19:32:58 RRSAgent has joined #site-design 19:32:58 logging to http://www.w3.org/2013/05/21-site-design-irc 19:33:00 zakim, who's here? 19:33:00 On the phone I see Ian, +1.347.908.aaaa, Troy 19:33:02 On IRC I see RRSAgent, bevcorwin, Ian, dorian, Zakim 19:33:06 zakim, aaaa is Bev 19:33:06 +Bev; got it 19:33:27 agenda+ Site statistics 19:33:30 +Dorian_Taylor 19:33:35 agenda+ Creating a vision for the new site 19:34:08 Troy has joined #site-design 19:34:17 zakim, who's here? 19:34:17 On the phone I see Ian, Bev, Troy, Dorian_Taylor 19:34:18 On IRC I see Troy, RRSAgent, bevcorwin, Ian, dorian, Zakim 19:34:29 [14:32] On the phone I see Ian, +1.347.908.aaaa, Troy 19:35:01 + +1.917.826.aabb 19:35:15 zakim, aabb is Noreen 19:35:15 +Noreen; got it 19:35:18 zakim, who's here? 19:35:18 On the phone I see Ian, Bev, Troy, Dorian_Taylor, Noreen 19:35:19 On IRC I see Troy, RRSAgent, bevcorwin, Ian, dorian, Zakim 19:35:33 Regrets: Robin, Kelly 19:35:40 Meeting: Site Redesign Task Force 19:36:00 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-site-design/2013May/0023.html 19:36:09 agenda? 19:36:15 zakim, close item 5 19:36:15 agendum 5, next meeting, closed 19:36:16 I see 2 items remaining on the agenda; the next one is 19:36:16 6. Site statistics [from Ian] 19:36:20 zakim, take up item 6 19:36:20 agendum 6. "Site statistics" taken up [from Ian] 19:36:26 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-site-design/2013May/0022.html 19:37:40 +Laura_Creekmore 19:38:01 lcreekmo has joined #site-design 19:39:29 Q. Do we know the referrers? 19:41:25 …e.g., what are the top 10 referrers 19:42:00 ==== 19:42:01 Who links the most to our site (Total links: 74,574,619) 19:42:01 - easy-coding.de 19:42:01 - worldcat.org 19:42:01 - woorank.com 19:42:01 - firmenanzeiger.net 19:42:05 - dbpedia.org 19:42:07 - egovmon.no 19:42:09 - webmastercoffee.com 19:42:11 - onki.fi 19:42:13 -agnic.org 19:42:15 - tumblr.com 19:42:17 - bioontology.org 19:42:19 - semanticweb.org 19:43:10 IJ: I will put Dorian in touch with Gerald re: stats 19:44:33 Dorian: DTDs will have referrers on them. 19:44:48 …traffic to DTDs problem 19:45:55 …I bet people curl w3.org to test their http library 19:47:25 Q. How do we redirect people to newer things? 19:47:30 (e.g., Check out HTML5!) 19:48:00 q 19:48:27 I think that a good content strategy that incorporates a hybrid human (user) and machine (user) with a focus on web accessibility will be a good way to direct and refer users 19:49:07 Laura: I think this is the right line of thinking…what you would want to do from a content perspective is to show a continum. 19:49:09 continuum 19:49:14 HTML5! Yes! 19:49:18 nwhysel has joined #site-design 19:49:43 Hi Noreen! 19:51:40 Top pages where search done 19:51:40 2194 http://www.w3.org/ 19:51:40 165 http://www.w3.org/standards/ 19:51:57 I bet that means they are looking for standards since they didn't see what they wanted 19:52:48 Top links from home page 19:52:48 8689 http://www.w3.org/ 19:52:48 2837 http://www.w3.org/standards/webdesign/ 19:52:48 1704 http://www.w3.org/standards/ 19:52:48 1595 http://www.w3.org/TR/html5/ 19:52:48 1223 http://www.w3.org/2009/03/image-display-none/results 19:52:55 I don't know what the last one is! 19:52:56 Image readers? 19:54:10 [We discuss that the TR page is not helping people find the commonly needed pieces of informatino] 19:54:55 IJ: Yes, we could pick top 10 specs (html5, html4, css2, wcag 2, ...) 19:55:12 Agreed 19:55:21 Noreen: You need to push forward the ones you want them to see as well 19:56:58 HTML5 differences from HTML4 19:56:58 http://www.w3.org/TR/html5-diff/ 19:56:58 Dorian: Which specs are proper supersets? 19:58:04 http://www.w3.org/standards/techs/css#w3c_all 19:58:29 http://www.w3.org/standards/techs/html#w3c_all 19:58:54 also: http://caniuse.com/ 20:02:01 Crowdsourcing w/ MMI is a good match 20:02:07 IJ: We could use a stack overflow approach - crowd-sourcing 20:02:36 -Troy 20:02:56 time dimension in web3D? 20:02:57 i personally use xhtml1(.1) + rdfa still 20:03:09 because html5 is mostly zzz ;) 20:03:19 IJ: So what do you see going on here via the data? 20:03:20 +Troy 20:05:16 Shari is available to attend next meeting to help with search strategy 20:05:27 Laura: I don't have a firm enough handle of who is coming to the site. 20:05:37 ….do we have a large number of casual users who are coming to the site 20:05:56 user experience? 20:05:58 …maybe people are using HTML4 while HTML5 is not a standard. 20:06:10 ….it would be good to know what traffic comes from what expertise 20:07:12 Dorian: Can we scrub out bots? 20:08:34 …do we have IP info to track? 20:08:45 include bots, but in a managed way 20:08:50 https://panopticlick.eff.org/ 20:09:25 gerald has joined #site-design 20:10:07 Hi Gerald 20:10:10 zakim, call gerald-cell 20:10:10 ok, Ian; the call is being made 20:10:12 +Gerald 20:10:20 Hi Troy 20:11:07 question for gerald: Do we have IP data we can use to track? 20:11:19 Ger: We have that data, but don't have software to proceed the logs 20:11:31 Also, how detailed is IP data? 20:11:35 Dorian: what format is the log? 20:11:45 Gerald: Apache format with a few extra fields we added 20:12:02 Dorian: There are presets like "common" and "combined" (has referred data) 20:12:10 Gerald: I think it's "combined" + extra fields 20:12:45 Gerald: How big are the logs per day? 20:12:55 Dorian: 20-30million lines 20:12:56 whoops 20:13:07 (Dorian asked; Gerald answered) 20:13:22 Dorian: I wrote a perl script to do something . 20:13:40 our apache config for logs: 20:13:41 LogFormat "%h %l %u %t \"%r\" %>s %b \"%{Referer}i\" \"%{User-agent}i\" \"%{Cont 20:13:42 ent-Type}o\" %v:%p \"%{DNT}i\"" w3_log 20:13:59 great thanks 20:14:19 -Dorian_Taylor 20:14:26 IJ to GO: Notice anything in the logs? 20:14:35 Gerald: Our logs have tons of bogus traffic from bots 20:14:45 oops, tapped out 20:14:58 …I tried to omit the noise from the results, but I think the HTML4 pages are still due to bad bots 20:15:26 IJ: Why do you think those are bad bots hitting HTML4? 20:15:47 actually i might have to scoot 20:16:01 a few days ago I revived our (team-internal) ,stats tool 20:16:12 will review when i return 20:16:15 thanks everybody 20:16:37 thank you Dorian! 20:16:52 https://www.w3.org/TR/html401/struct/links.html,stats 20:16:53 [[[ 20:16:54 Hits User-Agent string 20:16:55 1957 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1; SV1) 20:16:56 23 Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 5.0) 20:16:57 15 - 20:16:58 8 JSpider (http://j-spider.sourceforge.net) 20:16:59 ]]] 20:17:15 http://www.webmasterworld.com/search_engine_spiders/4058096.htm 20:17:16 the amount of traffic from that first UA is very unusual, probably one misbehaving bot 20:18:20 -Gerald 20:18:22 Thanks Ger! 20:18:58 gerald has left #site-design 20:19:46 IJ: +1 to improving TR page for usability. How do you organize large number of things/ 20:19:53 q? 20:20:03 zakim, close this item 20:20:03 agendum 6 closed 20:20:04 I see 1 item remaining on the agenda: 20:20:04 7. Creating a vision for the new site [from Ian] 20:20:11 zakim, take up item 7 20:20:11 agendum 7. "Creating a vision for the new site" taken up [from Ian] 20:20:48 When should we start looking at survey data? 20:20:58 Troy: ASAP 20:21:18 I can help review survey 20:24:13 are there known or expected users that should be targeted further before the survey closes? 20:24:55 IJ: I want site to make people feel like they can contribute; welcoming them 20:24:56 Troy: It becomes a great branding asset 20:25:35 Big vision thought: The site [from home page on down] clearly shares the mission of the org, directs visitors to standards in a simple way, and makes it easy to get involved. 20:25:41 Troy: Tizen assoc site requires discipline to keep it simple 20:26:00 Get involved 20:26:04 Use web technology 20:26:11 How the web is changing the world 20:27:47 Is the analogy of the web is the world's nervous system? If so, what part of the nervous system is the W3C? 20:33:05 -Troy 20:33:29 Sorry, had to drop for another meeting. 20:33:35 sure 20:34:23 rrsagent, make minutes 20:34:23 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2013/05/21-site-design-minutes.html Ian 20:36:08 Kelly has joined #site-design 20:36:38 -Laura_Creekmore 20:36:39 -Bev 20:36:40 -Noreen 20:36:43 Thank you! 20:36:44 rrsagent, set logs public 20:36:49 -Ian 20:36:50 Team_Comm(SITE)3:30PM has ended 20:36:50 Attendees were Ian, +1.347.908.aaaa, Troy, Bev, Dorian_Taylor, +1.917.826.aabb, Noreen, Laura_Creekmore, Gerald