14:39:19 RRSAgent has joined #smarterwebapps 14:39:19 logging to http://www.w3.org/2012/10/31-smarterwebapps-irc 14:39:31 rrsagent, set logs public 14:39:42 Zakim has joined #smarterwebapps 14:39:56 meeting: Smarter Web Apps 14:40:18 chair: Brian Sullivan 14:40:20 Arnaud has joined #smarterwebapps 14:40:26 schuki has joined #smarterwebapps 14:42:11 frodek has joined #smarterwebapps 14:45:08 massimo has joined #smarterwebapps 14:47:48 sburr has joined #smarterwebapps 14:48:20 Hidetoshi has joined #smarterwebapps 14:54:58 Topic : Smarter Webapps for Smarter Phones 14:55:15 massimo has joined #smarterwebapps 14:55:16 RRSAgent please make minutes 14:56:10 RRSAgent, please make minutes 14:56:10 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/10/31-smarterwebapps-minutes.html Arnaud 14:56:39 RRSAgent, make logs public 14:58:22 bryan has joined #smarterwebapps 14:59:25 Present+ Arnaud_Braud 14:59:33 bjkim has joined #smarterwebapps 14:59:40 BoHu_ChinaUnicom has joined #smarterwebapps 15:00:29 gmandyam has joined #smarterwebapps 15:00:32 rotsuya has joined #smarterwebapps 15:00:33 agenda: http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/SessionIdeas#Smarter_Webapps_for_Smarter_Phones 15:01:00 scribe: dsr 15:01:07 Present+ Tomoyuki_Shimizu 15:01:12 Brian talks through the proposed agenda 15:01:21 ttanaka2 has joined #smarterwebapps 15:01:21 Present+ Dave_Raggett 15:01:28 Milan_Patel has joined #smarterwebapps 15:01:44 yamaday has joined #smarterwebapps 15:02:30 jfmoy has joined #smarterwebapps 15:02:31 Daisuke has joined #smarterwebapps 15:02:43 josh has joined #smarterwebapps 15:03:05 Mohammed has joined #smarterwebapps 15:03:31 Bryan references the GSMA's Smarter Apps guidelines and points to Kamran Kordi who was heavily involved in their preparation. 15:03:55 The guidelines cover good practices, performance and efficiency. 15:04:13 hbang has joined #smarterwebapps 15:04:48 shan has joined #smarterwebapps 15:04:48 bradee-oh has joined #smarterwebapps 15:05:09 What can you do today with the current web platform, and what can we expect tomorrow? 15:06:13 See http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/smarterwebapps 15:06:26 eduardo_fullea_ has joined #smarterwebapps 15:06:35 richt has joined #smarterwebapps 15:07:06 jyp has joined #smarterwebapps 15:09:19 Bryan talks through: http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/smarterwebapps#What_you_can_do_today:_efficiency_focus 15:09:23 Wonsuk has joined #smarterwebapps 15:12:04 mdadas has joined #smarterwebapps 15:13:41 Need guides for server implementation and comparative performance of HTTP polling and web sockets. 15:15:35 Apps with continuous connections consume resources and need to add value in compensation. 15:17:12 Sharing a connection is better than opening many connections. This suggests using cooperative request scheduling. 15:17:39 kotakagi has joined #smarterwebapps 15:20:02 mdadas has joined #smarterwebapps 15:21:36 futomi_ has joined #smarterwebapps 15:21:58 JonathanJ1 has joined #smarterwebapps 15:22:17 Present+ Jonathan_Jeon 15:22:27 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:22:27 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/10/31-smarterwebapps-minutes.html JonathanJ1 15:24:38 evanli has joined #smarterwebapps 15:25:10 Present+ Wonsuk_Lee 15:25:38 ruby has joined #smarterwebapps 15:28:18 Bryan shows Hidetoshi Yokota's slides on network aware web apps. 15:29:34 toshi: enabling web apps to choose the best network interface available for a given task. 15:30:07 kawada has joined #smarterwebapps 15:31:49 http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/SessionIdeas#Smarter_Webapps_for_Smarter_Phones 15:32:14 http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/smarterwebapps 15:34:35 Toshi could you upload the ppt file to Wiki? 15:35:34 Bryan demo's the network information API test 15:37:12 This involves navigator.connection events 15:38:49 +q 15:39:39 what more should w3c do as next steps? http://www.w3.org/wiki/TPAC2012/smarterwebapps#What_Should_W3C_Do_as_Next_Steps 15:40:41 ack gmandyam 15:40:53 gmandyam: Bryan, you didn't mention anything about keepalive, which has implications for battery life. 15:41:40 Bryan: it was mentioned that web sockets doesn't require keep alive. 15:42:16 gmandyam: there is the danger that developers will add their own keep alive messages on web sockets with negative consequences. 15:43:26 q- 15:43:33 there is a connection manager running in the OS that ultimately takes decisions, it is up to the web app however, to make reasonable requests. 15:44:04 raman: why would I want a web app to change how connection management is working on my device? 15:44:26 Bryan: the app could prefer the wifi network when appropriate 15:45:02 raman: this is a symptom that we have failed to stitch the os and web platforms together properly. 15:45:29 Bryan: the problem is that the OS doesn't know the application context. 15:46:02 raman: are you talking about starting/stopping a network interface? 15:46:11 q? 15:46:17 Bryan: no, only about app awareness. 15:46:40 toshi: the application should be able to make requests of the OS network interface manager. 15:47:11 raman: I totally buy the value of network state awareness. 15:48:07 raman: if apps are clamoring to use given network interfaces, we can run into a mess. 15:49:41 David Rogers: the browser should be aware of the user's device level preferences. 15:49:44 kotakagi has joined #smarterwebapps 15:49:52 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:49:52 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/10/31-smarterwebapps-minutes.html shan 15:50:13 Bryan: we need to clarify the level of requests that the app can make to the OS connection manager. 15:51:03 ??: I believe that the OS is in a much better position to make decisions, and that there are privacy risks if we allow the apps to become involved? 15:52:16 some discussion on video streaming - is adaptation after the fact - or can we pass preferences in advance? 15:52:40 dnkim_ has joined #smarterwebapps 15:53:02 LTE might be preferable to WiFi, which could be metered. 15:53:18 Do we need consider to openCM API like API on the web ? - http://bit.ly/TupGCf 15:53:37 +1 to a more semantic representation of network-related information being exposed to web layer 15:53:44 Bryan: making the app aware, allows it to indicate its preferences in context 15:54:14 Providing preferences with the network request seems worth considering. 15:55:11 The preference could include a request to kill the connection if the device is roaming (high billing cost) 15:55:50 ?? (from Apple) want to see discussion of privacy implications. 15:57:15 rrsagent, draft minutes 15:57:15 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/10/31-smarterwebapps-minutes.html JonathanJ1 15:57:22 Raman: the roaming decision should be made by the user not the app 15:58:28 kawada has joined #smarterwebapps 15:58:35 The connection manager needs to resolve conflicts between policy, user and web apps. 15:59:11 toshi: 3GPP puts the operator policy higher than the user's 15:59:33 Bryan: we are out of time, I will update the wiki page based on what we've heard. 15:59:58 Wonsuk has left #smarterwebapps 16:00:01 please feel free to join the community group and contribute further! 16:00:06 rrsagent, make minutes 16:00:06 I have made the request to generate http://www.w3.org/2012/10/31-smarterwebapps-minutes.html dsr 16:00:11 dsr has left #smarterwebapps 16:00:27 bjkim has left #smarterwebapps 16:07:06 AndroUser2 has joined #smarterwebapps 16:08:29 rotsuya has joined #smarterwebapps 16:09:50 tomoyuki has joined #smarterwebapps 16:11:58 richt has joined #smarterwebapps 16:24:44 Hidetoshi has joined #smarterwebapps 16:24:51 Hidetoshi has left #smarterwebapps 17:04:13 Hidetoshi has joined #smarterwebapps 17:55:29 Zakim has left #smarterwebapps 18:00:35 jfmoy has joined #smarterwebapps 19:54:56 Hidetoshi has joined #smarterwebapps 22:32:13 sburr has joined #smarterwebapps 22:33:22 richt has joined #smarterwebapps 22:38:42 jfmoy has joined #smarterwebapps 23:21:19 rotsuya has joined #smarterwebapps 23:28:02 sburr_ has joined #smarterwebapps 23:37:28 rotsuya has joined #smarterwebapps