14:03:11 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #dpub
14:03:11 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/08/20-dpub-irc
14:03:13 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public
14:03:13 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #dpub
14:03:15 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be dpub
14:03:15 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM scheduled to start in 57 minutes
14:03:16 <trackbot> Meeting: Digital Publishing Interest Group Teleconference
14:03:16 <trackbot> Date: 20 August 2013
14:54:34 <mgylling> mgylling has joined #dpub
14:54:45 <Hajar> Hajar has joined #dpub
14:55:38 <mielvds> mielvds has joined #dpub
14:57:04 <tzviya> tzviya has joined #dpub
14:57:38 <gcapiel> gcapiel has joined #dpub
14:57:38 <duga> duga has joined #dpub
14:57:52 <Bill_Kasdorf> Bill_Kasdorf has joined #dpub
14:57:56 <Zakim> SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM has now started
14:58:02 <fjh> fjh has joined #dpub
14:58:03 <Zakim> +Tsviya
14:58:05 <mielvds1> mielvds1 has joined #dpub
14:58:25 <fjh> zakim, code?
14:58:25 <Zakim> the conference code is 3782 (tel:+1.617.761.6200 sip:zakim@voip.w3.org), fjh
14:58:39 <Zakim> + +1.415.577.aaaa
14:58:50 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
14:58:50 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
14:58:51 <Zakim> +Ivan
14:59:32 <Zakim> +duga
14:59:34 <Zakim> +mielvds
14:59:35 <gcapiel> +Gerardo as guest from Benetech
14:59:35 <Zakim> +plinss
14:59:43 <madi> madi has joined #dpub
14:59:48 <Zakim> +mgylling
14:59:53 <karen_> karen_ has joined #dpub
15:00:06 <Zakim> +??P16
15:00:09 <mgylling> regrets: Vladimir Levantovsky, Tom De Nies, Sharad Garg, George Kerscher
15:00:10 <Hajar_> Hajar_ has joined #dpub
15:00:14 <Zakim> +Karen_Myers
15:00:15 <Zakim> +azaroth
15:00:19 <mielvds1> zakim, Hajar is with me
15:00:19 <Zakim> sorry, mielvds1, I do not recognize a party named 'mielvds1'
15:00:21 <azaroth> azaroth has joined #dpub
15:00:31 <Zakim> +Madi
15:00:41 <mielvds1> zakim, mielvds is me
15:00:41 <Zakim> +mielvds1; got it
15:01:07 <gcapiel> Gerardo Capiel from Benetech
15:01:14 <mielvds1> zakim, Hajar is with me
15:01:14 <Zakim> +Hajar; got it
15:01:16 <Zakim> + +1.734.904.aabb
15:01:23 <ivan> Guest: Gerardo Capiel, Benetech
15:01:30 <Zakim> + +1.703.352.aacc
15:02:05 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
15:02:05 <Zakim> On the phone I see Tsviya, +1.415.577.aaaa, Ivan, duga, plinss, mielvds1, mgylling, ??P16, azaroth, Karen_Myers, Madi, +1.734.904.aabb, +1.703.352.aacc
15:02:08 <Zakim> mielvds1 has mielvds1, Hajar
15:02:08 <Zakim> On IRC I see azaroth, Hajar_, karen_, madi, mielvds1, fjh, Bill_Kasdorf, duga, gcapiel, tzviya, mielvds, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, trackbot, plinss, sandro
15:02:17 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:02:22 <fjh> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
15:02:23 <Zakim> +fjh; got it
15:02:33 <karen_> Scribe: Madi
15:02:36 <mgylling> Guest: Anh Bui, Benetech
15:02:37 <madi> madi will attempt to scribe
15:02:37 <JeanKaplansky> JeanKaplansky has joined #dpub
15:02:37 <fjh> Present+ Frederick_Hirsch
15:02:43 <fjh> zakim, who is here?
15:02:44 <Zakim> On the phone I see Tsviya, +1.415.577.aaaa, Ivan, duga, plinss, mielvds1, mgylling, ??P16, azaroth, Karen_Myers, Madi, +1.734.904.aabb, +1.703.352.aacc, fjh
15:02:46 <Zakim> mielvds1 has mielvds1, Hajar
15:02:46 <Zakim> On IRC I see JeanKaplansky, azaroth, Hajar_, karen_, madi, mielvds1, fjh, Bill_Kasdorf, duga, gcapiel, tzviya, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, trackbot, plinss, sandro
15:02:53 <JeanKaplansky> Jean Kaplansky is 703 in the US.
15:02:56 <gcapiel> Gerardo Capiel is 415-577-3484
15:02:57 <madi> @Karen thank you!
15:03:11 <ivan> zakim, aacc is JeanKaplansky
15:03:11 <Zakim> +JeanKaplansky; got it
15:03:22 <ivan> Guest: Jean (JeanKaplansky) Kaplansky
15:03:23 <tzviya> Tzviya Siegman is the 201 number
15:03:34 <ivan> zakim, who is here/
15:03:34 <Zakim> I don't understand 'who is here/', ivan
15:03:40 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
15:03:40 <Zakim> On the phone I see Tsviya, +1.415.577.aaaa, Ivan, duga, plinss, mielvds1, mgylling, ??P16, azaroth, Karen_Myers, Madi, +1.734.904.aabb, JeanKaplansky, fjh
15:03:44 <Zakim> mielvds1 has mielvds1, Hajar
15:03:44 <Zakim> On IRC I see JeanKaplansky, azaroth, Hajar_, karen_, madi, mielvds1, fjh, Bill_Kasdorf, duga, gcapiel, tzviya, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, trackbot, plinss, sandro
15:03:57 <ivan> zakim, aaabb is Bill_Kasdorf
15:03:57 <Zakim> sorry, ivan, I do not recognize a party named 'aaabb'
15:04:13 <ivan> zakim, aabb is Bill_Kasdorf
15:04:13 <Zakim> +Bill_Kasdorf; got it
15:04:34 <ivan> Guest: Bill (Bill_Kasdorf) Kasdorf
15:04:50 <madi> Ivan is still staring up the meeting
15:05:09 <ivan> zakim, aaaa is gcapiel
15:05:09 <Zakim> +gcapiel; got it
15:05:28 <ivan> Guest: Gerado (gcapiel) Capiel, Benetech
15:05:48 <ivan> zakim, who is here?
15:05:48 <Zakim> On the phone I see Tsviya, gcapiel, Ivan, duga, plinss, mielvds1, mgylling, ??P16, azaroth, Karen_Myers, Madi, Bill_Kasdorf, JeanKaplansky, fjh
15:05:50 <Zakim> mielvds1 has mielvds1, Hajar
15:05:50 <Zakim> On IRC I see JeanKaplansky, azaroth, Hajar_, karen_, madi, mielvds1, fjh, Bill_Kasdorf, duga, gcapiel, tzviya, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, trackbot, plinss, sandro
15:06:31 <ivan> scribenick: madi
15:06:38 <Bill_Kasdorf> On IRC now
15:06:39 <ivan> scribe: Madi
15:06:42 <madi> Markus opens the meeting with an acknowledgement of invited guests
15:06:48 <mgylling> https://www.w3.org/2013/meeting/dpub/2013-08-13
15:06:55 <madi> First agenda:  approval of meeting minutes.
15:07:22 <madi> No response.  Good, moving on. Minutes accepted.
15:07:54 <madi> Next agenda: new participants
15:08:02 <madi> @ ivan : ok
15:08:36 <madi> Any organization or individual as candidates, please contact the Co Chairs
15:09:15 <madi> Tzviya is now an invited expert.  Markus: Welcome Tziya
15:09:32 <madi> Introductions to new participants: Bill Kasdorf
15:09:51 <Zakim> -fjh
15:10:10 <madi> Introductions: Gerardo Capiel
15:10:32 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
15:11:14 <fjh_> fjh_ has joined #dpub
15:11:38 <fjh_> zakim, who is here?
15:11:38 <Zakim> On the phone I see Tsviya, gcapiel, Ivan, duga, plinss, mielvds1, mgylling, ??P16, azaroth, Karen_Myers, Madi, Bill_Kasdorf, JeanKaplansky, [IPcaller]
15:11:40 <Zakim> mielvds1 has mielvds1, Hajar
15:11:40 <Zakim> On IRC I see fjh_, JeanKaplansky, azaroth, Hajar_, karen_, madi, mielvds1, fjh, Bill_Kasdorf, duga, gcapiel, tzviya, mgylling, Zakim, RRSAgent, ivan, trackbot, plinss, sandro
15:11:46 <fjh_> zakim, [IPcaller] is me
15:11:46 <Zakim> +fjh_; got it
15:12:03 <fjh_> zakim, who is making noise?
15:12:14 <Zakim> fjh_, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: mielvds1 (64%), mgylling (29%)
15:12:14 <gcapiel> Links to affiliations I cited http://diagramcenter.org, http://benetech.org, http://bookshare.org and http://a11ymetadata.org
15:12:19 <madi> There are overheard conversations.  Please be sure to mute your phones.
15:12:45 <madi> Markus: moving on
15:13:05 <madi> Markus:  update of activities for new members
15:13:05 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/UseCase_Directory Use case directory
15:13:36 <fjh_> zakim, who is making noise?
15:13:47 <Zakim> fjh_, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: mgylling (100%)
15:13:51 <madi> There is structure with the Use Cases which may change, but we should stabilise quickly
15:14:25 <madi> There are two Use Cases listed which have been added as example
15:14:39 <ivan> -> http://www.w3.org/dpub/IG/wiki/NakaTobira_01 Naka-Tobira case
15:14:41 <madi> This page will be the central reference for USe Cases
15:15:08 <madi> NakaTobira_01:  this an individual use case.  One Wiki per use case.
15:15:49 <madi> The various fields contain descriptions or scenarios that need to be captured.  Non technical.
15:16:27 <madi> Experts are required to fill in details.  This is why it is marked in red to remind us that we are in need of experts.
15:16:52 <madi> Requirements will be distilled from the Use Case.
15:16:52 <ivan> s/NakaTobira_01: /NakeTobira_01 is /
15:17:47 <madi> NakTobira_01 is a the name of a Use Case.
15:18:35 <madi> Process includes adding the template metadata to complete
15:19:09 <madi> \Standing agenda items will alert new use cases, or those Use Cases that have been completed
15:19:23 <madi> If the Use Case is mature, it will be "Accepted"
15:19:48 <madi> Extensive discussions can be extended in the Wiki if needed
15:20:22 <madi> End of overview of the Use Case approach.  Many have been through something similar.  Input most welcome.
15:20:46 <madi> Open for comment, questions
15:20:56 <azaroth> +1 to approach
15:21:03 <tzviya> q+
15:21:14 <madi> One question from Tzviya
15:21:49 <madi> Tzviya: there will be more forthcoming specification details, for example CSS.
15:22:26 <madi> Markus:  yes.  Once we have enough meat, we'll start active outreach to solicit more information
15:22:52 <madi> Working groups will receive these.  Not ours to solve which problems, but that we describe them.
15:23:04 <JeanKaplansky> q+
15:23:10 <madi> Markus:  room for comments however.
15:23:18 <ivan> ack tzviya
15:23:31 <madi> Jean: Do we have details on these examples yet?
15:23:44 <madi> Do we need that level of detail?
15:24:19 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
15:24:21 <madi> Markus:  depends on who you ask.  There are varying levels of understanding/maturity
15:24:36 <duga> q+
15:24:57 <madi> Markus:  let's keep it common knowledge : make it easy to comprehend
15:25:00 <ivan> s/Jean/JeanKaplansky/
15:25:29 <ivan> ack JeanKaplansky
15:25:41 <madi> Bill Kasdorf: spend a little time on dependencies?
15:26:00 <madi> Markus:  Relation fields only relates to other Use Cases in our collection
15:26:33 <madi> Perhaps calling it TakaTobira should be generalised.
15:26:40 <madi> NakaTobira
15:26:59 <madi> Markus:  NataTobira is an issue in eBooks, concrete requirements
15:27:16 <ivan> ack Bill_Kasdorf
15:27:57 <madi> Bill Kasdorf:  I can provide concrete requirements in poetry, or aligning chapter title, or other vertical alignments.  Appropriate as separate Use Cases and link to NakaTobira?
15:28:15 <madi> Markus:  Yes, I see it that way. Use Cases from three different domains would be ideal.
15:28:31 <madi> Brady...?
15:29:03 <madi> Brady: Back to the NakaTobira case.  Important to have ample amount of detail.  There are 3 or 4 solutions, none of which work.
15:29:23 <madi> Brady:  If we don't include all the Use Cases, we'll only duplicate effort
15:29:45 <madi> Brady:  Why couldn't we solve this problem prior are all lessons we can learn and build on
15:30:21 <madi> Brady: What kinds of questions should I bring up in the USe Case or within the Working Group?
15:31:21 <madi> Markus:  Good question.  My state of mind - requirements using open web standard.  Our goal is to improve digital publishing with these standards.
15:32:04 <madi> Markus:  I will ignore ePub and work toward improving the open web standards.
15:32:56 <madi> Markus: Some solutions of NakaTobira in ePub, but a better one needed.  Here is where we can find the best solution for the long term.
15:33:19 <mgylling> q?
15:33:26 <ivan> ack duga
15:33:31 <madi> Duga ?
15:33:37 <duga> s/Brady/duga
15:33:42 <madi> Oh, sorry!
15:33:45 <duga> np!
15:34:20 <madi> Marching orders:  move forward with the design template and start populating them.  It may change, but we should get on with it.
15:34:33 <madi> Markus:  How to we get this started?
15:34:46 <madi> Markus: NExt Steps agenda items
15:34:54 <ivan> s/Marching orders:/Marching orders are to/
15:35:26 <madi> Many different approaches for this. Blanket canvasing, individual approaches
15:35:37 <madi> Markus: other suggestions?
15:35:42 <madi> Q+
15:36:11 <madi> Gerardo: We would be interested in assessment and metadata work.  We could take subset of those.
15:36:16 <madi> Markus:  Thank you.
15:36:54 <madi> Markus: sub groups as better than free for all?
15:36:59 <madi> Gerardo:  Yes.
15:37:42 <madi> Markus:  Let's begin composing sub groups, but very transparently so we stay informed.
15:37:59 <madi> Markus: We'd like to assign one person to drive a domain Use Case.
15:38:35 <gcapiel> We would also have an interest infographics and STEM in general
15:38:36 <Bill_Kasdorf> suggested term: issue monitor
15:38:40 <madi> Markus:  We could try that.
15:39:01 <madi> Markus:  Issue Monitor (suggested) might be Pagination.  Peter, any suggestions for this?
15:39:14 <Zakim> -duga
15:39:20 <madi> Peter: no
15:39:44 <madi> Markus:  I will scout for someone.  Action item for Markus:  Find the lead for the Pagination work.
15:39:47 <JeanKaplansky> q+
15:39:53 <madi> Peter: suggested....and I missed it....
15:40:05 <madi> Madi: missed it
15:40:15 <Zakim> +duga
15:40:16 <tzviya> Daniel Glazman suggested
15:40:45 <karen_> Madi: I have always called out to my folks at Pearson
15:40:55 <karen_> ...to identify key leads or key people to invite them
15:41:01 <karen_> ...and make it easy for them to fill out the use cases
15:41:09 <karen_> ...going to be a broader approach
15:41:17 <karen_> ...or do use cases and go find people to fill out
15:41:26 <madi> Markus:  Groups are only one approach.  Many ways to populate.
15:41:26 <karen_> Markus: no, just one approach
15:41:36 <karen_> ...if publishing house has one way of doing it, just do it
15:41:46 <karen_> ...just add the stuff you know you want to submit here
15:41:48 <karen_> ...that is fine
15:41:58 <Bill_Kasdorf> q+
15:41:59 <karen_> ...Interest Group will monitor the wiki for new use cases either way
15:42:05 <karen_> Madi: yes
15:42:06 <ivan> ack madi
15:42:11 <ivan> ack JeanKaplansky
15:42:21 <madi> Jean:  Getting this to public email.
15:42:41 <madi> ...MathML.  Will be following up with this.
15:43:12 <karen_> +1 Jean and MathML :)
15:43:15 <gcapiel> Yeah!
15:43:18 <madi> Queen of MathML.
15:43:46 <gcapiel> I'm also on MathJax steering comm
15:43:53 <madi> Markus:  third issue is Annotation and Reading
15:44:15 <madi> Markus:  Rob is here and Chair of the Open Annoations workteam.
15:44:26 <madi> ...we need to do the same here.
15:44:50 <madi> ..Markus: Rob, any suggestions for Annotations Use Case?
15:44:59 <madi> Rob: happy to do so.  Will put call out.
15:45:25 <madi> Markus: Thank you.
15:46:02 <madi> Markus:  Pagination? Jean for Math, Rob for Annotation.
15:46:11 <madi> ...anyone want to take a work thread?
15:46:23 <tzviya> q+
15:46:23 <madi> Markus:  Ivan, how about metadata?
15:46:25 <ivan> s/Rob:/azaroth:/
15:46:35 <madi> ...any suggestions on that?
15:46:47 <madi> Ivan:  We need a number of people outside this group.
15:46:59 <madi> ...Schema.org, Eduserve people...
15:47:06 <Bill_Kasdorf> I would recommend Mark Bide or Graham Bell as members of this IG
15:47:12 <madi> Ivan: many players in metadata.
15:47:25 <azaroth>  Editeur rather than Eduserve ?
15:47:40 <madi> Ivan:  Yes, we'll speak with Mark Bide and Graham Bell of EditEur.
15:47:46 <madi> ...as well as the library world.
15:47:55 <ivan> s/EditEur/EDItEUR/
15:48:20 <madi> Markus: stakeholders?
15:48:41 <madi> Ivan: at this moment, no groups in W3C that work on metadata that would be useful for publishing.
15:48:56 <madi> ...other topics, yes, like HTML.
15:49:19 <madi> ...we might need to set up a separate group on that to fill in gap.
15:49:30 <madi> Markus:  yes.
15:49:41 <mgylling> ack tzviya
15:49:41 <ivan> ack tzviya
15:50:15 <madi> Tzviya:  HTML, the way books and websites are different.  When tagging, many different ways to do this.
15:50:25 <mielvds1> agreed
15:50:42 <JeanKaplansky> JeanKaplansky has joined #dpub
15:50:48 <madi> Ivan:  HTML, metadata, structural semantics?  all different.
15:51:14 <madi> Bill Kasdorf:  they will intersect.  They are also defined differently
15:51:24 <JeanKaplansky> +q
15:51:37 <ivan> ack Bill_Kasdorf
15:51:49 <mielvds1> look at the role of RDFa on this as well
15:51:56 <madi> Bill Kasdorf:  question about the issue what to call these sub groups.
15:52:20 <mgylling> tzviya, FYI I added a "structural semantics" entry to the directory page…
15:52:21 <madi> ....Issue Monitor rather than Sub Group.  Issue Monitor can bring in external expert.  Is that ok?
15:52:48 <madi> Ivan: issues of membership can be complicated.
15:53:23 <madi> ...members can confer with colleagues and experts. But prefer to have it done with members of this group.
15:53:56 <madi> Bill Kasdorf:  Issue Monitor would actually be a member of the group, but may be conferring with others.
15:54:13 <madi> Ivan:  No strong feeling about the naming.
15:54:34 <madi> Markus:  perfectly fine to serve as a channel.
15:54:45 <mgylling> q?
15:54:53 <ivan> ack JeanKaplansky
15:55:24 <madi> @ Jean .  I have those days too...
15:55:32 <JeanKaplansky> q+ I remember!
15:55:52 <JeanKaplansky> q+
15:55:57 <madi> Markus:  more threads will be identified in the months to come.
15:56:06 <ivan> q=
15:56:42 <madi> Markus:  Look for new entries, look for expertise, and hopefully can starting moving complete Use Cases
15:56:50 <ivan> q?
15:57:11 <Zakim> -gcapiel
15:57:19 <madi> Jean:  with mark up in digital publishing, education and higher ed publishing will be discussed in October that might be of interest.
15:57:53 <madi> Jean the EduPub workshop.  HTML5, XHTML, we are at the beginning of these markup patterns.
15:58:09 <madi> Markus:  EduPUb conference a good input.
15:58:21 <madi> Madi, Markus and Jean plan to attend.
15:58:28 <madi> Markus:  Any other business?
15:58:37 <gcapiel> Gerardo will be there too
15:58:52 <madi> Ivan:  Please sign up for the China TPAC conference ASAP
15:59:01 <azaroth> Thanks Markus and all!
15:59:07 <madi> Markus:  concludes meeting
15:59:11 <azaroth> And thanks to Madi for scribing
15:59:13 <karen_> +1 Madi scribing today
15:59:20 <Zakim> -Tsviya
15:59:22 <Zakim> -??P16
15:59:22 <Zakim> -fjh_
15:59:22 <karen_> rrsagent, draft minutes
15:59:22 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/08/20-dpub-minutes.html karen_
15:59:23 <Zakim> -azaroth
15:59:24 <Zakim> -mgylling
15:59:25 <Zakim> -duga
15:59:25 <Zakim> -Bill_Kasdorf
15:59:26 <Zakim> -mielvds1
15:59:26 <Zakim> -Madi
15:59:31 <Zakim> -JeanKaplansky
15:59:32 <Zakim> -plinss
16:01:44 <mgylling> ouch, I forgot, calling back now
16:02:09 <karen_> ok
16:02:36 <mielvds> mielvds has joined #dpub
16:03:39 <karen_> zakim, who is on the call?
16:03:40 <Zakim> On the phone I see Ivan, Karen_Myers
16:04:57 <karen_> We will set up an ad hoc bridge
16:05:15 <Zakim> -Ivan
16:05:21 <Zakim> -Karen_Myers
16:05:22 <Zakim> SW_DPUB-IG()11:00AM has ended
16:05:22 <Zakim> Attendees were Tsviya, +1.415.577.aaaa, Ivan, duga, plinss, mgylling, Karen_Myers, azaroth, Madi, mielvds1, Hajar, +1.734.904.aabb, +1.703.352.aacc, fjh, JeanKaplansky,
16:05:22 <Zakim> ... Bill_Kasdorf, gcapiel, fjh_
16:05:31 <ivan> zakim, room for 4?
16:05:32 <Zakim> ok, ivan; conference Team_(dpub)16:05Z scheduled with code 3782 (DPUB) for 60 minutes until 1705Z
16:05:41 <ivan> zakim, dial ivan-voip
16:05:41 <Zakim> ok, ivan; the call is being made
16:05:42 <Zakim> Team_(dpub)16:05Z has now started
16:05:42 <Zakim> +Ivan
16:06:04 <gcapiel> gcapiel has left #dpub
16:06:10 <Zakim> +Karen_Myers
16:06:31 <ivan> markus, you can come in now!
16:07:03 <Zakim> +mgylling
16:07:04 <Zakim> -mgylling
16:07:04 <Zakim> +mgylling
16:19:50 <karen_> Ken Brooks
16:27:56 <Zakim> -mgylling
16:27:58 <Zakim> -Karen_Myers
16:27:59 <Zakim> -Ivan
16:28:01 <Zakim> Team_(dpub)16:05Z has ended
16:28:01 <Zakim> Attendees were Ivan, Karen_Myers, mgylling