Warning:
This wiki has been archived and is now read-only.
Chatlog 2012-10-08
From Linked Data Platform
See original RRSAgent log or preview nicely formatted version.
Please justify/explain all edits to this page, in your "edit summary" text.
13:57:23 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #ldp 13:57:23 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/10/08-ldp-irc 13:57:25 <trackbot> RRSAgent, make logs public 13:57:25 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #ldp 13:57:27 <trackbot> Zakim, this will be LDP 13:57:27 <Zakim> ok, trackbot; I see SW_LDP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 3 minutes 13:57:28 <trackbot> Meeting: Linked Data Platform (LDP) Working Group Teleconference 13:57:28 <trackbot> Date: 08 October 2012 13:57:41 <BartvanLeeuwen> BartvanLeeuwen has joined #ldp 13:57:50 <nmihindu> nmihindu has joined #ldp 13:58:07 <svillata> svillata has joined #ldp 13:58:30 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has now started 13:58:37 <Zakim> +??P0 13:58:48 <Zakim> + +1.408.996.aaaa 13:58:49 <rgarcia> rgarcia has joined #ldp 13:58:57 <Arnaud> zakim, aaaa is me 13:58:57 <Zakim> +Arnaud; got it 13:58:59 <Zakim> -??P0 13:59:03 <Zakim> +??P2 13:59:29 <ghard> ghard has joined #ldp 13:59:51 <Zakim> +??P7 13:59:55 <Zakim> +??P0 13:59:56 <Zakim> + +44.117.370.aabb 13:59:59 <Zakim> +??P4 14:00:04 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:00:04 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, ??P2, ??P7, +44.117.370.aabb, ??P0, ??P4 14:00:04 <Zakim> +[IBM] 14:00:09 <nmihindu> zakim, P2 is me 14:00:09 <Zakim> sorry, nmihindu, I do not recognize a party named 'P2' 14:00:18 <SteveS> zakim, [IBM] is me 14:00:18 <Zakim> +SteveS; got it 14:00:25 <Zakim> -??P0 14:00:25 <stevebattle> zakim, +44.117.370.aabb is me 14:00:25 <Zakim> +stevebattle; got it 14:00:30 <svillata> Zakim, ??P7 is me 14:00:30 <Zakim> +svillata; got it 14:00:46 <Zakim> +??P0 14:01:00 <rgarcia> zakim, ??P0 is me 14:01:00 <Zakim> +rgarcia; got it 14:01:10 <nmihindu> Zakim, ??P2 is me 14:01:10 <Zakim> +nmihindu; got it 14:01:26 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:01:26 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, nmihindu, svillata, stevebattle, ??P4, SteveS, rgarcia 14:01:28 <Zakim> +??P11 14:01:37 <Zakim> + +1.845.433.aacc 14:01:37 <ghard> zakim, ??P11 is me 14:01:39 <Zakim> +ghard; got it 14:01:43 <JohnArwe> JohnArwe has joined #ldp 14:02:13 <Zakim> +??P5 14:02:17 <BartvanLeeuwen> Zakim, ??p5 is me 14:02:17 <Zakim> +BartvanLeeuwen; got it 14:02:26 <jkopecky> jkopecky has joined #ldp 14:02:26 <AndyS> AndyS has joined #ldp 14:02:35 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:02:35 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, nmihindu, svillata, stevebattle, ??P4, SteveS, rgarcia, ghard, +1.845.433.aacc, BartvanLeeuwen 14:02:40 <Zakim> + +44.208.573.aadd 14:03:01 <rogerm> rogerm has joined #ldp 14:03:04 <Zakim> +??P16 14:03:20 <rogerm> rogermenday is on the call 14:03:23 <JohnArwe> zakim, aacc is me 14:03:23 <Zakim> +JohnArwe; got it 14:03:23 <antonis> zakim, ??p16 is me 14:03:24 <Zakim> +antonis; got it 14:03:47 <ArthurK> ArthurK has joined #ldp 14:03:47 <Kalpa> Kalpa has joined #ldp 14:04:01 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:04:01 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, nmihindu, svillata, stevebattle, ??P4, SteveS, rgarcia, ghard, JohnArwe, BartvanLeeuwen, +44.208.573.aadd, antonis 14:04:07 <Zakim> +??P17 14:04:13 <jkopecky> zakim, ??P17 is me 14:04:13 <Zakim> +jkopecky; got it 14:04:18 <Zakim> +bblfish 14:04:53 <JohnArwe> zakim, aadd is bblfish 14:04:53 <Zakim> +bblfish; got it 14:04:54 <bblfish> bblfish has joined #ldp 14:05:06 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:05:06 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, nmihindu, svillata, stevebattle, ??P4, SteveS, rgarcia, ghard, JohnArwe, BartvanLeeuwen, bblfish.a, antonis, jkopecky, bblfish 14:05:11 <AndyS> AndyS has left #ldp 14:05:23 <bblfish> oh two bblfishes? 14:05:42 <Zakim> + +1.937.775.aaee 14:05:45 <bblfish> on the phone, that seems odd 14:05:49 <Zakim> +ArthurK 14:05:51 <Zakim> -ArthurK 14:05:58 <Kalpa> zakim, aaee is me 14:05:58 <Zakim> +Kalpa; got it 14:05:59 <bblfish> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:05:59 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, nmihindu, svillata, stevebattle, ??P4, SteveS, rgarcia, ghard, JohnArwe, BartvanLeeuwen, bblfish.a, antonis, jkopecky, bblfish, Kalpa 14:06:11 <JohnArwe> henry, IRC show a + and then a - bblfish just a few lines back ... seems like a transient 14:06:36 <JohnArwe> * but steve you have 2 ears 14:06:44 <Zakim> +ArthurK 14:07:14 <AndyS_> AndyS_ has joined #ldp 14:08:50 <Zakim> +??P20 14:09:06 <oberger> Zakim, ??P20 is me 14:09:06 <Zakim> +oberger; got it 14:09:13 <oberger> sorry a bit late 14:11:49 <ghard> http://www.w3.org/2009/CommonScribe/manual.html 14:12:03 <oberger> who's the scribe, then ? 14:12:15 <AndyS> AndyS has joined #ldp 14:12:59 <stevebattle> Scribe: Kalpa 14:13:01 <Zakim> +[IPcaller] 14:13:05 <oberger> Minutes from last meeting 14:13:14 <Kalpa> approving the minutes from the last week 14:13:14 <AndyS> zakim, IPCaller is me 14:13:14 <Zakim> +AndyS; got it 14:13:18 <oberger> good luck Kalpa ;-) 14:13:27 <bblfish> Approved: Minutes from Oct 1st 14:13:28 <Kalpa> last week's minutes (Oct 1st) approved 14:13:31 <SteveS> +1 for approving Oct 1st 14:13:57 <oberger> and they say we don't work in France ;) 14:14:46 <Kalpa> registering for FacetoFace meeting and please register for the event 14:14:52 <SteveS_> SteveS_ has joined #ldp 14:14:54 <Arnaud> q? 14:15:08 <Kalpa> deadline to get discount is Oct 16th 14:15:31 <Kalpa> moving onto actions list. 14:15:35 <SteveS> See http://www.w3.org/2012/10/TPAC/Overview.html#fees for deadline and fee details 14:16:42 <oberger> I think I saw some mention of SDShare from Mhausenblas 14:17:11 <oberger> do we need a twitter account to syndicate or is #ldp enough ? 14:18:06 <SteveS> Proposed W3C Community Group for SDshare http://www.w3.org/community/blog/2012/10/05/proposed-group-sdshare-community-group/ 14:18:15 <oberger> (Mhausenblas proposal for stepping down from editor's role) 14:18:59 <Kalpa> oberger: Mhausenblas request to step down from editor's role 14:19:03 <oberger> ^ to b discussed later 14:19:36 <JohnArwe> kalpa, WG home page has a link near bottom under ...Resources to common scribe manual if you want to read up on the tools ... pts to http://www.w3.org/2009/CommonScribe/manual 14:20:00 <bblfish> Issue-9? 14:20:00 <trackbot> ISSUE-9 -- Should properties used in BPR representations be BPRs? -- raised 14:20:00 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/9 14:20:22 <SteveS> Topic: discussing pending issues and transitioning to open 14:20:51 <SteveS> +1 ISSUE-9 to open 14:21:07 <bblfish> +1 good points. The vocabulary is too strict here 14:21:59 <Kalpa> moving onto discuss about issues. follow the link http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues 14:22:09 <bblfish> Issue-9 open 14:22:14 <bblfish> open Issue-9 14:22:36 <Kalpa> no objections to open issue 9 14:22:56 <JohnArwe> trackbot, open issue-9 14:22:56 <trackbot> Sorry, JohnArwe, I don't understand 'trackbot, open issue-9'. Please refer to http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc for help 14:23:33 <Arnaud> issue-9 open 14:24:03 <bblfish> open ISSUE-9 14:24:03 <oberger> the docs don't seem to mention opening them in http://www.w3.org/2005/06/tracker/irc 14:24:11 <bblfish> reopen ISSUE-9 14:24:11 <trackbot> ISSUE-9 Should properties used in BPR representations be BPRs? re-opened 14:24:24 <bblfish> Issue-10? 14:24:24 <trackbot> ISSUE-10 -- Include clarifications and guidance around ETags -- raised 14:24:24 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/10 14:24:49 <Kalpa> discussing issue 10, no objects to open issue 10 14:24:50 <stevebattle> +1 important to distinguish between strong and weak etags 14:24:57 <bblfish> Issue-11? 14:24:57 <trackbot> ISSUE-11 -- Do we need to define server-managed properties or do we leave them to applications? -- raised 14:24:57 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/11 14:25:57 <oberger> +1 for the MAY 14:26:04 <Kalpa> no objects to open issue 11 and opening issue 11 14:26:05 <SteveS> open ISSUE-11 14:26:18 <bblfish> reopen Issue-11 14:26:18 <trackbot> ISSUE-11 Do we need to define server-managed properties or do we leave them to applications? re-opened 14:26:32 <bblfish> Issue-12? 14:26:32 <trackbot> ISSUE-12 -- Can HTTP PATCH be used for resource creation? -- raised 14:26:32 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/12 14:26:38 <bblfish> wait too quickly? 14:26:47 <Kalpa> opening issue 12 and moving to issue 13 14:27:10 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-10 14:27:10 <trackbot> ISSUE-10 Include clarifications and guidance around ETags re-opened 14:27:17 <bblfish> Issue-13? 14:27:17 <trackbot> ISSUE-13 -- Include clarifications about BPC representations that include member triples -- raised 14:27:17 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/13 14:27:17 <stevebattle> +1 interesting I have UC examples of resources being created as side effect of patch 14:27:52 <Kalpa> opening issue 13 14:27:57 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-12 14:27:59 <trackbot> ISSUE-12 Can HTTP PATCH be used for resource creation? re-opened 14:28:06 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-13 14:28:07 <trackbot> ISSUE-13 Include clarifications about BPC representations that include member triples re-opened 14:28:09 <bblfish> Issue-14? 14:28:09 <trackbot> ISSUE-14 -- Include clarifications about ordering in BPC representations -- raised 14:28:09 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/14 14:29:22 <stevebattle> How are different ordering affordances defined? 14:29:38 <JohnArwe> it is the *representation* that is ordered, not the triples themselves 14:31:05 <stevebattle> I guess if you want a semantic ordering you use a List 14:32:11 <oberger> need a use case 14:32:21 <Arnaud> q? 14:32:24 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-14 14:32:24 <trackbot> ISSUE-14 Include clarifications about ordering in BPC representations re-opened 14:32:32 <Kalpa> opening issue 14 for now and sicuss further later 14:32:40 <bblfish> Issue-15? 14:32:40 <trackbot> ISSUE-15 -- sharing binary resources and metadata -- raised 14:32:40 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/15 14:32:50 <Arnaud> zakim, who's on the phone? 14:32:50 <Zakim> On the phone I see Arnaud, nmihindu, svillata, stevebattle, ??P4, SteveS, rgarcia, ghard, JohnArwe, BartvanLeeuwen, bblfish.a, antonis, jkopecky, bblfish, Kalpa, ArthurK, oberger, 14:32:53 <Zakim> ... AndyS 14:33:30 <stevebattle> Does issue-15 relate to the use of wrds:describedby? 14:33:42 <Kalpa> issue 15 - what is a resource. 14:33:50 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-15 14:33:50 <trackbot> ISSUE-15 sharing binary resources and metadata re-opened 14:33:58 <Kalpa> Arnaud: any disagreements for opening issue 15? 14:34:07 <Kalpa> no objects and opening issue 15 14:35:00 <bblfish> Issue-15? 14:35:00 <trackbot> ISSUE-15 -- sharing binary resources and metadata -- open 14:35:00 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/15 14:35:08 <Kalpa> opening issue 16 14:35:13 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-16 14:35:14 <trackbot> ISSUE-16 Redirection of non-information resources to BPRs re-opened 14:35:23 <bblfish> Issue-16? 14:35:23 <trackbot> ISSUE-16 -- Redirection of non-information resources to BPRs -- open 14:35:23 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/16 14:35:30 <bblfish> Issue-17? 14:35:30 <trackbot> ISSUE-17 -- changesets as a recommended PATCH format -- raised 14:35:30 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/17 14:35:43 <bblfish> +1 14:35:54 <Zakim> -ArthurK 14:35:56 <SteveS> +1 14:36:08 <rgarcia> +1 14:36:34 <bblfish> Essentially one would want to take SPARQL update and turn it into a PATCH 14:36:38 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-17 14:36:38 <trackbot> ISSUE-17 changesets as a recommended PATCH format re-opened 14:36:39 <Kalpa> Arnaud: is http patch in issue 17 is the same as from raul? 14:36:39 <bblfish> no? 14:36:43 <Zakim> -svillata 14:36:51 <bblfish> Issue-18? 14:36:51 <trackbot> ISSUE-18 -- container membership and robust pagination -- raised 14:36:51 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/18 14:36:57 <Kalpa> issue 17 is a different issue and opening issue 17 14:37:48 <AndyS> Why not status code 501? 14:41:22 <AndyS> In the LDA, the response has response metadata e.g. #pages. so you can go to last. 14:41:46 <Kalpa> opening issue 18 14:41:47 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-18 14:41:47 <trackbot> ISSUE-18 container membership and robust pagination re-opened 14:41:56 <bblfish> Opening Issue-18 but not a big issue because URLs are in fact opaque. Should be easy to close 14:42:03 <bblfish> Issue-19? 14:42:03 <trackbot> ISSUE-19 -- Adressing more error cases -- raised 14:42:03 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/19 14:42:17 <oberger> can't seem to unmute 14:42:53 <AndyS> zakim, unmute oberger 14:42:53 <Zakim> oberger was not muted, AndyS 14:42:53 <Kalpa> Arnaud: issue 19 is important and there is not many links in the issue page 14:43:20 <Zakim> +??P7 14:43:52 <Kalpa> enough discussion in the mailing list and hence propose to open the issue 19 14:44:04 <Kalpa> no objects and opening issue 19 14:44:05 <JohnArwe> thread 10/1-10/3 about 8 emails 14:44:06 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-19 14:44:06 <trackbot> ISSUE-19 Adressing more error cases re-opened 14:44:13 <bblfish> Issue-20? 14:44:13 <trackbot> ISSUE-20 -- Identifying and naming POSTed resources -- raised 14:44:13 <trackbot> http://www.w3.org/2012/ldp/track/issues/20 14:44:28 <JohnArwe> ...did not have issue # so nothing for tracker to latch onto 14:45:25 <bblfish> q? 14:46:19 <bblfish> <> 14:46:29 <bblfish> <> <#me> 14:47:09 <oberger> <_POSTED_> ? 14:47:23 <jkopecky> q? to ask if that's allowed 14:47:24 <SteveS> seems fine for RDF docs, what about if I want to name a non-RDF resource such as steve_profile.gif? 14:47:37 <jkopecky> q+ to ask if that's allowed 14:47:46 <AndyS> It's the target of the request - ie. the HTTP container. 14:48:02 <jkopecky> q- 14:48:15 <AndyS> but "willful violation" may be the right approach. 14:48:19 <bblfish> ok. 14:48:25 <bblfish> I'have to go early now. 14:48:29 <bblfish> sorry 14:48:35 <Zakim> -bblfish 14:48:49 <Kalpa> opening issue 20 14:49:53 <Kalpa> opening issue 21 14:49:53 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-20 14:49:53 <trackbot> ISSUE-20 Identifying and naming POSTed resources re-opened 14:49:59 <SteveS> reopen ISSUE-21 14:49:59 <trackbot> ISSUE-21 container affordances re-opened 14:50:37 <stevebattle> not comfortable with 'willfull vioation' ! 14:51:31 <AndyS> Base URI determination -- RFC 3986 section 5.1 14:51:32 <stevebattle> s/vioation/violation/ <Arnaud> topic: Specification 14:52:14 <Kalpa> Arnaud: today is the deadline to raise issues. If you find an issue you can and should still raise it but we may not have time to process it before publication and it will be at the editors' discretion whether they appear in the draft or not. Editors will annotate the draft with all open issues as of today. <Arnaud> Arnaud: Spec editors we are on track to have the spec in two weeks? <Arnaud> SteveS: yes 14:52:33 <oberger> again, what do we do with mhausenblas' editor chair ? 14:52:41 <AndyS> http://tools.ietf.org/html/rfc3986#section-5.1 14:53:02 <rgarcia> I sent an email about rewriting improvements, it is not a "serious issue" but I would take in into account 14:53:33 <oberger> ah, my bad 14:53:47 <oberger> mhausenblas only stepped down from use case 14:53:55 <Kalpa> Topic: usecase and requirements 14:53:56 <Zakim> -??P7 <Arnaud> stevebattle: done with the initial pass 14:54:25 <Kalpa> people need to review the document for mistakes 14:55:46 <Kalpa> 2 weeks for reviewing documents 14:55:55 <oberger> and raising issues <Arnaud> Arnaud: we will go through a process similar to what we are doing for the spec, people should raise issues they find and we will decide what to do with them <Arnaud> Arnaud: Regarding Michael stepping down as editor I believe we discussed this last week and you're ok with that for now? <Arnaud> stevebattle: yes <Arnaud> Arnaud: Ok, if you ever need help just let us know and we'll see to get someone else to help <Arnaud> topic: Issue-8 Specification Name 14:56:29 <Kalpa> Arnaud: we ended last week's call discussing the issue with the name of the specification 14:56:39 <oberger> back to Issue-8 <Arnaud> Arnaud: we really should resolve this before we publish our first draft, while several names have been proposed, I think we should stick with either the name of the member submission or the wg 14:56:55 <Kalpa> ... linked data profile or linked data platform 14:57:15 <stevebattle> 'linked data platform' is my choice 14:57:22 <oberger> let's get drunk in Lyon and decide 14:57:34 <SteveS> my proposal, which many seemed happy with last week, is 'Linked Data Platform"�' 14:57:37 <rgarcia> My vote: 14:57:37 <rgarcia> Linked Data Platform Resource + Linked Data Platform Container (LDP Resource + LDP Container) 14:57:51 <oberger> damn it 14:58:35 <ghard> LOL 14:59:40 <stevebattle> +1 LDP Resource + LDP Container 14:59:54 <BartvanLeeuwen> +1 LDP Resource + Container 14:59:58 <Arnaud> strawpoll: use the name: linked data platform 15:00:09 <oberger> +1 LDP Resource + LDP Container 15:00:20 <svillata> +1 LDP Resource + Container 15:00:33 <SteveS> +1 for LDP = Linked Data Platform 15:00:43 <jkopecky> how about Linked Data Platform Specification (rather than just LD Platform) 15:00:47 <SteveS> and LDP is the name of the spec 15:00:54 <Arnaud> +1 15:01:03 <jkopecky> LDP would be short for Linked Data Platform Specification 15:01:08 <stevebattle> Whatever Arnaud says. 15:02:12 <jkopecky> LDP would be short for Linked Data Platform Specification 15:02:24 <Zakim> -bblfish.a 15:02:36 <rgarcia> An W3C recommendation is synonym to specification 15:02:41 <SteveS> Proposal: LDP = Linked Data Platform for specification name, removing LDBP 15:02:47 <oberger> Issue-8 pending review ? 15:03:10 <Kalpa> Arnaud: issue 8 is tentatively resolved, pending review, we will need to resolve it next week. 15:03:15 <jkopecky> raul, yes, but "W3C Recommendation" is a subtitle, so that's why I'd like to have "Spec" in the title there 15:03:42 <rgarcia> OK, can live with that. :) 15:03:55 <oberger> and let's get drunk in Lyon anyway ;) 15:04:02 <jkopecky> do enjoy 8-) <Arnaud> steves: will wait for final resolution to update the draft 15:04:22 <Zakim> -JohnArwe 15:04:27 <ghard> Cheers 15:04:33 <oberger> bye 15:04:37 <BartvanLeeuwen> bye 15:04:38 <svillata> bye 15:04:39 <Zakim> -oberger 15:04:39 <antonis> cheers- bye 15:04:40 <Zakim> -ghard 15:04:41 <Zakim> -SteveS 15:04:42 <Zakim> -AndyS 15:04:42 <Zakim> -jkopecky 15:04:43 <Zakim> -rgarcia 15:04:43 <Zakim> -Arnaud 15:04:44 <Zakim> -stevebattle 15:04:45 <Zakim> -BartvanLeeuwen 15:04:48 <Zakim> -antonis 15:04:49 <Arnaud> meeting adjourned 15:04:50 <Zakim> -??P4 15:04:52 <Zakim> -Kalpa 15:04:54 <Zakim> -nmihindu 15:04:54 <AndyS> AndyS has left #ldp 15:04:56 <Zakim> SW_LDP()10:00AM has ended 15:04:58 <Zakim> Attendees were +1.408.996.aaaa, Arnaud, SteveS, stevebattle, svillata, rgarcia, nmihindu, +1.845.433.aacc, ghard, BartvanLeeuwen, +44.208.573.aadd, JohnArwe, antonis, jkopecky, 15:05:01 <Zakim> ... bblfish, +1.937.775.aaee, ArthurK, Kalpa, oberger, AndyS 15:10:25 <stevebattle> stevebattle has joined #ldp 15:15:52 <JohnArwe> JohnArwe has joined #ldp 15:39:16 <SteveS> SteveS has joined #ldp 16:00:40 <SteveS_> SteveS_ has joined #ldp 16:13:22 <gavinc> gavinc has joined #ldp # SPECIAL MARKER FOR CHATSYNC. DO NOT EDIT THIS LINE OR BELOW. SRCLINESUSED=00000333