IRC log of xproc on 2012-06-28

Timestamps are in UTC.

13:43:05 [RRSAgent]
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logging to
13:43:08 [Zakim]
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13:43:11 [Norm]
zakim, this will be xproc
13:43:11 [Zakim]
ok, Norm; I see XML_PMWG()10:00AM scheduled to start in 17 minutes
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13:58:45 [Vojtech]
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XML_PMWG()10:00AM has now started
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+ +1.805.560.aaaa
14:01:07 [Zakim]
14:01:15 [Vojtech]
zakim, jeroen is vojtech
14:01:17 [Norm]
I'm on my way
14:01:33 [Zakim]
+vojtech; got it
14:02:01 [Zakim]
+ +1.778.440.aabb
14:03:40 [Norm]
14:03:52 [Norm]
zakim, passcode?
14:04:02 [Zakim]
the conference code is 97762 (tel:+1.617.761.6200, Norm
14:04:20 [Zakim]
14:04:21 [Norm]
zakim, who's here?
14:04:32 [Zakim]
On the phone I see +1.805.560.aaaa, vojtech, +1.778.440.aabb, Norm
14:04:41 [Zakim]
On IRC I see Vojtech, cornelia, Zakim, RRSAgent, Norm, Liam
14:04:46 [Norm]
zakim, aaaa is cornelia
14:04:50 [Norm]
zakim, aabb is murray
14:04:55 [Zakim]
+cornelia; got it
14:05:00 [Zakim]
+murray; got it
14:05:10 [Norm]
Regrets: Jim, Mohamed
14:05:30 [Norm]
rrsagent, set logs world-visible
14:05:30 [Norm]
Meeting: XML Processing Model WG
14:05:30 [Norm]
Date: 28 June 2012
14:05:30 [Norm]
14:05:30 [Norm]
Meeting: 217
14:05:30 [Norm]
Chair: Norm
14:05:32 [Norm]
Scribe: Norm
14:05:34 [Norm]
ScribeNick: Norm
14:05:36 [Norm]
Topic: Accept this agenda?
14:05:38 [Norm]
14:05:43 [Norm]
14:05:57 [Norm]
Present: Vojtech, Cornelia, Norm, Murray
14:06:02 [Norm]
Topic: Accept minutes from the previous meeting?
14:06:02 [Norm]
14:06:09 [Norm]
14:06:14 [Norm]
Topic: Next meeting: telcon, 12 July 2012 (skip 5 July)
14:06:35 [Norm]
No regrets heard
14:06:48 [Norm]
Topic: Review of open action items
14:07:09 [alexmilowski]
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14:07:43 [Norm]
No progress reported. Much wailing and tears reported.
14:08:00 [Norm]
Topic: Review of requirements and use cases
14:08:12 [Zakim]
14:08:19 [Norm]
Present: Vojtech, Cornelia, Norm, Murray, Alex
14:09:21 [Norm]
Norm: Anyone have any high-level thoughts on how to improve progess?
14:10:00 [Norm]
Murray: We've got a holiday in the US next week, and folks preparing for Balisage in August...summer is slow.
14:10:04 [Norm]
Cornelia: Yes, summer is slow.
14:10:58 [Norm]
Norm: Should we take the month of July off?
14:11:27 [Norm]
Cornelia: I think we should take a month off, because we're going to end up taking some time off anyway.
14:11:47 [Norm]
Cornelia: I'm goign to read the req doc top-to-bottom, are there any other homework assignments we could be doing?
14:12:41 [Norm]
Norm: Well, I've got some big proposals and we should all read the document.
14:14:02 [Norm]
Proposal: We'll take July off to recharge our batteries. Next meeting: 16 August.
14:14:18 [Norm]
14:14:55 [Norm]
Norm: Take it away, Murray
14:15:39 [Norm]
Murray: I pulled in a bunch of possible specs and now I think we should eliminate the ones we're really not going to do.
14:16:40 [Norm]
Murray: So, XPointer and XLink can go.
14:16:45 [Norm]
Murray: We can do MathML
14:16:50 [Norm]
Norm: What would a MathML step do?
14:17:01 [Norm]
Murray: Convert MathML to presentation or results.
14:17:09 [Norm]
Alex: Converting MathML into an image for example.
14:18:05 [Norm]
Murray: XForms? No.
14:18:30 [Norm]
Murray: EXI would seem to be relevant. We might want to accept EXI as inputs.
14:19:26 [Norm]
Norm: Yes, I think so.
14:20:30 [Norm]
Murray: So I'm going to leave it in.
14:20:41 [Norm]
Murray: I thought we might have some sort of special HTML processing step.
14:21:39 [Norm]
Norm: I think we might want to leave HTML5 in there, because we're going to talk about HTML5 coming in on steps like p:http-request.
14:22:11 [Norm]
Alex: There's definitely a difference between cleanup and parsing using the HTML5 rules.
14:22:34 [Norm]
Norm: I think HTML5 should stay, I'd e inclined to pull the others but I don't feel strongly about it.
14:22:36 [Norm]
Murray: I agree.
14:22:40 [Norm]
Murray: Now, CSS.
14:23:21 [Norm]
Norm: Seems like an edge case to me.
14:23:24 [Norm]
Murray: Yep.
14:23:52 [Norm]
Murray: Then I put in these common publishing formats. I had a chat about building a DITA step.
14:24:49 [Norm]
Norm: Yeah, certainly for the office formats, I can imagine steps.
14:24:58 [Norm]
...I'm agnostic about leaving them.
14:25:10 [Norm]
Murray: I thought it might be handy to have common interfaces to these document types.
14:25:41 [Norm]
...But we're building XProc so that others can build tools like these, so maybe we should just leave it out until the fullness.
14:25:48 [Norm]
s/fullness/fullness of time/
14:26:00 [Norm]
...So I think we should take them out.
14:26:01 [Norm]
Norm: Ok.
14:26:15 [Norm]
Murray: Similarly, I think someone could develop a UBL step.
14:26:21 [Norm]
Norm: And we don't have the experience to do it.
14:26:27 [Norm]
Murray: So, out.
14:27:44 [Norm]
Norm: We punted in V1.0 because signatures work over sequences of characters.
14:29:23 [Norm]
Some discussion of digital signatures
14:29:29 [Norm]
Alex: EPUB3 has digital signatures.
14:30:47 [Norm]
Norm: I think we should leave digital signatures in the list, to remind us at least that we might want to reconsider signatures in
14:31:08 [Norm]
ACTION: Alex to produce a use case with digital signatures in an EPU3 document.
14:32:06 [Norm]
Murray: What about the semantic web? I think we could imagine steps that work with the semantic web.
14:32:19 [Norm]
Alex: We could certainly have a step that extracted RDF from RDFa documents.
14:32:26 [Norm]
Murray: As a core step?
14:32:39 [Norm]
ACTION: Alex to produce a use case for semantic web steps.
14:32:59 [Norm]
Murray: SMIL out?
14:33:05 [Norm]
14:33:24 [Norm]
Murray: Mail in?
14:33:26 [Norm]
Norm: Yes.
14:34:07 [Norm]
Murray: Non-XML formats.
14:34:11 [Norm]
...CSV seems easy.
14:34:22 [Norm]
...JSON is obvious too, right.
14:34:44 [Norm]
14:34:50 [Norm]
Norm: Goodness, how would you do that.
14:35:00 [Norm]
14:35:12 [Norm]
Alex: We'd have to add that to the places where there are inputs.
14:36:47 [Norm]
Norm: I'd be inclined to limit this list to CSV and JSON.
14:37:21 [Norm]
Murray: WebDAV?
14:38:14 [Norm]
...It's unlikely that you want WebDAV *in* XProc.
14:38:44 [Norm]
Murray: The end of that list is a list of reference processors.
14:39:31 [Norm]
Norm: I think libhtml5 should be added to the list.
14:42:06 [Norm]
Murray: This document has grown, and there's a lot of good stuff, and ultimately we need to produce a R&UC document.
14:42:15 [Norm]
...A lot of what's in the back is useful material.
14:42:22 [ht]
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14:42:57 [Norm]
...But if we're going to get a R&UC document out, we should separate some of it out.
14:43:27 [Norm]
Murray: But maybe we should leave it in until 16 August.
14:44:01 [Norm]
Norm: I'm ok with leaving it in until August.
14:44:01 [Zakim]
14:46:16 [Norm]
Murray: I think we should have some OS steps and some of these other steps in F.
14:47:15 [Norm]
Alex: I think there are a lots of levels of sorting here.
14:47:35 [Norm]
Murray: But the OS/directory steps seem so fully specified, that we should just be able to include them.
14:50:41 [Norm]
Some discussion of the steps.
14:50:48 [Norm]
Norm: I think we might just publish them as a note.
14:51:30 [Norm]
ACTION: Norm to draft notes for OS and directory steps
14:51:58 [Norm]
Murray: I think that's the end of my list.
14:52:41 [Norm]
Topic: Any other business?
14:53:00 [Norm]
None heard.
14:53:14 [Zakim]
14:53:15 [Norm]
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14:53:19 [Norm]
rrsagent, draft minutes
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I have made the request to generate Norm
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XML_PMWG()10:00AM has ended
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Attendees were +1.805.560.aaaa, vojtech, +1.778.440.aabb, Norm, cornelia, murray, Alex_Milows, ht
14:55:24 [Norm]
rrsagent, set logs world visible
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rrsagent, draft minutes
14:55:25 [RRSAgent]
I have made the request to generate Norm
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