12:46:32 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #webtv
12:46:32 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/09/04-webtv-irc
12:46:34 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs world
12:46:34 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #webtv
12:46:36 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be
12:46:36 <Zakim> I don't understand 'this will be', trackbot
12:46:37 <trackbot> Meeting: Web and TV Interest Group Teleconference
12:46:37 <trackbot> Date: 04 September 2013
12:47:02 <olivier> zakim, this will be WEBTV1
12:47:02 <Zakim> ok, olivier; I see UW_WebTVIG()9:00AM scheduled to start in 13 minutes
12:52:30 <olivier> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2013Sep/0002.html
12:52:39 <olivier> Agenda+ Roll Call
12:52:45 <olivier> Agenda+ Review Open Action Items http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/7
12:52:51 <olivier> Agenda+ Review and discuss the list of use cases (last call per schedule)
12:53:00 <olivier> Agenda+ Review and discuss the requirements
12:53:06 <olivier> Agenda+ Start to discuss gap analysis
12:53:13 <olivier> Agenda+ Next steps
12:53:18 <olivier> Agenda+ AOB
12:53:50 <skim13> skim13 has joined #webtv
12:57:22 <kaz> kaz has joined #webtv
12:57:32 <ddavis> ddavis has joined #webtv
12:57:57 <Bin_Hu> Bin_Hu has joined #webtv
12:58:30 <kaz> zakim, call kazuyuki-617
12:58:30 <Zakim> ok, kaz; the call is being made
12:58:31 <Zakim> UW_WebTVIG()9:00AM has now started
12:58:32 <Zakim> +Kazuyuki
12:58:54 <Zakim> + +1.425.214.aaaa
12:59:08 <kaz> zakim, aaaa is Bin_Hu
12:59:08 <Zakim> +Bin_Hu; got it
12:59:17 <Sheau> Sheau has joined #webtv
12:59:45 <Zakim> + +1.508.276.aabb
12:59:56 <Sheau> aabb is Sheau
13:00:10 <Zakim> +??P17
13:00:13 <ddavis> Zakim, ??P17 is ddavis
13:00:13 <Zakim> +ddavis; got it
13:00:32 <Sheau> Zakim, aabb is Sheau
13:00:32 <Zakim> +Sheau; got it
13:00:39 <kaz> zakim, who is here?
13:00:39 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki, Bin_Hu, Sheau, ddavis
13:00:40 <Zakim> On IRC I see Sheau, Bin_Hu, ddavis, kaz, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, olivier, timeless, trackbot
13:01:56 <kaz> Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2013Sep/0002.html
13:02:06 <olivier> agenda?
13:02:13 <gmandyam> gmandyam has joined #webtv
13:02:37 <gmandyam> Giri Mandyam from Qualcomm Innovation Center joining.  will be on the bridge shortly
13:03:08 <Zakim> + +1.858.780.aacc
13:03:20 <gmandyam> Zakim, aacc is me
13:03:20 <Zakim> +gmandyam; got it
13:04:21 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
13:04:41 <igarashi> igarashi has joined #webtv
13:04:42 <olivier> zakim, IPcaller is me
13:04:42 <Zakim> +olivier; got it
13:05:25 <olivier> zakim, who is here?
13:05:25 <Zakim> On the phone I see Kazuyuki, Bin_Hu, Sheau, ddavis, gmandyam, olivier
13:05:26 <Zakim> On IRC I see igarashi, gmandyam, Sheau, Bin_Hu, ddavis, kaz, skim13, Zakim, RRSAgent, olivier, timeless, trackbot
13:06:07 <Zakim> +Mark_Vickers
13:06:35 <Zakim> +??P22
13:06:45 <kaz> Present: Kaz, Bin, Sheau, Daniel, Giri, Olivier, MarkV, Igarashi
13:06:45 <Mark_Vickers> Mark_Vickers has joined #webtv
13:06:51 <kaz> zakim, ??P22 is igarashi
13:06:51 <Zakim> +igarashi; got it
13:07:12 <Zakim> + +1.818.406.aadd
13:08:33 <kaz> zakim, aadd is cyril
13:08:33 <Zakim> +cyril; got it
13:08:44 <olivier> zakim, agenda?
13:08:44 <Zakim> I see 7 items remaining on the agenda:
13:08:45 <Zakim> 1. Roll Call [from olivier]
13:08:45 <Zakim> 2. Review Open Action Items http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/7 [from olivier]
13:08:45 <Zakim> 3. Review and discuss the list of use cases (last call per schedule) [from olivier]
13:08:45 <Zakim> 4. Review and discuss the requirements [from olivier]
13:08:46 <Zakim> 5. Start to discuss gap analysis [from olivier]
13:08:46 <Zakim> 6. Next steps [from olivier]
13:08:46 <Zakim> 7. AOB [from olivier]
13:08:55 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 1
13:08:55 <Zakim> agendum 1. "Roll Call" taken up [from olivier]
13:09:24 <olivier> scribe: Mark_Vickers
13:09:28 <CyrilRa> CyrilRa has joined #webtv
13:09:29 <olivier> ScribeNick: Mark_Vickers
13:10:05 <olivier> Giri Mandyam
13:11:21 <Mark_Vickers> giri: introduces himself.
13:11:51 <gmandyam> kaz - thanks.  Glad to finally have been able to join.
13:12:10 <olivier> zakim, close agendum 1
13:12:10 <Zakim> agendum 1, Roll Call, closed
13:12:11 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
13:12:11 <Zakim> 2. Review Open Action Items http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/7 [from olivier]
13:12:12 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Have bridge for 90 min, may not use 90.
13:12:18 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 2
13:12:18 <Zakim> agendum 2. "Review Open Action Items http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/7" taken up [from olivier]
13:13:07 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: 2 open action items. both on giuseppe, who isn't on the call today.
13:13:19 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
13:13:44 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: olivier says he's still working on his action items.
13:14:02 <ddavis> s/olivier/giuseppe/
13:14:09 <olivier> zakim, IPcaller is Sung Hei Kim
13:14:09 <Zakim> I don't understand 'IPcaller is Sung Hei Kim', olivier
13:14:15 <olivier> IPcaller is Sung Hei Kim
13:14:45 <olivier> zakim, close agendum
13:14:45 <Zakim> I don't understand 'close agendum', olivier
13:14:55 <olivier> zakim, IPcaller is skim13
13:14:55 <Zakim> +skim13; got it
13:15:03 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 3
13:15:03 <Zakim> agendum 3. "Review and discuss the list of use cases (last call per schedule)" taken up [from olivier]
13:15:46 <kaz> present+ Sung_Hei
13:15:50 <olivier> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Media_APIs#Iterations_and_Timeline
13:16:05 <kaz> rrsagent, make log public
13:16:10 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
13:16:10 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/09/04-webtv-minutes.html kaz
13:16:10 <olivier> http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/wiki/Media_APIs/Use_Cases
13:16:32 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Today is deadline for final review of use cases.
13:17:16 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: First: Any additional use cases or any use cases to be deleted from the list?
13:18:12 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Work still going on on last two use cases.
13:18:45 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Please focus on new use case 12.
13:19:17 <olivier> Mark_Vickers: multi-screen advertisement is a large topic, could almost be the focus on a single group
13:19:49 <Mark_Vickers> mark_vickers: the topic of multiscreen advertisement is very large.
13:20:23 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: we will work on those 12 use cases.
13:21:58 <olivier> zakim, agenda?
13:21:58 <Zakim> I see 6 items remaining on the agenda:
13:21:59 <Zakim> 2. Review Open Action Items http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/7 [from olivier]
13:21:59 <Zakim> 3. Review and discuss the list of use cases (last call per schedule) [from olivier]
13:21:59 <Zakim> 4. Review and discuss the requirements [from olivier]
13:21:59 <Zakim> 5. Start to discuss gap analysis [from olivier]
13:21:59 <Zakim> 6. Next steps [from olivier]
13:22:00 <Zakim> 7. AOB [from olivier]
13:22:07 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: question on the next step: what do we want to do with the mapping onto requirements?
13:22:07 <olivier> zakim, close agendum 2
13:22:07 <Zakim> agendum 2, Review Open Action Items http://www.w3.org/2011/webtv/track/products/7, closed
13:22:09 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
13:22:09 <Zakim> 3. Review and discuss the list of use cases (last call per schedule) [from olivier]
13:22:58 <Zakim> + +49.303.aaee
13:23:19 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: What I would like to do today is to speak about use case 12, then review the mapping table, then discuss how to do the gap analysis.
13:23:33 <kaz> zakim, aaee is Louay
13:23:33 <kaz> Present+ Louay
13:23:33 <Zakim> +Louay; got it
13:24:14 <olivier> [Louay introduces himself]
13:24:17 <Mark_Vickers> louay: introduces himself. main topic at Fraunhofer is multiscreen.
13:24:42 <olivier> Agenda+ review of Use Case Twelve - Multiscreen Advertisement
13:24:54 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 8
13:24:54 <Zakim> agendum 8. "review of Use Case Twelve - Multiscreen Advertisement" taken up [from olivier]
13:25:02 <Mark_Vickers> louay: Use case 12 is related to recent work at Fraunhofer.
13:25:18 <olivier> zakim, close agendum 3
13:25:18 <Zakim> agendum 3, Review and discuss the list of use cases (last call per schedule), closed
13:25:20 <Zakim> I see 5 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
13:25:20 <Zakim> 4. Review and discuss the requirements [from olivier]
13:25:59 <Mark_Vickers> louay: Idea behind use case is more or le ad insertion with second screen advertisement related to content on the main screen.
13:27:48 <Mark_Vickers> louay: There are many relevant technologies. In our prototype, we used Bonjour discovery of Android devices, TV connected to proxy which performed discovery, communication with WebSockets
13:27:58 <gmandyam> q+
13:28:38 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Is Mark suggesting we split the use case?
13:28:46 <Sheau> q+
13:29:28 <olivier> Mark_Vickers: ad insertion could be done on 1st screen
13:29:33 <olivier> ack gm
13:29:45 <Mark_Vickers> mav: Not suggesting whether to split, just that it is a large topic.
13:31:01 <gmandyam> Had two questions:  (1) Is multiscreen ads part of the HbbTV 2.0 work?, (2) Should this UC be generalized multiscreen rendering?
13:31:36 <Mark_Vickers> louay: Regarding hbbtv, in hbbtv 2.4 there is a lot of discussion of multiple devices.
13:32:25 <Mark_Vickers> louay: the prototype isn't related to any hbbtv spec.
13:33:02 <Mark_Vickers> louay: the communication used in the prototype is new, but the topic has been discussed in hbbtv.
13:33:57 <olivier> ack s
13:34:04 <Mark_Vickers> louay: As to the technology, the technology used for connecting the screens could be used for any multiscreen use cases.
13:35:39 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: This is indeed a large use case. More than half of other existing use cases could be folded into this one (e.g. discovery & synchronization). Could we have a hierarchy of use cases with large use case and su-use cases?
13:36:00 <Mark_Vickers> s/su-use/sub-use
13:37:03 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: There's no rule on large vs. sub use cases. I'm hearing that this use case is large. Should we split it into multiple use cases?
13:37:20 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Any thought on how to split it?
13:40:06 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: We could group the use cases into groups. One group would be synchronized multiscreen, the other would be ads starting and ending at same time without synchrony, third would be users interacting with ads
13:40:36 <olivier> q?
13:40:36 <Bin_Hu> q+
13:40:45 <olivier> ack B
13:41:59 <Mark_Vickers> bin: instead of splitting into multiple use cases, ask louay whether there are any additional requirements from this use case, since the end goal is gap analysis. This might be easier.
13:42:37 <Mark_Vickers> alivier: Following that. Sheau, would you say everything is covered?
13:43:37 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: I agree with bin that at this point we have covered the space pretty well. We should use use case 12 to guide our search for requirements.
13:44:07 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Sheau, please review use case 12 for any additional requirements.
13:45:13 <olivier> Mark_Vickers: for some networks there would be a requirement that messaging for ad insertion can not be used for ad elimination
13:46:05 <kaz> kaz has joined #webtv
13:48:22 <Sheau> q+
13:49:10 <Mark_Vickers> who is speaking?
13:49:14 <olivier> Cyril
13:49:32 <kaz> kaz has joined #webtv
13:50:01 <Mark_Vickers> cyril: The OATC group is addressing these issues in a spec delivering metadata to the client.
13:50:32 <kaz> kaz has joined #webtv
13:51:16 <Mark_Vickers> cyril: The OATC has a spec. There will soon be a new spec defining a stream of metadata to the client. Avoiding ad elimination could be tricky.
13:51:20 <olivier> ack s
13:53:16 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: I'd like to expand further that this is not limited to ads. We should provide more signaling, to avoid ads or segments being messed up. We need to provide guidance as to what can be modified. Need to add semantics to signals.
13:53:54 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: I suggest we move to next agenda item to review the grid.
13:54:07 <olivier> zakim, close agendum 8
13:54:07 <Zakim> agendum 8, review of Use Case Twelve - Multiscreen Advertisement, closed
13:54:10 <Zakim> I see 4 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is
13:54:10 <Zakim> 4. Review and discuss the requirements [from olivier]
13:54:17 <olivier> zakim, take up agendum 4
13:54:17 <Zakim> agendum 4. "Review and discuss the requirements" taken up [from olivier]
13:54:27 <olivier> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AvACjV6qSvmxdEctdjYwa2JOalZLOG10elE1LVRZNlE#gid=0
13:55:34 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Want to review two contentious items, then review new use case 12.
13:56:40 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: 1st contentious area:
13:58:10 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: want to make sure we provide function of parental control. For example, when I say "content protection" I mean that when a child browses content, some content would be eliminated from display.
13:58:39 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Sounds like we agree we can remove the X
13:59:33 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Next item was use case 9 & content streaming, which actually wasn't contentious on reconsideration, so not an issue
13:59:55 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Reviewing use case 12
14:00:43 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: This use case about device discovery, not service discovery
14:00:54 <kaz> q+
14:01:31 <olivier> http://www.w3.org/TR/hnreq/
14:01:36 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: While it seems the same, it is reverse: Service discovery vs. device discovery.
14:02:44 <olivier> ACTION: Sheau to split the first requirement to be "service discovery" and "device discovery" in the requirements document and cross-ref table
14:02:45 <trackbot> Created ACTION-140 - Split the first requirement to be "service discovery" and "device discovery" in the requirements document and cross-ref table [on Sheau Ng - due 2013-09-11].
14:03:32 <olivier> http://www.w3.org/TR/hnreq/#discovery-and-advertising
14:05:13 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Suggests sheau use the HN Requirements document for semantics
14:05:44 <olivier> ack kaz
14:06:39 <Mark_Vickers> kaz: W3C MMI architecture has defined semantic architecture that could be used here.
14:07:03 <Mark_Vickers> http://www.w3.org/TR/mmi-arch/
14:09:27 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: [Continues editing list of requirements for use case 12]
14:10:42 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: questions use case 12 requirement for 1.5.1 device authentication.
14:11:01 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: user identification needed
14:11:44 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: that would be 1.5.3 subscriber authentication
14:11:59 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: there are cases where number of devices are limited
14:12:22 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: OK, we'll leave 1.5.1 device authentication
14:13:13 <igarashi> q+
14:13:29 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: [Continues editing list of requirements for use case 12]
14:14:52 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: There is no cross on 1.8 Context-based and targeted service aggregation. Believe ther should be one. Hearing no objections, it is added.
14:16:06 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Any need for 1.11 Offline mode for services and content
14:16:20 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: recorded content would be 1.11
14:16:30 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: added cross for 1.11
14:17:26 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: 1.12 device-to-device content transfer, is there any content transfer or just communication?
14:18:30 <Mark_Vickers> louay: there is app to app communication. it could include content or content could be referenced in communication and pulled from a third party.
14:19:17 <kaz> q?
14:19:18 <Mark_Vickers> sheau: one scenario is that the broadcast could include different versions of ad content and then the main device could serve that content to the mobile device
14:19:18 <olivier> ack igarashi
14:20:25 <Mark_Vickers> igarashi: I'd also like to discuss use case 8 before end of the call.
14:20:42 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: let's try to wrap us use case 12 quickly
14:21:02 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: we'll keep cross on 1.12
14:21:29 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: 1.13 payment mechanism definitely in scope
14:21:47 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: 1.14 search - agree not in scenario
14:22:16 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: 1.15 & 1.16 also not in scenario
14:23:06 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: I believe that 1.17 channel identification chould be added. Any agree? [no replies] Not added.
14:23:13 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: [Continues editing list of requirements for use case 12]
14:24:12 <Mark_Vickers> olivier completes review of use case 12 requirements in table.
14:25:16 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Group should work offline on whether there are additional requirements from use case 12 to be reviewed next week.
14:25:32 <kaz> kaz has joined #webtv
14:25:51 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: If there are any questions on requirements, please add to table using color red and adding a question mark "?"
14:26:27 <gmandyam> q+
14:26:53 <Mark_Vickers> igarashi: offline mode is necessary for Use Case 8: download and go
14:27:44 <Mark_Vickers> igarashi:requirement 1.12 device-to-device content transfer is required for use case 8 also
14:28:49 <olivier> http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-web-and-tv/2013Jul/0050.html
14:30:02 <Mark_Vickers> igarashi: Suggest adding adding further description for content protection requirement to include offline content protection.
14:30:32 <kaz> kaz has joined #webtv
14:30:50 <CyrilRa> CyrilRa has joined #webtv
14:31:57 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: Suggest rewording the requirement offline on the list.
14:32:01 <gmandyam> UC 8:  Is network selection (e.g. optimum network for download) in scope?
14:32:01 <olivier> ack g
14:32:36 <Mark_Vickers> giri: Is network selection also in scope for use case 8?
14:33:11 <olivier> ACTION: gmandyam to add requirement for network selection (relevant to UC8)
14:33:11 <trackbot> Created ACTION-141 - Add requirement for network selection (relevant to uc8) [on Giridhar Mandyam - due 2013-09-11].
14:33:57 <Zakim> -Bin_Hu
14:33:58 <Zakim> -Sheau
14:33:59 <Zakim> -skim13
14:34:00 <Zakim> -cyril
14:34:01 <Zakim> -gmandyam
14:34:02 <Zakim> -olivier
14:34:02 <Mark_Vickers> olivier: next teleconference is in 2 weeks. we'll send agenda. thanks to all. apologies for running over time. meeting adjourned.
14:34:04 <Zakim> -ddavis
14:34:04 <Zakim> -Louay
14:34:05 <olivier> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:34:05 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/09/04-webtv-minutes.html olivier
14:34:10 <Zakim> -Mark_Vickers
14:34:12 <skim13> skim13 has left #webtv
14:34:12 <igarashi> igarashi has joined #webtv
14:34:19 <Zakim> -Kazuyuki
14:34:20 <Zakim> -igarashi
14:34:20 <Zakim> UW_WebTVIG()9:00AM has ended
14:34:20 <Zakim> Attendees were Kazuyuki, +1.425.214.aaaa, Bin_Hu, +1.508.276.aabb, ddavis, Sheau, +1.858.780.aacc, gmandyam, olivier, Mark_Vickers, igarashi, +1.818.406.aadd, cyril, skim13,
14:34:20 <Zakim> ... +49.303.aaee, Louay
14:34:27 <Mark_Vickers> whew!
14:34:41 <Mark_Vickers> np
14:34:59 <Mark_Vickers> just a two-fingered typist, though. ;-)
14:34:59 <CyrilRa> aadd is me
14:35:09 <Mark_Vickers> please
14:35:19 <CyrilRa> Zakim, aadd is me
14:35:19 <Zakim> sorry, CyrilRa, I do not recognize a party named 'aadd'
14:35:40 <kaz> [ adjourned ]
14:35:42 <igarashi> igarashi has joined #webtv
14:35:44 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:35:44 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/09/04-webtv-minutes.html kaz
14:35:49 <kaz> rrsagent, stop
14:37:17 <kaz> Chair: Olivier
14:37:27 <kaz> Present+ Cyril
14:37:31 <kaz> rrsagent, draft minutes
14:37:31 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/09/04-webtv-minutes.html kaz
14:37:33 <kaz> rrsagent, stop