16:54:51 <RRSAgent> RRSAgent has joined #html-techs-tf
16:54:51 <RRSAgent> logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/12/17-html-techs-tf-irc
16:54:55 <Zakim> Zakim has joined #html-techs-tf
17:00:11 <jamesn> zakim, this will be WAI_HTML
17:00:11 <Zakim> ok, jamesn; I see WAI_HTML TT()11:30AM scheduled to start 30 minutes ago
17:00:20 <Loretta> Loretta has joined #html-techs-tf
17:00:31 <jamesn> Meeting: HTML Techniques Task Force
17:01:08 <jamesn> jamesn has changed the topic to: Meeting this week. No meetings Dec 24 & Dec 31.
17:01:45 <Zakim> WAI_HTML TT()11:30AM has now started
17:01:53 <Zakim> +James_Nurthen
17:01:57 <Zakim> +??P2
17:02:12 <jamesn> zakim, ??P2 is Loretta
17:02:12 <Zakim> +Loretta; got it
17:02:25 <Zakim> +Marc_Johlic
17:02:39 <marcjohlic> marcjohlic has joined #html-techs-tf
17:08:27 <jamesn> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/26_11_2012/
17:08:31 <Loretta_> Loretta_ has joined #html-techs-tf
17:08:35 <jamesn> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/26_11_2012/
17:09:31 <Zakim> +Jon_Gunderson
17:09:45 <jamesn> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/26_11_2012/results
17:10:03 <jamesn> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_aria-describedby
17:11:31 <jongund> jongund has joined #html-techs-tf
17:13:52 <jamesn> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_aria-describedby
17:13:57 <jamesn> scribe: jamesn
17:14:12 <jamesn> we are looking at example 3 according to the diff as this is the new part
17:15:06 <jamesn> LGR: Example 3 doesn't seem like 1.1.1
17:15:22 <jamesn> LGR: A screen reader would read that every time focus hits
17:15:28 <jamesn> JN: It depends on the screen reader
17:15:50 <jamesn> JN: described is read automatically by some and some it says may need additional info
17:16:22 <jamesn> LGR: Maybe we should expand this technqiue to cover more than 1.1.1
17:16:25 <marcjohlic> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Techniques/ARIA
17:16:35 <jamesn> MJ: 3.3.2 seems to cover this
17:18:36 <jamesn> MJ: If this was labelled as ARIA-6. If 111 and 332 referenced aria-6, woudl that be too confusing
17:19:05 <jamesn> LGR: there are examples which address multiple success criteria. Have to be very careful how you write the description
17:19:33 <jamesn> ... It doesn't talk at all about how aria-describedby works. It assumers you know how it works.,
17:19:48 <jamesn> ... I don't like this description much
17:20:00 <jamesn> ... Have a feeling I commented this on an earlier survey
17:21:30 <Zakim> -Loretta
17:24:10 <Zakim> +[GVoice]
17:24:49 <jamesn> zakim, GVoice is Loretta
17:24:49 <Zakim> +Loretta; got it
17:25:33 <adam> adam has joined #html-techs-tf
17:25:33 <Loretta> Loretta has joined #html-techs-tf
17:25:46 <Loretta> Argh! I'm having wireless problems again.
17:25:53 <jamesn> zakim, who is on the call?
17:25:53 <Zakim> On the phone I see James_Nurthen, Marc_Johlic, Jon_Gunderson, Loretta
17:25:59 <Loretta> I tried dialing in from my desktop, but I think there is no mic.
17:25:59 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
17:26:01 <Loretta> I canhear you.
17:26:15 <Loretta> RIght.
17:26:22 <jamesn> zakim, IPcaller is Adam
17:26:22 <Zakim> +Adam; got it
17:26:27 <Loretta> I may try skype again.
17:28:01 <Loretta> Maybe I should try revising the description.
17:28:13 <Loretta> Sure.
17:28:40 <Loretta> ok
17:29:45 <Zakim> +[IPcaller]
17:29:55 <jamesn> JN: group consensus seems to be that it is ok to edit anyone else's technqiue so long as you back it up with survey comments and good tracking
17:30:07 <Zakim> -Loretta
17:30:27 <jamesn> JN: LGR to update description
17:30:58 <jamesn> LGR: will try to make the technqique description more general so we can merge the describedby techqnieus
17:31:21 <jamesn> http://www.w3.org/WAI/GL/wiki/Using_aria-labelledby_to_concatenate_a_label_from_several_text_nodes
17:31:28 <jamesn> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/26_11_2012/results
17:31:54 <jamesn> https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/11262012/results#xconcat
17:32:55 <jamesn> JN: Jons commetn in first survey
17:33:33 <jamesn> JG: Track 1 and Track 2 don't mean much. Wouldn't the time be more useful
17:34:44 <jamesn> LGR: The reason didn't put in the labelledby is that they are already the table headers
17:35:00 <jamesn> JG: swicth screen reader modes?
17:35:12 <jamesn> LGR: do you duplicate the header information in the text of each cell
17:35:42 <jamesn> JG: probably in forms mode.
17:35:53 <jamesn> LGR: If in table mode will probably be repeated
17:39:21 <jamesn> LGR: we will have to add ids to the column header cells and add the time information
17:40:05 <jamesn> JN: part of what determines forms mode vs table mode is the amount of information in the table
17:40:21 <jamesn> LGR: whatever we put out could be used as the model
17:40:55 <jamesn> JN: concern as to how people misread technqiues - may have people looking at this as how you have to do this.
17:46:39 <jamesn> JN: changed example 3 based on JG commetns
17:48:41 <jamesn> JN: LGR comments on survey
17:48:51 <jongund> http://www.w3.org/TR/wai-aria/roles#namecalculation
17:49:31 <jamesn> JN: seems to be 2 parts to the first comment. 1) the test description part, and 2) make sure the description covers what happens about seperators
17:54:10 <jamesn> LGR: This has been fixed
17:56:22 <jamesn> JN: I generally tell people to put it on (tabindex=-1)
17:56:33 <jamesn> JN: but should wait and talk to Cynthia
17:57:55 <Zakim> -Jon_Gunderson
18:00:03 <jamesn> LGR: why isn't this 1.1.1
18:02:34 <jamesn> JN: added 1.1.1
18:03:04 <jamesn> Stefan's comments on survey https://www.w3.org/2002/09/wbs/35422/11262012/results#xconcat not yet addressed
18:03:31 <Zakim> -Adam
18:03:32 <Zakim> -Marc_Johlic
18:03:33 <jamesn> zakim, please pert
18:03:33 <Zakim> I don't understand 'please pert', jamesn
18:03:34 <Zakim> -James_Nurthen
18:03:39 <jamesn> zakim, please part
18:03:39 <Zakim> leaving.  As of this point the attendees were James_Nurthen, Loretta, Marc_Johlic, Jon_Gunderson, Adam, [IPcaller]
18:03:39 <Zakim> Zakim has left #html-techs-tf
18:03:45 <jamesn> rrsagent, make log world
18:03:49 <jamesn> rrsagent, make minutes
18:03:49 <RRSAgent> I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/12/17-html-techs-tf-minutes.html jamesn
18:45:21 <jongund> http://www.openajax.org/member/wiki/Accessibility_WCAG_2.0_Validation_Rules#Goals_for_Ruleset_Version_1.0