14:35:52 RRSAgent has joined #dap 14:35:52 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/11/14-dap-irc 14:35:54 RRSAgent, make logs world 14:35:56 Zakim, this will be DAP 14:35:57 Meeting: Device APIs Working Group Teleconference 14:35:57 Date: 14 November 2012 14:35:57 ok, trackbot; I see UW_DAP()10:00AM scheduled to start in 25 minutes 14:36:17 Agenda: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0025.html 14:36:39 fjh has changed the topic to: dap 3279 ; agenda http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0025.html 14:37:05 Regrets+ Josh_Soref 14:37:20 Chair: Frederick_Hirsch 14:37:23 Present+ Frederick_Hirsch 14:55:15 Milan_Patel has joined #dap 14:59:10 UW_DAP()10:00AM has now started 14:59:15 + +25686aaaa 14:59:46 Present+ Milan_Patel 15:00:01 +[IPcaller] 15:00:09 zakim, [IPcaller] is me 15:00:09 +fjh; got it 15:00:36 Topic: Welcome, agenda review, scribe selection, announcements 15:01:00 Jungkee has joined #dap 15:01:15 zakim, aaaa is milan_patel 15:01:15 +milan_patel; got it 15:01:16 Present+ Jungkee_Song 15:01:17 + +1.858.750.aabb 15:01:34 zakim, aabb is jungkee 15:01:34 +jungkee; got it 15:01:39 zakim, who is here? 15:01:39 On the phone I see milan_patel, fjh, jungkee 15:01:41 On IRC I see Jungkee, Milan_Patel, RRSAgent, fjh, darobin, naomi, timeless, Josh_Soref, richt_, dom, trackbot, Zakim, tobie, mounir, slightlyoff 15:01:56 gmandyam has joined #dap 15:02:11 AnssiK has joined #dap 15:02:15 Giri Mandyam from Qualcomm Innovation Center (QuIC) joining 15:03:05 Present+ Girl_Mandyam 15:03:13 s/Giri Mandyam from Qualcomm Innovation Center (QuIC) joining// 15:03:32 zakim, who is here> 15:03:32 I don't understand 'who is here>', fjh 15:03:37 zakim, who is here? 15:03:37 On the phone I see milan_patel, fjh, jungkee 15:03:39 On IRC I see AnssiK, gmandyam, Jungkee, Milan_Patel, RRSAgent, fjh, darobin, naomi, timeless, Josh_Soref, richt_, dom, trackbot, Zakim, tobie, mounir, slightlyoff 15:03:46 s|zakim, who is here>|| 15:03:50 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:03:50 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/11/14-dap-minutes.html fjh 15:03:59 naomi has left #dap 15:04:10 +??P25 15:04:17 zakim, ??P25 is me 15:04:17 +AnssiK; got it 15:04:26 Present+ Anssi_Kostiainen 15:04:53 ScribeNick: fjh 15:05:08 fjh: No call next week, next call on 28 November. 15:05:30 naomi has joined #dap 15:05:49 fjh: no other announcements, apart from welcome to new participants http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0026.html 15:06:06 Topic: Minutes approval 15:06:23 fjh: F2F minutes to be published, anticipate will approve on 28 November. 15:06:34 fjh: I sent Informal chair notes on F2F: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0020.html 15:06:43 Web Based Signage slides from F2F: http://www.w3.org/community/websignage/wiki/images/3/30/Tpac2012_signage_bg_discovered_by_personal_devices.pdf 15:06:59 Topic: Network Information API 15:07:30 fjh: Mounir updated the editors draft, http://dvcs.w3.org/hg/dap/raw-file/tip/network-api/Overview.html 15:07:37 ACTION-590? 15:07:37 ACTION-590 -- Mounir Lamouri to prepare updated WD of network information with updated status, including addition of use cases -- due 2012-11-08 -- OPEN 15:07:37 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/590 15:07:44 close ACTION-590 15:07:44 ACTION-590 Prepare updated WD of network information with updated status, including addition of use cases closed 15:07:53 fjh: I sent some comments to the list 15:08:16 fjh: I think the test in example 3 may require a "not", http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0030.html 15:08:20 Clarke has joined #dap 15:08:41 +1 to publish an updated WD 15:09:11 fjh: I suggest we get this published as an updated WD, with the changes I proposed (assuming Mounir agrees). An improvement over what is in TR 15:09:23 fjh: any objection to publishing updated WD? 15:09:46 RESOLUTION: publish updated WD of Network Information API using updated editors draft with changes proposed by Frederick, as agreed by Mounir 15:10:06 action: fjh to arrange publication of updated WD of Network Information API 15:10:06 Created ACTION-594 - Arrange publication of updated WD of Network Information API [on Frederick Hirsch - due 2012-11-21]. 15:10:22 fjh: no need for CfC for this, as we agreed at F2F this is necessary and it is an update of a WD 15:10:34 Topic: Proximity API 15:10:43 CfC to publish Last Call, http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0002.html 15:11:20 q+ 15:11:21 fjh: agreement on the list add a text field for which sensor 15:11:24 http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0029.html 15:11:35 fjh: concerns with this, seems to be agreement on list 15:11:39 ack AnssiK 15:12:54 anssik: note that CfC was for ambient light 15:13:08 fjh: my mistake in reading the draft minutes, we already agreed 15:13:35 fjh: will publish in conjunction with ambient light 15:13:41 fjh: concerns with adding field 15:14:04 anssik: we should have some implementation experience, concern about arbitrary text field 15:15:01 fjh: anssi can you please comment on the list with the concern? 15:15:12 anssik: yes, will do. we should give this a bit of time 15:16:09 fjh: defer decision to publish until this is resolved, I note that CfC for publishing ambient light has completed (as of yesterday) with no objection 15:16:27 fjh: so we can publish both once ready, i.e. when we have resolved this field discussion 15:16:43 zakim, who is here? 15:16:43 On the phone I see milan_patel, fjh, jungkee, AnssiK 15:16:45 On IRC I see Clarke, AnssiK, gmandyam, Jungkee, Milan_Patel, RRSAgent, fjh, darobin, timeless, Josh_Soref, richt_, dom, trackbot, Zakim, tobie, mounir, slightlyoff 15:17:23 fjh: it would be good to get Last Call published before we hit the holiday period, perhaps we can resolve by 28 November. 15:18:00 anssik: are you proposing we publish both together? 15:18:22 fjh: yes, it is less work for team, less confusing for Last Call timing, etc 15:18:42 anssik: suggest we might not want to add the field, not to hold up 15:18:56 naomi has joined #dap 15:19:36 naomi has left #dap 15:19:49 fjh: this is a generic problem - which sensor, which camera etc 15:20:18 anssik: problem in touch as well, which touch point 15:20:38 zakim, who is here? 15:20:38 On the phone I see milan_patel, fjh, jungkee, AnssiK 15:20:39 On IRC I see Clarke, AnssiK, gmandyam, Jungkee, Milan_Patel, RRSAgent, fjh, darobin, timeless, Josh_Soref, richt_, dom, trackbot, Zakim, tobie, mounir, slightlyoff 15:21:38 anssik: might not be as simple as adding a string 15:21:49 fjh: not sure, this seems to warrant list discussion 15:22:09 fjh: let's try to resolve this on the list so we can arrange publication of Last Call week of 28 Nov 15:22:38 Topic: HTML Media Capture Last Call Comments 15:22:54 fjh: I sent proposed changes: http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-device-apis/2012Nov/0024.html 15:23:15 anssik: looks good, will wait a few days for feedback then incorporate 15:23:52 fjh: would prefer to have changes in place to share with Doug 15:24:13 fjh: and others 15:24:31 anssik: ok, will make the changes now so we can share updated editors draft showing changes in place 15:24:51 fjh: will need to work through remaining comments, but I'd like to do this first as it may resolve others as well 15:25:10 Topic: Vibration API 15:25:20 fjh: much discussion on list, not sure where it leaves us 15:25:46 anssik: david bryant would like us to expose maximum duration of vibration time through API 15:26:02 fjh: debate of whether that is meaningful 15:26:18 anssik: correct, may wish to keep API simpler, avoid misuse 15:26:48 ... golden rule of api design, minimize surface, not convinced that this is an issue with any implementations 15:27:00 fjh: how to bring this to closure? 15:27:52 anssik: asked David to experiment with implementations, to see if concerns are valid. He wrote code instead, showing how you can determine maximum length seeing when exception is thrown 15:28:11 ... no high value use case for adding field 15:28:34 fjh: we will need explicit WG decision 15:28:41 anssik: yes, also need implementers view 15:28:47 ... user configurable in firefox 15:29:25 ... web developer should not know this information, typical in web, web developer does not have much detail on user agent 15:29:36 ... limits may be UA dependent 15:30:10 ... similar to requiring certain screen resolutions when browsing the web, a bad idea 15:30:35 ... do not want web developers to design app with this in mind 15:31:35 fjh: sounds like two different use cases - one where it just vibrates, another with a time of vibration 15:31:52 anssik: should not put in API unless we really need it 15:32:10 ... mozilla did not include, proving the point 15:34:59 fjh: suggest you send email to list suggesting we not add this, noting reasons discussed here. 15:35:07 anssik: will do this 15:35:22 zakim, who is here? 15:35:22 On the phone I see milan_patel, fjh, jungkee, AnssiK 15:35:24 On IRC I see AnssiK, gmandyam, Jungkee, Milan_Patel, RRSAgent, fjh, darobin, timeless, Josh_Soref, richt_, dom, trackbot, Zakim, tobie, mounir, slightlyoff 15:35:31 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:35:31 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/11/14-dap-minutes.html fjh 15:36:31 Topic: Other F2F follow up 15:36:46 none today 15:36:55 Topic: Action Review 15:37:08 ACTION-593? 15:37:08 ACTION-593 -- Dominique Hazaël-Massieux to build a survey for finding a week for DAP meeting March/April -- due 2012-11-09 -- OPEN 15:37:08 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/593 15:37:32 ACTION-587? 15:37:32 ACTION-587 -- Anssi Kostiainen to prepare Proximity LC draft and run through pubrules -- due 2012-11-08 -- OPEN 15:37:32 http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/587 15:37:46 anssik: I should have this for the next call 15:38:16 fjh: please review the list at http://www.w3.org/2009/dap/track/actions/open 15:38:38 -AnssiK 15:38:39 Topic: Other Business 15:38:40 -jungkee 15:38:45 -milan_patel 15:38:48 none 15:38:52 reminder, No call next week, next call on 28 November. 15:38:56 Topic: Adjourn 15:39:01 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:39:01 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/11/14-dap-minutes.html fjh 15:40:05 s/concerns with adding field/concerns with adding field?/ 15:41:00 s/will need to work/Thanks - will need to work/ 15:41:54 rrsagent, generate minutes 15:41:54 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/11/14-dap-minutes.html fjh 15:43:19 fjh_ has joined #dap 15:44:01 -fjh 15:44:03 UW_DAP()10:00AM has ended 15:44:03 Attendees were +25686aaaa, fjh, milan_patel, +1.858.750.aabb, jungkee, AnssiK 16:10:11 AnssiK1 has joined #dap 16:17:16 spoussa has joined #dap 17:00:44 spoussa has joined #dap 17:31:01 jeffh has joined #dap