20:59:26 RRSAgent has joined #svg 20:59:26 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/11/15-svg-irc 20:59:28 RRSAgent, make logs public 20:59:30 Zakim, this will be GA_SVGWG 20:59:30 ok, trackbot, I see GA_SVGWG(SVG1)4:00PM already started 20:59:31 Meeting: SVG Working Group Teleconference 20:59:31 Date: 15 November 2012 21:00:09 +[IPcaller] 21:00:21 Zakim, [IP is me 21:00:22 +ed; got it 21:00:25 ed: If no one joins, I will scribe today. It is so much easier to just scribe yourself :P 21:00:26 +Doug_Schepers 21:00:48 Zakim, aaaa is me 21:00:48 +krit; got it 21:01:22 + +33.9.53.77.aabb 21:01:33 zakim, +33 is me 21:01:33 +Tav; got it 21:01:45 + +33.9.80.39.aacc 21:02:20 zakim, aacc is me 21:02:20 +Cyril; got it 21:02:35 scribeNick: ed 21:02:40 chair: ed 21:03:01 Topic: FXTF meetings 21:03:32 DS: brought it up in CSS WG 21:03:42 ... will bring it up on the mailinglist too 21:03:48 +nikos 21:04:12 ... not sure when the old telcon time was, but may not work for brian e.g 21:04:57 ...was same time as SVG WG telcon but on mondays 21:05:45 ED: for me it's mostly a concern about participation and that there are workitems to discuss 21:06:21 DS: concerns these specs: blending&composition, masks, filter effects, transforms 21:07:14 ED: weekly telcon? bi-weekly? or based on agenda requests? 21:07:28 DS: just one meeting soon, then based on request is fine with me 21:07:40 ... who would call in from SVGWG? 21:07:50 nikos: i'd call in 21:07:57 TB: me too 21:08:08 ED: probably me too 21:08:18 +cabanier 21:09:11 Topic: diffusion curves 21:09:27 Rik: needs more research 21:09:43 DS: as I understand it the diffusion curves can do some things meshes can't 21:10:01 nikos: right, DC are easier to author 21:10:42 rik: are they paint servers? how does it fit in? 21:11:28 CC: you could think of DC as a representation of what flash has 21:11:36 rik: no, flash doesn't have DC 21:11:49 CC: no, I meant the colors on the side of the curve 21:11:59 ... for SWF 21:12:17 ... more like gradients than fill or stroke 21:12:54 DS: if you have a path that crosses itself, does the path gets flattened first? 21:13:05 CC: it doesn't matter if you flatten it before or after 21:13:35 rik: meshes have the same issues, they're also not fill or stroke 21:13:58 DS: that means we either have DC or meshes, or both? 21:14:23 CC: gradient meshes are things of today, DC is still at the research states, think they will solve differnt usecases 21:14:42 TB: meshes are used in PDF, postscript etc, so useful to have 21:15:00 ... is there a software package to play with DC somewhere? 21:15:25 CC: yes, the MS tool i posted to the mailinglist has a tool where you can play with DCs 21:15:52 TB: thinking of this from an artists standpoint 21:16:16 CC: yes, you have tools that take an image and convert it, you can also create from scratch 21:16:48 s/convert/trace/ 21:17:30 DS: do we want to resolve to not add DC to SVG2? and postpone it? 21:17:42 TB: if we want to put it in, someone has to sign up to do the work 21:18:02 CC: we don't need to say anything, if someone makes a proposal for it we can consider it then 21:18:15 (all agree) 21:18:33 Topic: extrapolated linejoin 21:18:53 TB: would like to call it 'talon' 21:18:59 talon 21:19:11 doug: where are you getting that term? 21:19:19 TB: because it looks like a bird claw 21:19:40 ... more unique than arc 21:19:51 ... or extrapolated join 21:20:01 ... because it describes the shape 21:21:01 ... all the other shapes have five letters, this one is also five 21:21:27 CC: I don't know if talon is a good word, misleading in french 21:21:35 nikos: waht does it mean in french? 21:21:42 CC: the heel of a foot 21:22:31 ... anyway, don't have a strong opinion on naming 21:23:03 ED: for me I think arc is more natural 21:23:07 TB: ok 21:23:14 Doug: take this to mailinglist 21:24:45 topic: content model for svg2 21:25:21 DS: do we want the svg spec to say what the content model for elements is, or do we want to remove it from the spec? 21:25:53 ... we dont' provide a DTD for SVG2 at the moment 21:26:15 doug: was talking to mike smith and robin berjon about producing an RNG for SVG2 21:26:34 ... DTDs can't express SVG very well 21:26:48 DS: browsers don't validate, is that just a waste of time? 21:26:57 doug: validators validate 21:27:05 ... for ppl being able to validate svg 21:27:24 DS: can a rect have a rect child, do we allow or disallow? 21:27:46 doug: we talked before about having a fallback model, where if something wasn't supported it would... 21:27:54 ... so that you could fallback to another element 21:28:14 DS: so any arbitrary element would get treated as a element 21:28:23 ... is it transformable, locatable, editable? 21:28:42 doug: i reckon it would be treated just like a 21:29:00 ... all behaviours as if the arbitary element was a 21:29:20 DS: but we have elements that are not transformable for example, so why should we assume the new element is transformable? 21:29:33 doug: haven't thought deeply about that 21:29:44 DS: who's working on this content model? 21:29:55 doug: I don't know anybody is 21:30:06 DS: seems like a huge gap in the spec 21:30:25 ... what happens with elements that occur where they shouldn't be and so on 21:31:51 -Doug_Schepers 21:32:00 ED: we should define the model, at minimal describe what happens. it sounds as if you're asking for someone to step up and do the RNG? 21:32:42 DS: not sure if it needs to be an RNG, but we don't describe what should happen (yet) 21:34:35 ED: think we should get the model proposals up on the wiki or something, and then discuss at the f2f 21:36:15 ... one easy way is to take the model already defined in SVG Tiny 1.2, and backport that, then if we want to change the model do it afterwards 21:36:47 ... there was an RNG for 1.2Full but not sure what state it's in 21:37:13 DS: would someone take an action for backporting the content model wording from 1.2T? 21:38:57 ACTION: ed to backport content model wording from 1.2T to SVG2 21:38:57 Created ACTION-3400 - Backport content model wording from 1.2T to SVG2 [on Erik Dahlström - due 2012-11-22]. 21:40:04 -cabanier 21:40:06 -krit 21:40:07 -Tav 21:40:07 -nikos 21:40:08 -ed 21:40:08 GA_SVGWG(SVG1)4:00PM has ended 21:40:08 Attendees were +1.415.832.aaaa, [IPcaller], ed, Doug_Schepers, krit, +33.9.53.77.aabb, Tav, +33.9.80.39.aacc, Cyril, nikos, cabanier 21:41:24 next week is thanksgiving and some people won't call in, let's cancel next week's call 21:41:32 trackbot, end telcon 21:41:32 Zakim, list attendees 21:41:32 sorry, trackbot, I don't know what conference this is 21:41:40 RRSAgent, please draft minutes 21:41:40 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/11/15-svg-minutes.html trackbot 21:41:41 RRSAgent, bye 21:41:41 I see 1 open action item saved in http://www.w3.org/2012/11/15-svg-actions.rdf : 21:41:41 ACTION: ed to backport content model wording from 1.2T to SVG2 [1] 21:41:41 recorded in http://www.w3.org/2012/11/15-svg-irc#T21-38-57