phil Madans Pierre Danet Prashant Prashant Rajesh Ranjan Richard Schwerdtfeger Richard Ishida Robert Sanderson Satoshi Kojima Shane McCarron Shinyu Murakami Somnath Chandra Susann Keohane Suzanne Taylor Swaran Lata Thierry Michel Tim Clark Timothy Cole Tom De Nies Toru Kawakubo Tyng-Ruey Chuang Tzviya Siegman Vincent Gros Vladimir Levantovsky William McCoy William Mischo Zakim IRC Bot Trackbot IRC Bot RRSAgent IRC Bot
Unknown Ralph: i|Peter: older|[Peter notes that MathJax is not a polyfill in the modern sense] ←
15:28:56 <Karen> Scribenick: Dauwhe
(Scribe set to Dave Cramer)
15:28:57 <dauwhe> scribenick: dauwhe
15:29:03 <ivan> ack ivan
Ivan Herman: ack ivan ←
15:29:13 <dauwhe> ivan: I see that Karen is leaving
Ivan Herman: I see that Karen is leaving ←
15:29:23 <dauwhe> ... do you have to run now?
... do you have to run now? ←
15:29:27 <dauwhe> pkra: I can do one more
Peter Krautzberger: I can do one more ←
15:29:32 <dauwhe> ivan: I was on the queue
Ivan Herman: I was on the queue ←
15:29:55 <dauwhe> ... let's say you have a free hand in the sense of trying to modify MathML to work better with current environment
... let's say you have a free hand in the sense of trying to modify MathML to work better with current environment ←
15:30:01 <dauwhe> ... and you had a free hand in MathJax
... and you had a free hand in MathJax ←
15:30:16 <dauwhe> ... what could be done to move the whole situation out of the current "dip"
... what could be done to move the whole situation out of the current "dip" ←
15:30:21 <dauwhe> ... what actions would be useful?
... what actions would be useful? ←
15:30:38 <dauwhe> ... taking into account that the browsers don't care
... taking into account that the browsers don't care ←
15:30:59 <dauwhe> ... we can put possible answers on the agenda for a new meeting
... we can put possible answers on the agenda for a new meeting ←
15:31:19 <dauwhe> ... we have an idea of where we are, the question is where we can go
... we have an idea of where we are, the question is where we can go ←
15:31:29 <dauwhe> ... this can be discussed at TPAC
... this can be discussed at TPAC ←
15:31:34 <dauwhe> pkra: I won't be at TPAC
Peter Krautzberger: I won't be at TPAC ←
15:31:55 <dauwhe> ivan: thank you very much Peter!
Ivan Herman: thank you very much Peter! ←
15:32:26 <dauwhe> ivan: we did not plan for other agenda items
Ivan Herman: we did not plan for other agenda items ←
15:32:39 <dauwhe> ... are there any pressing items?
... are there any pressing items? ←
15:33:08 <Bill_Kasdorf> Dave has permanent merit status. A few minutes of scribing makes no difference.
Bill Kasdorf: Dave has permanent merit status. A few minutes of scribing makes no difference. ←
15:33:11 <dauwhe> ... so let's get back to the topic next week, and we can gather questions
... so let's get back to the topic next week, and we can gather questions ←
15:33:24 <dauwhe> ivan: meeting is adjourned. Thanks all!
Ivan Herman: meeting is adjourned. Thanks all! ←
15:36:52 <ivan> rrsagent, draft minutes
Ivan Herman: rrsagent, draft minutes ←
15:36:52 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/09/14-dpub-minutes.html ivan
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/09/14-dpub-minutes.html ivan ←
15:37:04 <ivan> trackbot, end telcon
Ivan Herman: trackbot, end telcon ←
15:37:04 <trackbot> Zakim, list attendees
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, list attendees ←
15:37:04 <Zakim> As of this point the attendees have been Mike_Miller, Ralph_Swick, Peter, Krautzberger, Alan, Stearns, Tim_Cole, Charles_LaPierre, duga, Karen, Bill_Kasdorf, Thierry, Michel, Bert,
Zakim IRC Bot: As of this point the attendees have been Mike_Miller, Ralph_Swick, Peter, Krautzberger, Alan, Stearns, Tim_Cole, Charles_LaPierre, duga, Karen, Bill_Kasdorf, Thierry, Michel, Bert, ←
15:37:07 <Zakim> ... Nick, Paul, Belfanti, (Having, trouble, logging, into, WebEx), Dave_Cramer
Zakim IRC Bot: ... Nick, Paul, Belfanti, (Having, trouble, logging, into, WebEx), Dave_Cramer ←
15:37:12 <trackbot> RRSAgent, please draft minutes
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, please draft minutes ←
15:37:12 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/09/14-dpub-minutes.html trackbot
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2015/09/14-dpub-minutes.html trackbot ←
15:37:13 <trackbot> RRSAgent, bye
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, bye ←
15:37:13 <RRSAgent> I see no action items
RRSAgent IRC Bot: I see no action items ←
Formatted by CommonScribe