A brief exchange took place on attendance at F2F Meeting at TPAC. Registration was open. The EO Group will meet on Thursday and Friday. Wednesday Plenary session should also be interesting for those who can attend.
The group reviewed the topic of How People with Disabilities Use the Web. This is foreseen to be wrapped up by the end of July. Discussion revolved around Stories of Web Users and Shadi explained and considered some of the concerns around two particular stories, the order in which the stories are listed, plus terminology.
Brainstorming followed on the title change from "Diversity in Web Use" to another more explicit title.
Some time was spent on "WCAG Overview" and participants on the call were asked for their position. Attention was drawn that WCAG is not yet an ISO standard. W3C WAI will ensure sufficient publicity (media, blog, twitter) when this occurs.
Usually, an action item is not assigned to a person if they are not on the call. Shawn proposed that an exception be made and that action items would be assigned in the tracker for ALL active participants.
Shawn reminded everyone to check their individual action items and to update their Availability for Upcoming EOWG Teleconferences.
Shawn: Registration is open. EO meets on Thursday and Friday
Shadi: Let me know if you want to attend on Monday and Tuesday. Might be interested in future work
Shawn: We might do a formal meeting with the Task Force. Might be a good time to discuss evaluation resources suite.
Shawn: hard to predict where we will be but if possible, may want to try at least for Tuesday
<Suzette> not sure - anyone share a room
Shadi: Been working on this
version for a while. Hope to have it wrapped up by end of July.
Working through previous comments, including extensive ones
from Shawn. Don't be too daunted by extensive notes, most are
copy edited but a few need to be brought in for
... Today would like to focus on Diversity in Web Use and ?? Can we jump in. There is link to wiki page that captures issues for today' discussion.
Shadi: Stories of Web Users is
linked from wiki page let's consider this draft and the
... first point on Ms. Laitinen. Should she be a fluent or not so fluent user of Braille?
... decided that her Braille use would be for very detailed work but not be as fluent a user.
... Any discussion of that decision - that she is less fluent and uses Brille as a check for detailed work like numbers, etc?
Sylvie: I agree that not all blind people are expert Braille users. But the connotation as it is seems negative. Perhaps a bit negative to say "she does not read very well"
Shawn: I can help with the wording, don't need to do it more.
Sylvie: You talk then about screen reader and refreshable Braille, but isn't that a contradiction if she doesn't read well?
Shadi: Can maybe say she reads Braille but prefers screen reading software.
Shawn: Maybe say mostly uses screen reader and occaisionally uses Braille.
Suzette: What would be the scenario where a user would fall back to Braille?
<Sylvie> I need to read it again.
sylvie: I'm afraid people will
miss the point about her being able to read braille or
... my problem is the sentence is too long and overcomplicated, maybe some little copy editing?
shadi: Helpful to confirm that
the concept is wrong - i can see how it could be
... thoughts from others?
... taking shawn's offer for some copy editing on this
... more ocnformtable to use text out speech than braille
shawn: The 1st one in the list is colour-blindness, not a particularly compelling example
shadi: Let's look at story order
<Zakim> shawn, you wanted to say (for later) colorblind first?
shadi: Next point is Ms.
... in previous version, a deaf person who became legally blind
... story seemed a bit overstretched for some people
... remove the use of mobile device from the story and just bring the mobile device element to another story
... proposed resolution is to roll back to mobile and leave that as future wish list
... totally take mobile out of that story and create another one for mobile later
<Vicki> fine with me
shadi: the mobile bit doesn't fit well in there
shawn: I'm happy to revert to it and I trust shadi's judgement
<suzette> good to have mobile on wish list
I'm also fine with reverting
We should be very careful not to overcharge the stories so they remain credible
So whatever it is we need to take out, we should so it's doesn't look "too big"
shadi: It's much preferable to plan another story centred on mobile than try to ram it into an existing one
sylvie: I have internationalization concerns with this
<shawn> Sylvie: issue with "legally blind" internationally
<shawn> ... and issues with being able to see some
<shawn> [ Shawn knows in UK: "registered blind"]
sylvie: In europe, legally blind has their own criteria for recognizing someone who's blind and if we say she can see partially, it might throw peole off
<suzette> There is a wikipedia entry on blindness in US and EU
shadi: Should we even integrate the term legally blind in there?
I think we should leave the term out then
shawn: And focus on the fact that
she has a visual disability (or tunnel vision) that would give
it something specific to say
... i'm happy to help word smith this as well - the emphasis should be on visual condition
<Sylvie> +1 to Shawn
<shawn> ... Can say something like, which is considered legally blind in her country
shadi: Bottom line is - let's be
careful with jargon and address deaf/blindness as a condition
that's very important
... let's focus on explaining the condition, that's the real important part in this
... Next story - Miss Martinez
... another mobile concern
<Zakim> Shawn, you wanted to look *briefly* :-) at order of stories
shadi: Order of stories - should we change it?
shawn: Maybe not start with colour-blindness is the 1st story?
<Vicki> Good point Denis.
denis: We should align the order to at least fit in with the order and prioritization we made in the accessibility basics document
shadi: I don't seem much problem in having different orders for the stories as the documents have different purposes
<Vicki> Fine with me
denis: Let's avoid prioritizing the stories by how disabling the disabilities actually are
shadi: Let's continue with
diversity in web use - 2 issues there: 1. the title (very
similar titles - diversity of web users and web uses) and 2.
conceptually, the page objectives seem kind of related
... both titles and topics are very related in appearance but not in the approach - we need to look at the overlap
<suzette> Suzette: I think the separation of the people from the tools and strategies worked OK
<suzette> Suzette: When the tab links are viewed in isolation they are too similar , I thought the second one should emphasis tools or strategies
<suzette> Suzette: So I think the title is the issue
<Sylvie> What about browsing strategies or different g strategies?browsing st
<Sylvie> Sorry: Different browsing strategies
shadi: Focus on tools and strategies
<suzette> Different Tools and strategies
<Sylvie> Too long
shawn: Assistive Technologies and
... if ppl don't even understand what AT is, they could hardly understand what we're talking about
<shawn> Web wheelchairs :-)
<shawn> Hardware, software, and personal techniques
<shawn> Denis: Tools and strategies
suzette: User interaction is important, so are design solutions
<shawn> s/shawn: user interaction is important, so are design solutions/vicki: user interaction is important, so are design solutions/
<shawn> Vicki: user interaction is important, so are design solutions
<suzette> Zools and preferences (is the first subheading)
shawn: Tools and techniques?
sylvie: Techniques would be too similar, i would agree with tools and preferences
vicky: Tools and preferences would work
shadi: I like tools and preferences too
How about using the right tools?
shawn:Tools people use?
<shawn> Users' Tools and Techniques
shawn: Users, tools and techniques?
<shawn> Tools and Techniques Users Use :)
<shawn> Tools and Strategies
<shawn> Strategies for Web Use
shadi: I could go with either
<shawn> Tools and Strategies for Web Use (short version: Tools and Strategies)
1. Tools and Techniques
1. Tools and strategies
2. Strategies for web use
<suzette> +1 for strategies for web use
+1 for strategies for web use
<shawn> Configurations for Web Use
<Vicki> +1 for Tools and Strategies
<shawn> Tools and Cnfigurations
shawn: Let's bring these new suggestions in the wiki ... anything else?
<suzette> yes good work
shawn: Let's start by looking at original wcag overview page
shawn: Look at the existing page
and see if there are overall comments. look at specific
scenario, one use case e.g. we sent out a press release saying
that wcag 2.0 is now... etc. so somebody gets this and not
particular familiar with wai or
... they follow the link and end up here. what overall comments would you have about this existing page?
... the page was designed a long time ago. is this page meeting the needs today?
denis: As regards the ref to iso, it looks something positive, but don't know what the wai position is
shawn: It is positive. ... The idea is just to look at how to improve this page overall
denis: Tempted to have the principles explained here.
sylvie: Maybe remove the older references to wcag 1. also, might confuse people if we talk about atag at the beginning
denis: In eval group, we have looked at a list for who wcag is intended for and we have a much more extensive list of people so maybe we should compare the two lists and see what we want to add.
ian: I think the iso section needs more but i understand that it needs to be finalized. Perhaps make it clearer that ISO is WCAG 2. First paragraph of "what is in the WCAG documents", perhaps it needs to be simpler. Content is spot on, just a friendlier style.
<suzette> Third paragraph starts What is in WCAG 2.0
shawn: It appears that moving ATAG and UUAG to the end is required.
sylvie: General comments: if WCAG is becoming ISO, something about translations should be mentioned. We need on the supporting docs that WAI plans to update, so maybe we should mention that we already have updates and maybe which updates could be found, i.e., more exhaustive about the techniques.
denis:On "who develops wcag". not sure that it's relevant to have the second and third paragraphs in this document.
shawn: I agree. I'll check on that.
suzette: In the menu list: there is something about "development process", can we not move some of that there.
shawn: Our continued message is that "you are welcome to contribute", maybe we need to find a shorter and more friendlier way to do this.
<suzette> Each of the pages on WCAG, ATAG and UAAG have the same piece on how it was developed
ian: Would it be mixing things up if we put that here. There already appears to be an overload of information. Now, asking people to also contribute, it might seem a little quick to contribute. They're not ready yet.
shawn: Yes, we'll look at
... In terms of your scheduling, at some point soon, ISO will be done. In case you see tweets etc., watch out for those. When it is ready, W3C and WAI will clearly announce it with press release, tweets, blog etc.
... if you have any more of the Overview page, please send them soon.
... the last agenda item is "Action items"
<shawn> Action item - discuss assigning actions for active participants to review docs for publication in July
shawn: We previously said that we do not assign actions unless people are on the call but I would like to propose that we make an exception in this case. I would like to propose that we assign action items in tracker for ALL active participants. Is that okay for everyone?
Denis, Suzette, Vicki are all okay
shawn: Great, no objections. Please update your availability for forthcoming meetings. 13th and 20th we may not meet. I will have several documents for review.
Bon weekend à tous!
Shawn: to assign action items to ALL participants
[End of minutes]