W3C

- DRAFT -

RDF Working Group Teleconference

20 Nov 2013

See also: IRC log

Attendees

Present
ericP, David_Wood, Guus, AndyS, Ivan, gkellogg, markus, Sandro, PatH, FabGandon, AZ, Souri, Arnaud, TallTed, zwu2, pchampin
Regrets
Chair
Guus
Scribe
markus

Contents


<trackbot> Date: 20 November 2013

<scribe> scribe: markus

<ericP> +1

<PatH> +1

guus: propose to accept the minutes of last week's telecon

RESOLUTION: accept minutes of last week's telecon

guus: there are 3 actions...
... all three actions are now done
... objections?
... we'll put ACTION-98 on the agenda next week

davidwood: I hope to have something for the next telecon regarding ACTION-193

guus: closing ACTION-268 (actions are for concrete actions)

<PatH> I should be able to attend (from the USA)

guus: antoine, I suggest you include Sandro's boxed datasets to section 4 to your note

<AZ> yes, please send the link

guus: section 3 looks very complete but section 4 needs more work

CR implementations

gkellogg: nothing new but the traffic on the mailing list suggests that people are working on implementations
... we are also waiting for a couple of tests from, e.g., Peter Ansell
... the reports haven't been updated yet
... they don't contain the new tests
... we have no implementations which pass the new tests yet
... will re-generate the reports as soon as andy and I updated our implementations

guus: ok.. the only problem I see is the semantics test suite
... peter approached a number of people
... we could have a timing problem here.. we need to get this done till middle of december
... someone willing or planning to do an implementation for the semantics tests?
... if we make no progress till next week we may need to do some emergency actions, i.e., work ourselves on implementations

CR comments

ericP: it's difficult to get reponses from commenters

<AndyS> Also reply re ISSUE-172

<PatH> +1 to not changing anything now.

http://www.w3.org/TR/rdf11-concepts/#dfn-rdf-term

<AZ> Henry Story has just sent RESOLVED

<AndyS> TriG / Bare collections http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-wg/2013Nov/0080.html

ACTION for davidwood to describe how SPARQL datasets relate to RDF datasets in RDF Concepts

<trackbot> Error finding 'for'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/users>.

ACTION on davidwood to describe how SPARQL datasets relate to RDF datasets in RDF Concepts

<trackbot> Error finding 'on'. You can review and register nicknames at <http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/track/users>.

ACTION davidwood to describe how SPARQL datasets relate to RDF datasets in RDF Concepts

<trackbot> Created ACTION-326 - Describe how sparql datasets relate to rdf datasets in rdf concepts [on David Wood - due 2013-11-27].

<ericP> http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/Turtle_Candidate_Recommendation_Comments#c3 marked resolved. now to pester David Robillard...

gregg: I think TriG compatiblity with N3 is more on the syntactic level not semantic

andys: not sure.. it talks about provenance etc.

<PatH> Peter, do you have any news of progress on semantics text suite implementations?? We were discussing this earlier.

<Guus> this is not a WG requirement, so let's not spend too much time on it

<PatH> text/test

gregg: a solution would be to disallow bare graphs

<PatH> graph modesty should be accepted by all civilized people.

guus: how much time do we wanna spend on this? it's not a WG requirement

andys: I propose we do no nothing.. it's too late

sandro: we are not doing N3 so compatibility to Turtle is most important
... we are moving towards SPARQL-style
... at some point we should deprecate the other forms

<PatH> bare graphs and now content sniffing? This is getting out of hand.

<pfps> I haven't heard back from anyone on entailment implementations, except for initial ACKs.

gregg: a problem in practice is that sometimes it becomes very difficult to tell what format a file is in by just looking at its content

<PatH> OK tnx.

<AndyS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-wg/2013Nov/0090.html

guus: TriG compatibility with N-Quads

andys: there's a proposed reply here http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-wg/2013Nov/0090.html
... not really what the commenter asked for but should resolve the issue

<PatH> Is there a less squirrely change to the grammar that would get the quads he wants?

andys: TriG and Turtle are "human-readable" formats.. N-Quads/N-Triples are intended for data dumps

guus: I can live with this proposed response

gkellogg: I agree with andy

path: I agree but think we talk about "human readable" etc. in the response

<AndyS> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-rdf-wg/2013Nov/0094.html

andys: "Escaped characters in N-Triples" indirectly affects all syntaxes
... I'm wondering if the change was intentional or if it was an editorial mistake
... if we don't know.. we have to make a decision
... we can be liberal.. counterargument: it introduces more ways to write the same thing

guus: we should be consistent across our syntaxes and we shouldn't introduce major design changes
... I'll go with the majority

andys: I don't care.. I don't believe in canonical N-Triples
... if we remove it it's a change to the CR docs so it's probably better to leave it as-is

gregg: should we add a syntax test or be completely silent on it?

<FabGandon> ok

andys: we should do nothing (it should have been a negative syntax test)

RDF Schema

RDF/XML

<FabGandon> Status

<FabGandon> http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/TF-RDF-XML

<AndyS> AndyS: do not want to add a negative syntax test for \' if we decide to not have \' formally in NT and Nq

FabGandon: 1-4 are done
... 5-6 are open errata
... I need someone else to take a look to make sure I don't make a mistake
... 7 should probably not be done
... 8 is done

ACTION guus to review proposed changes in http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/TF-RDF-XML

<trackbot> Created ACTION-327 - Review proposed changes in http://www.w3.org/2011/rdf-wg/wiki/tf-rdf-xml [on Guus Schreiber - due 2013-11-27].

guus: we can only do this if we publish this as revised proposed recommendation in december

<Arnaud> sorry, got to go

Primer

guus: any reviewers for primer?

<pchampin> I volunteer to review it

<PatH> I volunteer. Can I make some suggested edits to it?

<PatH> Thats where I will bite first :-)

RDF Schema

guus: RDF schema document is in good shape
... there's a link with a diff to the previous version
... I did a number of edits... could someone review them?

davidwood: I'll do as soon as I'm done with my other actions

guus: adjourned

<pfps> I looked over the initial set of edits to RDF Schema, and they all looked OK, I think.

<Guus> trackbot, end meeting

Summary of Action Items

[End of minutes]

Minutes formatted by David Booth's scribe.perl version 1.138 (CVS log)
$Date: 2013/11/20 17:07:58 $

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Found Scribe: markus
Inferring ScribeNick: markus
Default Present: ericP, David_Wood, Guus, AndyS, Ivan, gkellogg, markus, Sandro, PatH, FabGandon, AZ, Souri, Arnaud, TallTed, zwu2, pchampin
Present: ericP David_Wood Guus AndyS Ivan gkellogg markus Sandro PatH FabGandon AZ Souri Arnaud TallTed zwu2 pchampin
Found Date: 20 Nov 2013
Guessing minutes URL: http://www.w3.org/2013/11/20-rdf-wg-minutes.html
People with action items: 

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