None.
15:39:59 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/12/16-dpub-irc
RRSAgent IRC Bot: logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/12/16-dpub-irc ←
15:40:01 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
<ivan> Present: ivan, mgylling, lizadaly, Bill_Kasdorf, Liam, Bert, fjh, Suzanne_Taylor, benjaminsko, Stearns, Laura_Fowler, azaroth, dshkolnik, dauwhe, plinss, gcapiel
15:40:03 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be dpub
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be dpub ←
15:40:03 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 20 minutes
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot; I see SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 20 minutes ←
15:40:04 <trackbot> Meeting: Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
15:40:04 <trackbot> Date: 16 December 2013
15:57:18 <Zakim> SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM has now started
(No events recorded for 17 minutes)
Zakim IRC Bot: SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM has now started ←
15:57:25 <Zakim> +??P50
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P50 ←
15:57:34 <mgylling> trackbot, start telcon
Markus Gylling: trackbot, start telcon ←
15:57:36 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
Trackbot IRC Bot: RRSAgent, make logs public ←
15:57:38 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be dpub
Trackbot IRC Bot: Zakim, this will be dpub ←
15:57:38 <Zakim> ok, trackbot, I see SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM already started
Zakim IRC Bot: ok, trackbot, I see SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM already started ←
15:57:39 <trackbot> Meeting: Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
15:57:39 <trackbot> Date: 16 December 2013
15:57:52 <mgylling> zakim, ??P50 is mgylling
Markus Gylling: zakim, ??P50 is mgylling ←
15:57:52 <Zakim> +mgylling; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +mgylling; got it ←
15:58:16 <mgylling> regrets: Vladimir Levantovsky, Tom De Nies, Phil Madans, Rich Schwerdtfeger, Thierry Michel, Tzviya Siegman, George Walkley, Pierre Danet, Luc Audrain, Vincent Gros
15:58:48 <ivan> zakim, code?
Ivan Herman: zakim, code? ←
15:58:48 <Zakim> the conference code is 3782 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: the conference code is 3782 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), ivan ←
15:59:12 <Zakim> +Ivan
Zakim IRC Bot: +Ivan ←
15:59:16 <Zakim> + +1.503.614.aaaa
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.503.614.aaaa ←
15:59:30 <Zakim> + +1.505.665.aabb
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.505.665.aabb ←
15:59:41 <Zakim> +Liza
Zakim IRC Bot: +Liza ←
15:59:43 <azaroth> Zakim, aabb is azaroth
Robert Sanderson: Zakim, aabb is azaroth ←
15:59:43 <Zakim> +azaroth; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +azaroth; got it ←
15:59:47 <Zakim> +Stearns
Zakim IRC Bot: +Stearns ←
15:59:48 <Zakim> +dauwhe
Zakim IRC Bot: +dauwhe ←
16:00:01 <ivan> zakim, aaaa is Sharad
Ivan Herman: zakim, aaaa is Sharad ←
16:00:02 <Zakim> +Sharad; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +Sharad; got it ←
16:00:06 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
Zakim IRC Bot: +[IPcaller] ←
16:00:10 <fjh> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
Frederick Hirsch: zakim, [IPcaller] is me ←
16:00:10 <Zakim> +fjh; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +fjh; got it ←
16:00:51 <Zakim> +??P78
Zakim IRC Bot: +??P78 ←
16:01:08 <mgylling> regrets: Vladimir Levantovsky, Tom De Nies, Phil Madans, Rich Schwerdtfeger, Thierry Michel, Tzviya Siegman, George Walkley, Pierre Danet, Luc Audrain, Vincent Gros, Brady Duga
16:01:08 <Zakim> +Bill_Kasdorf
Zakim IRC Bot: +Bill_Kasdorf ←
16:01:13 <Zakim> + +1.408.431.aacc
Zakim IRC Bot: + +1.408.431.aacc ←
16:01:21 <gcapiel> Zakim, ??P78 is me
Gerardo Capiel: Zakim, ??P78 is me ←
16:01:21 <Zakim> +gcapiel; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +gcapiel; got it ←
16:01:24 <Zakim> +plinss
Zakim IRC Bot: +plinss ←
16:01:40 <Zakim> +Suzanne_Taylor
Zakim IRC Bot: +Suzanne_Taylor ←
16:02:00 <mgylling> zakim, who is here?
Markus Gylling: zakim, who is here? ←
16:02:00 <Zakim> On the phone I see mgylling, Ivan, Sharad, azaroth, Liza, Stearns, dauwhe, fjh, gcapiel, Bill_Kasdorf, +1.408.431.aacc, plinss, Suzanne_Taylor
Zakim IRC Bot: On the phone I see mgylling, Ivan, Sharad, azaroth, Liza, Stearns, dauwhe, fjh, gcapiel, Bill_Kasdorf, +1.408.431.aacc, plinss, Suzanne_Taylor ←
16:02:02 <Zakim> On IRC I see Suzanne, lizadaly, Bill_Kasdorf, gcapiel, dshkolnik, Sharad, fjh, azaroth, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, Bert, dauwhe, liam, astearns, trackbot, plinss
Zakim IRC Bot: On IRC I see Suzanne, lizadaly, Bill_Kasdorf, gcapiel, dshkolnik, Sharad, fjh, azaroth, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, Bert, dauwhe, liam, astearns, trackbot, plinss ←
16:02:19 <astearns> zakim, aacc is dshkolnik
Alan Stearns: zakim, aacc is dshkolnik ←
16:02:19 <Zakim> +dshkolnik; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +dshkolnik; got it ←
16:02:39 <Zakim> +JeanKaplansky
Zakim IRC Bot: +JeanKaplansky ←
16:02:56 <Zakim> +Liam
Zakim IRC Bot: +Liam ←
16:03:21 <Zakim> +Laura_Fowler
Zakim IRC Bot: +Laura_Fowler ←
16:03:46 <Zakim> + +49.305.770.aadd
Zakim IRC Bot: + +49.305.770.aadd ←
16:03:49 <mgylling> scribe: lizadaly
(Scribe set to Liza Daly)
16:04:44 <lizadaly> (Do I scribe here or in separate notes?)
(Do I scribe here or in separate notes?) ←
16:04:54 <azaroth> Here would be great, thanks Liza
Robert Sanderson: Here would be great, thanks Liza ←
16:05:01 <lizadaly> You bet
You bet ←
16:05:31 <azaroth> Zakim, aadd is olaf_druemmer
Robert Sanderson: Zakim, aadd is olaf_druemmer ←
16:05:31 <Zakim> +olaf_druemmer; got it
Zakim IRC Bot: +olaf_druemmer; got it ←
16:05:38 <lizadaly> Markus: 2nd week where we are trying theme-based called; today Annotations is up
Markus Gylling: 2nd week where we are trying theme-based called; today Annotations is up ←
16:06:07 <Zakim> +Bert
Zakim IRC Bot: +Bert ←
16:06:11 <lizadaly> First, approve previous minutes; objections to approval for last week's minutes? No; minutes are approved
First, approve previous minutes; objections to approval for last week's minutes? No; minutes are approved ←
16:06:18 <lizadaly> When should we meet again after Christmas?
When should we meet again after Christmas? ←
16:06:39 <lizadaly> Monday 6th or Monday the 13th?
Monday 6th or Monday the 13th? ←
16:06:48 <dshkolnik> 6th is fine here
Dmitry Shkolnik: 6th is fine here ←
16:06:53 <azaroth> 6th is fine for me
Robert Sanderson: 6th is fine for me ←
16:06:56 <gcapiel> 1/13 is better, but 1/6 works
Gerardo Capiel: 1/13 is better, but 1/6 works ←
16:07:09 <lizadaly> Deadline for CSS Shapes notes is the 7th
Deadline for CSS Shapes notes is the 7th ←
16:07:30 <lizadaly> It is so duly noted that the next meeting will be the 6th of January
It is so duly noted that the next meeting will be the 6th of January ←
16:07:47 <lizadaly> Theme for the 6th of January?
Theme for the 6th of January? ←
16:08:00 <lizadaly> (TBD after discussion)
(TBD after discussion) ←
16:08:20 <lizadaly> Other discussion: Ivan will look into the mailing list issue raised by Tony
Other discussion: Ivan will look into the mailing list issue raised by Tony ←
16:08:32 <lizadaly> ...but he believes it may be fine now
...but he believes it may be fine now ←
16:08:50 <lizadaly> Others are encouraged to raise any additional issues and he will follow up with the systems staff
Others are encouraged to raise any additional issues and he will follow up with the systems staff ←
16:08:59 <ivan> Topic: Annotations
16:08:59 <lizadaly> ANNOTATIONS
16:09:11 <olaf_druemmer> My name is Olaf Drümmer, I am CEO of callas software GmbH and axaio software GmbH in Berlin, Germany. I am also the chairman of teh PDF Association. My interest is around accessibility, MathML, STEM, and digital publishing in genera
Olaf Drümmer: My name is Olaf Drümmer, I am CEO of callas software GmbH and axaio software GmbH in Berlin, Germany. I am also the chairman of teh PDF Association. My interest is around accessibility, MathML, STEM, and digital publishing in general. ←
16:09:19 <lizadaly> Markus suggests we provide some context for this discussion
Markus suggests we provide some context for this discussion ←
16:09:30 <lizadaly> "Who is doing what?"
"Who is doing what?" ←
16:09:57 <lizadaly> Markus: There are 3 entities engaged in this work
Markus Gylling: There are 3 entities engaged in this work ←
16:10:04 <lizadaly> 1. Open Annotation Community Group
1. Open Annotation Community Group ←
16:10:35 <lizadaly> Markus: 2. The IDPF, adapting the Open Annotations specification for use with EPUB
Markus Gylling: 2. The IDPF, adapting the Open Annotations specification for use with EPUB ←
16:10:40 <ivan> Guest: Olaf (olaf_druemmer) Drümmer, Callas Software GmbH
16:10:56 <lizadaly> Markus: They are pointing to it and developing some specializations for it
Markus Gylling: They are pointing to it and developing some specializations for it ←
16:11:15 <lizadaly> Markus: 3. This interest group, at this point collecting use cases for annotations as it relates to digital publishing
Markus Gylling: 3. This interest group, at this point collecting use cases for annotations as it relates to digital publishing ←
16:11:42 <lizadaly> Markus: The use case corpus as developed here has a wider scope than the original OA effort as it takes into account new cases discovered in the collaboration with the IDPF
Markus Gylling: The use case corpus as developed here has a wider scope than the original OA effort as it takes into account new cases discovered in the collaboration with the IDPF ←
16:11:56 <lizadaly> Azaroth: As an interest group, our charter doesn't allow us to _create_ specifications
Robert Sanderson: As an interest group, our charter doesn't allow us to _create_ specifications ←
16:12:22 <lizadaly> Markus: One of the interesting things about this group is that a new W3C Working Group could use our use cases as inputs to their process
Markus Gylling: One of the interesting things about this group is that a new W3C Working Group could use our use cases as inputs to their process ←
16:12:41 <lizadaly> Markus: The use cases developing here are partly informing the IDPF work and possibly future OA WGs
Markus Gylling: The use cases developing here are partly informing the IDPF work and possibly future OA WGs ←
16:12:52 <lizadaly> Markus: Did that help set context?
Markus Gylling: Did that help set context? ←
16:13:04 <lizadaly> Ivan: Yes but the WG discussion is premature
Ivan Herman: Yes but the WG discussion is premature ←
16:13:12 <lizadaly> Markus: Indeed
Markus Gylling: Indeed ←
16:13:47 <lizadaly> Markus: Another context: in the ebook space, there is no standard interoperable annotations spec; each reading system or platform uses their own
Markus Gylling: Another context: in the ebook space, there is no standard interoperable annotations spec; each reading system or platform uses their own ←
16:14:16 <lizadaly> Markus: There is a lot of lock-in, and this is a problem in trade publishing but even more so in the educational sector where annotations are used more proactively
Markus Gylling: There is a lot of lock-in, and this is a problem in trade publishing but even more so in the educational sector where annotations are used more proactively ←
16:14:34 <lizadaly> Markus: There is a clear need expressed by the e-education space for an interoperable specification/protocol for transportable annotations
Markus Gylling: There is a clear need expressed by the e-education space for an interoperable specification/protocol for transportable annotations ←
16:15:08 <lizadaly> Azaroth: There was some work that was too early by NISO to bring together interested parties in annotations
Robert Sanderson: There was some work that was too early by NISO to bring together interested parties in annotations ←
16:15:25 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Many of the people here were a part of that and it did get the conversation started, but nothing concrete came out of that
Robert Sanderson: Many of the people here were a part of that and it did get the conversation started, but nothing concrete came out of that ←
16:15:40 <lizadaly> Markus: Questions/comments?
Markus Gylling: Questions/comments? ←
16:16:21 <lizadaly> Liam: There seems to be some competition in the educational space already providing annotation services
Liam Quin: There seems to be some competition in the educational space already providing annotation services ←
16:16:39 <lizadaly> Liam: That can be a precursor to standardization or it can make standardization difficult if those players aren't on board
Liam Quin: That can be a precursor to standardization or it can make standardization difficult if those players aren't on board ←
16:17:02 <lizadaly> ???: A lot of interest in annotation in other sectors, see RapGenius
Robert Sanderson: A lot of interest in annotation in other sectors, see RapGenius ←
16:17:13 <azaroth> s/???/Azaroth/
16:17:14 <ivan> s/???/Azaroth/
16:17:18 <lizadaly> BillK: There's a lot of activity in the scholarly science and research space
Bill Kasdorf: There's a lot of activity in the scholarly science and research space ←
16:17:20 <lizadaly> (thanks)
(thanks) ←
16:17:47 <Zakim> +benjaminsko
Zakim IRC Bot: +benjaminsko ←
16:18:18 <lizadaly> Markus: Let's look at two things: 1) work done so far in use cases
Markus Gylling: Let's look at two things: 1) work done so far in use cases ←
16:18:29 <lizadaly> Markus: 2) Next steps for this task force
Markus Gylling: 2) Next steps for this task force ←
16:18:46 <mgylling> http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Task_Forces/Annotation
Markus Gylling: http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/Task_Forces/Annotation ←
16:18:56 <mgylling> http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/UseCase_Directory#Social_Reading_and_Annotations
Markus Gylling: http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/UseCase_Directory#Social_Reading_and_Annotations ←
16:18:58 <lizadaly> Markus: The Annotation task force main page
Markus Gylling: The Annotation task force main page ←
16:19:06 <lizadaly> Markus: 2nd URL is the Use Case collection
Markus Gylling: 2nd URL is the Use Case collection ←
16:19:52 <lizadaly> Azaroth: There are 6 categories
Robert Sanderson: There are 6 categories ←
16:20:02 <lizadaly> Azaroth: 1. Basic use cases, annotations on the entire publication
Robert Sanderson: 1. Basic use cases, annotations on the entire publication ←
16:20:22 <lizadaly> Azaroth: 4 UCs in that section are different ways that annotations can be used at the publication level
Robert Sanderson: 4 UCs in that section are different ways that annotations can be used at the publication level ←
16:20:59 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Comments on the publication ("this is a great book!"); tag the publication; structured comment (score + review); personal vs. public annotations
Robert Sanderson: Comments on the publication ("this is a great book!"); tag the publication; structured comment (score + review); personal vs. public annotations ←
16:21:13 <lizadaly> Azaroth: 2. Annotations that target segments of the work
Robert Sanderson: 2. Annotations that target segments of the work ←
16:21:28 <lizadaly> Azaroth: e.g. reading location, reading position, bookmarks
Robert Sanderson: e.g. reading location, reading position, bookmarks ←
16:21:47 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Highlighting a span of text (neither highlight nor bookmark have commentary, just pointers)
Robert Sanderson: Highlighting a span of text (neither highlight nor bookmark have commentary, just pointers) ←
16:22:09 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Commenting on some part of the text, or an embedded resource (img, video)
Robert Sanderson: Commenting on some part of the text, or an embedded resource (img, video) ←
16:22:26 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Annotation parts of those resources
Robert Sanderson: Annotation parts of those resources ←
16:22:51 <lizadaly> Azaroth: 3. Advanced UCs: cross-format annotations (e.g. annotation the "work" rather than the instance of the work)
Robert Sanderson: 3. Advanced UCs: cross-format annotations (e.g. annotation the "work" rather than the instance of the work) ←
16:23:20 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Styles within an annotation (green vs. yellow highlights)
Robert Sanderson: Styles within an annotation (green vs. yellow highlights) ←
16:23:31 <lizadaly> Azaroth: State of those resources on the web (content negotiable)
Robert Sanderson: State of those resources on the web (content negotiable) ←
16:23:46 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Recording state of user-manipulatable resources (this may be out of scope)
Robert Sanderson: Recording state of user-manipulatable resources (this may be out of scope) ←
16:24:09 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Multiple bodies
Robert Sanderson: Multiple bodies ←
16:24:20 <lizadaly> Azaroth: All these are covered by the Open Annotation specification already
Robert Sanderson: All these are covered by the Open Annotation specification already ←
16:24:27 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Those not covered:
Robert Sanderson: Those not covered: ←
16:24:37 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Serialize annotations into a single package
Robert Sanderson: Serialize annotations into a single package ←
16:25:13 <lizadaly> Azaroth: OA spec does not have an API, so these are covered here
Robert Sanderson: OA spec does not have an API, so these are covered here ←
16:25:30 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Ensuring that annotations persist and can be transferred
Robert Sanderson: Ensuring that annotations persist and can be transferred ←
16:25:57 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
16:26:08 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Issues around publications that are not published openly (like DRM) or issues where the annotations are not published openly
Robert Sanderson: Issues around publications that are not published openly (like DRM) or issues where the annotations are not published openly ←
16:26:29 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Specifying the target audience for the annotations ("these annotations are appropriate for young children")
Robert Sanderson: Specifying the target audience for the annotations ("these annotations are appropriate for young children") ←
16:26:47 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Contributing accessibility information about resources
Robert Sanderson: Contributing accessibility information about resources ←
16:26:59 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Have a rich description of a resource for use by other users
Robert Sanderson: Have a rich description of a resource for use by other users ←
16:27:27 <mgylling> q?
Markus Gylling: q? ←
16:27:32 <mgylling> ack ivan
Markus Gylling: ack ivan ←
16:27:48 <gcapiel> q+
Gerardo Capiel: q+ ←
16:27:49 <Zakim> -Liam
Zakim IRC Bot: -Liam ←
16:28:14 <lizadaly> Ivan: On the API: Do you mean a JavaScript API that browsers can use via the web?
Ivan Herman: On the API: Do you mean a JavaScript API that browsers can use via the web? ←
16:28:39 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Could be both server-to-server or browser-to-server
Robert Sanderson: Could be both server-to-server or browser-to-server ←
16:29:29 <lizadaly> Azaroth: but this work focused on system-to-system
Robert Sanderson: but this work focused on system-to-system ←
16:29:59 <lizadaly> Ivan: Re: target audience for annotations; isn't this the same issue as requesting annotations for annotations?
Ivan Herman: Re: target audience for annotations; isn't this the same issue as requesting annotations for annotations? ←
16:30:41 <lizadaly> Ivan: This more general use case could subsume that
Ivan Herman: This more general use case could subsume that ←
16:30:59 <lizadaly> Azaroth: You could annotate the annotation to give it a target audience, or it could be directly-applied metadata
Robert Sanderson: You could annotate the annotation to give it a target audience, or it could be directly-applied metadata ←
16:31:31 <lizadaly> Azaroth: We have laid out different approaches; most people take the metadata approach because implementation is easier
Robert Sanderson: We have laid out different approaches; most people take the metadata approach because implementation is easier ←
16:31:55 <lizadaly> Azaroth: but either way is possible
Robert Sanderson: but either way is possible ←
16:32:18 <lizadaly> Markus: (Learning Resource Metadata Initiative)
Markus Gylling: (Learning Resource Metadata Initiative) ←
16:32:25 <mgylling> q?
Markus Gylling: q? ←
16:32:32 <mgylling> ack gcapiel
Markus Gylling: ack gcapiel ←
16:33:10 <lizadaly> Gerardo: Is there a way to know that an annotation is specific to the purpose of describing an image vs [ lost signal ]
Gerardo Capiel: Is there a way to know that an annotation is specific to the purpose of describing an image vs [ lost signal ] ←
16:34:04 <lizadaly> Azaroth: We went for a general system that doesn't need to know the specific motivation of the system
Robert Sanderson: We went for a general system that doesn't need to know the specific motivation of the system ←
16:34:11 <gcapiel> versus providing general comments or feedback
Gerardo Capiel: versus providing general comments or feedback ←
16:34:12 <azaroth> metadata vs annotation discussion: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-openannotation/2013Oct/0001.html
Robert Sanderson: metadata vs annotation discussion: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-openannotation/2013Oct/0001.html ←
16:34:15 <mgylling> q?
Markus Gylling: q? ←
16:34:35 <azaroth> motivations; http://www.openannotation.org/spec/core/core.html#Motivations
Robert Sanderson: motivations; http://www.openannotation.org/spec/core/core.html#Motivations ←
16:34:42 <lizadaly> Markus: In the advanced model use cases section, cases 5 & 6
Markus Gylling: In the advanced model use cases section, cases 5 & 6 ←
16:34:52 <lizadaly> Markus: 6 is the user-manipulated case
Markus Gylling: 6 is the user-manipulated case ←
16:35:25 <lizadaly> Azaroth: There is an object called 'state' which we have used for recording HTTP-level information (e.g. HTTP headers like content negotiation, time at which it should be applied)
Robert Sanderson: There is an object called 'state' which we have used for recording HTTP-level information (e.g. HTTP headers like content negotiation, time at which it should be applied) ←
16:36:00 <lizadaly> Azaroth: "Here is the time at which the annotation applies to the resource" which is not the same as whether you can retrieve that resource
Robert Sanderson: "Here is the time at which the annotation applies to the resource" which is not the same as whether you can retrieve that resource ←
16:36:19 <lizadaly> Azaroth: We envision using this process for user-manipulated annotations, though none are defined at this time
Robert Sanderson: We envision using this process for user-manipulated annotations, though none are defined at this time ←
16:36:35 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Is there something specific to the digital publishing world in which it would be a "failure" if this were not defined?
Robert Sanderson: Is there something specific to the digital publishing world in which it would be a "failure" if this were not defined? ←
16:36:50 <Zakim> +Liam
Zakim IRC Bot: +Liam ←
16:37:29 <lizadaly> Markus: In an educational setting, learners will have a quiz widget ('answer these 10 questions'); the teacher wants to annotation question 8 and makes the annotation; when the learners get into the quiz they should not see the annotation until they get to question 8
Markus Gylling: In an educational setting, learners will have a quiz widget ('answer these 10 questions'); the teacher wants to annotation question 8 and makes the annotation; when the learners get into the quiz they should not see the annotation until they get to question 8 ←
16:37:42 <lizadaly> Markus: There is no predictability in how this widget is built
Markus Gylling: There is no predictability in how this widget is built ←
16:38:12 <lizadaly> Azaroth: There might be an opportunity to attach to JS events "only display this onChange, etc"
Robert Sanderson: There might be an opportunity to attach to JS events "only display this onChange, etc" ←
16:38:24 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Because this is complex since there are no standards in how these widgets behave
Robert Sanderson: Because this is complex since there are no standards in how these widgets behave ←
16:38:35 <mgylling> q?
Markus Gylling: q? ←
16:38:35 <lizadaly> Azaroth: ...I wanted to raise this with the group
Robert Sanderson: ...I wanted to raise this with the group ←
16:39:10 <lizadaly> Markus: What is your sense of how complete this is in terms of use cases?
Markus Gylling: What is your sense of how complete this is in terms of use cases? ←
16:39:19 <Zakim> -dshkolnik
Zakim IRC Bot: -dshkolnik ←
16:39:44 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Very small number of features present in the model that are not used by any of these use cases
Robert Sanderson: Very small number of features present in the model that are not used by any of these use cases ←
16:40:00 <lizadaly> Azaroth: I could create cases for them but they would not be very relevant to this IG audience
Robert Sanderson: I could create cases for them but they would not be very relevant to this IG audience ←
16:40:06 <Zakim> +dshkolnik
Zakim IRC Bot: +dshkolnik ←
16:40:07 <lizadaly> Azaroth: It is complete from my perspective
Robert Sanderson: It is complete from my perspective ←
16:40:42 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
Bill Kasdorf: q+ ←
16:40:45 <lizadaly> Markus: We need to review this further to decide whether it is complete; are there things that seem to be missing right now?
Markus Gylling: We need to review this further to decide whether it is complete; are there things that seem to be missing right now? ←
16:40:48 <ivan> q+
Ivan Herman: q+ ←
16:41:11 <mgylling> ack Bill_Kasdorf
Markus Gylling: ack Bill_Kasdorf ←
16:41:27 <lizadaly> BillK: This may overlap with some categories we already have including versioning: how do we indicate the version of a publication that is being commented on?
Bill Kasdorf: This may overlap with some categories we already have including versioning: how do we indicate the version of a publication that is being commented on? ←
16:41:46 <lizadaly> Azaroth: The way we have approached versioning is to look at the web architecture and go with what's there
Robert Sanderson: The way we have approached versioning is to look at the web architecture and go with what's there ←
16:42:17 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Hints: state of the resource at a time period is how we've tried to capture versioning in a neutral way
Robert Sanderson: Hints: state of the resource at a time period is how we've tried to capture versioning in a neutral way ←
16:43:04 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Easier would be to give every version of a resource a URI (like Wikipedia)
Robert Sanderson: Easier would be to give every version of a resource a URI (like Wikipedia) ←
16:43:33 <lizadaly> BillK: I'm thinking of annotation that is a critique or a correction that has been subsequently corrected
Bill Kasdorf: I'm thinking of annotation that is a critique or a correction that has been subsequently corrected ←
16:43:54 <lizadaly> BillK: The ability to then indicate whether the comment still applies or does not apply in a later version
Bill Kasdorf: The ability to then indicate whether the comment still applies or does not apply in a later version ←
16:44:20 <lizadaly> Azaroth: So, either multiple specific version to which it applies, or a range of time in which it applies
Robert Sanderson: So, either multiple specific version to which it applies, or a range of time in which it applies ←
16:44:27 <lizadaly> BillK: This can only be applied after the fact
Bill Kasdorf: This can only be applied after the fact ←
16:44:38 <lizadaly> Azaroth: The annotation and the publication may be in different systems
Robert Sanderson: The annotation and the publication may be in different systems ←
16:45:14 <lizadaly> Azaroth: We discussed this issue: when an annotation only applies in a specific case, we decided not to open that can of worms
Robert Sanderson: We discussed this issue: when an annotation only applies in a specific case, we decided not to open that can of worms ←
16:45:27 <lizadaly> Azaroth: but we decided to tackle specific instances of this issue if they came up
Robert Sanderson: but we decided to tackle specific instances of this issue if they came up ←
16:46:04 <lizadaly> BillK: In the scholarly world: the mechanism by CrossRef is called CrossMark
Bill Kasdorf: In the scholarly world: the mechanism by CrossRef is called CrossMark ←
16:46:13 <lizadaly> BillK: A user of a publication can see whether they have the latest version of the publication
Bill Kasdorf: A user of a publication can see whether they have the latest version of the publication ←
16:46:30 <lizadaly> BillK: Important for medical use cases since they can get retracted
Bill Kasdorf: Important for medical use cases since they can get retracted ←
16:46:43 <lizadaly> Markus: Is this something we want to represent in the use case collection then?
Markus Gylling: Is this something we want to represent in the use case collection then? ←
16:47:01 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Nothing's been accepted yet, so we can rediscuss whether to tackle it
Robert Sanderson: Nothing's been accepted yet, so we can rediscuss whether to tackle it ←
16:47:19 <lizadaly> BillK: I wasn't sure if this was a distinct use case or a variation on an existing one
Bill Kasdorf: I wasn't sure if this was a distinct use case or a variation on an existing one ←
16:47:59 <lizadaly> (Markus is having connection problems)
(Markus is having connection problems) ←
16:48:26 <ivan> ack ivan
Ivan Herman: ack ivan ←
16:48:53 <lizadaly> Ivan: The annotations themselves should/may be structured and therefore a formatted document
Ivan Herman: The annotations themselves should/may be structured and therefore a formatted document ←
16:49:10 <lizadaly> Ivan: e.g. the annotation needs to have markup
Ivan Herman: e.g. the annotation needs to have markup ←
16:49:36 <lizadaly> Azaroth: That use case is there; any resource can be a body of an annotation
Robert Sanderson: That use case is there; any resource can be a body of an annotation ←
16:49:44 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Including cat images
Robert Sanderson: Including cat images ←
16:49:53 <ivan> q?
Ivan Herman: q? ←
16:50:06 <Zakim> -Sharad
Zakim IRC Bot: -Sharad ←
16:50:22 <lizadaly> Ivan questions the utility of a fish for connection resolution
Ivan questions the utility of a fish for connection resolution ←
16:50:31 <lizadaly> Ivan: Next steps, Rob?
Ivan Herman: Next steps, Rob? ←
16:51:05 <lizadaly> Azaroth: I will add the use case of whether an annotation is valid for a document at a particular state
Robert Sanderson: I will add the use case of whether an annotation is valid for a document at a particular state ←
16:51:17 <lizadaly> Azaroth: How do we move to more formal vetting? Do we want for the other task forces?
Robert Sanderson: How do we move to more formal vetting? Do we wait for the other task forces? ←
16:51:25 <lizadaly> s/want/wait/
16:51:46 <lizadaly> Ivan: We don't have any formal approach
Ivan Herman: We don't have any formal approach ←
16:51:58 <lizadaly> Ivan: The unit of the task force is the entire IG
Ivan Herman: The unit of the task force is the entire IG ←
16:52:10 <lizadaly> Ivan: The IG should get some time to review the UCs
Ivan Herman: The IG should get some time to review the UCs ←
16:52:26 <lizadaly> Ivan: and then say yes/no
Ivan Herman: and then say yes/no ←
16:52:34 <lizadaly> Ivan: Assuming they agree... what is the next step?
Ivan Herman: Assuming they agree... what is the next step? ←
16:52:49 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Markus and I will take the UCs back to the IDPF and to the community group
Robert Sanderson: Markus and I will take the UCs back to the IDPF and to the community group ←
16:53:21 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Within the community group we can help with the annotations packages problems and system-to-system APIs
Robert Sanderson: Within the community group we can help with the annotations packages problems and system-to-system APIs ←
16:53:41 <lizadaly> Azaroth: We haven't want to formalize metadata in that group but could take a stab at it for this audience and for accessibility
Robert Sanderson: We haven't want to formalize metadata in that group but could take a stab at it for this audience and for accessibility ←
16:54:36 <lizadaly> Ivan: What I would like to see: 2 documents, 1 is looking at the use cases: are there requirements that lead to missing features?
Ivan Herman: What I would like to see: 2 documents, 1 is looking at the use cases: are there requirements that lead to missing features? ←
16:55:36 <lizadaly> Ivan: 2. Particular to this task force: if the IG decides that they want to go for a WG, how do these use cases the charter of a possible WG?
Ivan Herman: 2. Particular to this task force: if the IG decides that they want to go for a WG, how do these use cases the charter of a possible WG? ←
16:55:43 <lizadaly> Ivan: 1 outcome is a draft charter
Ivan Herman: 1 outcome is a draft charter ←
16:56:15 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Markus, Rob, and Paolo discussed using these UCs towards a charter
Robert Sanderson: Markus, Rob, and Paolo discussed using these UCs towards a charter ←
16:57:10 <lizadaly> Azaroth: Re: missing features in the OWP (Open Web Platform), would be helpful to have people in the other task forces with web experience look at whether those features are possible now
Robert Sanderson: Re: missing features in the OWP (Open Web Platform), would be helpful to have people in the other task forces with web experience look at whether those features are possible now ←
16:58:18 <lizadaly> Ivan: 3. Maybe require work with BillK's task force: identification of how parts of a document are targeted for annotation
Ivan Herman: 3. Maybe require work with BillK's task force: identification of how parts of a document are targeted for annotation ←
16:58:30 <ivan> q?
Ivan Herman: q? ←
16:59:08 <lizadaly> Dave Cramer: I volunteer for latinreq
Dave Cramer: I volunteer for latinreq ←
16:59:34 <lizadaly> BillK: There will need to be a CSS discussion at that meeting too
Bill Kasdorf: There will need to be a CSS discussion at that meeting too ←
17:00:05 <azaroth> ACTION: azaroth to note the differences between javascript API vs inter-system web API
ACTION: azaroth to note the differences between javascript API vs inter-system web API ←
17:00:05 <trackbot> Created ACTION-13 - Note the differences between javascript api vs inter-system web api [on Robert Sanderson - due 2013-12-23].
Trackbot IRC Bot: Created ACTION-13 - Note the differences between javascript api vs inter-system web api [on Robert Sanderson - due 2013-12-23]. ←
17:00:28 <Zakim> -gcapiel
Zakim IRC Bot: -gcapiel ←
17:00:46 <lizadaly> Dave Cramer: We will use the mailing list for discussions of that
Dave Cramer: We will use the mailing list for discussions of that ←
17:01:18 <lizadaly> Thanks!
Thanks! ←
17:01:19 <azaroth> ACTION: azaroth to create new use case regarding description of when annotation is no longer relevant for a publication (eg corrections)
ACTION: azaroth to create new use case regarding description of when annotation is no longer relevant for a publication (eg corrections) ←
17:01:20 <mgylling> bye!