13:47:35 RRSAgent has joined #dap 13:47:35 logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-irc 13:47:37 RRSAgent, make logs world 13:47:37 Zakim has joined #dap 13:47:39 Zakim, this will be DAP 13:47:39 ok, trackbot; I see UW_DAP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 13 minutes 13:47:40 Meeting: Device APIs Working Group Teleconference 13:47:40 Date: 22 May 2013 13:50:32 UW_DAP()10:00AM has now started 13:50:38 +Josh_Soref 13:50:47 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0055.html 13:51:14 fjh has changed the topic to: dap 3279 ; agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0055.html 13:51:43 Chair: Frederick_Hirsch 13:51:47 Present+ Frederick_Hirsch 13:52:07 Topic: Welcome, agenda review, scribe selection, announcements 13:55:39 -Josh_Soref 13:55:40 UW_DAP()10:00AM has ended 13:55:40 Attendees were Josh_Soref 13:57:42 scribe: Josh_Soref 13:57:44 UW_DAP()10:00AM has now started 13:57:51 +Josh_Soref 13:58:29 Zakim, mute me 13:58:29 sorry, Josh_Soref, muting is not permitted when only one person is present 13:59:46 +[IPcaller] 13:59:54 zakim, [IPcaller] is me 13:59:54 +fjh; got it 14:00:00 zakim, who is here 14:00:00 fjh, you need to end that query with '?' 14:00:08 zakim, who is here? 14:00:08 On the phone I see Josh_Soref, fjh 14:00:09 On IRC I see RRSAgent, fjh, richt, Josh_Soref, ted, anssik, trackbot, slightlyoff, mounir 14:00:22 gmandyam has joined #dap 14:00:30 +gmandyam 14:00:43 Zakim, mute me 14:00:43 Josh_Soref should now be muted 14:00:44 rrsagent, generate minutes? 14:00:44 I'm logging. Sorry, nothing found for 'generate minutes' 14:00:52 rrsagent, generate minutes 14:00:52 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-minutes.html fjh 14:02:05 +??P8 14:02:07 Present+ Anssi_Kostiainen 14:02:12 zakim, ??P8 is me 14:02:12 +anssik; got it 14:02:46 fjh: gmandyam, were you on the last call? 14:02:48 gmandyam: i was 14:02:48 Present+ gmandyam 14:03:02 fjh: you're not in the attendees 14:03:03 ... i'll get that fixed 14:05:28 zakim, who is here? 14:05:28 On the phone I see Josh_Soref (muted), fjh, gmandyam, anssik 14:05:29 On IRC I see gmandyam, Zakim, RRSAgent, fjh, richt, Josh_Soref, ted, anssik, trackbot, slightlyoff, mounir 14:05:57 Web Intents Addendum, Pick Media Intent, Pick Contacts Intent shelved, publishing Web Intents as WG Note, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0051.html 14:06:28 fjh: publication of Web Intents as Note tomorrow is underway 14:06:37 Media Capture and Streams updated WD published 16 May 2013, http://www.w3.org/TR/mediacapture-streams/ (significant changes) 14:06:49 topic: Minutes approval 14:07:07 Approve minutes from 15 May 2013 ; http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/att-0056/minutes-2013-05-15.html 14:07:30 fjh: i've updated the minutes to include gmandyam 14:07:35 RESOLUTION: Minutes from 15 May 2013 are approved 14:07:45 topic: Vibration 14:07:47 updated editors draft, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0025.html (Anssi) 14:07:48 CfC to publish another Last Call WD (CfC end 21 May): http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0037.html 14:07:59 fjh: no objections, i believe there was support 14:08:02 ... i'll arrange to publish a LC 14:08:11 ... anssik, can you prepare a LC 14:08:19 ... we need to pick a two-week window 14:08:21 anssik: yeah, i can do htat 14:08:24 s/htat/that/ 14:08:29 fjh: if we can publish it next week 14:08:40 ... if you can prepare a draft, and we publish on May 30 14:08:55 ... change Status section to mention LC and reference change to Error Handling 14:09:05 ... and give 3 week LC ending 20th of June? 14:09:15 ... and then we can go to CR 14:09:15 ... any concern w/ that? 14:09:15 ... i think that works 14:09:31 ... anssik, let me know when you're done 14:09:36 ... and i'll do the pub process 14:09:45 fjh: thinking if 2 or 3 weeks is appropriate 14:09:46 ... i don't think it matters 14:10:04 anssik: we had a clock once 14:10:13 Zakim, who is making noise? 14:10:24 Josh_Soref, listening for 10 seconds I heard sound from the following: anssik (64%) 14:10:34 ... we haven't received explicit +1 on the new design 14:10:43 fjh: so, 3 weeks 14:10:45 ... publish 30 May 14:10:53 ... and finish on 20 June 14:10:56 s/anssik: we had a clock once// 14:11:01 ... i don't think i'm forgetting anything 14:11:13 s/... we/anssik: we/ 14:11:22 TOPIC: Proximity, Light 14:11:26 Updated with draft privacy considerations, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0053.html (Anssi) 14:11:26 Includes update to Event related normative text: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0054.html 14:11:27 Plans to update technical approach: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0026.html (Anssi) 14:11:27 Open issue: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0034.html 14:11:27 As decided at last meeting, waiting until end of May for discussion on list. 14:11:27 Please review draft and discuss on list. 14:11:54 fjh: if you don't hear anything 14:12:11 anssik: i can restate what i said in the mail 14:12:27 ... i'm planning to update the draft if i don't hear concerns w/in a week 14:12:43 fjh: better to provide a specific date 14:12:47 anssik: maybe Tuesday 14:13:00 ... so we can talk about it on next week's call 14:13:14 fjh: send an email saying you'll do it on the 28th 14:13:17 anssik: sure 14:13:31 anssik: thanks for handling the Privacy thing 14:13:38 ... it's good that there are experts looking at the spec 14:13:40 topic: Network Service Discovery 14:13:50 prefix issue , http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013Apr/0054.html (Jean-Claude) 14:13:50 status http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0028.html (Rich) 14:13:50 Awaiting further activity 14:13:55 fjh: i think we're waiting for Cathee to get back 14:14:06 topic: Test Cases and Interop - status and plans 14:14:13 Battery, Vibration, Light, Proximity, Network Service Discovery 14:14:13 Network Service Discovery implementation released as open source, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2013May/0045.html (Jean-Claude) 14:14:40 anssik: we're working on implementing 14:14:47 ... getting the implementation to match the latest spec 14:14:57 s/Cathee/Cathy/ 14:15:04 s/on implementing/on implementing HTML Media Capture/ 14:15:14 ... i can't give you an estimate of when it will happen 14:15:15 fjh: what about Battery 14:15:23 anssik: i think we're going first w/ HTML Media Capture 14:15:33 ... that's something we're currently looking at implementing 14:15:36 s/Battery/Battery, Light, Proximity/ 14:15:40 ... I think Battery is in fairly good shape 14:15:56 ... i'm not sure when we're migrating tests to the github repo 14:16:04 ... that could attract outside contributors 14:16:07 fjh: i checked with dom 14:16:15 anssik: i think that could make it easier for outside contributors 14:16:31 fjh: if we don't get anyone, -- just you 14:16:33 ... where are we? 14:16:36 anssik: Battery is 14:16:39 ... coverage is good 14:16:55 ... some tests require interactive testing 14:17:04 ... you can always make things more clever 14:17:10 ... Vibration tests, i haven't started 14:17:18 ... we have darobin's initial draft 14:17:29 ... Proximity, i think marcos has tests 14:17:34 ... which are fairly extensive 14:17:47 ... for Ambient Light, i think marcos also 14:17:51 ... you can use the same structure 14:18:08 ... those are pretty much done 14:18:17 ... all these specs have test suites 14:18:26 ... the most mature are Battery, Proximity and Ambient 14:18:35 ... while Media Capture and Vibration are early drafts 14:18:42 fjh: XXX 14:18:55 anssik: i'm optimistic that when we migrate to github, we'll get outside contributors 14:19:04 s/XXX/this is good. so we need to make sure all the tests are in one place and are documented/ 14:19:13 ... maybe people who do browser work will be more comfortable contributing 14:19:20 ... since you don't need a w3 account 14:19:24 fjh: HTML Media Capture 14:19:36 ... Network Service needs looking 14:19:44 ... so the next step is getting implementations 14:19:58 ... we need to figure out who's doing implementations 14:20:13 ... we haven't gotten confirmation that people are participating 14:20:23 ... i can send a message on that 14:20:29 action: fjh to follow up on implementation status for DAP specifications 14:20:29 Created ACTION-632 - Follow up on implementation status for DAP specifications [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2013-05-29]. 14:21:05 fjh: I will also check on status of documentation 14:21:18 s/fjh/scribe/ 14:21:18 s/fjh/scribe/ 14:21:23 s/scribe:/fjh:/ 14:21:29 fjh: do you have any timeframe 14:21:37 ... on when your team will be doing things w/ HTML Media Capture? 14:21:47 anssik: we're working on getting the implementation in 14:21:53 ... quite natural to start testing after that 14:21:57 ... witihin a month 14:22:03 fjh: so an implementation before summer 14:22:04 anssik: yeah 14:22:20 topic: Action Review 14:22:29 ACTION-523? 14:22:29 ACTION-523 -- Anssi Kostiainen to work on test cases for battery, vibration, and HTML Media Capture -- due 2012-08-31 -- OPEN 14:22:29 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/523 14:22:33 ACTION-621? 14:22:33 ACTION-621 -- Anssi Kostiainen to create test cases for HTML Media Capture -- due 2013-03-13 -- OPEN 14:22:33 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/621 14:22:40 ACTION-625? 14:22:40 ACTION-625 -- Dominique Hazaƫl-Massieux to move DAP tests to Git, with help from others as needed -- due 2013-05-01 -- OPEN 14:22:40 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/625 14:22:45 no pending actions 14:22:51 topic: Issue Review 14:22:55 ISSUE-128? 14:22:55 ISSUE-128 -- Need more description on how bandwidth should be estimated -- open 14:22:55 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/issues/128 14:23:07 fjh: not sure what we're going to do with this 14:23:13 ... suggestions on what to do next? 14:25:07 fjh: should we be shelving this? 14:25:12 ... the sense i'm getting is that 14:25:20 ... this is more regarding control 14:25:24 ... do we really need this spec? 14:25:27 Josh_Soref: I don't think we do 14:26:02 gmandyam: if timeliness is an issue 14:26:08 ... dealing with latency is problematic 14:26:19 fjh: wondering if i should issue a CfC to shelve 14:26:40 Josh_Soref: i'm in favor of shelving, but we should explain in detail in the document why it's a futile/useless effort 14:26:48 fjh: anyone have a problem w/ shelving? 14:26:51 gmandyam: no problem 14:27:27 action: fjh to start CfC to shelve Network Information API, first checking with editor 14:27:27 Created ACTION-633 - Start CfC to shelve Network Information API, first checking with editor [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2013-05-29]. 14:27:45 topic: Other Business 14:27:49 [ none ] 14:28:05 fjh: i'd like to cancel the 26 June 14:28:12 My two issues with BW estimation in the Network Info API: (1) It currently leaves the BW estimation algm. up to the implementation, which would potentially provide an uneven experience for developers and (2) It is not clear if the BW estimate provides any value over Performance Timing, which is an approved and working W3C standard 14:28:13 RESOLUTION: Cancel 26 June call 14:28:54 -gmandyam 14:29:08 Tizen Developers Conference 14:29:18 -Josh_Soref 14:29:20 -anssik 14:29:22 -fjh 14:29:22 UW_DAP()10:00AM has ended 14:29:22 Attendees were Josh_Soref, fjh, gmandyam, anssik 14:29:23 s/Tizen Developers Conference// 14:29:28 [ Adjourned ] 14:29:32 RRSAgent, draft minutes 14:29:32 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-minutes.html Josh_Soref 14:29:34 trackbot, end meeting 14:29:34 Zakim, list attendees 14:29:34 sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is 14:29:42 RRSAgent, please draft minutes 14:29:42 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-minutes.html trackbot 14:29:43 RRSAgent, bye 14:29:43 I see 2 open action items saved in http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-actions.rdf : 14:29:43 ACTION: fjh to follow up on implementation status for DAP specifications [1] 14:29:43 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-irc#T14-20-29 14:29:43 ACTION: fjh to start CfC to shelve Network Information API, first checking with editor [2] 14:29:43 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-irc#T14-27-27 14:30:14 RRSAgent has joined #dap 14:30:14 logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-irc 14:30:21 RRSAgent, make logs public 14:30:52 present+ Josh_Soref 14:31:00 RRSAgent, make minutes 14:31:00 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/22-dap-minutes.html Josh_Soref 14:31:03 RRSAgent, bye 14:31:03 I see no action items